Replicate a face from a frontal photo, at hand, no plugins that fails

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Comments

  • ZilvergrafixZilvergrafix Posts: 912
    kwannie said:

    Nope! That won't do Outrider. you did nothing worthy of offending to that degree please do stay in the conversation.! Check your P.M. i sent you a message!!

    Zilver sorry about the time lapse I am attaching the dat file here, but I beleave I need to send the scene sub set of the character also because like strait out of

    Face Gen DAZ assigns noses and other parts what it choses so there are some tweaks I added.

    Outrider, can sub sets be legally shared also?

    Thanks! laugh

  • ZilvergrafixZilvergrafix Posts: 912

    It was not my intention to offend anyone. I have never made any claim that I am some expert at anything Daz. All I wanted to do was offer what I thought was helpful advice. It is clear that is not the case, so I'll take my leave.

     

    but ... you-are-an-expert !, never minimize your skills, it is the way of the greatness, and, sometimes not to be understood by the majority is just normal. wink

    be like me, I'm AN EXPERT creating cute females, and nobody can beat me! nobody !, even DAZ can't! cool

  • kwanniekwannie Posts: 571

    Wow, you got that from the DAT file I sent ? How much tweaking did you have to do, and what skin texture are you using? Looks much better than what I came up with. Maybe you could share the preset you made, I already have the DAT, lol. Nice work

  • ZilvergrafixZilvergrafix Posts: 912
    edited April 22
    kwannie said:

    Wow, you got that from the DAT file I sent ? How much tweaking did you have to do, and what skin texture are you using? Looks much better than what I came up with. Maybe you could share the preset you made, I already have the DAT, lol. Nice work

    here.

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    Post edited by Zilvergrafix on
  • kwanniekwannie Posts: 571

    Thank you Zilver, does the Grace Yong Skin texture work for all of your Idol Presets? I have found using the same texture then just adjusting translucency or tint and maybe a few other tweaks works well when you use multiple characters in a scene instead of using a different skin for each one. What type of scenes are you actually doing with all the idols you are creating? Still or animation? If you like doing animations I might have something that would interest you.

  • ZilvergrafixZilvergrafix Posts: 912
    kwannie said:

    Thank you Zilver, does the Grace Yong Skin texture work for all of your Idol Presets? I have found using the same texture then just adjusting translucency or tint and maybe a few other tweaks works well when you use multiple characters in a scene instead of using a different skin for each one. What type of scenes are you actually doing with all the idols you are creating? Still or animation? If you like doing animations I might have something that would interest you.

    Mainly I use asian female textures like

    https://www.daz3d.com/acicia-bundle-for-genesis-8-females

    https://www.daz3d.com/co-reine-and-co-reine-hair-for-genesis-8-females

    https://www.daz3d.com/co-ichigo-and-ichigo-hair-for-genesis-8-females

    https://www.daz3d.com/melody-for-rynne-8

    https://www.daz3d.com/lancy-character-with-dforce-hair-and-expressions-for-genesis-8-female

    https://www.daz3d.com/yui-character-and-hair-for-genesis-8-female

    https://www.daz3d.com/kim-seohyun-for-genesis-8-female

    https://www.daz3d.com/vivy-character-and-hair-pack-for-genesis-8-female

    https://www.daz3d.com/yiyi-and-expressions-for-genesis-8-female

    at this time only can use a max of 3 G8 characters with full textures and clothes, more of 3 characters I must reduce textures using V3DSO Scene Optimizer plugin.https://www.daz3d.com/scene-optimizer

    animations, impossible with this ton of G8 morphs and dforces applied, doable with Aiko3 and Genesis1 but G8 for my PC is impossible.

    yep I do stills only.

     

  • kwanniekwannie Posts: 571

    If you have read any of my other threads you can see that I have a very big interest in converting MMD motions to BVH so that they can be used in DAZ and even saved as an Aniblock. I can conver both body motion and face  (lip sync) dat into BVH. I was looking at the music video that Sakura might have done and I found Fiesta, Produce 48, Kiss Me and several others. All of these have beed traced into MMD which I can convert the motion into BVH. I have made several videos using KPOP and JPOP motions and I have been able to get my system to render to about 4 frames a minute with three characters  and I just have a single standard GTX 1080. I also attached a picture of an MMD stage that I can convert to OBJ. and bring into DAZ. Anyway, not trying to sell you on it, just letting you know what is possible. I do it all the time.

    stage test jg.jpg
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  • ZilvergrafixZilvergrafix Posts: 912
    kwannie said:

    If you have read any of my other threads you can see that I have a very big interest in converting MMD motions to BVH so that they can be used in DAZ and even saved as an Aniblock. I can conver both body motion and face  (lip sync) dat into BVH. I was looking at the music video that Sakura might have done and I found Fiesta, Produce 48, Kiss Me and several others. All of these have beed traced into MMD which I can convert the motion into BVH. I have made several videos using KPOP and JPOP motions and I have been able to get my system to render to about 4 frames a minute with three characters  and I just have a single standard GTX 1080. I also attached a picture of an MMD stage that I can convert to OBJ. and bring into DAZ. Anyway, not trying to sell you on it, just letting you know what is possible. I do it all the time.

    if you have a Youtube channel I would love to view your animations, or any other video website, Fiesta is the most recent song of IZONE, the Kpop Group where Sakura is in.

     

  • This is probably about as good as I can get it using morphs alone without spending a lot more time on it and saving multiple versions(and probably making it into a mess). I did switch the skin from Grace Yong for G8F to Hinako for Mei Lin 8, plus I had to tinker with the Transmitted Measurement Distance & Scattering Measurement Distance in order to get rid of the random black specks that appear randomly on her skin in iray renders. Found a number of bikini shots of her & shaped the legs + torso.

     

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  • ZilvergrafixZilvergrafix Posts: 912
    edited April 23

    This is probably about as good as I can get it using morphs alone without spending a lot more time on it and saving multiple versions(and probably making it into a mess). I did switch the skin from Grace Yong for G8F to Hinako for Mei Lin 8, plus I had to tinker with the Transmitted Measurement Distance & Scattering Measurement Distance in order to get rid of the random black specks that appear randomly on her skin in iray renders. Found a number of bikini shots of her & shaped the legs + torso.

    Great job!, you light setup is wonderful too. even if not 100% accurate Sakura you have a nice character!

    analyzing your morph, is very closer than mine, you are getting something there!! surprise

    maybe the eyes need some tweak, more rounded, and thin lips, take a look:

     

    Post edited by Zilvergrafix on
  • kwanniekwannie Posts: 571

    I don't have a youtube channel so I attache a zip of the first 1000 frames of a video I made usinf Fiesta converted into BVH.  Now the disclaimer is that this was quick test vid without any adjustments. BVH files always have to be cleaned up for jerkiness, and some of the bends ans rotations need to be tweaked. But it is a very simple process once you get to steps down. I reduced the quality of the vid to keep it small, and I used  HD Visemes at 100 percent which drove the lip shapes a bit hard. But this should give you an idea. BTW I rendered at 1080 X 870 used Scene optimizer and got just ove 100 frames  in two and a half hours.

    zip
    zip
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  • kwanniekwannie Posts: 571

    I just attached another face gen dat based on the last photo above, I couldn't resist........lol.

    zip
    zip
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  • kwanniekwannie Posts: 571

    I know I know.....I'm posting a billion attachments, just figured I would go ahead and send the other two dat files I had just in case they are useful. OK thats all...............

  • kwanniekwannie Posts: 571

    ......................couldn't get the attachemet to upload in last comment, because I tried to put both in one zip file.

    zip
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    Sakura 3.zip
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    zip
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    Sakura 4.zip
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  • This is probably about as good as I can get it using morphs alone without spending a lot more time on it and saving multiple versions(and probably making it into a mess). I did switch the skin from Grace Yong for G8F to Hinako for Mei Lin 8, plus I had to tinker with the Transmitted Measurement Distance & Scattering Measurement Distance in order to get rid of the random black specks that appear randomly on her skin in iray renders. Found a number of bikini shots of her & shaped the legs + torso.

    Great job!, you light setup is wonderful too. even if not 100% accurate Sakura you have a nice character!

    analyzing your morph, is very closer than mine, you are getting something there!! surprise

    maybe the eyes need some tweak, more rounded, and thin lips, take a look:

     

    I probably wouldn't be able to do that at this point & would end up having to start from scratch again, lol. Making the lips thinner would be easy, but then the entire jaw, chin, cheeks & cheek contours, nose, etc., would have to be resized/shaped again(lots of morphs) in order to be within proportions that yield a general likeness of her face. That photo appears to be a formal glamor or promo shot, and it looks like she has her eyes a little widened as part of her facial expression for the shot, so I wouldn't expect that look to be her neutral face(which is what I was trying to shape) in regards to the eyes. I stayed with using 3 photo references from different angles that had the least amount of facial expression. If I tried using too many different photos for different parts of the face, I would end up making a mess because everything would end up way way out of proportion.

    The scene was very basic and only used 3 spotlights & 3 cameras with the character at the default position(0,0,0). The first two spotlights were aimed at the head while the third one was aimed at the knees.

    Spotlight #1 Xt 23.27, Yt 200.54, Zt 207.93, Xr -9.51, Yr 6.52, Zr 0.00. Spread Angle 90.00, Light Geometry Disk, Height & Width 50.00, Lumens 90,000, Temp(K) 6000

    Spotlight #2 Xt -218.68, Yt 164.22, Zt 0.00, Xr 0.00, Yr -90.00, Zr 0.00. Spread Angle 90.00, Light Geometry Disk, Height & Width 50.00, Lumens 50,000, Temp(K) 6000

    Spotlight #3 Xt 23.27, Yt 96.92, Zt 207.93, Xr -9.51, Yr 6.52, Zr 0.00. Spread Angle 90.00, Light Geometry Disk, Height & Width 50.00, Lumens 80,000, Temp(K) 6000

    All default setting were used for the cameras except for the Focal Lengths. The full body shot used a focal length of 100.00 while the other two used 50.00. I did not use DOF. The render settings were all default & set to render "Scene Only". I'm probably still a long way off compared to her real-life facial specifications and was only successful at getting it to kind of looking like one or two of her pictures.

  • ZilvergrafixZilvergrafix Posts: 912
    kwannie said:

    ......................couldn't get the attachemet to upload in last comment, because I tried to put both in one zip file.

    thanks!

  • ZilvergrafixZilvergrafix Posts: 912

    I probably wouldn't be able to do that at this point & would end up having to start from scratch again, lol. Making the lips thinner would be easy, but then the entire jaw, chin, cheeks & cheek contours, nose, etc., would have to be resized/shaped again(lots of morphs) in order to be within proportions that yield a general likeness of her face. That photo appears to be a formal glamor or promo shot, and it looks like she has her eyes a little widened as part of her facial expression for the shot, so I wouldn't expect that look to be her neutral face(which is what I was trying to shape) in regards to the eyes. I stayed with using 3 photo references from different angles that had the least amount of facial expression. If I tried using too many different photos for different parts of the face, I would end up making a mess because everything would end up way way out of proportion.

    Which image did you use for this result?

  • I used the following 3 image at the bottom. The first one for the eye to cheek to chin shape; the second for the facial outline, eye to nose to mouth to chin position; and the third for the facial depth/shape. One of the things I got wrong with it was the vertical distance relationship between the eyes, nose, and mouth, which is why the model's cheeks are a bit longer than they should be. Also, the face needed to be a bit more convex. I'm rendering from the same camera used in that image so you'll be able to see the difference when its completed after I used your more recent reference image to make a few changes.

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  • Here they are, two of them at least, taken from the same cameras: I actually liked the first set that I did better, but I think the second set are probably a little bit closer.

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  • ZilvergrafixZilvergrafix Posts: 912

    thanks for you tips and for the image references.

  • thanks for you tips and for the image references.

    Np, I just hope you have a better graphics card than I do. Trying to do likenesses of someone from photos goes a lot quicker & smoother when you don't have to wait 5-10 minutes to see how a minor shape change renders. My next desktop is going to have a Titan RTX for sure!

  • ZilvergrafixZilvergrafix Posts: 912

    Np, I just hope you have a better graphics card than I do. Trying to do likenesses of someone from photos goes a lot quicker & smoother when you don't have to wait 5-10 minutes to see how a minor shape change renders. My next desktop is going to have a Titan RTX for sure!

    I have a GTX 1060 6Gb edition, and satisfies all my needs of rendering, I can afford a RTX 2080 but I made a promise this year not waste more money in hardware for 3D Renders that nobody view even posting on "Show your iRay renders" angry or  "the club post of ignoring Zilvergrafix´s great renders bc they are undoubtely better than us" angry

    #endoftherant #nowicandopornlikenormallydo

    anyway... this is my final result:

    that concludes my vision, next goal is mastering Blender and Zbrush for a more complete set of tools and in a distant future make a better Sakura clone.

     

     

  • Catherine3678abCatherine3678ab Posts: 2,803

    Looks good.

     

  • ZilvergrafixZilvergrafix Posts: 912

    Looks good.

     

    thanks! laugh

  • info_b3470fa520info_b3470fa520 Posts: 753
    edited April 27

    White Paper:  Working with Difficult Photos in DAZ Studio

     

    There are now at least three software applications that turn a portrait photo into a 3D character in DAZ Studio. What these software applications have in common is that they apply the shape changes that a custom character causes to the base Genesis figures (morphing) and also apply texture from the photo to the 3D head (texture mapping).

    With that said, all three use different methods to achieve this goal and with various grades of success. This paper attempts to examine the challenges presented by “difficult” photos.

    What is a “Difficult Photo”?

    All three can handle frontal and unsmiling photos relatively easily. Unfortunately, the majority of photos are not straight-on “mugshots” but photos where the face is partially rotated at least in one axis. The majority of photos also tend to have an “open smile” with teeth showing. (see Picture 1 below).

     

     

     

     

    Here is a schematic of these challenges (Picture 2):

    Any “Photo-to-3D Head” software thus needs to perform a few additional tasks if it wants to succeed:

    1. Establish rotation angle/degree and direction, create a new and uniform shape and then rotate the 3D mesh back to frontal.
    2. Also detect if a photo represents close lips or an open smile. The method to do so is to deploy an automatic “facial feature detection” algorithm that find several dozen significant points in a photo that represent eyes, nose, mouth, etc. By comparing these pointsets the software needs to “decide” if there is an open smile present or not.

    Once the 3D head is rotated back to frontal with the corrected shape, the texture mapping can take place. This represents a further challenge; Since part of the texture is turned away and not visible, a method needs to be found to replace or repair missing texture.

    Compare Results of Shaping Heads based on a Difficult Photo.

    Below you can observe three samples on how the various software performed with the same photo. As is obvious, they achieved various degrees of success in capturing the shape of the head.

    The first head on the left captured both the shape of the head and the open smile well. The head on the middle did a poor job in capturing the shape but recognized the open smile. The head on the right did a good job in re-creating the shape of the head but was not built to recognize or display an open smile with teeth showing (see Picture 3 below).

     

    What About Texture Mapping?

    Here the three compared software applications also showed differences.

    The head on the left captured and applied texture correctly. The middle head also did a decent job of applying the texture but missed on the overall hue. It also captured some artifacts like the remnant of the hair. The head on the left did poorly, since it “painted” teeth on the lower closed lip. Otherwise it did capture texture and hue nicely albeit did poorly in filling in missing texture to the left of the nose.

    Overall Conclusion

    Our goal was not to judge performance, but rather to explain why different software processes produce different results. As we said above, with simple, straight and unsmiling photos at least two of the three software performed well, so anyone who can replace challenging (rotated+smiling) photos can do so and get good results.

    Resource photo to run your own test:

    Post edited by info_b3470fa520 on
  • fred9803fred9803 Posts: 999

    A good synopsis info_b. It's also very hard for a face-on photo to generate depth data... length of nose, cheek/chin depth etc.

    I would have liked Face Transfer to include a face profile option like the other software apps. to help with facial geometry.

  • Speaking of which: there are a lot of very talented people on this thread. If anyone is interested to be a beta tester for the upcoming HeadShop 13, please send me an email to [email protected] To preview the new version, follow this link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5IhOtNPzhI

    Laslo

  • Catherine3678abCatherine3678ab Posts: 2,803

    Speaking of which: there are a lot of very talented people on this thread. If anyone is interested to be a beta tester for the upcoming HeadShop 13, please send me an email to [email protected] To preview the new version, follow this link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5IhOtNPzhI

    Laslo

    email sent :-)

  • davidtriunedavidtriune Posts: 330

    if only we could take pictures of anyone using an orthographic camera. that would solve all our problems.

  • ZilvergrafixZilvergrafix Posts: 912

    Speaking of which: there are a lot of very talented people on this thread. If anyone is interested to be a beta tester for the upcoming HeadShop 13, please send me an email to [email protected] To preview the new version, follow this link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5IhOtNPzhI

    Laslo

    looks promising your plugin, can you make a test using Sakura photos?, I saw your plugin can do many aproximations with a 3/4 faced image, btw you did a digital version of some entrepreneur

     

     

     

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