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No encrypted for me.

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  • SuperdogSuperdog Posts: 765
    edited January 2016
    lx said:
    Superdog said:
    I manually download and install all my files. Will 4.9 mess up my content folder when it downloads encrypted only content? I've backed up my content folder but it's huge and it would take ages to reinstall if it got messed up. I'm petrified that 4.9 will somehow corrupt my content folder. How can 4.9 tell whether products have already been installed so that it doesn't install encrypted stuff over my manual installations? This is my biggest concern and one that I also had with DIM so I stayed well away from it and carried on manually installing content. If I understand correctly it's no longer possible to avoid the new encrypted system after upgrading to 4.9. Will I still be able to transfer files to iClone via the pipeline? Colour me confused about 4.9!

    What no

    Encrypted content is part of Connect (but not all of it) which is completely separate to your current stuff. 4.9 doesn't actually have anything to do with your current content. Buying encrypted content also won't make your old content encrypted.

    There are super justifiable worries about encrypted content but seriously most of these posts are just misinformed worries who don't read or understand the faq and then spread more misinformation to others.

    THIS is the biggest reason DRM is bad. It doesn't matter what the facts are about the changes; only peoples' perception on what those changes mean to them. If it's a hassle or confusing, they'll stop shopping, whether they should have or not (compared to their personal needs.)

    While I understand your frustration with those of us who find this confusing have you had a look at the Connect FAQ? The 35 FAQ's read more like a manual than a succinct summation of the facts. Having bought loads of software over the years I've never before found it necessary to read so much information about a new feature in a point update. This isn't just a small improvement but a completely new way of working approaching the scale of IRAY. So please forgive the confusion and try to offer those of us who haven't yet had time to read the War and Peace of FAQ's some latitiude. Having numerous types of content and different ways to install it is probably more the cause of confusion than any misinformation that might be spread by those of us who lack the ability to grasp how it works or why it's even necessary.

    Post edited by Richard Haseltine on
  • HavosHavos Posts: 5,413
    edited January 2016
    Design Anvil - Razor42 said:
    Havos said:
    Design Anvil - Razor42 said:

    @kaleb242

    Out of curiousity which other apps are you using .duf files with?

    Blacksmith3D reads duf files. When you load a character or material duf, it populates all the correct surfaces, bump maps etc on the figure. Very useful, and it is a program I use a fair bit.

    Interesting.

    What are the advantedges in using a .duf format in blacksmith3d over a cr2? As it reads cr2 as well right?

    I have not tried using CR2, so that might work as far as most files are concerned, assuming it picks up the specular etc maps from the CR2. It would be an extra step needing to export as CR2, but I suppose one that people could live with. I know if I read in an obj file it only picks up the diffuse maps.

    Edit: Naturally I could also save an ecrypted character using Save Character Preset, and then get Blacksmith 3D to read this, so there are workarounds.

    Post edited by Havos on
  • Design Anvil - Razor42Design Anvil - Razor42 Posts: 1,239
    edited January 2016

    If your texture painting wouldn't it be more practical to just load on the textures you want to modify, as you need them,to avoid bloating memory usage with unneeded textures. Anyway getting a little off topic here. Just trying to gauge what it is exactly that people are percieving they are losing by encrypted .duf content.

    Post edited by Design Anvil - Razor42 on
  • lx_2807502lx_2807502 Posts: 2,996
    edited January 2016
    Superdog said:
    lx said:
    Superdog said:
    I manually download and install all my files. Will 4.9 mess up my content folder when it downloads encrypted only content? I've backed up my content folder but it's huge and it would take ages to reinstall if it got messed up. I'm petrified that 4.9 will somehow corrupt my content folder. How can 4.9 tell whether products have already been installed so that it doesn't install encrypted stuff over my manual installations? This is my biggest concern and one that I also had with DIM so I stayed well away from it and carried on manually installing content. If I understand correctly it's no longer possible to avoid the new encrypted system after upgrading to 4.9. Will I still be able to transfer files to iClone via the pipeline? Colour me confused about 4.9!

    What no

    Encrypted content is part of Connect (but not all of it) which is completely separate to your current stuff. 4.9 doesn't actually have anything to do with your current content. Buying encrypted content also won't make your old content encrypted.

    There are super justifiable worries about encrypted content but seriously most of these posts are just misinformed worries who don't read or understand the faq and then spread more misinformation to others.

    THIS is the biggest reason DRM is bad. It doesn't matter what the facts are about the changes; only peoples' perception on what those changes mean to them. If it's a hassle or confusing, they'll stop shopping, whether they should have or not (compared to their personal needs.)

    While I understand your frustration with those of us who find this confusing have you had a look at the Connect FAQ? The 35 FAQ's read more like a manual than a succinct summation of the facts. Having bought loads of software over the years I've never before found it necessary to read so much information about a new feature in a point update. This isn't just a small improvement but a completely new way of working approaching the scale of IRAY. So please forgive the confusion and try to offer those of us who haven't yet had time to read the War and Peace of FAQ's some latitiude. Having numerous types of content and different ways to install it is probably more the cause of confusion than any misinformation that might be spread by those of us who lack the ability to grasp how it works or why it's even necessary.

    It's okay I understand it and I still think it's unnecessary. But the short answer is still no, 4.9 and its Connect content and its encrypted content will not touch your old files in any way.

    Post edited by Richard Haseltine on
  • Design Anvil - Razor42Design Anvil - Razor42 Posts: 1,239
    edited January 2016
    But of course, you weren't going to do encrypted only content either.

    Got a quote on that one? ;)

    Post edited by Design Anvil - Razor42 on
  • ScavengerScavenger Posts: 2,674
    Gr00vus said:

    It's software - it's technically possible. It may be less than simple to implement, but it's technically possible.

    Think "Developers license".  To make iPhone apps, you pay Apple some money and get access to development software that emulates IOS.

    They just make a version of Daz that doesn't use Daz Connect and sell/license it out.

  • HavosHavos Posts: 5,413
    Design Anvil - Razor42 said:
    Havos said:
    Design Anvil - Razor42 said:

    @kaleb242

    Out of curiousity which other apps are you using .duf files with?

    Blacksmith3D reads duf files. When you load a character or material duf, it populates all the correct surfaces, bump maps etc on the figure. Very useful, and it is a program I use a fair bit.

    Interesting.

    What are the advantedges in using a .duf format in blacksmith3d over a cr2? As it reads cr2 as well right?

    I have not tried using CR2, so that might work as far as most files are concerned, assuming it picks up the specular etc maps frmo

    Design Anvil - Razor42 said:

    If your texture painting wouldn't it be more practical to just load on the textures you want to modify, as you need them,to avoid bloating memory usage with unneeded textures. Anyway getting a little off topic here. Just trying to gauge what it is exactly that people are percieving they are losing by encrypted .duf content.

    Indeed, and as I said there are work arounds, I was really just replying to the fact that there are other apps out there that read duf files, and as DS continues to gain in popularity, that list could grow as well, so it is not possible to say encryption is a non-issue since only DS can read duf files.

  • HavosHavos Posts: 5,413
    edited January 2016
    Scavenger said:
    Gr00vus said:

    It's software - it's technically possible. It may be less than simple to implement, but it's technically possible.

    Think "Developers license".  To make iPhone apps, you pay Apple some money and get access to development software that emulates IOS.

    They just make a version of Daz that doesn't use Daz Connect and sell/license it out.

    Actually (and I am an IOS developer with said license), you do not need a paid licence to get access to the software, that is free to all. However you do need one in order to publish your apps to the Apple App Store.

    Post edited by Havos on
  • ScavengerScavenger Posts: 2,674
    Havos said:
    Scavenger said:
    Gr00vus said:

    It's software - it's technically possible. It may be less than simple to implement, but it's technically possible.

    Think "Developers license".  To make iPhone apps, you pay Apple some money and get access to development software that emulates IOS.

    They just make a version of Daz that doesn't use Daz Connect and sell/license it out.

    Actually (and I am an IOS developer with said license), you do not need a paid licence to get access to the software, that is free to all. However you do need one in order to publish your apps to the Apple App Store.

    Huh..maybe things changed since last I looked? (I have a Mac OS developer account, but it's laid dormant for years, and never done more than a cursory glance at the IOS side--Good to know). Anyway, I stand (well lay as I hope for sleep to overtake me) corrected!

  • Design Anvil - Razor42Design Anvil - Razor42 Posts: 1,239
    edited January 2016

    ...

    Post edited by Design Anvil - Razor42 on
  • Design Anvil - Razor42Design Anvil - Razor42 Posts: 1,239
    edited January 2016
    Scavenger said:

    Think "Developers license".  To make iPhone apps, you pay Apple some money and get access to development software that emulates IOS.

    They just make a version of Daz that doesn't use Daz Connect and sell/license it out.

    DS 4.9 already has a version in built that doesn't use Daz Connect. What would be the point of an independent version?

    To use 4.9 without Daz Connect:

     

    DCDS4.9.jpg
    424 x 450 - 10K
    Post edited by Design Anvil - Razor42 on
  • MendomanMendoman Posts: 404
    Design Anvil - Razor42 said:

    If your texture painting wouldn't it be more practical to just load on the textures you want to modify, as you need them,to avoid bloating memory usage with unneeded textures. Anyway getting a little off topic here. Just trying to gauge what it is exactly that people are percieving they are losing by encrypted .duf content.

    Well, my problem with encrypted content is, that I only use DS for posing. Now if/when all the new content is encrypted, I can't move them to Blender, where I do all the heavy lifting ( Cloth simulation, fluid simulation, scene modeling and rendering ), so why would I spend any of my hard earned $ to products that I can't use? Well, technically I can move them as .obj or something, and then tweak materials manually, but I have to admit, I really don't have enough time/interest to do it like that. 3d rendering is just a hobby for me. I rather take my money to other online stores, that will sell me products in DIMM format. I won't complain though, there's dozens of online stores that are willing to take my money, so I will just vote with my wallet, and move my business elsewhere. No big deal and life will go on.

  • Design Anvil - Razor42Design Anvil - Razor42 Posts: 1,239
    edited January 2016
    Mendoman said:
    Design Anvil - Razor42 said:

    If your texture painting wouldn't it be more practical to just load on the textures you want to modify, as you need them,to avoid bloating memory usage with unneeded textures. Anyway getting a little off topic here. Just trying to gauge what it is exactly that people are percieving they are losing by encrypted .duf content.

    Well, my problem with encrypted content is, that I only use DS for posing. Now if/when all the new content is encrypted, I can't move them to Blender, where I do all the heavy lifting ( Cloth simulation, fluid simulation, scene modeling and rendering ), so why would I spend any of my hard earned $ to products that I can't use? Well, technically I can move them as .obj or something, and then tweak materials manually, but I have to admit, I really don't have enough time/interest to do it like that. 3d rendering is just a hobby for me. I rather take my money to other online stores, that will sell me products in DIMM format. I won't complain though, there's dozens of online stores that are willing to take my money, so I will just vote with my wallet, and move my business elsewhere. No big deal and life will go on.

    Maybe I'm ill informed but, 

    How does .duf file encryption of Daz products affect transfering something to Blender? Unless Blender is reading the encrypted .dufs?

    Which other stores can sell you products in DIM format? 

     

     

    Post edited by Design Anvil - Razor42 on
  • fred9803fred9803 Posts: 1,564

    I'm still tring to get my head around a comment earlier in this tread -

    "Up until a few days ago there was no plan for encrypted only content."

    When back in early November last year it was stated -

    "New products will begin to migrate toward a Daz Connect-only delivery."

  • MendomanMendoman Posts: 404

    Well, I use a program/plugin called mcjTeleblender ( an excellent piece of software btw ) to automate the process, and it moves entire DS scenes straight to Blender ( it transfers props, cameras and figures in a scene as .obj and then create materials for them too, so my DS scene is pretty much ready to render in Cycles when I click one button ). As far as I understand, DS scenes only have references to products like Victoria and morphs and stuff like that, so if those products are encrypted, I assume the plugin can't read the information. I hope I'm wrong, but that's a huge show stopper for me, if I have to move everything manually.

    And my mistake, I should have said zip or non-encrypted format, but I hope you still got my point.

  • frogimusfrogimus Posts: 200

    @Design Anvil - I'm sure you are trying to be helpful but your responses are starting to seem a bit confrontational, which isn't going to help. Instead of "why cant you?" maybe phrase it more like " you still can, Exports still work the same" (assuming they do).

    Personally I don't like the amount of screen real estate taken by the DC stuff. The Login button, the extra tabs...All this stuff is irritating. Give me the ability to remove it from my screen and i'll be more content. Especially that ugly, bright vomit green.

     

     

  • Design Anvil - Razor42Design Anvil - Razor42 Posts: 1,239
    edited January 2016

    Well Good news, you do seem to be wrong ;) as mcjTeleblender is obj export based it isn't reliant on the .duf encrypted files to generate your scene in Blender.

    So Daz Connect .Duf file encryption shouldn't effect how it moves the scene to blender, as far as I know. You could drop a quick question here if you wanted to confirm there is no issue with 4.9 or encryption mcjteleblender thread.

    I believe with some of the improvements in the last couple of DS versions the future may include a possible use of .dae support for figures in mcjTeleblender, which whould give some posing control as well. 

     

    Your free to pickup your DS content wherever you choose, and as far as I know thats not likely to change.

    Post edited by Design Anvil - Razor42 on
  • Design Anvil - Razor42Design Anvil - Razor42 Posts: 1,239
    ashley9803 said:

    I'm still tring to get my head around a comment earlier in this tread -

    "Up until a few days ago there was no plan for encrypted only content."

    When back in early November last year it was stated -

    "New products will begin to migrate toward a Daz Connect-only delivery."

    Daz Connect and encrypted content are two different things, Daz connect is basically a built in DIM and encryption is the file protection on some Daz 3D products that will be delivered through Daz Connect. 

  • Design Anvil - Razor42Design Anvil - Razor42 Posts: 1,239
    edited January 2016
    frogimus said:

    @Design Anvil - I'm sure you are trying to be helpful but your responses are starting to seem a bit confrontational, which isn't going to help. Instead of "why cant you?" maybe phrase it more like " you still can, Exports still work the same" (assuming they do).

    Export functions are still the same as far as I know.

    My apologies if I have come across as confrontational that isn't my intention, though Im not actually sure where I did say ""why can't you?"".

    But anyways...

    Back to lurking... hf

    Post edited by Design Anvil - Razor42 on
  • ScavengerScavenger Posts: 2,674
    Design Anvil - Razor42 said:
    Scavenger said:

    Think "Developers license".  To make iPhone apps, you pay Apple some money and get access to development software that emulates IOS.

    They just make a version of Daz that doesn't use Daz Connect and sell/license it out.

    DS 4.9 already has a version in built that doesn't use Daz Connect. What would be the point of an independent version?


     

    I was giving an example of how simple a solution would be for the question of "How would vendors create new products in a Daz Connect Only future".

  • fred9803fred9803 Posts: 1,564
    Design Anvil - Razor42 said:
    ashley9803 said:

    I'm still tring to get my head around a comment earlier in this tread -

    "Up until a few days ago there was no plan for encrypted only content."

    When back in early November last year it was stated -

    "New products will begin to migrate toward a Daz Connect-only delivery."

    Daz Connect and encrypted content are two different things, Daz connect is basically a built in DIM and encryption is the file protection on some Daz 3D products that will be delivered through Daz Connect. 

    I had thought, and I may be wrong about where I read it, that Daz Connect downloads are all encrypted, new content or older content installed via Connect. So anything installed by Connect will encrypted from now on.

    So saying that products will be Daz Connect only is the same as saying they are encrypted only content. Although I may be completely wrong about all this.

  • atticanneatticanne Posts: 3,009
    DAZ_Steve said:
    Havos said:

    Just to address Steve's point number 1). I have written programs that read duf files in order to generate smart data (for older stuff with no smart data), and for other small utility purposes. Not critical stuff, but things I enjoying doing. I understand I am in a small minority that does this, but clearly encryption effects that particular use case.

    I do understand why you are doing this, and I do not believe it is because DAZ no longer trusts its customers, but as has been said many times before, it is a shame when legitimate customers have to suffer due to the criminals.

    Old files are still, and will be available in their old formats and un-encypted. 

    Then why are all the older versions of Studio missing from my Product Library?  Please make these older versions available.  They are necessary for converting old files to 4.8.  I will not be using DS4.9.

  • BeeMKayBeeMKay Posts: 7,019
    ashley9803 said:
    Design Anvil - Razor42 said:
    ashley9803 said:

    I'm still tring to get my head around a comment earlier in this tread -

    "Up until a few days ago there was no plan for encrypted only content."

    When back in early November last year it was stated -

    "New products will begin to migrate toward a Daz Connect-only delivery."

    Daz Connect and encrypted content are two different things, Daz connect is basically a built in DIM and encryption is the file protection on some Daz 3D products that will be delivered through Daz Connect.

    I had thought, and I may be wrong about where I read it, that Daz Connect downloads are all encrypted, new content or older content installed via Connect. So anything installed by Connect will encrypted from now on.

    So saying that products will be Daz Connect only is the same as saying they are encrypted only content. Although I may be completely wrong about all this.

     

    You got that right, but DAZ Connect in itself is a different distribution method *combined* with the encryption. They could also just simply switch off the encryption part, and DC would download&install unencrypted. There was something along the line during the early stages of Beta.

  • HavosHavos Posts: 5,413
    ashley9803 said:
    Design Anvil - Razor42 said:
    ashley9803 said:

    I'm still tring to get my head around a comment earlier in this tread -

    "Up until a few days ago there was no plan for encrypted only content."

    When back in early November last year it was stated -

    "New products will begin to migrate toward a Daz Connect-only delivery."

    Daz Connect and encrypted content are two different things, Daz connect is basically a built in DIM and encryption is the file protection on some Daz 3D products that will be delivered through Daz Connect. 

    I had thought, and I may be wrong about where I read it, that Daz Connect downloads are all encrypted, new content or older content installed via Connect. So anything installed by Connect will encrypted from now on.

    So saying that products will be Daz Connect only is the same as saying they are encrypted only content. Although I may be completely wrong about all this.

    I do not believe this is correct, it was true at the start of the beta, but DAZ abandoned the idea and decided that just "DAZ Connect Only" products would be encrypted. Older products, even when installed with DAZ Connect should still be in the clear, though I have not tested this myself.

  • fred9803fred9803 Posts: 1,564

    So let me get this right. When it is said that - "..file protection on some Daz 3D products that will be delivered through Daz Connect.", so other content installed Via DC will NOT be in an encrypted format.

    This isn't what I read earlier, but thanks for the clarification, and it's good to know that not everything delivered through DC will be encrypted.

  • Design Anvil - Razor42Design Anvil - Razor42 Posts: 1,239
    edited January 2016

    I'm not saying that DC content won't be encrypted, I'm saying that they are two different things. I have noticed in store there are two different icons one for Daz Connect and one for Encrypted content.

     

    This one has the Daz Connect icon: http://www.daz3d.com/growing-up-for-genesis-3-male-s 

     

    This has the encrypted content icon: http://www.daz3d.com/medieval-storage-room

    Post edited by Design Anvil - Razor42 on
  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,725
    atticanne said:
    DAZ_Steve said:
    Havos said:

    Just to address Steve's point number 1). I have written programs that read duf files in order to generate smart data (for older stuff with no smart data), and for other small utility purposes. Not critical stuff, but things I enjoying doing. I understand I am in a small minority that does this, but clearly encryption effects that particular use case.

    I do understand why you are doing this, and I do not believe it is because DAZ no longer trusts its customers, but as has been said many times before, it is a shame when legitimate customers have to suffer due to the criminals.

    Old files are still, and will be available in their old formats and un-encypted. 

    Then why are all the older versions of Studio missing from my Product Library?  Please make these older versions available.  They are necessary for converting old files to 4.8.  I will not be using DS4.9.

    +yes

  • DaikatanaDaikatana Posts: 830
    Design Anvil - Razor42 said:

    If your texture painting wouldn't it be more practical to just load on the textures you want to modify, as you need them,to avoid bloating memory usage with unneeded textures. Anyway getting a little off topic here. Just trying to gauge what it is exactly that people are percieving they are losing by encrypted .duf content.

    the major downsides of encrypted content in my opinion are

    a) the risk of losing my investment in said content should DAZ3D go out of business. It's happened to many people when other companies using various methods of DRM have suddenly folded.  Yes , it was said there is/would be a poison pill solution  but it was also said that there were no plans for encrypted only content and we all see how THAT turned out.  

    b). Losing access to my content as well as the use of studio itself when I build another computer.  If the software is indeed tied to various hardware identifiers of the computer hardware, and those identifiers change, that could be a problem. Maybe not as big an issue while DAZ3D is still a solvent functional company but if/when DAZ3D folds, it becomes a huge issue.   Again you could refer to the "poison pill option" but we don't even know for certain that is even an existing thing because while we were told it was in existence several weeks ago, just yesterday and employee of DAZ3D said in these very forums that it "was being looked into".   Nobody knows what's actually true about this whole DRM scheme and that is making people uncomfortable and distrustful.

    c). Being stuck in a walled garden. The more difficult it is to use content in other applications , the less people will buy the content.  Lots of people like to use their content in different applications.  Adding another level of complexity to this or making it impossible will simply make it so people buy their content elsewhere.  As DAZ3D is essentially a content provider this move has a huge possibility of DAZ3D shooting itself ( and the various PA's that sell through DAZ3D) in the foot so to speak.    Driving business elsewhere in order to protect yourself from business losses is kinda counter productive don't you think?

     

     

  • DaikatanaDaikatana Posts: 830
    Lostboys said:
    timmins.william said:

    I will repeat. Do vendors have any say in whether their content is encrypted?

     

     

              Any clear answear here?So we can blacklist and stop paying vendors who agreed selling their content through a way that is insulting to their customers?

    Sadly enough, it had occurred to me yesterday that there was a possibility that I would no longer be purchasing from some of my favorite artists here at DAZ3D if they choose to have their content encrypted.  I hope that does not happen but I do fear it will.  The vendors in question may not miss my purchases as much as I will miss using their creations but I have to look out for my own best interests

     

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,725

    this is no longer an issue for me, I cannot install postSQL on my PC in spite of checking firewall and AV settings rules exclusions so no connect for me whether I want it or not

    and none of it works in Carrara, fortunately I bought 60 PC items as well as those 3 freebies I shall never see but they will work fine in Carrara and Poser so happy enough, I must back up all my zips for the day I can no longer access my online library, at least I had longer than 30 days and did not need to pay more for a year like SmithMicro makes you so not complaining just getting ready.

This discussion has been closed.