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DAZ Productions, Inc.
224 S 200 W, Suite #250
Salt Lake City, UT 84101
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© 2024 Daz Productions Inc. All Rights Reserved.
Comments
I think some may equate less buff with younger. Lucian looks 40ish to me. Especially with that permanent scowl
And I was mostly going by body shape. We never had a character with Elijah's classic stringbean build before.
I finally pulled the trigger on Lucas 8 and got his pro bundle. Since that gave me Elijah 7 pro bundle and David 5 pro bundles free (I already had the Brodie bundle), I decided to load Elijah first and do a quick render of him:
Elijah is gorgeous! He's stunning!
And loading him first and checking him out first before Lucas 8 was a mistake. Because after seeing the beautiful Elijah then seeing Lucas... Oy! The difference in the two is night and day.
Lucas is really REALLY lacking in detail. And not just lacking detail with his skin (which it is, and imo, is pretty bad) but his body and face morph are really lacking detail too. Comparing Elijah to Lucas makes my face hurt. And what's with the ORANGE!? Lucas looks like an oompa loompa.
Lucas 8 is my first Daz Original Genesis 8 male ...but if Daz doesn't change the direction they're going with the Official Daz Original Genesis 8 line, he might be my last. I just hope they change their direction - that's just... that's bad. I mean, he might be ..no he IS.. the worst figure I've ever bought. The only thing that makes me NOT regret buying him is that in buying him I got the other two bundles free.
Here's another comparison. Both with the same render settings and lighting, both just "out of the box" with no changes made to their skin settings.
Lucas also took WAY longer to render than Elijah. While Elijah rendered in just under five minutes, Lucas took 14 and a half minutes to render. So nearly THREE TIMES as long to render a figure with way less detail and realism. And again, I used the same render settings and lighting for both.
I'm seriously scared for Daz though if they continue to make figures like Lucas (and according to the forum here a lot of people aren't liking the female G8 line as well). Though I only have V8 (and I like her), others are saying that she's the best one and that the other DO G8F figures all have orangy skin and lacking in detail too like Lucas. I hope Daz changes the direction they're going with the G8 line. Because if Lucas is anything like the others in the Daz Originals Genesis 8 line, they are seriously going backwards.
I'm not sure I agree with the adrogynous part, but the rest, yeah, I can agree with. Which makes me sad becuase I REALLY wanted to like Lucas. And I feel aweful for disliking him as I know someone probably put a lot of work into him (I've been learning how much hard work and crazy hours goes into character creation). But I seriously dislike this figure. What happened? We got great detailed characters like Ivan and Lucas ...and now we're getting flat skin, very orange skin, low detail in both the textures and morph ...What? Why?
I'm not keen on the facial sculpts of the new generation. In my opinion they need to hire the artist they have used before. Michael 8's face in particular was pretty awful with the mouth being really lowset and strange looking. When I see expression sets using the base figure M8 I cringe because he doesn't look real, the mouth is off, and the expressions look diabolic and odd. The females are slighly better, but the guy releases so far haven't been too great as far as base figures go. I would prefer a few classically pretty and handsome bases, rather than the distinctive character thing they seem to be doing. I understand some may like that, but it isn't my cuppa tea. I can't use a base model whose mouth is really really low and the eyebrows not following the orbit of the eye is just kind of funky.
I don't really compare Elijah to Lucas since Lucas looks like a teen to me. He's not detailed because he's young and kind of kid-like. (I'm kind of surprised he has elements to be honest) The main problem though is the eyebrows and hairlines on his hair sets are mostly female and that compared with the glossy lips looks like they used female content and resources on him, which combined with his lack of detail isn't the look I'm looking for.
I don't really render teens anyway.
While I agree with most of what you said, I'm not really buying the reasoning for lack of detail in Lucas becuase "he's young and kind of kid-like". He only looks young and kid like, to me, BECAUSE of the lack of details. And I think of Elijah being in the late teens to early 20s range. Lucas, to me, looks to be just a little younger than Elijah. Plus Teen Josie and Tween Julie are both younger than Lucas and they both are more detailed then he is.
Elijah is one of my favorite G3M characters. I'm kinda bummed to think that there might not be a G8 version. Oh well...there's nothing wrong with my G3M version...hehe.
As for the G8s, I do like V8. So far, she's really the only one I use, tho I've used Mike 8 a little bit (but I too think he looks odd with those low, wide lips that curl under at the outer corners). I've managed to morph Mike 8 into a few new characters I really like tho. I like V8 the more I use her. The rest of the G8s I have I like less the more I use them. It is worrying.
Laurie
Its probably a rush release. Generic skin, generic look. Something to release during the sale.
Teen boys are notorious bad sellers, so I doubt a lot of energy was expended on his creation. Since they probably didn't expect to make much money on him.
I'm not one to speak about the teen characters though. The last one I liked were the millenium series...
As far as the girls go, there is a ton more energy spent in developing and creating female content here at DAZ. That's just the way it is. So if female characters have more details. items, and content, it is because that's where the money is. Male stuff when it is done, often doesn't seem to have as much attention paid to it and there are mistakes that would never fly with similar female releases. Since Gen 8 was released he's gotten very few content or items released for him.
I made some major changes to Lucas' skin settings and WHOA! He looks like a completely different character!
The new settings also decreased the render times by quite a bit.
Why, oh WHY would they put that level of detail into skin textures only to cover it all up and hide it with weird orange waxyness??
I think he looks WAY better with my settings changes. What on earth where they thinking covering up all those great details with those awful skin settings?
I take it back, I don't regret getting him now. lol My skin settings made all the difference for me. That's sad though, he should, imo, have those details "out of the box" without forcing people to spend hours tweaking and changing a bunch of settings to get him to A) not look like an Oompa Loompa and B) to actually have a decent degree of skin details.
Really though, with my skin settings, I can see myself actually using him now. :)
He looks great indeed.
Would you like to share your tweek/setting changes?
And I disagree. Lighting, distance from camera and skin material settings are all interrelated and should influence the level of detail seen to make a scene truly photorealistic. I will agree that he's got odd coloration, but your version is too pale for my taste.
Yet its a comment about Lucian...who is clearly an older male with his flat chest shape and other proportions. He is not "young" by any stretch of the imagination.
@divamakeup better material settings help them all, but it doesn't save the base shape. Nice job with that, though. His textures are usable.
Young men come in lots of different shapes and sizes. Generic and average does not make for a memorable character.
@divamakeup better material settings help them all, but it doesn't save the base shape. Nice job with that, though. His textures are usable. If you ignore the rookie effects maps... check the indented chest hairs on the bump. And what is with this jacking up the bump to 5 and 8?
Young men come in lots of different shapes and sizes. Generic and average does not make for a memorable character.
I like the skin alterations. His mouth is still kind of strange looking but all gen 8 men have these really odd Cupid’s bow mouths. But paler allows the detail to show rather than the spray tan look
Nice skin. I haven't really played with Lucas, just mixed a bit of him in with my M8 characters, so if there's any way to de-orange him and sort that mouth, I'm all ears.
Right? What is with those lips? I've seen a few like that, and I know noone in real life that has that exaggerated shape,
And is it just me or are Gen8's eyes less convincing than Gen3?
The mouths are problematic. They are too low (i raise them sometimes as high as 60 percent) and angled at the corners and top to be typical. It is made worse by the reddish color and gloss that seems to be added and when expressions are used. The tech looks better on women but I spend a lot of time trying to scrub out the hard lines of the top and when the character smiles or has an expression there is an odd v-shape that forms. I think part of the issue is the angled the mouth. It’s subtley not right.
This product https://www.daz3d.com/rarestone-s-face-morphs-collection-for-genesis-8-male
helps with the angle of the mouth. You can adjust many parts of the lip so you aren’t stuck with the squid mouth
I generally try to remove the bow element since I like fuller lips that aren’t so harshly defined.. but I have found even when you scrub out the mouths the characters no matter what the shape of the lips look kind of strange and sort of alike
i actually have found I like the genesesis 3 male facial expressions on Genesis 8. They look less exaggerated.
I made some minor mods to his face with ZBrush.
I definitely like him better now. But it took some work. I can see myself rendering him and Elijah as my two go-to guys. :)
Sure, let me see if I can package it up and send you the link. :) Send me a PM as a nudge if you don't hear back from me in a day or so (I can get forgetful).
hahah Ummm Yeah, I can't say that I understand your thinking there. Expecting people to make camera distance changes and lighting changes are a given - that's just part of rendering. Expecing your customers to do extensive and extremely time consuming changes to your product's skin texture settings - thats not cool. Your product should render decently "out of the box" and it shouldn't require a crazy amount of time dedicated to making adjustments to it's settings to get it to stop looking like an Oompa Loompa and to get a decent amount of skin detail to show in renders.
Thanks, evilded777. I agree and hope to have the time this weekend to make some adjustments to his body in ZBrush. I made some adjustments to his face and found it made a big difference in my desire to render him or not. I think making a few minor modifications to his body and giving him a bit more detailing will be a big help too. It's just sad that he's not so great "out of the box" - here's hoping that Daz makes some changes and start to put out a bit more "polished" Daz Original Genesis 8 characters. I'm really REALLY hoping they go back to the level of awesome detail we got with Elijah and Ivan.
Thanks, Serene Night! :D I like the skin better too, making him darker is easy, I might do an alternate setting with his skin a little darker - but I kind of like him pale. lol :) And yeah, the mouth is a bit unusual and, imo, a little odd looking. I'll probably make some adjustments to it in ZBrush.
Excellent tweaking Divamakeup! The Daz default settings are always kinda terrible IMO, I actually like G8's defaults better than G3's believe it or not. (in that I think both are pretty bad but I have to do less tweaking to get something usable)
I will again spam my psa for everyone to use the "Translucency Medium" preset that comes with the Daz characters, Its not as nice as Diva's tweaks, but it will get you something pretty passable with One Simple ClickTM
... And I do agree that lucas is a bit bland looking young /= smooth :( although I do really like his nose
Yeah, the translucency is definitely an improvement with the lower setting (it's a good PSA lol). Why on earth they purposfully jacked the translucency up to 90 and set that as the default is mind boggling.
I'd like the link, too, please? Your results are the only thing that will keep Lucas from being returned for me.
Your Lucas skin looks fantastic Diva :)
Laurie
Theoretically its possible to have a skin setup with a Translucency strength of .9 and still have the skin look light, but a) that doesn't solve the render time issue b) in my experimenting I have a recurring issue of the characters breaking out in green fireflies if I push the settings too much trying to make things lighter
below is as light as I've gotten the skin with translucency at .9 so far same lights and rendered the same time as the others. If I actually let it render enough it would probably look pretty decent, but man is it super fiddly tiny value chances can make everything go screwy, If you look close you can see some of the green fireflies starting to creep in.
Will do! :) I'll send you the link as well.
Thank you, Laurie! :D I'm on my way to bed but should have the settings packaged up and ready for download by Sunday evening (Cali time).