formerly male content creation thread

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  • WilmapWilmap Posts: 2,913

    I made a Polo shirt like that. Loads of people seem to like it and have downloaded it.

  • DiomedeDiomede Posts: 11,294

    Your website has so many useful and helpful resources.  Thank you.  I hope people are appreciative.  For example, here are some tutorials.    https://www.wilmapsdigitalcreations.co.uk/view_products.php?cat=10

     

    Wilmap said:

    I made a Polo shirt like that. Loads of people seem to like it and have downloaded it.

     

  • KnittingmommyKnittingmommy Posts: 7,808
    edited November 2015

    While it isn't for men, I plan to finish the dress that I started with the tutorial that I linked above.  I only have seams and hems left to do and then it is all about the finish work with uv maps, rigging, etc. which applies to mensware as well.  For my first mens outfit, I'm leaning toward the great kilt.  While there are a couple of really good kilts here on DAZ, they are for the older models and they are all of the more modern kilt design.  I would love to be able to have a great kilt with morphs for all of the various ways to wear such a kilt.  It will also mean a lot of morphs for poses if I do right.  Luckily, it all starts with a very simple shirt looking shirt.  But, the great kilt is going to be my end result that I wish to accomplish. I found this website that sells great kilts and has a ton of pictures for references.  I also found this website, too, which should help me out as they have a couple of blogposts on how a couple of items are made in real life that might be helpful especially since I'm a sewer and if I can see how it is made then I might be able to successfully translate that to my project.  I think the shirt and vest will be pretty straight forward even for a beginner like me.    The kilt itself is just one long rectangle of fabric in real life.  The trick for 3D will be to get the pleats and various wearing morphs done on the kilt so that it looks nice and that it looks like it is that same rectangular piece of fabric which, in a 3D model, it really won't be. 

    edit:  I hope it is okay to have to pictures linked in the forum.  I only linked the photos from their website.  If it isn't, I'll remove the photos and just provide a link to the photos themselves.

    Post edited by Knittingmommy on
  • lxlx Posts: 2,994
    Adrean said:

    Product Suggestion:

    Fantasy Armours. Fantasy/Game related, not necessarily historically accurate.

    And compatible with at least G2M.

    I think there are quite a bunch of armors out there for michael 4-6 but mostly seem to be restrained or limited by the idea of historic accuracy. Things that include accentuated pauldron/chest/faulds piece as well as a curving abdomen plus slim waist are basically non-existent, not to mention awesome patterns/engraves on the metal . Yes some current pieces can be adjusted but that involves a lot of extra work and even then there is no saying whether it will work. Adjusting the character might work to some extent but it becomes a pain when I need to re-dress the male characters with some other garments.

    Examples of fantasy armours I would like to see on characters:

    Just a search with keyword "Lineage 2 armor“ or ”Aion armor" or "vindictus armor" will yield plenty of results that are more imaginative and creative than many products out there.

     

    Also suggestion:

    Manga style short hair. Especially spiky hair styles. Seriouly I cannot find anything that is satisfactory in this category currently.

    Fantasy scaves/capes:  You know, something like this

    http://www.bumped.org/psublog/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Genga-Koei1.jpg

    I used to spend hours just looking through images of Lineage 2 and Aion outfits and weapons. Such beautiful design. 

    I'm also surprised at the lack of proper manga style hair around (for both genders.) I personally think that anime characters with the usual realistic hairs look weird, but maybe that's just me.

    I'm making a simple top to start, but I have a question. How difficult/feasible is it to make a clothing item where parts bend but others simply move?

    e.g. a fabric top with some armour plates attached. the fabric morphs along with the character, but the plates themselves should only follow rather than deform. Is it simple vertex weight painting, or more complicated?

  • Oso3DOso3D Posts: 14,250

    Rigid items are a problem. Clothing and fitting doesn't work very well with them -- really rigid armors, like breastplate, you are better off creating as a prop and parenting it to the chest, then adjusting the scale a bit to fit the figure.

    Semirigid or mixed items are a problem.For example, if I really wanted to make a 'realistic' shirt, I'd probably make a shirt with markers (or stitches) for where the buttons go, then add the buttons as rigid objects in the right places.

     

  • j cadej cade Posts: 1,827

    I can vouch for Blondie9999's tutorial, I have at least one and found it very useful. They are some of the few tutorials on weigtmapping around.

     

    Honestly though Studio has really gotten insanely easy in terms of weightmapping over the past few versions. Pretty much 90% of your rigging can be done using only transfer utility and the smooth tool in the weightmapping tab. I seriously recomend fiddling with weightmapping, if nothing else it can seriously improve your transferred clothes.

     

    Below is a (female) example of the automatic transfer vs. the automatic transfer + some very quick smoothing in the weightmapping tab. This was seriously 2 minutes of work. Generally the closer your object is to the figure the easier it is for the automatic transfer to get good results. But, genuinely, just waving the smoothing brush around aimlessly over your clothing will make it look better 9 times out of 10.

     

    For  modeling my main tip would be work as lowres as possible and then add detail. Its like drawing, start with the basic shape of what you're creating and then add detail. Most of the stuff I make starts life as a cylinder. low-ish res stuff also tends to have less problems with clingwrapping when it comes to following morphs

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  • DiomedeDiomede Posts: 11,294

    In addition to the prop option, it is worth distinuishing two different functions that might distort a mesh.  One is when the figure is posed which is when the bones of the rigging are rotated.  A second situation is when morphs are applied to the figure and the clothing is supposed to auto-fit along with the changing mesh.  The best strategy for relatively stiff features may depend on the given situation.  Hopefully, our more experienced Daz people will help us, along with folks like me studying the documentation and the tutorials more.  I know that in Carrara I would be able to use the weightpainting brush to exclude chosen polygons when a bone is rotated such as applying poses, in which case I might not want to use a prop.  I bet Daz Studio has similar ability.  The answer will be in some of those videos and tutorials linked to above, which I plan to be pouring through intensely as we go along.

     

    Great Question!

     

     

  • Oso3DOso3D Posts: 14,250
    Cylinder, sort of like box modeling? (Which, near as I can figure out, is 'start with a box and change all the bits that shouldn't be a box')
  • DiomedeDiomede Posts: 11,294

    Thank you, J Cade.  Will definitely look into the Blondie99 tutorial.

     

    For anyone joining me on my particular journey, I don't plan to start on any actual modeling, etc. for some time yet.  I am still at the concept phase.  But no need to hold anyone else back who is more advanced.  

     

    Love the kilt idea.  For the drape, may I recommend a program that has a physics function?  Poser, Blender, Marvelous Designer, (I use Carrara), and I'm sure there are others.  Physics can be used as a modeling aid sometimes. 

  • LeanaLeana Posts: 7,530
    Leana said:
    3Ddreamer said:

    There is a workman bundle for M4 at RDNA I picked up with some of that - can't give you a link as I am at work just now and having a mental blank on who made it.

    There's the Toolboi outfit by BadKittehCo, which used to be at RDNA but is now at Rendo. Maybe it's the one you were thinking of?

    https://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/toolboi-summer-collection/110664/

    https://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/toolboi-winter-collection/110662/

    The first link doesn't work.  I think that semi-colon is messing up the link because it causes link to add some extra characters.  You might want to edit out the semi-colon somehow.  I notice that it doesn't show up in the quote so I'm not sure how the semi-colon is in your post.  Deleting the extra characters after the last slash does send people to the correct page, though.

    Well the semicolon apparently came from a trailing space which was translated to "&nbsp added to the URL + a semicolon" for whatever reason. I removed it using the "source" editor.

  • DiomedeDiomede Posts: 11,294

    RE: Box modeling.  Yes, in that method start with a box.  Then expand (typically called extrude) and edit until you get the shape you want.  The result will then have the 4-sided quads that are generally preferred.  I thought that I had posted a pic of my low res generic G2M starter envelope mesh, but I guess I had put it in the other thread.  It is what I used for the gloves example above.  Here it is with a little box progression thrown in.  I was going to post it to sharecg but there is already a free starter mesh there.  See the early posts in the thread for the link.  You can derive a low-res starter mesh for a t-shirt without much effort.

     

    As J Cade mentioned, Daz has made the model mesh part of this relatvely simple, so don't think you have to be the world's most sophisticated modeler. You don't have to start with a box.  A cylinder or another shape may work fine.  We can get more complicated later, if desired.  But if you are a sophisticated modeler, go for it!

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  • j cadej cade Posts: 1,827
    edited November 2015

    Yep pretty much box modelling, I just find it easier to start with cylinders. Here's a brief rundown recreating the dress from my previous post.

     

    Vickie in a barrel! A cylinder I have moved a few vertices around on.

    Oh look theres a waist! Loop cut is the best tool ever.

    Used loop cut again and moved the vertices to flesh out the basic shape.

    Cut a hole and extruded out sleeves. Otherwise known as "Oh look! another cylinder!"

    More loop cutting on the sleeves, and extruded up the neckline. also I added a subdivide modifier and set the shading to smooth to give myself a better visual.

    Add some details like seam lines, any guesses on what tool I used? (its loop cut).

    After this all I would do next is setup a cloth sim to have it drape and add a few wrinkles.

     

     

     

     

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    Post edited by j cade on
  • Oso3DOso3D Posts: 14,250

    Box modeling and most pics illustrating it always remind me of:

     

  • DiomedeDiomede Posts: 11,294
    edited November 2015

    Note: if you start with something like my envelope mesh and just cut out your pants or shirt, the edges will look too sharp, like paper, instead of having a hem or seam.  Fortunately, a solution for making trims is simple.     https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1PTaIjn854

    Making clothing trim in Hexagon 2

    Jen Greenlees

     

    Post edited by Diomede on
  • diomede said:
     

    Love the kilt idea.  For the drape, may I recommend a program that has a physics function?  Poser, Blender, Marvelous Designer, (I use Carrara), and I'm sure there are others.  Physics can be used as a modeling aid sometimes. 

    I have Blender as well as Maya and 3DMax both which I have access through a student license for my kids so anything I made with either of those two programs would have to be given away for free.  I'm slowly figuring out Blender, though, and I have a resident expert (DH) who uses it.  He doesn't do anything with DAZ, though, so I would have to figure out how to get my model in to Blender and then get it DAZ once finished the clothes.  I have a couple of tutorials on doing that somewhere.  I just have to find them on my computer.

     

    Chohole said:

    Looks like a great kilt.  Unfortunately, I don't have Poser and it looks like it is cloth room dependent as well as being for M4.  I'd like to make a kilt completely for DAZ users and for G2 males (females should be able to use it, too).

  • DiomedeDiomede Posts: 11,294
    edited November 2015

    LOL - sorry.

     

    .

    Box modeling and most pics illustrating it always remind me of:

     

     

     

    Post edited by Diomede on
  • SickleYieldSickleYield Posts: 7,418

    I've got a tutorial on strip modeling, if anyone wants to try that method (box modeling is perfectly valid, this is just another way).

    http://sickleyield.deviantart.com/journal/Tutorial-G1G2-Clothing-in-Blender-1-428585748

  • I've got a tutorial on strip modeling, if anyone wants to try that method (box modeling is perfectly valid, this is just another way).

    http://sickleyield.deviantart.com/journal/Tutorial-G1G2-Clothing-in-Blender-1-428585748

    Ha, SY!! I actually have that in my favorites over on DA, but I hadn't been over there to grab any links for this thread yet.  You beat me to it.

  • SickleYieldSickleYield Posts: 7,418
    edited November 2015

    NP. :)

    It's good to remember that, regardless of your method, if you see a product with perfectly distributed polygons in its final geometry, that is frequently a result of a remesh in Zbrush (or another program with a similar feature).  Blender's remesher is still very poor, unfortunately.  You can get a better (often not perfect) result if you thrash out your base model as completely as possible at a lower resolution and only subdivide (or subsurface modifier, in Blender) when it's really time to sculpt the wrinkles and seams and everything else is basically done.  This is what I did before I had Zbrush to work with, and all of my earlier products (the old Gen 4 ones at Rendo, which are still selling now) were made this way.

    Post edited by SickleYield on
  • nicsttnicstt Posts: 10,651
    lx said:

    I've been using Blender for a few weeks and Daz for a couple of months, no 3d experience before that.

    What would be a good item to start with? A top? Full body armour is appealing but might be a bit much right out the gate, something requiring a decent range of rigging would be more ideal for learning...

    If you're going to use Blender, I'd reccomment CG Cookie for tutorials there are many free, and they first teach you how to learn blender; I like blender and found them invaluable.

  • mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 15,001

    There is a Great Kilt for M4...Poser dynamic...

    http://www.sharecg.com/v/55095/gallery/11/Poser/Great-Kilts-Dynamic-Props-for-M4

    I've always wanted to take a stab at actually rigging it, but never really made the time to do it.

  • mjc1016 said:

    There is a Great Kilt for M4...Poser dynamic...

    http://www.sharecg.com/v/55095/gallery/11/Poser/Great-Kilts-Dynamic-Props-for-M4

    I've always wanted to take a stab at actually rigging it, but never really made the time to do it.

    Can you take something like that for the Poser cloth room and rig it for DS?  Since I don't use Poser, I wasn't aware this might be possible.

  • j cadej cade Posts: 1,827

    Another Tip, analyze the stuff you really like. If there's something youve bought that you feel really works well, take it apart and try to figure out why. For instance I really like Alfred's Finery. It poses and morphs really well, when I transfered it over to G2f it was less shrinkwrappy than a lot of clothes designed for her. more importantly looking at its how its made, like looking at it in wireframe mode I have a pretty good idea why. it has relatively even topology, but details like the wrinkles and seams are built into it. At this point I understand that sort of stuff on a more abstract and intelectual level. but when I was starting out it was much more "I don't really know why, but I really like how this vendor's stuff works, I'm going to construct my stuff in the same way."

     

    Mindvision is another vendor whose stuff always transferred and morphed well. sure enough look at the wireframe and its nice even squares.

     

    Also turn on show hidden to see whats going on under the hood, its always interesting to see what sort of corrective things might be needed.

  • IceDragonArtIceDragonArt Posts: 12,432

    I am going to be following this very very closely.  I want to learn how to do this but I am still so new I barely understand some of the terms you are using lol.  I am working my way through a very very basic blender tutorial.  I have sculptrix which I reallly like but it uses triangle polygons and not square ones.  Plus it doesn't bridge to daz.  But I will be watching closely and following along and giving some of the tutorials a try along the way.

  • mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 15,001
    mjc1016 said:

    There is a Great Kilt for M4...Poser dynamic...

    http://www.sharecg.com/v/55095/gallery/11/Poser/Great-Kilts-Dynamic-Props-for-M4

    I've always wanted to take a stab at actually rigging it, but never really made the time to do it.

    Can you take something like that for the Poser cloth room and rig it for DS?  Since I don't use Poser, I wasn't aware this might be possible.

    Short answer...yes, pretty much like rigging any raw obj.  Except some may need more prep work than others.  Rosemaryr's stuff isn't too difficult to rig, most of the time (I've done a couple other of her items).

  • Design Anvil - Razor42Design Anvil - Razor42 Posts: 1,169
    edited November 2015

    Great initiative here! Will be watching and happy to offer any help that I can along the way.

    Post edited by Design Anvil - Razor42 on
  • lxlx Posts: 2,994
    edited November 2015

    Rigid items are a problem. Clothing and fitting doesn't work very well with them -- really rigid armors, like breastplate, you are better off creating as a prop and parenting it to the chest, then adjusting the scale a bit to fit the figure.

    Semirigid or mixed items are a problem.For example, if I really wanted to make a 'realistic' shirt, I'd probably make a shirt with markers (or stitches) for where the buttons go, then add the buttons as rigid objects in the right places.

    Thanks. I think it may be a better idea to stick with just the underlayer for now and then once I figure that out I'll look at stapling rigid objects onto it.

     

    NP. :)

    It's good to remember that, regardless of your method, if you see a product with perfectly distributed polygons in its final geometry, that is frequently a result of a remesh in Zbrush (or another program with a similar feature).  Blender's remesher is still very poor, unfortunately.  You can get a better (often not perfect) result if you thrash out your base model as completely as possible at a lower resolution and only subdivide (or subsurface modifier, in Blender) when it's really time to sculpt the wrinkles and seams and everything else is basically done.  This is what I did before I had Zbrush to work with, and all of my earlier products (the old Gen 4 ones at Rendo, which are still selling now) were made this way.

    I've been wondering about this. I spend ages making my squares look all nice and pretty but then I load some Daz item I've bought and the lines are flawless and I just think 'what how did you even' Mostly I've just been doing a lot of smoothing/subdividing/decimating/edge sliding to smooth and reduce things back down.

    That said, everything I make right now is usually modelled in some bizarre way, because I'm more interested in learning all of my options and styles rather than the finished result. I feel like if anyone who knew what they were doing saw my workflow they'd have a heart attack.

    Using Blender has been the strangest experience. Pretty much every part and action I've come across has been "this is completely overwhelming and bewildering" which then transformed into "this is so unbelievably logical why don't all programs work like this one." It took some getting used to (and a lot of reading of the amazingly detailed manual) but every part of it feels so stunningly efficient and logical to me now.

    A couple of random Blender tips I've stumbled across:
    - gg will activate vertex or edge slide as opposed to grab/move/translate/whatever. This is so convenient to tap as a shortcut and really great for rearranging vertices without messing up your model, as well as for reducing polygons (slide an edge into another, hit the remove doubles button on the toolbar - this can probably be done better but it's how I do it.)
    - holding alt while rotating your view via holding middle mouse will snap to the nearest ortho view as you near it. These are probably my two favourite commands in the world, and two I didn't actually get from the manual.

    Also if you set your scene to metric and the scale to 0.01, everything will be measured according to "realworld" Daz figure sizes without any scaling. I assume this works for imperial as well. I find doing this and turning on edge lengths in the n panel so much more convenient than using rulers and things.

    Post edited by lx on
  • IceDragonArtIceDragonArt Posts: 12,432
    lx said:

    Rigid items are a problem. Clothing and fitting doesn't work very well with them -- really rigid armors, like breastplate, you are better off creating as a prop and parenting it to the chest, then adjusting the scale a bit to fit the figure.

    Semirigid or mixed items are a problem.For example, if I really wanted to make a 'realistic' shirt, I'd probably make a shirt with markers (or stitches) for where the buttons go, then add the buttons as rigid objects in the right places.

    Thanks. I think it may be a better idea to stick with just the underlayer for now and then once I figure that out I'll look at stapling rigid objects onto it.

     

    NP. :)

    It's good to remember that, regardless of your method, if you see a product with perfectly distributed polygons in its final geometry, that is frequently a result of a remesh in Zbrush (or another program with a similar feature).  Blender's remesher is still very poor, unfortunately.  You can get a better (often not perfect) result if you thrash out your base model as completely as possible at a lower resolution and only subdivide (or subsurface modifier, in Blender) when it's really time to sculpt the wrinkles and seams and everything else is basically done.  This is what I did before I had Zbrush to work with, and all of my earlier products (the old Gen 4 ones at Rendo, which are still selling now) were made this way.

    I've been wondering about this. I spend ages making my squares look all nice and pretty but then I load some Daz item I've bought and the lines are flawless and I just think 'what how did you even' Mostly I've just been doing a lot of smoothing/subdividing/decimating/edge sliding to smooth and reduce things back down.

    That said, everything I make right now is usually modelled in some bizarre way, because I'm more interested in learning all of my options and styles rather than the finished result. I feel like if anyone who knew what they were doing saw my workflow they'd have a heart attack.

    Using Blender has been the strangest experience. Pretty much every part and action I've come across has been "this is completely overwhelming and bewildering" which then transformed into "this is so unbelievably logical why don't all programs work like this one." It took some getting used to (and a lot of reading of the amazingly detailed manual) but every part of it feels so stunningly efficient and logical to me now.

    A couple of random Blender tips I've stumbled across:
    - gg will activate vertex or edge slide as opposed to grab/move/translate/whatever. This is so convenient to tap as a shortcut and really great for rearranging vertices without messing up your model, as well as for reducing polygons (slide an edge into another, hit the remove doubles button on the toolbar - this can probably be done better but it's how I do it.)
    - holding alt while rotating your view via holding middle mouse will snap to the nearest ortho view as you near it. These are probably my two favourite commands in the world, and two I didn't actually get from the manual.

    Also if you set your scene to metric and the scale to 0.01, everything will be measured according to "realworld" Daz figure sizes without any scaling. I assume this works for imperial as well. I find doing this and turning on edge lengths in the n panel so much more convenient than using rulers and things.

    See, this is total gibberish to me.  But I'm stubborn so I am going to go and figure out what you are talking about.

    I had also wondered why there is so few real armour (like knight in shining armour ) kind of stuff around.  Now I understand why.  I'm off to peruse the various tutorials and links provided.

     

  • mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 15,001
    Sonja11 said:
     

    I had also wondered why there is so few real armour (like knight in shining armour ) kind of stuff around.  Now I understand why.  I'm off to peruse the various tutorials and links provided.

     

    Making 3D armor that will move with a posable character is probably one of the harder things to do.  And the other thing...short of the 'parade' armor, most of the real thing is pretty darn boring.

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