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Greetings,
Any word on the Autumn Haze outfit? It looks really pretty, but I'd love to know if the bottom part of the skirt can be made dynamic...
-- Morgan
That is also true for dForce clothing - only difference is the vendor already did all the work and figured out the optimum settings for the outfit in most cases. :)
I haven't yet been able to try the Dforce utilities yet. Real life situations in the way right now (my Dad had a stroke in July so I been back at my parents home in my childhood bedroom with no access to my desktop) but it looks so exciting. I know it's a lot to ask but if anyone has these items below, I'd love to know how well they work.
https://www.daz3d.com/elven-dress-for-genesis
https://www.daz3d.com/dragonkeeper-outfit-for-v4
https://www.daz3d.com/dragon-queen-for-genesis-female
https://www.daz3d.com/dragon-princess
https://www.daz3d.com/priestess-for-genesis-female
https://www.daz3d.com/sensibility-for-genesis-2-females
https://www.daz3d.com/victoria-iven-for-genesis-3-females
https://www.daz3d.com/vintage-rose-for-genesis-3-females
https://www.daz3d.com/winter-fantasy-for-genesis-2-females
https://www.daz3d.com/the-glacierqueen-outfit-for-victoria-4
I was working with the Elven Warrior Overtunic, (which doesn't work well with dForce "out-of-the-box,) and discovered that Self Collide will cause the fabric to seek itself. It was rather funny watching the tail end of one section move sideways and up as it sought out the other section. Here is an image that compares the results side-by side:
I think Daz should change the default Self Collide On to Self Collide Off, and then people would see a lot fewer explosions as they get started with dForce. (Fewer explosions would mean fewer frustrated users, IMO.)
This works for the PA but not the customers. Many of us have thousands of dollars' worth of existing products for existing V4, Genesis and Genesis 2 figures, and just like anyone else, we're not made of money, so saying "go buy the new stuff because we won't make any money off updating the old stuff" doesn't work. The old stuff is already done and there. There's nothing but time. No new software, no new Wacom tablet, no new hardware.
Re-release it and sell it as dForce-enabled, replacing the original, but do it for the figure it was originally intended for, you don't have to make an entirely new one for the latest rendition of Genesis 3/8.
I think you're missing the point; time taken to find where the older files are stored (if they do regular system backups), time taken to make any significant alterations that might be needed (not everything that works as a conforming item will work properly as a dynamic item) and add the dForce modifiers and weight maps is time taken away from making something that is more likely to make them money and pay their bills. I'm sure that in some cases you'll see older items updated to support dForce, but the majority of it will have to be done by us, as unpleasant as that might seem.
I don't have the Winter Fantasy for G2F but I have it for G3F. It works well. I just made sure to turn Dyanmic Strength (under the surfaces tab) to zero for the Buttons, Loops, and String.
Here's the Winter Fantasy for G3F with the hood. I made sure to turn the dynamic strength to zero for the buttons and the pom-poms.
As a musician who has been at it long enough to know I'm good enough to quit the day job and play music for money, I know it won't pay my bills until I figure out a way to get all the money for my work. As long as there's a contract and someone else is taking over half the money I make, it's not logical to quit my day job and do what I enjoy doing exclusively to pay my bills.
I don't use/buy G3/G8 products because I have already bought 42 different G2 characters and tons of items for G2. I'm sure I'm not the only one, either. I'm sorry this technology didn't come out before/alongside G2, I really am, because that would have worked out really well for all involved. Unfortunately, with the rushed release of G3 and then the inexplicable leap to G8 and then when we're most likely at the cusp of G9 or even 10 (gotta keep up with them iPhone releases, though we may never see DS 5 like was supposed to come after .9, now we're back to .1?), yeah you're gonna catch a lot of new customers early and they'll be stoked to find dynamic cloth on their brand new figures. Unfortunately, as is common with this product line, the previous customers are kicked to the DIY curb when new tech arrives.
But that's fine, because all those new fish will experience the "I have your money, now go away" when the next New Thang comes out.
We aren't made of money either. It's not like we make a pack and sell thousands of dollars worth of it. Or time is very valuable if we want to support our families we surly aren't going to do something that is going to give us little return or a huge risk. We have to always look ahead and work on what we have scheduled next. We work anywhere from 10-15 hours a day 7 days a week on projects and If there was money in doing this, it would be done, but a few people don't make up the majority of the customer base and the majority like the new shiny thing and not a repeat of the old just with a few extra options. We have been down this road may times over when Daz upgrades and there are new and exciting things within DS now. We have solid sales numbers that we go by and if it doesn't sell many to cover the time we spent on doing it then we won't go back to it. There may be some that have the time to dedicate a week on a very risky update then more power to them, but most of us do this for a living and we have to think about or families, paying our bills and feeding our kids. People seem to think PA's make hand over fist but that is far from the truth. Most of us are just scraping by and/or have a second job. This is a hard profession to be in and takes dedication, a lot of time and money to keep current on all of our software and updated computers to be able to handle all of these programs. We can spend up to 10k a yr just updating software and computers to be able to stay current on everything. Remember we have to pay Daz 50% of our money so if something is $20 and it on a 60%-70 off sale we are only bring in under $5 after Daz takes their cut. Its not cheap.
DS 4 was barely out when the "what we'd like to see in DS 5" thread was started, for one thing. For another, the newest version of DS is 4.10, not 4.1; software development versioning does not always stop at a .9 minor version as anyone that's studied software like the Linux Kernel development can tell you.
OOo nice I'm hoping that with a little fiddling, we can get a lot of the old stuff to work. Thanks Diva
So far I've had pretty good success with a lot of the older clothing. I just make sure that if they have buttons or pockets or other things that could fall off that I turn the dynamic strength on those bits to zero.
Sorceress for Genesis 3 Female seems to work.
Love the way the sleeves turn out
I understand software versioning. It still makes no sense. If you go from 4.01 to 4.09 then you can say 4.10. If you go from 4.1 through 4.9, you go to 5. Minor versions would be 4.9.9 before going to 5. Or 4.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9.9 and then you go to 5.
But at some point, you have to accept that there's a 5 in your future. Embrace the 5.
Most folks don't want to have to rebuy all of the plugins that they use, especially when there may be some that are never updated again. It's happened before, and I'm pretty sure that's why DAZ has made every effort to keep the plugin SDK unchanged, which will be required when they do finally decide to go that step.
It is NOT a decimal system. Each number between the dots is INDEPENDENT and an integer. The first number is the major version, the next one is the minor version, and then come the built numbers. DAZ can go to 4.768.xxx if they like or beyond, there is no limit and it is standard in software labeling. The current verison of the Mac operating system OSX is 10.13 (ten.thirteen) before that one were 10.12, 10.11, 10.10, 10.9 etc.
Ciao
TD
There are two choices here that have absolutely no bearing on the end-user:
1: You have a family
2: You quit a job working for someone else that supported your entirely-optional, not-required-by-law family to pursue your hobby as a vocation, before you had enough money saved or before making the proper investments that would cover your expenses (losses) while you signed away 50% of your paycheck for said labors because that was the only deal being offered.
And this is exactly why you can't buy my music anywhere. I knew it was a screwjob. I can see it from here. I saw it from 30 years back when I first started.
I know PAs are getting shorted. No, you're not selling 10K copies a month for $5 each and swimming in cash. The system is set up to prevent that, because that's how systems are set up for Artists. And then you have to contend with piracy. Yes, I'm well aware of all the pitfalls of trying to make a living from your passion. I don't need to be lectured on it or read yet another rant on how someone's personal choices are supposed to concern me.
I bought products that are extremely limited in their base functionality. Here is now an opportunity for the people who made those products to update them to increase their functionality. If you wish to replace the original versions with the dForce-enabled ones and sell them, I'd probably buy them again to have that functionality, because there's tons of it, and I have a library of Genesis 2 figures I'm happy with, and for the convenience of having it already done.
Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly capable of applying dForce modifiers to them myself, and I'm currently working on that. Others either cannot or will not, and would probably accept the fact they would have to buy a dForce-enabled version of a product they already have, simply because that one little thing would open up the one area that Daz Studio has historically failed at: animation. One of the main reasons it has failed, and what has kept it from being a serious threat to Poser for over a decade, is the lack of a dynamic cloth and hair system. (the other issue was not having an entirely built-in animation system with full graph and keyframing control).
However, it's also been free, while Poser has only increased in price while not making considerable improvements. I get that. I get all of that. It doesn't have to be explained to me.
Alternatively, would it be possible, under the EULA or otherwise permissible, for a third-party to put up a dForce preset for those existing products? Not the original files, just the dForce preset that would require the user to already have the content in question. If they didn't already own the original figure, the preset wouldn't work. That way those who already paid good money for a feature-limited product can still use what they've bought, and PAs don't have to worry about anything except What's New.
I think people are already posting dForce settings on ShareCG, aren't they? There's usually a crowd of amateurs keen to wade in and help with freebies.
Personally, I don't think it is fair to expect the PA to retro-fit dForce presets - there was no prospect of dForce when the clothing was designed. I'm all for users adding to the list of tested products though and, hopefully, some kind soul will build an index of them (not me though - I'm far from being organised enough for that task).
Not just amateurs, Aava Nainen has been posting settings for her stuff on ShareCG, too. And posting the links to those in here and other threads.
In the three years I've been part of the Daz Community, I've seen extraordinary generosity by so many of the PAs, giving their time to help us figure what the heck we're doing! Some of the PAs will have the time and will give us help with dForce settings, like Aave Nainen has. Some of the PAs simple won't have the time. For many, this is not only a passion, but a second job.
I choose to be grateful for whatever the PAs can give, be it free products, free tutorials, or just encouragement. Thank you, guys. You rock in my book.
Seems to me that the subject has totally lost the point of the thread ........but that's just my view
Sorry - didn't mean to suggest that only amateurs helped with freebies, just that they do so too. I hope it was clear that I I do appreciate the efforts of the PAs.
I hate to be "that person" but can we keep to the topic and mainly just post about the clothing that we've confirmed is dForce compatible? That way people just looking for compatible clothing don't have to wade through a bunch of posts about other discussions. There are at least a dozen other dForce threads where other discussions can be had. :)
And on that note, the Valkyrie Outfit for Genesis 3 Female seems to work ok. In some of the more extreme poses it looks like the straps can get oddly distorted, however it seems to work for less extreme poses.
That looks really nice, Diva. Have you tried it with the rest of the outfit?
Thanks, L'Adair. :)
The rest of it is pretty tight and conforming and look like they're supposed to be rigid metal bits, so I didn't really see a need to make them dynamic as that would just make them lose their rigid shape. :)
For me, the main thing I want to use DForce with are capes: particularly https://www.daz3d.com/super-hero-cape-set-for-genesis-3-male-s
Has anyone used DForce on this yet?
I tried; selected the cape, applied the dforce modifiers for 'dynamic' (I have no idea if that's correct or not; none of the help I've found has been worth the time so far), and kept getting an error when I clicked 'simulate'.
I'm sorry. I wasn't clear. I was wondering how the cloth draped with the rest of the outfit in place. I didn't mean use dForce on the other items. I'm playing with Summer Flirt now, and the only part I've made dynamic is the lightweight sweater vest, (the vendor calls it a cardigan.)
Elven dress just crashed DS for me trying it out of the box. To be fair, I'd forgotten to tell it to run from animation, and the skirt started out poking through the ground plane (so at the very least, an animated drape is required)
Had an update in DIM this morning for SY Fantasy Wear Megapack Genesis 8 Female(s) by the Super Sickleyield.
Resolved Issues: 2017-10-30 - dForce added to the product <-- from the readme page
Just tried a very simple test and it seems to work great. And out-of-the-box. The product page hasn't added the dForce compatibility yet.
A quick and dirty render: