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Fiddling with Iray skin settings...

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  • KurzonDaxKurzonDax Posts: 228
    timmins.william said:
    evilded777 said:
    Looks like a nice start, Toyen. Seems like her face is a different tone than the rest of her skin? More reddish?

     
    evilded777 said:
     

    This is what I'm talking about realism... people aspire for this marketing perfection, but a lot of folks I know, their faces/heads ARE more ruddy than the rest of them. Complexion isn't even for most people. 

    Personally, differences like that make the image seem more real.

     

    You mean every figure we render shouldn't look like it just popped out of the pages of Sports Illustrated Swimsuit? Heresy, I say!!!

    The problem happens when that ruddishness (is that even a word?) doesn't blend in with the neighbor texture maps cohesively and you end up with nasty seams.

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,146

    Thanks for the tip Szark.  Turns out that the maps needed more tweaking so got it fixed.  YAY! 

    I think the over all effect needs more tweaking but still don't know enough about all this to make any sort of educated guess. 

    Suggestions? 

     

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  • mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 15,001
    evilded777 said:
    timmins.william said:
    evilded777 said:
    Looks like a nice start, Toyen. Seems like her face is a different tone than the rest of her skin? More reddish?

     
    evilded777 said:
     

    This is what I'm talking about realism... people aspire for this marketing perfection, but a lot of folks I know, their faces/heads ARE more ruddy than the rest of them. Complexion isn't even for most people. 

    Personally, differences like that make the image seem more real.

     

    They CAN make an image seem more realistic. They don't always. Depends on a lot of factors.  Sometimes, it just looks wrong; other times its perfect.

    And when it is uncontrolled/happy accident then is where the problems crop up.  The goal should be maps that are as neutral as possible, that as a set are internally consistent and as error free as possible.

    That means no extra baked in highlights, makeup, occlusion, etc.

    That means consistent gamma and colorspace.

    That means not only should the diffuse have the care and attention on matching the seams, but every other map in the set, too.

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,146

    Oh and thanks for the other comments. 

    Andy, not tried the larger maps idea as of yet because this is a merchant resource (yea, cheating a bit with that but not had time to really dive into making my own maps from scratch as of yet) so rescaling the map up to 8K and back down to 4 K perhaps is not what your suggesting!  cheeky

  • KurzonDaxKurzonDax Posts: 228

    You don't need to scale it back down.  You can use an 8k bump map even if you're diffuse or other textures are only 4K.  The UV mapping doesn't care since it functions relative to the size of each map independently. 

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,146
    edited December 2015

    I think I'm finally getting the skin settings to my liking.  After spending some time looking over others settings, doing allot of comparison renders I'm finally seeing the minute detail I've been looking for but I did something weird and she looks very sunburned right now .... LOL  So not sure what to turn down..

     

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    Post edited by RAMWolff on
  • KurzonDaxKurzonDax Posts: 228
    edited December 2015

    Did you set the translucency weight to 0 on purpose?

     

    EDIT: Nevermind.... You posted settings for one of the eye surfaces.

    Post edited by KurzonDax on
  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,146

    OMG... can I just say how stupid I am sometimes... OK.... I'M STUPID!  lol  I'll get the Face settings uploaded in a minute...

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,146

    *SIGH*  OK, here are the Face surface settings.... cheeky

     

     

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  • KurzonDaxKurzonDax Posts: 228

    Hahaha! No sweat.  I was sitting there looking through the settings thinking wow, this is one whacky setup for a skin shader.  It was only afterwards I noticed the file name of the image and it suddenly dawned on me.  One would think I should have noticed the thumbnails of the texture maps were eyes.

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,146

    cheeky

  • KurzonDaxKurzonDax Posts: 228

    With how it is configured now, you have a couple of different options for applying some solarcain to the sunburn.

    1. You could reduce the translucency weight (maybe to 0.35 or so, you'll have to experiment)
    2. You could lower the red channel in the transmitted color.  This would effectively result in more red being absorbed instead of being transmitted or scattered.  Do this in small increments though.  For example, maybe drop it to .72 and then do a test render.
    3. A combination of 1 and 2

    The color setting for the translucency color may have a bit too much red for that particular translucency map.  It kind of looks to me that the map has some level of a red cast to it.

    From the little I can see of the texture maps, the diffuse map looks pretty saturated and the translucency map looks somewhat desaturated.  Another option you could try would be the following (fair warning, without actually seeing the maps, I can't say how well this will work)

    1. Swap those two maps (put translucency color in to diffuse and the current diffuse map in to translucency color)
    2. Set the actual color parameter of translucency color to put white
    3. Set your transmitted color to something like .9, .9, .9

    Do a render and see what you think.  Use the transmitted color to make tweaks to the overall hue.  So if you think it's too red, lower the red channel a bit. 

  • KurzonDaxKurzonDax Posts: 228

    You might also lower the transmitted measurement distance down to 1 or so. 

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,146

    I've tried it all, still coming out redish.  So there must be a weight setting or something that I can hike up to allow more in?  I have no idea!  lol

  • KurzonDaxKurzonDax Posts: 228

    Are you using v4.8 or v4.9 of Studio?

  • jag11jag11 Posts: 885
    RAMWolff said:

    *SIGH*  OK, here are the Face surface settings.... cheeky

    Richard,  try this:

    1. Set settings from this post
    2. Set Translucency Color Texture to the same one used on Base Color.
    3. Renders on DS 4.8 came out red, in DS 4.9 look more nat.
  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,146

    OK.. .figured it out... the Scatter Only is the way to go.  The Scatter and Transmit is what's causing the red overcast indubitably!  I tried as I went along trying out the suggestions KurzonDax offered and then I came upon that setting and thought "why not?" and sure enough!  ...........

     

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  • AndyGrimmAndyGrimm Posts: 910
    edited December 2015

     

     @RAMWolff

    you lose a big portion of reality when you set scatter only.. you want all those colors getting transmitted!

    Your skin setup IS more or less correct... (screenshoot)

    you have FULL control over redish AND luminance using (Changing) only two paramters...

    translucency color AND transmission color!

    set transmission color to 0.75 0.75 0.75 and see what happens!

    set it 0.5 0.5 0.5 and she goes darker....

    you want more red... R 0..75, G, 0.5 B 0.5

    brighter but more blue and green (lesser red).... 05, 0.75, 0.75   and so on...

    Play with this settings the way i explained it here again...I have a reason why i calll transmitted colors a simple color filter mixer smiley.. because that IS what it does.

    the other parameter is translucency color where you have a map AND a brown....   but it worked before using those values so leave them...

    you can take down translucency weight to 0.4 - 0.45.....  this ALSO makes her lesser red. (in addition to transmitted colors...

    Post edited by AndyGrimm on
  • KurzonDaxKurzonDax Posts: 228
    RAMWolff said:

    OK.. .figured it out... the Scatter Only is the way to go.  The Scatter and Transmit is what's causing the red overcast indubitably!  I tried as I went along trying out the suggestions KurzonDax offered and then I came upon that setting and thought "why not?" and sure enough!  ...........

     

    That is the hallmark of the SSS issue in Studio v4.8 

  • AndyGrimmAndyGrimm Posts: 910
    edited December 2015

    And yes transmitted measurment is a little bit high.... use a value in this range 0.8 - 1.2 ( = also a little bit lesser red)


    AND dont forget to save skins (materials from time to time) smiley

    Post edited by AndyGrimm on
  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,146
    KurzonDax said:
    RAMWolff said:

    OK.. .figured it out... the Scatter Only is the way to go.  The Scatter and Transmit is what's causing the red overcast indubitably!  I tried as I went along trying out the suggestions KurzonDax offered and then I came upon that setting and thought "why not?" and sure enough!  ...........

     

    That is the hallmark of the SSS issue in Studio v4.8 

    Yes and I'm still using that.  I won't upgraded until DS 4.9 is FINAL and released to the wild.  So your aluding to the fact I'll have to change some settings regardless when I finally get 4.9 installed. 

    Also, did see something I'm not crazy about.  In an up close render of the face the pores now look like blackheads on the nose!  lmao   It figures.  LOL 

    OK Andy.  I'll try your setting instructions!  :-)

  • AndyGrimmAndyGrimm Posts: 910
    edited December 2015

    SSS amount is set to 2... lower it to one....

    one of the things i mentioned is the reason for her suddenly reddish skin.... i think it is SSS amount.

     

    Post edited by AndyGrimm on
  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,146
    AndyGrimm said:

     

     @RAMWolff

    you lose a big portion of reality when you set scatter only.. you want all those colors getting transmitted!

    Your skin setup IS more or less correct... (screenshoot)

    you have FULL control over redish AND luminance using (Changing) only two paramters...

    translucency color AND transmission color!

    set transmission color to 0.75 0.75 0.75 and see what happens!

    set it 0.5 0.5 0.5 and she goes darker....

    you want more red... R 0..75, G, 0.5 B 0.5

    brighter but more blue and green (lesser red).... 05, 0.75, 0.75   and so on...

    Play with this settings the way i explained it here again...I have a reason why i calll transmitted colors a simple color filter mixer smiley.. because that IS what it does.

    the other parameter is translucency color where you have a map AND a brown....   but it worked before using those values so leave them...

    you can take down translucency weight to 0.4 - 0.45.....  this ALSO makes her lesser red. (in addition to transmitted colors...

    Do you mean Transmitted Color set to 0.75, 0.75, 0.75?

  • AndyGrimmAndyGrimm Posts: 910
    edited December 2015

    lower first sss amount.. if that does not help enough... set.also .. 0.75 0.75 0.75 in transmitted colors.. 

    Post edited by AndyGrimm on
  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,146

    Hi Anday,

    Tried your settings. Very very red

    Scatter and Transmitt on

    Translucency Color: 0.42, 0.23, 0.16

    Translucency Weight: 0.40

    Transmitted Color: 0.75, 0.75, 0.75

     

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  • AndyGrimmAndyGrimm Posts: 910

    i dont believe you devil

    Set sss amount to 1 !

  • AndyGrimmAndyGrimm Posts: 910

    transmitted measurment is a little bit high.... use a value in this range 0.8 - 1.2 

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,146

    Tried those too! 

    See screen shot...

     

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  • AndyGrimmAndyGrimm Posts: 910

    hmmm.... did you change the light ? ...


    set sss amount and translucency amount TO zero for a test....   or did you work on maps? your base looks extrem saturated .

  • AndyGrimmAndyGrimm Posts: 910

    i see close to zero change - DID YOU RELLY LOWER SSS AMOUNT from 2 to 1  ? devil

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