Genesis 10
Yui
Posts: 25
Will there ever be a G10 model, and will it be as hated as G9 was/is?
Post edited by Richard Haseltine at
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If we get G10 and it is bad or even somehow worse, I think it would just result in acquiescence. You can only shock and awe like that once, the second time people just roll their eyes and move on or they begrudgingly accept it.
Also, many are permanently on G8 and DS4 I think. There is no changing that due to reliance on older hardware due to the expense of the hardware and the reliance on older scripts. Those 2 things don't seem like they will change in the forseable future.
SO I think if they want G10 to succeed it has to be backwards compatible with DS4 and G8 and G9. Probably way to big of a thing to actually happen.
Or maybe it goes in a completely different direction. A 3D avatar that is completely AI driven, from the morphs, to the posing, to the changing of clothes. Not that I personally would buy it, but just thinking out of the proverbial box how I would keep it alive. Either you have to collect your core audience under one tent, who are currently split between G8 and G9, or you have to go way out there and get the folks who are into AI. Just my thoughts, nothing but pure speculation.
Moved to the Common as it is not a Daz Studio application topic.
Daz has not said anything about a Genesis 10.
Eventually, sure. And all things are hated by some number of people.
I will be surprised if G10 arrives and it is backwards compatible with DS4; the economy is bad, expendable income is low, it's a bad time to ask the customers to buy an entirely new set of content, so for G10 to be a success, I think it would need to have some killer feature that is not already present on G8 or G9, and can't be practically retrofitted to it... and there's strong odds that anything that might be will require new program features that they won't be adding into DS4.
I'm pretty much invested in G9. I'm not creating enough art these days to justify collecting everything again.
Why do you assume G9 is hated? I think it's much better than G8, and it's certainly being supported by both DAZ and PAs.
I don't really think we *need* a G10 any time soon, I'd rather see improvements and features added to the new DAZ Studio. This isn't something I'd worry about now though.
Because a handful of loud, chronic complainers can easily be mistaken for a consensus.
When would PAs, still trying to catch up to DS6 support for existing plugins, have time to create a robust G10 ecosystem?
The generational changeover seems to be around 4 years. I think both V4 & G8 are causing DAZ issues with such a long tail to their usage that G9 probably hasn't reach its full potential away from the DAZ store, especially given the lack of a major technological leap compared to G8. As for a G10.. I suspect few people have an appetite for it yet, and will only do so once there is a visible and significant benefit to using G10. And that will involve completion of the transfer of script tools to DS6 as well as a real 'something' that makes it easier to use or makes the images have a 'wow' factor compared to ones featuring the current in-use generations.
I think it's getting a lot harder to get the required step change to justify a complete new generation, because DS is such a mature & evolved product. That in itself means that the easy, middling and moderately hard stuff has already been done, leaving only the 'extremely hard' improvements to be made.
Regards,
Richard
the only possible things that could sell me on a Genesis 10 would be
separate body parts with individual subdivision to optimize facial HD without the whole mesh and geoshells needing to be subdivided
can swap out those body parts IE heads, limbs etc (already doable with geogfafts) so really G10 would be a highpoly head with addable body parts
like Unreal Metahumans
the bodies need not be humanoid
a quadruped and upright version that can share poses, clothing etc
so dressed cats and other critters which take their normal form but can be anthropomorphic and conversely humans can take a beastly cryptid quadruped form
(I already could do this for over a decade with iMotions in iClone 6, it's just having the same bones named and posed the same, usually Autodesk biped)
a subscription option that actually lets people create HDMorphs and dforce Strandbased hair instead of spending money at online AI sites instead of DAZ3D to get what they want
I'm only just starting to use the G9, and I haven't even installed most of my G9 products yet because of hard drive space...
I hope that both the official team and PA can fully realize that hard drive space is the biggest obstacle to new products, and this situation will continue for several years.
If the G10 is simply a higher quality version with larger file sizes and higher hardware requirements, I can't afford it.
However, I would be very interested if the G10 is highly backward compatible, allowing direct application of G9 and G8 figures without conversion (or with a high-performance converter), and also features more realistic muscle simulation.
But rather than working on the G10, I believe there are other things that need to be prioritized for improvement.
It was easier in the beginning, where things generally were of such a quality compared to today, that there was a huge potential for improvement. The closer you reach perfection, the more difficult it becomes to make improvements that can justify the cost of upgrading. Plus it often requires hardware upgrades, which is a big issue for many, especially right now. Many with older but still powerful graphics card simply can't use them with DS6.
This.
There will certainly be another base figure at some point, but nothing has been mentioned so far. And every single base figure release causes complaints.
I hope not, ans if I hope everything I already bought ist compatible. by the way, I don't hate Genesis 9. For me it's the best character of all the Genesis characters.
Well, I'd call myself a Genesis 9 hater. Wouldn't say everybody hates G9, but at least I am one of them. But who am I to judge. I also hated the most successful figure Victoria 4.
So a possible Genesis 10 means hope to me. It can only get better.
Seperate figure genders, making eyes and mouth a part of the main figure again, bringing back A stance... Oh wait, that is pretty much G8.
So, seriously I think, there is nothing that can be done with a new figure. Daz has to improve its feature list.
Look at Reallusion and you can see, what I mean. No, I don't mean AI.
I absolutely hate AI.
Genesis 10 will be an AI agent that can generate DAZ artists and customers,to buy the artist's work, thus removing the most unstable factor in the equation ... squishy humans. Ugh humans ... hurray AI agents ... where real intelligence lives.
What I hope is a 3 figure set: masculine, feminine, and gender-neutral (more similar to Genesis 1 than 9) for creatures, all with cross/figure features for wearables and similar. HIgh detailed, possibly, like Genesis 2.
Probalby asking too much but... hey, dreaming is (still) free.
Personally would prefer "dForce2 - Now with less explosions" way before any new Genesis figure.
How in the heck is it not!? All this time I thought my topic was deleted! Tried searching for it, and nothing came up. No notification whatsoever as to what happened, or when people reply! I'm now only finding it after mentioning it in another topic, and someone gave me the link! >:{
Figures are, for the most part, software-agnostic. The Daz Studio forum is for questions directly related to DS software.
Not an assumtion. Since it's release, I've scene many complaints about the model on different sites. That's why content for G8 & 8.1F is still more used than any other model. G9 has better topology yes, but pretty much everything else about it I dislike! When compared to all previous models; G9 gives off a {do I dare say} woke vibe.
All new generation figures will be hated by anyone who does not want to adapt to change. Thats just a human reaction.
As someone who works with g9 all day every day, I can safely say it is the best generation of figures produced for d/s. It is way more versitile than any previous generation and can easier adapt to even the extreme shapes I make for it.
But that said, there will really be no need for a G10 until there is some marked improvement in what can be done with d/s. If there is no serious technical growth, then it would just be change for the sake of change and not really becoming an improvement. Right now G9 is perfectly suited for the current state of d/s
ten, spend, will it even bend.
Are you getting on the 10 train?
I actually felt way more creatve during V4 time. I know overall enjoyed myself a lot more.Was using Poser though. I think if DAZ hadn't gone away from Poser products I would still be using it.
Get the basic figures right first, so they look, and bend like real people ( men and women ), and have basic detail like nipples. Provide the end user with the ability to morph the figures across the wide range of real human shapes Once all that is working, then is the time to consider extreme shapes.
Woke vibe? What does that even mean? Best to leave it. I'm sure it all becomes politics and TOS violation in a matter of a few posts.
I do have a fair-size library of G9 stuff, and I work with it as I can. I can't imagine what G10 would have that would entice me to climb the figure mountain again. I have more than enough stuff from V4 to G9 to keep me busy 'til the bitter end. What follows is my briefly encapsulation of the long slog that ensued around G9. I'm not trying to open another G9 argument thread, and I will not make any further posts to this topic.
I will say, G9 offered the promise of more balance between male and female figures, but it has not really lived up to its potential. Somewhere along the way, we got a division between "G9 feminine" and "G9 masculine" with requirements different enough to obviate the whole "one gender" idea. Certainly, the hope of getting figures with both male and female versions proved sort of unworkable. It could just be the sheer amount of extra work to fully realize the one figure in 2 genders. Whatever the cause, we're drowning in G9F content! There are many accounts of serious and irreconcilable bend issues. This is a source of consternation. G9 tends to be kind of a resource pig compared to previous generations - everything seems to end up heavier,. G9 is a cagey development target because of the utter lack of edge-loop structure in its modeling. Despite claims that edge loops are passe and not required, I assure you professional 3D modelers I've interacted with rely on edge-loops to make their forms and topology work. If the concern is human characters, some edge-loop structure would have been most welcome. Creature creators using the proprietary HD tools in DS reportedly prefer G9 to earlier generations. That doesn't help regular customers, as noted above. Due to the G9 topology, there are no delineated lips or nipples. The chest is weird, etc. There's more, but this is enough for me.
After all that, I can only say, some of the G9 assets are beautiful, and I use G9 clones to share G9 stuff with earlier generations.