New Iray render engine. Too good to be true?

kyoto kid

CypherFOX said:

Greetings,

Out of curiosity, run the same render w/o Spectral Rendering and see what the times are?  And see if you can really tell the difference for that scene...

--  Morgan

 

..r.unning a test with spectral rendering turned off now.

kyoto kid

nonesuch00 said:

kyoto kid said:

...OK ran a test with a scene that had one G2F figure five emissive lights, a simple setting with a a water surface shader (all manually optimised for Iray) with the following settings:

Render size 900 x 675

Firefly FIlter: On

Noise Filter: On

Render Quality: 2

Max Samples 15,000

Max Time: 28.800 seconds

Rendering Converged Ratio: 100%

Spectral Rendering Natural, Observer: cie 1931

Draw Dome: Off

ISO 64

f stop 7.2

Burn Highlights: 0

Crush Blacks: 0

SS Haze 0.05

SS Blue-Red tint -0,05

The process was cancelled at 99.02% Convergence

Total Time 7h:51m:26s

Iterations 10,635.

Yeah, for CPU rendering, decent noisless quality is definitely slower and the Iray hair shader still looked wrong.

That's pretty.

...thank you. I am doing ths as a tribute to Draagonstorm (the character's albino skin was created with Skin Builder Pro for Genesis/G2F which she collaborated with Zev0 on)  Just wish I could get the hair looking better.

Taoz

kyoto kid said:

Taozen said:

White/light grey hair seems to be difficult to get right in general.

...it's not so much the colour as it is the way Iray treats trasnmapped hair.  I used Slosh's UHT2 and had to crank up the cutout opacity to 200% (opacity setting 3) yet the upper part of the hair still looks slightly thin and transparent as does the tail behind. As the character is an albino, it should be colourless (appearing almost white) but even using the "Stark White" colour setting, it still comes out somewhat grey.

When I tested the UHT2 shaders I managed to produce this, apparently because I did something wrong (the grey version in one of my posts below on the same page is correctly done), but I'm not sure what it was.

http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/1340551/#Comment_1340551

kyoto kid

...OK got the results, and the test with Specular Rendering turned off took 5h:48m to get to about the same convergence (99.05%  with 8,212 iterations) saving only about 2 hours over the previous test. There is a slight difference in teh appearance, however I need to take a closer look at the two different tests when my eyes are not as tired.

kyoto kid

Taozen said:

kyoto kid said:

Taozen said:

White/light grey hair seems to be difficult to get right in general.

...it's not so much the colour as it is the way Iray treats trasnmapped hair.  I used Slosh's UHT2 and had to crank up the cutout opacity to 200% (opacity setting 3) yet the upper part of the hair still looks slightly thin and transparent as does the tail behind. As the character is an albino, it should be colourless (appearing almost white) but even using the "Stark White" colour setting, it still comes out somewhat grey.

When I tested the UHT2 shaders I managed to produce this, apparently because I did something wrong (the grey version in one of my posts below on the same page is correctly done), but I'm not sure what it was.

http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/1340551/#Comment_1340551

...yeah, I notice the white hair looks more "translucent". 

Here is what true albino hair should look like:

Basically the hair has no melanin (basically colourless) so it appears "white" in most light.  Sadly there seem to be no really good white hair textures for transmapped strip textured hair as they all tend to come out more grey or silver when rendered. Removing the colour map and going to a stark white 255,255,255  often removes the finer hair details so it loses depth and looks flat.  Apparently I fear to get an accurate appearance might mean having to use fibremesh.

nonesuch00

kyoto kid said:

Taozen said:

kyoto kid said:

Taozen said:

White/light grey hair seems to be difficult to get right in general.

...it's not so much the colour as it is the way Iray treats trasnmapped hair.  I used Slosh's UHT2 and had to crank up the cutout opacity to 200% (opacity setting 3) yet the upper part of the hair still looks slightly thin and transparent as does the tail behind. As the character is an albino, it should be colourless (appearing almost white) but even using the "Stark White" colour setting, it still comes out somewhat grey.

When I tested the UHT2 shaders I managed to produce this, apparently because I did something wrong (the grey version in one of my posts below on the same page is correctly done), but I'm not sure what it was.

http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/1340551/#Comment_1340551

...yeah, I notice the white hair looks more "translucent". 

Here is what true albino hair should look like:

Basically the hair has no melanin (basically colourless) so it appears "white" in most light.  Sadly there seem to be no really good white hair textures for transmapped strip textured hair as they all tend to come out more grey or silver when rendered. Removing the colour map and going to a stark white 255,255,255  often removes the finer hair details so it loses depth and looks flat.  Apparently I fear to get an accurate appearance might mean having to use fibremesh.

You probably need to start at 0.8, 0.8 0.8 and work you why up for white hair for the shades of white.

AllenArt

AllenArt said:

Rashad Carter said:

pkappetein said:

So how can I make it brighter inside ?   I tried all the lamps  and didn't work.   and when i change ISO  (which works)

but then the skydome and env. outside turns into a flaming war..  (and rendering takes a long long time)  idk why  if you just change the iso.

 

Apparently when a human being is standing in a dark room the pupils become dilated. This has the effect of allowing much more light in. While this dilation allows enough light for us to see the room, it also allows us to see the outside as it would appear with our pupils accepting much more light than usual. Typically, when in a bright environment the pupils become smaller to avoid overexposing the retina.

So from my experience I think the overexposed outside is exactly what would happen if the room itself had become bright enough to see clearly.

In the end, the Sun is always king of all the lights in any scene unless there's some sort of localized high energy discharge.

If you research such scenarios online I think you will find lots of examples of overexposed outdoors with dim interiors.

Exactly this :) Even a camera blows out the light coming thru the windows into a dark room in an effort to let the l

Laurie

might not hurt to put a very slight shade of yellow in the color chip next to the base color. It looks very slightly yellow to me. And I know someone who's albino. Anyone whose hair appears bright white is using a lavender or blue rinse ;). Hair with no color is ever-so-slightly yellow.

Laurie

kyoto kid

nonesuch00 said:

kyoto kid said:

Taozen said:

kyoto kid said:

Taozen said:

White/light grey hair seems to be difficult to get right in general.

...it's not so much the colour as it is the way Iray treats trasnmapped hair.  I used Slosh's UHT2 and had to crank up the cutout opacity to 200% (opacity setting 3) yet the upper part of the hair still looks slightly thin and transparent as does the tail behind. As the character is an albino, it should be colourless (appearing almost white) but even using the "Stark White" colour setting, it still comes out somewhat grey.

When I tested the UHT2 shaders I managed to produce this, apparently because I did something wrong (the grey version in one of my posts below on the same page is correctly done), but I'm not sure what it was.

http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/1340551/#Comment_1340551

...yeah, I notice the white hair looks more "translucent". 

Here is what true albino hair should look like:

Basically the hair has no melanin (basically colourless) so it appears "white" in most light.  Sadly there seem to be no really good white hair textures for transmapped strip textured hair as they all tend to come out more grey or silver when rendered. Removing the colour map and going to a stark white 255,255,255  often removes the finer hair details so it loses depth and looks flat.  Apparently I fear to get an accurate appearance might mean having to use fibremesh.

You probably need to start at 0.8, 0.8 0.8 and work you why up for white hair for the shades of white.

...this will not work with most white transmapped hair shader maps as many use photo based textures that are already set to 1.0, 1.0, 1.0  and would only look "greyer".  I would effectively have to create my own custom hair textures which is beyond my expertise.  Again, if I simply delete the shader map, I pretty much lose all detail as well and the hair just looks like a flat white shape even though the bump and cutout opacity maps are still there. 

If I had the extra 50$, I'd get LAMH as that at least will convert to Fibremesh for Iray which is a little more "render time friendly".  For Garibaldi I have to convert to a .obj which as I mentioned, ramps up the poly count to ludicrous values (especially for long hair like the character has). 

Evenios

stupid me apparently i have been using it in cpu mode only (but even so it acutally does pretty good render times for cpu only)

i have a 960 gtx so upadating my drivers (thought for some stupid reason my internet is deciding to be slow on me today) but wiil hopefully see massive improvements once i get gpu rendering working LOL.

unknownmystery445

Is the render studio infinite cove already fixed in this version? Many people posted that it looked not smooth in the new DS update.

Taoz

unknownmystery445 said:

Is the render studio infinite cove already fixed in this version? Many people posted that it looked not smooth in the new DS update.

It broke in DS 4.9.3.166, AFAIK that's still the current official version.

pfunkyfize

AlienRenders said:

I find that it is faster, but beware the convergence. 95% convergence is rather grainy now compared to the previous version. I'm now upping the convergence to 99% where I would never do this on the older version.

 

I thought there was something funny going on when 100% convergence was reached on mine quickly. I am running 2x GTX980TI cards and when 100% is reached it still looks a bit grainy than before the update. I am considering making my 980TIs run outside of the box and run a 1070 inside the box but if the grain is still there I may just drop that idea.

I am glad I am not going crazy and it seems you all are experiencing it too. Faster renders but more noise/grain.