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Essentially any figure compatibilty comes down to 3 things:
1) Ability to share clothing.
2) Ability to move morphs from figure to figure.
3) Ability to share skins
4) Abilty to share poses
Right now, one day after G2F has been released we have part of 1), ie G3F can wear G2F clothing using the G2F clone it has. However using this you can create your own clone for any figure that G2F supports (which is pretty much all Gen 4 and Gen 3 figures, plus Genesis 1). Those that do not wish to make their own clones can wait until PAs release clones for it.
So 1) is covered. However once you have 1) done, then 2) is also possible, again via transfer utilty, or later with a PA product like Generation X.
3) Will be the hardest from what I have read, but I have not studied the technical reasons of what the issues are yet, but clearly using a different UV system is going to make the kind of skin sharing possible for G2F and Genesis tricky.
For 4) we already have a PA product by Zev0 and DraagonStorm to do this.
So all in all we should get 1) and 2) at some point, have 4) already, and maybe 3) in the future. 3 out of 4 is not so bad.
EDIT: Added point 4)
And that, folks is the game changer...DAZ has finally moved to the 'standard'...
I love standards. They make things so much nicer when they can interact properly.
But. Spooky, just because Studio supports something and there's a line in a changelog about it...please trumpet it a little more? The difference between what is 'supported' and what is used, because nobody really knows about what is supported is pretty big (or has been...not sure of the undocumented supported features at the moment, as we don't usually find out about them until much, much later...)
This in combination with the Optitex dynamic clothing question brings up a cool thought.
It is called dual quaternion skinning. :) It is in 3DS Max, Maya, Motion Builder, Blender, Softimage, etc. It isn't new, DS has supported it for some time now, it just hasn't been used by anyone in DS. It isn't proprietary and while Autodesk software does use it, they don't own it. :) Using Gen4 dynamic cloths on gen6 was a pain, assuming you started with a gen6 figure that remotely was the same shape and proportions to the gen4 figure the outfit was made for.
Now, Poser has that cloth room thing (I think Carrara has something as well), however... Autodesk. FEA. what!? simulating clothing drapes using "Finite Element Analysis". Forget about mimicking a drape, we'll simulate it for real at the thread level of the cloth, (Supercomputer required for best results), lol.
I don't mind GF3 not being backwards compatible, I'm happy to have GF2 for all my Mil4 and 5 needs.
What I have an issue with, is the way they rolled her out. No teasing, no buildup, no warning, no anticipation. DAZ seem to be treating Vicky as Ho-Hum, no big deal. I plan on getting her eventually, But like any costumer, I liked to be charmed, convinced.
Frankly they should have waited until they rolled out DAZ Studio 5, now that it seems that they are fazing out 3Delight render engine for the Iray render system. I haven't invested in anything Iray until I know for sure, I know I'll get her, V7 is just too beautiful, especially knowing that Mike7 will be on the way. But I'm burned by not having mated pairs, No Hiro 6 for Aiko6, No Bishie6 for Keiko6. No more picking up another girl without knowing a boy is on the way. All my Manga dreams are pretty much stuck with Aiko 4 and Hitomi/Hiro5. And I REALLY love Aiko 6, she is beautiful!
I really wish DAZ would talk to us about the direction that they are going with the company. They seem to be all over the place. Am I even their target audience? I need to know what to invest. Iray lights and shaders?? Is that the future of DAZ Studio. I kind of need to know now so I can invest in learning how to use it. Simply put, its so overwhelming. Where is the step by step tutorial? What do all these scientific words mean? And how does it apply? I look at all these new panels in Studio and I'm wandering how I'm suppose to understand all this. I only have maybe 1 hour a day to play with DAZ, time is very important to me with working full time, spending time with the family, trying to find the time to read and pray and working up the courage to draw again.
All day I've been thinking about this. This feel like I've been slapped because they know I'll buy her anyway. Maybe I need to walk away completely from DAZ as a company. Sorry about the rant, this roll out was a rude awakening.
Agreed! I have even less time than you and I know I could sure do with some good tutorials and explanations on terminology etc. Iray, shaders, skin textures, UV maps.... it hurts my mind.
I could seriously do with some Oompa-Loompa's running around figuring it out for me and just telling me "Push here to make pretty pictures"! :P
Actually everyone has been looking at the tease of V7's back for the last week... and no one noticed to even begin the speculation threads.
Also DAZ has said DS v5 designation is for when they are ready to change the SDK, because it would break plugins.
Great render Hellboy !
I think V7 is one of their best !!!
Well, I was not planning on purchasing V7, as I just don't need it. However with the associated sales, several Items I've been looking at were drastically discounted. When I put everything in the cart, it was $80 without V7, $40 with, so she was essentially a freebie...
Now, my computer is older, and as such this doesn't apply to everyone.... but man, the G3 is a memory hog. Just loading G3 took 5 minutes to load in, and used 3.5gig ram (I might have other issues here, but...) Then when I tried a simple 3dlight render, I get this:
I expect there is a bit of operator error involved, but I think I'll be holding off on "buying in" on G3 stuff for a bit.
Midnight_stories, what is that outfit?????
My feelings I guess are mixed on the release, when I seen the email this morning before I clocked in for work was excited, slightly shocked but I was shocked we didn't see her sooner, and I guess kinda annoyed it was that sudden, but V7 does look amazing, and the discount for prior owners of pose builder is nice. My first thought was to buy the uv coverter when Slosh releases it so was sad when I read it's not going to be possible to make it, so does that mean there wil no longer be a way to use textures from Genesis 2? And with GenX are we gonna have to wait for GenX3 to be created like with GenX2 since everything different again?
I'm curious to see what Zev0 is working on for Genesis 3. Is your new product you linked to going to be sold here Slosh, it looks great.
Actually everyone has been looking at the tease of V7's back for the last week... and no one noticed to even begin the speculation threads.
Also DAZ has said DS v5 designation is for when they are ready to change the SDK, because it would break plugins.
While I certainly missed that (as I really wasn't looking) I did call it back in April that I expected G3 to be released within 2 months...
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/55359/
Almost to the day...
This is very good post Genesis 3 Female and V7 by SickleYield
Some things are explained in clear and objective manner as expected from one of the top-notch PAs.
The most harsh thing to consider is
That's also sad news. Well, maybe still David 7 ?
Midnight_stories, what is that outfit?????
If you mean this one It's called "Road Predator" I have a stand alone whip and poses also. But Daz is sitting on it, so don't know when it'd going to be released. More shots in the gallery.
Just wondering, is there an Iray skin converter for G3F (like the one for G2F/G2M that used to be in the 4.8 beta content installer, but it's nowhere in sight in the 4.8 release Starter Essentials installers), or do I have to buy V7 to get the one there? I've hunted in all the usual places, and I can't find one.
Hope I have answered your shader problem correctly here http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/58098/ and it's not found to be a V7 problem.
Cheers :-)
Unless they changed that policy. Like I said it's been a long time since I remembered to invoke it.
Hope I have answered your shader problem here http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/58098/ and it's not found to be a V7 problem.
Cheers :-)
Yeah, I haven't had a chance to try it yet, It was mainly timing... First time I get this issue, is my first attempt to render a V7.... Oh well, nasty Brown stuff happens...
Problem is style. Doesn't look good if the characters are from two different genres.
- Does that mean Gen 4 and Genesis 1 & 2 support in DS will slowly get worse like it was for Gen 4 ("why fix bugs for something old...").
- Will they do a new UV map for each figure for G3 like they did for G2?
- Why not give us more backward compatibility to convince us??? In G2 the G1 clone shapes where there, they were just configured to be only for autofit. So the work was done already, but we had to use a text editor to activate it...
As long as I cannot use Gen4, Genesis 1 and 2:
- morphs
- skins
- cloth
- hair
on G3 I will not switch. But not as 10 PA products, as one this time please.
That's much what I was thinking when someone mentioned that only a minority of users frequent the forums. I don't know how all those that don't ever find out how it all works, because most of what I know I've learned from discussion on here. So much of what can be achieved with Daz Studio just doesn't seem to be documented at all outside the forums.
I didn't realise until someone else said a few pages back in the thread that you can easily access all those hidden nodes in G3's face - it wasn't revealed in the hour or so I spent experimenting with the figure earlier, and I probably wouldn't have found it by accident. Yet it's probably done more to warm me to the possibilities of the figure than the few lines Daz has put next to the usual pouting picture of her in action... 'Genesis 3 captures facial expression in a very life-like way, the movable jaw and increased facial polygons and eye reflection mesh makes for incredibly life-like characters that truly convey emotions. It also has twice as many points of articulation than ever before, for even greater amazing expression capabilities.' Right. This tells me that it does something vaguely improved under the skin, but it gives me absolutely no clue that I can make use of G3s hidden facial nodes straight out of the box. I'd have thought they'd have been keen to make that point rather than have a user make it for them in a place that the majority wouldn't see.
I suspect you have something set up wrongly. When I loaded G3F into DAZ Studio memory usage went from 220mb to 350mb, making her around 120mb or so. Much, much less than my genesis 1/2 figures, but then I have no additional morphs for her so far, just what comes for free, so a small size is to be expected.
She loaded in about 3 seconds.
I had to cut back my time here in the forums and searching through threads. I was a stay at home mom so I had time to study DAZ and experiment, not so now. Going through forums just to understand how it all works is starting to frustrate me. I need Youtube so I can watch how it's suppose to work now. I didn't jump into the Iray Beta cause I knew I didn't have the time. Besides I thought it was another plugin like Reality so I didn't bother. I didn't want to junk up my new computer with unnecessary programs. It barely can handle DAZ a is.
Auto-adjustments will be made for those who bought before the discounts came in, no need to do anything.
Any knowledge on how we will see these automatic adjustments? Will the difference be returned to our purchase method..issued as store credit..etc? When should we see the adjustments by?
So... if you know me, I don't tend to use the female models much. I haven't bought a female on day of release since V4.
I stuck my neck out and bought V7 today.
She bends pretty darn nice, I must say. Better than I have ever seen. Please pay this much attention when you build Michael 7.
Regarding the content other than the model I only have this to say: go read the forums, do your research. Please stop trying to make stuff that doesn't follow the basic rules of PBR and try to convince me that its high-end content.
If you mean this one It's called "Road Predator" I have a stand alone whip and poses also. But Daz is sitting on it, so don't know when it'd going to be released. More shots in the gallery.
YES!!! omg that will be an instabuy for me. :-) I'm a sucker for the "bodysuit" thing - your Sky Chaser is my all time favourite sci fi Genesis outfit....with Eliminator my second all time fave for Genesis 2. (Arcadia Rising is fabulous looking and I drool every time I see it; it's on my wishlist for the moment)
And that, folks is the game changer...DAZ has finally moved to the 'standard'...
I love standards. They make things so much nicer when they can interact properly.
But. Spooky, just because Studio supports something and there's a line in a changelog about it...please trumpet it a little more? The difference between what is 'supported' and what is used, because nobody really knows about what is supported is pretty big (or has been...not sure of the undocumented supported features at the moment, as we don't usually find out about them until much, much later...)That has been under the hood in DS since sometime around DS 3, maybe even 2. :) You will not find it in a recent change log. :)
Like PTEX it is and has been in there, but largely unused, until they find a compelling reason to use it more. In this case they found a compelling reason to use it more. :) And you are hearing about it. LOL.
It is called dual quaternion skinning. :) It is in 3DS Max, Maya, Motion Builder, Blender, Softimage, etc. It isn't new, DS has supported it for some time now, it just hasn't been used by anyone in DS. It isn't proprietary and while Autodesk software does use it, they don't own it. :)
I will point out that there is no problem with Poser adding dual quaternion skinning, in fact there is no reason, other than Smith Micro not wanting to, Poser's devs could not build a native DSON importer to handle this figure, or Genesis 1&2 into Poser.
I will point out that there is no problem with Poser adding dual quaternion skinning, in fact there is no reason, other than Smith Micro not wanting to, Poser's devs could not build a native DSON importer to handle this figure, or Genesis 1&2 into Poser.
It is illegal for SM to reverse engineer the DSON code (DMCA). That is why the add-on framework was developed for Poser 9/2012. DSON is Daz's code, not SM's. Steve Cooper covered this back in August 2011.
I think you have that incorrect. Why would you reverse engineer something where the spec is freely and publicly available:
http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/dson_spec/start
But they can implement the new skinning system as DAZ_Spooky said. No DAZ code required ;)
On reading your post I totally agree about V7, and feel the same. I guess female renders make up 2% of all my renders so far :lol: BUT, I have been playing with the Genesis 3 Female Starter Essentials pack, and I am very impressed. I have been comparing G2F alongside G3F with regards to movement and morphs and there is a very noticeable difference. So much so, that like you, I will purchase V7.
I also hope the G3 male is equally as impressive when he arrives.
There are a lot of strong views on the forums at the moment about the introduction of G3 in general, and I remember feeling the same as a new 3d artist, a couple of years ago, buying up loads of Genesis 1 content to suddenly find G2 was announced. I was determined not to buy G2 but at the same time wanted my G1 figures to have the benefits of the new G2 morphs etc, and eventually I did purchase and use G2 and have never looked back.
Like some others have said, my first reaction to the G3 announcement was..'Oh no, I am not going through all that purchasing thing again and expense for another new Genesis model" but I am sure I will want my new characters to have all the latest 'bells and whistles' and I still have a great runtime full of past characters and clothing I can still use on their respective base models, although I do realise that not everything I have will now work on the new G3 base, but I am cool with that. :coolsmile:
I must also congratulate DAZ (and any PA's involved with the content) for all the items they packaged for the Genesis 3 Female Starter Essentials pack....and all for FREE. There was so much to play with, and definitely helped convince me to purchase V7.
Hope DAZ does the same for the G3M Starter Essentials Pack, and we don't have to wait too long for M7's arrival. ;-P
Cheers.
:-)