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I didn't say they were different people, I was very very careful not to, I actually thought this would give it away.
Imagine I did this with Monique, Alexandra, and Victoria, no one would have been fooled at all even if I outright said they were all different. Distinctiveness.
Fascinating. Was anybody anywhere near close in matching the make-ups with their usual characters? I'm wondering how much that contributes to us recognising them. Or to thinking that we do :)
Yes, and I was looking for Steph's angular jaw and in 2, it looks more angular and I couldn't find the cleft in Olympia's chin or notch on nose so I thought that might be a normals thing and it has different textures with different or no normals... I guessed number 4 as Penny but thought she looked better here than in the promos. So because I thought they were 4 different characters, I made excuses for each one. Interesting psychological experiment really...
I realize that by definition, you can say that distinctive, just means not identical. But, I think the point is that so many people are saying that many of the G8F releases look the same to them. Of course, it's subjective. But, that is the point isn't it? If a lot of people are saying that all the new products look the same to them, isn't that reason enough to consider making something more interesting and varied? It's all down to Daz and their artists as to whether or not they think departing from this formula will create better or worse sales. I think the people that say "they all look the same" are just voicing their opinion that they would like new figures that bring a different look to the table. Of course, if you're satisfied with the new release offerings, you're not going to complain, eh?
I was thinking that those were all Victoria 8 when I was looking at them but the similarity to the pose on number 3 to recent renders of Penny and that Penny is so recent made me think Penny. You'll notice Victoria's face looks much fuller in number 3, I guess because of the angle.
And it's not a surprise now in hindsight that I said I wasn't at all sure about the others, because well there was good reason I wasn't sure, and that's because they are all the same character.
All I knew was the way I read the post with those pictures was that it said one was V8, O8, S8, & P8 but now after your reveal I know I should of looked for a linguistic exactness like a lawyer tries to read and write for.
So the who's who is like the old joke, "Railroad crossing, look out for the cars, can you spell that without any Rs"?
Fun experiment. I also thought they were all the same character...but couldn't decide which one...LOL That tells you how much difference I see in them. No biggie really, I'll still probably buy the ones I don't have when the price goes so low that it's a no brainer. But for me to buy a new and exciting character, it will have to either be the aforementioned no brainer, or simply be so intriguing that I can't pass it up. :) Penny is close. I think she has some merit...just not enough for me to pull out the wallet, yet. And, the free pro packs are ones that I passed on before because they were low on my priority list. It's a good value. But, I'd rather be more excited about the new character. Those renders with Diva's shader settings look great. I might still be persuaded eventually.
I will be buying either the Charlotte 8 or the Penny 8 in the future. Maybe both.
1 was Victoria makeup, and only one person guessed Victoria.
2 was Penny makeup, and by luck of the draw very distinctive, so I was surprised that no one at all guessed Penny here.
3 was Stephanie makeup, and again only one person guessed Stephanie.
4 was Olympia and only one guessed Olympia.
No one got more than one makeup matched to their guess. So there was a surprising lack of correlation between character makeup and guesses.
For the rest of it, I really had three questions I wanted to ask here:
"Can people recognize Victoria well enough to know she is not one of the other three similar characters?"
"Can people tell all four similar characters apart from each other?"
"Can people tell which of four similar characters is in a single picture?"
But due to the nature of this nonsense I could only ever ask one, so I chose the first because I thought it was the most interesting.
And yes this all is because of psychology, but psychology is that thing that makes different people distinctive to us to begin with.
People have really similar problems trying to match colors without reference points. Memory makes things blurry, really blurry.
Yes, I thought it was very interesting that the one person that said "wait, these are the same morph" still didn't hazard a guess as to which one.
Great experiment. I was looking at them and couldn't tell which was which. To me, they all looked very much like the same model, but seeing that you listed different characters I tried to spot and see the differences. Should have went with my first impressions, LOL. It's like the celebrity look alike thread where someone says they look like so and so and all I see is victoria in most cases, LOL.
He made a good point I think. Had this been any G3F character, I doubt there would have been much doubt that it was all the same character. We already knew and accepted, concisiously or unconcisiously, that some of these G8F look alike quite a bit.
I think you underestimate suggestibility. If I am told "these are four characters" or read something written to heavily imply it. I will accept it.
I generally assume complete good faith (probabably a bad internet habit, but if I didn't I'd also probably go even crazier with second guessing every interaction)
What if I had used Monique?
In all 4 shots with only 1 straight on? yes I probably could've convinced myself it was 4 characters. Now, if all 4 had been Alexandra I would have figured it, but it takes really obvious things to shake me.
It might be more of a me thing, like I said, my options are pretty much assume good faith unless its completly blatantly obvious with a neon sign or second guess every interaction until I have a mental breakdown
In that case I guess we can rule you out as a tell and just rely on the fact that it was pretty easy to convince a whole bunch of other people Victoria could be one of the Vicky-alikes.
"People are suggestible" doesn't invalidate the point, it is the point, that those four characters fall into a group where it's so very easy for average people familiar with the topic to believe they're the same. If everyone had perfect discernment I don't think there would even be questions about distinctiveness in this way.
Honestly the makeup wasn't a factor for me. When I was looking I was a bit incredulous that those 4 models all looked so much alike that I was thinking maybe all the complaints were right about all these DAZ Originals being minor tweeks.
I see what you did there LOL Would be fascinated to now see the renders redone with the four different characters for comparison.
two seperate things used mega grass for the forground and the background/lights were beach 2 16k no dof from
I think the only thing really shown by the V8 trick is that if you slap the same skin and hair on a character or characters and then shoot them from different angles with different expressions with different makeups it's hard to tell who they are.
Add to it the fact that G8 gets HD expressions and a ton of facial rigging that change the position of the facial features with the expressions, then it makes it even harder to tell.
These are Genesis 3 "Official Daz Characters" and have been out for quite some time. They should be instantly recognizable. And there might be some who CAN instantly recognize them, but I'm sure there are people who can't instantly recognize them, even people who own them who maybe don't instantly recognize them. And these are G3 figures that don't even have the benefit of all the extra facial rigging nor did I use any HD expressions - so the expressions don't change the faces as much as the G8 expressions do.
While I do think there are people who will be able to instantly recognize the above characters (without looking at the G3 DO figures to compare), I think that there are some who will struggle with naming some of them, even though most have been out for years (while the G8 characters have only been out for months).
While I do think a couple of the DO G8 figures are a little similar, they are still distinctive and unique characters and aren't THAT similar, imo. :) While the trick was an interesting one, I don't think it proved what it was supposed to have proved, but that's just my opinion. :) I could be 100% off the mark, of course. I just think that the V8 test only showed that angles and lighting and makeup and expressions can change the look of a character pretty dramatically. Again, just my opinion. :)
but it's also the same with real life though isn't there are a lot of people unrelated world over that have similar features some even look related or actual identical I myself have a few and others who have seen them say we are identical and there have been memes showing actors/singers that were pretty much dead ringers and Kate Perry's current look keep thinking she's Miley Cyrus and Kate's old look she had several looking like her
Good try Divamakeup but you can't fool me: they're all the same pic of George with different makeup.
Contouring is everything...
For me, as a non-native-english-speaking newbie, who can't identify any G2, G3 or G8 male or female unless it's something special like George, Ollie or any with some extremely outstanding features, "distinctive" comes with the meaning of "it looks like a really different person, not just an older/younger version or a possible close relative".
And as it is - in my not so humble opinion - many figures ("named" ones and all the others, that have names, too, but aren't official enough to have a "real name", because they are just morphed or z-brushed a bit) share too many similiarities. Especially the females often only seem to have one possible look for their noses. And the contours of their faces are often very, very, very closely resembling each other. Quite often it seems to be dependent on the PA. Some of them send out quite a few clones with very subtle alterations, then adding "differences" to the figures by choice of skins, tattoo options, make-up options and specials like vampire teeth or whatever.
So in the end, for me it's usually the "optional stuff" (= special looking skins and unique features) that make me want to buy a figure. Most of the other distinctive marks (different shapes of head, face, body, facial features, whatever...) I often can do myself by using morphs or dialing in a different figure..
I also think that many people underestimate the importance of different skins, as these can change the looks of a figure enormously. Use the "Old Chap" textures/skin on any other male figure and you will see a totally different character immediately.
Good points.
One thing I don't think has been mentioned which you allude to, is that many PAs (probably all?) have a distinctive style they like to propegate, so customers can tell their products, and hence gain sales because of that. That is likely to create some similarities.
Figured I would add a render of Penny 8 with OOT Clasic Hair Bob. The renders in the this thread did finally persuade me to go ahead and buy her, so thanks to all who sent in earlier renders!
She does indeed have a tattoo "Still I Rise" on her neck/chest. I absolutly love this character, my only complaint is that the tattoo is not optional :(
Perhaps P3D could push out a small update for a non tattoo mat version? *wink* *wink*
Here is a render of her with the Lauren Hair that comes with the Pro Bundle.
Same skin wasn't really the point though, or was it? Maybe I misunderstood. I thought the exercise was to show that we were ready to believe that we're looking at different characters with their own shape and skin even though they're the same, because both shape and skin look fairly similar on some of this generation. Whereas on G3F there were considerable differences. It just cannot be denied that G3Fs look more distinctive, I'll just be honest and say I noticed this very early on myself.
I'm not saying it's good or bad, I'll leave that to others. Arguments could be made for having a cohesive look for figures of the same generation. Much like characters in a game are going to have a certain art direction to fit together, ideally anyway. But there's plenty of bad that could be said about it too and it shouldn't just be written off as negativism.