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With the ways you can dial in height, body size, etc. to me it's less imortant what name is assigned to a character. David was irrelevant the moment you could shorten him or making him more muscluar or generate younger guys with genesis. As long as different shapes are added into genesis, you can make what you want from the gene pool without worrying about a particular name coming back. I do like the fact that we're getting new "people" introduced rather than stagnating with more recognizable names... the only male that's been a mainstay is Michael and that's probably that's the only male product name that consistently sells.
...and sometimes it is more than "looks the same" like the "new" Victorian Storefronts released today.
If you are talking about 'The Shambles' then that sort of area with that sort of look is pretty typical of English towns and cities today, a lot of english towns have really old areas in them that have changed with the times, personally I don't think there is anything quite like it in the store, the city near where I live still has cobbled streets but some of the store fronts are modern.
...actually to make that new Genesis Generation figure "workable" one really only needs the head, body, and (maybe) expression morphs which are not included in any Pro Bundle. While I wish these were bundled together (they were for Genesis "Classic"), they are still a minor outlay compared to the price of a character pro bundle which is primarily clothing, hair, poses, and skins (with makeup for females) and is pretty much useless without the base body and head morphs unless you want very limited variety for your characters. . The only other base item I would include is the latest update of Zev0's Growing up as then you have age range covered as well.
Years ago I did this with just the base G2F, the base head/body morphs, and Growing Up morphs.
...ugh, attachments are flaky again (not showing up as loaded before saving post).
When I get started to work on Genesis 2 Male or Genesis 2 Female, I just happen to stop myself and get stuck on what to do next. Even if I had more than enough money to buy all the Genesis 2 Pro Bundles, I would be 100% happier if they were 100% Free.
Thanks for understanding. Things have been a little nuts over here this year, and while I definitely try not to be one to bring my IRL drama to the forum, sometimes the ol' brain crashes on me at bad times.
I still see stuff I want, but I think it's an overall obsession and not so rooted in reality.
Like the Pretty Hands and Feet. Am I REALLY going to use that?
Eyelashes...there's a product just for that.....
Eyebrows...it goes on and on Veins....
There's this one muscular one, like muscles flexed, I think. Haven't used it yet. lol
But to imagine amassing all those products over again, just for the latest generation....?
-----
I love getting utilities...like the Atmospheric release today.
That can be used forever so it's a good investment.
I do expect to own EVERYTHING Gen 3 at some point.
Yep, I'm a Dazaholic...damn.
Well, okay. Here's a couple of examples. I design eBooks. They are not commercial, no money is made -- which is just as well, since the content is basically all fanfic which is already posted somewhere else on the internet.
So, back around 2010-2011 I had a couple of different projects which needed models of things which didn't exist in any marketplace.
I asked here in the forums for help.
Two items were graciously provided by a member who did a lot of freebies. A third, which was a specific outfit for a specific non-DAZ standalone figure, I posted a thread offering a commission. It was a simple outfit, but simply didn't exist, the character was very much not a standard human figure, and autofit was (iirc) still a gleem in DAZ's R&D's eye.
A young vendor who had some products over on Rendo, but none here, took me up on it. I had no need for it to be an exclusive, so it was released over on Rendo as well as me getting my own copy.
I doubt that it was ever a big seller. But if something stops selling on Rendo it goes into Clearance, and if it stays there without selling for some ammount of time, it disappears.
That was in something like 2011. The item is still at Rendo. It's in Clearance, yes, but it's still there.
And I am still grateful that the vendor took me up on it.
Indeed,
This is the very essence of a loss leader business model
I allows continued development of the "free" core program.
It is only sustainable if a certain number of users
( with disposable income),
remain on the content hamster wheel,
it pays the salaries of the programmers who gave you "Dforce".
There is nothing deceptive or ,IMHO,even ethicly wrong with such a business model.
Daz at its core is a 3D content company and they make nice
reasonably priced content overall.
Peoples personal economic considerations May require them to sruggle with workarounds and fixes or stay with a certain generation of figures.
True in some cases but sometimes ones comfort Zone is where one needs to stay as long as one is willing to quietly endure the viscissitudes of not updating/upgrading or........( yeah, here it comes)
Aquire the skills to liberate yourself entirely
or at least minimized your dependancy on the PA's.
Perhaps someday DAZ will eventually offer all the Genesis 2 Pro Bundles as a Freebie.
It may or may never happen.
Well, wouldn't anyone? But then, that would be a little bit "entitled" to expect something like that, wouldn't it? What about all the work that people put in on a still very viable figure? ;)
Laurie
...I pretty much have most of the base G2 and even some G3 characters I picked up at a very deep discount, as well as a few for free on special offers.
As I tend to purchase more utilities (morph, skin eyes, etc) I feel I have quite the toolbox to create just about any character I need at a fraction of the cost of buying character based bundles (more so thanks to GenX2 and 3). Again, the base Genesis-"x" morphs are sold separately and not in the bundles which is due to the nature of the Genesis platform, once you have them (and they are a necessity) they work for any character "shape" that is released under that Genesis generation. I also am somewhat selective about clothing as I just do not bother much with certain popular genre (fantasy and horror) as well as skimpy/revealing clothes, which often are well represented in character pro and starter bundles. So for myself a pro bundle, even some starter bundles, are somewhat a waste compared to just buying the clothing items I actually would use. Hair is another. Save for what would fit my cyber apocalypse scenes (shaved, buzz cut, mohawk, etc), I tend to go with relatively "normal" everyday looking hair content instead of the rather wild if not even odd hairstyles I sometimes see included
I expect that he is the first male of a new generation plays a big part.
...one of the more annoying features of G2 was pretty much every character had his/her own UV set rather than using the G2 base.
Fortunately that was somewhat mitigated by Zev0 and Draagonstorm with Skin Builder Pro as well as Sickleyield/Fuseling's Beautiful skins series.
But then that says that it's only worth making the first model and nothing else because people will only buy the main one. Meanwhile all the female models are released and there's at least 3 that's been showing up almost every generation. Lends creditibility to the male items don't sell issue, doesn't it?
The main problem with David was that the Genesis version of him was not truly David. There was no David 4, David 3 was a younger, slimmer, shorter more normal. less toned and built version of M3. David 5 was simply a variant of Mike, rather than being the boy next door or your best friends brother, if you see what I mean. Because he wasn't properly David he failed to make the grade for those who, like me, preferred David to Michael. The number of people who don't work out, don't have a 6 pack, don't have biceps they can flex does tend to be far larger than the ones who are buff, toned and built. Also I think that there are a good percentage of people who are not at the tall end of the scale. Look around you on a crowded street, and see how the crowd is made up, be honest about it. see if you don't agree with me.
Still David, like Hiro didn't sell that much to begin with. David 5 rolled out near the end of Genesis 1 and before V6 dropped so I don't think the faith wasn't there that he would have been a big seller anyway. Still my figures made from the base genesis (or the young adult characters I made with M5) sold better than what was done when i did a shape using David 5.
This sounds very much like another discussion over on another site about support for a diffrenent program or the lack of it *cough*. Same answer though. If you have found a nitche use for an earlier generation and it works for you we are happy for you. If you are making your own content for it, so much the better. PA's are going to make content that sells to the widest audience unless they are independently wealthy and just doing this for fun. While DAZ may push their newest figures, the other site doesn't, and you know what? The availability of content for figures fewer people are using is pretty much the same as it is here.
I still love g2 and find them the definitive medium of both simplicity and complexity for animations and renders. The "6"s are just the most versatile figures on the market as well as the most resource managable. I practically adore them but I still enjoy Genesis 7 and 8 regardless. I still buy older generation content and will continue to add to my 4 and 6 collection.
That's because the issue isn't a company pushing a product, it's simple supply and demand. The majority of paying customers are going to drive what's made regardless of what's being pushed (or what some people think is being pushed), and vendors are going to supply that demand because it's monetarily feasible to do so.
Not arguing about that, only suggesting a reason Michael is so popular; folks wait for a male, not the male.
Genesis 3 are very viable in 8, and I have no issue buying them, but would I pay the same?
No. Why? Because I use G8, and any morphs included in G3 are toughish to transfer atm with associated helpers (It is fairly straightforward transfering the basics.); HD morphs seem to be impossible, that makes G3 of lower value.
I agree completely!!
However in the Daz content market, what we see "on the street" has ZERO bearing on what sells here and that is idealized
Attractive,Fantasy representations of women& Men
That buyers seem to prefer...sales number are not really subject to
emotional considerations.
they are quite binary.
Did this sell?? yes..make more
Did that Sell ?? no...dont waste anymore time
What precentage of over 40 women "on the street" look like Alexandra 8??
"Bethany 7" represents the average BMI of Most North american
Caucasian women. IMHO
in this Market she is considered a Bold, Brave even risky "abberation"
from the " norm" to say nothing of products like the recent "Big Girls" for G8F.
This market is about Fantasy IMHO
people will have to learn to manipulate Morph sliders if they want "reality"
or what they see "on the street".
I loved David 5. Possibly my favorite figure... that said I don't see the attachment to the name. To my mind figures like Elijah, Owen, and Lucian fill a similar niche: sculped figures so not super smooth like the base mesh, but without a 6-pack or strongly evident muscles (since the subject is gen2, much to my chagrin that generation didn't have a David equivalent, I used transferred David 5 for all my male characters... and most of my female ones)
And height is really easy IMO. just use the height slider. I generally use it at around 45% Its actually probably better to do it this way than have characters with baked in height. From a morph autofollow perspective if nothing else (sometimes baked in changes to heights can make the autofollow morphs do weird things)
Big Girls has so far sold 405 copies and was over 100 on its first day. It was a calculated commercial success, and Kindred Arts and I did not just make it because we feel like big girls should be represented (although, since I'm pretty fat, I do kind of like that concept). We made it because we thought it would sell. The only products I make for purposes of representation are the Faces Of products (and up until Genesis 8 they still paid enough to justify that).
My opinion is that Bethany didn't do that well because she didn't commit far enough in one direction or the other. People like characters that demonstrate broad strokes, which they can then moderate by using lower dial values (although maybe that's what you're saying here).
You can't make a slightly bigger girl. You have to make a BIG girl. You can't make a girl that vaguely looks sort of pretty. You make a girl that's smoking hot, or a girl with a unique enough face to add value to a runtime. You don't make a boy with a couple freckles. You make a boy with no freckles, or ALL the freckles. And so on. A lack of moderation represents a risk; but a lack of moderation is necessary to successful marketing in a visual medium, too.
Not really IMHO
The subject of this thread :Genesis 2
has been quite naturally
supplanted by arguably "better" Daz Studio native figures
with majorcontent support from the majority of the PA's.
The "stagnation" that may be Hypothetically occuring
in"other" figure content markets is the result of a woeful lack
of a new widely embraced Female to supplant the 12+ year Old figure
still in majority use. IMHO
we can find such discussions on this site too in the cough Carrara forum
but yeah this is actually a topic that affects many DAZ studio users too, a point of solidarity so to speak
...Steph was sort of the female equivalent of "David". Smaller more petite and realistically proportioned than the tall leggy fashion model Vicky. When Steph4 was released, I was hoping a David 4 wasn't far behind. Sadly that wasn't the case. Didn't care much for Steph 5 as she seemed almost the opposite of the original with the "Curvy" and "Tall" shapes.
Our Lora for V5 did decent as well, though I created the larger shape as an additive to a base for mixing and matching, but then I have larger and smoother shapes shapes mixed through out my shapes in all the generations of Genesis, with the later versions backed up with lots of correctives and JCMs.