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Victoria 7

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  • MN-150374MN-150374 Posts: 923
    edited December 1969

    HeraldOfFire said:
    ... Curiously, the Genesis 3 genitalia has it's own unique UV map rather than simply sharing the hip UV's like it's predecessors. That being said, it's also significantly more detailed than those earlier models too which goes some way towards explaining the change. ...

    I don´t believe that, maybe you should post some close ups to prove your point ... :-)

  • artistb3artistb3 Posts: 188
    edited December 1969

    Again they do it and again they will probably get away with it because end-users will eventually give in the marketing pressure. I suspect that it will be harder for DAZ to pull it off this time, but eventually users will pay to replace content and users will pay for re-issue of previously-purchased tools necessary for forward and backward compatibility.

    But, again, it is the end-users that have the power to say "not anymore". If end-users take the initiative (via the pocketbook) to provide DAZ this message, DAZ will have to listen at some point. But when, oh when, will end-users finally say "enough is enough"?

  • HeraHera Posts: 1,958
    edited June 2015

    And here I was, waiting for Freak 6!!!

    Besides that the bundles seem kinda pricey and not containing that much. Fi there's only one alternative figure (another caucasian too!) and just 4 outfits in the pro bundle and none of the outfits seems that functional or versatile. Fi no skirt or pair of jeans or jacket or sweater or smth. The only outfit which seems remotely interesting is the vigilante one, that motorbike helmet looks thrilling.

    Usually I´ve been buying the pro bundle to catch the most of it, and then living with one or two things I'd never use. But here there's not that much which motivates me with getting the pro.

    So after having cooled down a bit I'll be getting the base figure and the vigilante outfit and that's about it. And then wait 'til October for the African gal or smth.

    Honestly my problem is not really money - but time to have fun with my investments and thus motivate them when looking myself in the mirror. There's still a lot more to be done with V6 and discovering iray on my behalf.

    Post edited by Hera on
  • KeryaKerya Posts: 10,943
    edited December 1969

    MN-150374 said:
    HeraldOfFire said:
    ... Curiously, the Genesis 3 genitalia has it's own unique UV map rather than simply sharing the hip UV's like it's predecessors. That being said, it's also significantly more detailed than those earlier models too which goes some way towards explaining the change. ...

    I don´t believe that, maybe you should post some close ups to prove your point ... :-)

    *giggles*

  • ValkeerieValkeerie Posts: 163
    edited December 1969

    I use DAZ for storytelling, and buy historical costumes (e.g. Victorian, Edwardian, uniforms etc). Since IRay I find the base figures look amazing and the clothes look unrealistic by comparison. The figure realism has gone up a level but the clothes are stuck. Many simple poses require ludicrous amounts of time and ingenuity because clothes (even quite recent clothing) aren't morphing well. As a rule, trousers have to be painted on with pre-defined creases, and big dresses usually go ape when a character is posed, and they collide through chairs etc.

    So .. no problems at all with G2 figures, endless time-consuming difficulties with G2 clothing.

    Guess what I would like? Speaking selfishly, and ignoring commercial reality? A good selection of decent dynamic clothing and proper collision detection. It isn't rocket science. What I do not need is a new G3 figure. It isn't going to take me anywhere I want to go.

    So I am pleased that DAZ is continuing to develop its products, but the clothing (unless you count endless variations of bikinis and bare-midriff fantasy) looks increasingly out of place.

    Valkeerie

  • nDelphinDelphi Posts: 1,918
    edited December 1969

    artistb3 said:
    Again they do it and again they will probably get away with it because end-users will eventually give in the marketing pressure. I suspect that it will be harder for DAZ to pull it off this time, but eventually users will pay to replace content and users will pay for re-issue of previously-purchased tools necessary for forward and backward compatibility.

    But, again, it is the end-users that have the power to say "not anymore". If end-users take the initiative (via the pocketbook) to provide DAZ this message, DAZ will have to listen at some point. But when, oh when, will end-users finally say "enough is enough"?

    I scratch my head, really. If you don't need V7 don't purchase her. She is not being forced on you or the market. In the end the market will definately decide and I bet on V7 or V8 and even V20.

    V7 doesn't mean your previous figures are made useless all of a sudden. You will see less PA support, but even V4 is getting a ton of new stuff.

    Open your mind to the world at large.

    DAZ 3D is a business catering to a large market. Most of that market doesn't hang out on the forums like we do.

  • RCTSpankyRCTSpanky Posts: 850
    edited December 1969

    Genesis 3 should be the most realictic chacter ever. But until any cloths and hair isn't dynamic and follow each and every pose automatically and correct, they are far away from their goal.

  • DisparateDreamerDisparateDreamer Posts: 2,520
    edited December 1969

    Kerya said:
    belovedalia said:
    ...
    Certain things can cause the drape to not work, and it will fall to the ground. I've noticed that trying to make it collide with a plane prim will often make that happen but i don't know why.

    Make sure the plane primitive has enough polygons/vertices and the clothes will not fall through ...

    it's not falling thru the plane, its falling through the body. And it doesn't matter how may polygons it is, sometimes it happens. turning off "collide with plane" and it will collide again with the body.... its very strange glitch, sometimes happens sometimes doesn't.

  • DrPingyDrPingy Posts: 78
    edited December 1969

    lee_lhs said:
    DrPingy said:
    Is there available a template for Genesis 3 and Vic 7?

    Yes, if you go to your product library, --> DAZ Studio 4.8 --> Genesis 3 Starter Essentials
    The Templates are available for manual download.

    Well hidden!

    Thank you very much.

    If there are more interesting things hidden?

  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited December 1969

    Tharcion said:

    No. The main problem is that there isn't any good looking clothing for male characters. I believe this has a simple basis: economics. Clothing (preferably skimpy, definitely sexy) for female characters sells better. Go take a look at a rendering site and do a quick assessment of male vs female character renders. It is a little surprising that more female outfits don't tend to work as well as they could with breasts the size of barrage balloons, given that that's the favoured body form, but no breasts at all is not a common option.

    The fact that it takes DAZ a good long while to produce black skintones could be seen as an interesting sociological factoid too. Seems like it's white, then Asian, then black, and female before male. I'm assuming that's the manga/anime influence.

    Meanwhile, G2 (G2F anyway) had managed to get into the "mainstream" in a manner G1 never did, and that did result in more products being created for it, which was great. G3 will not be picked up in that way for a couple of years, if at all. However, most of the non-DAZ material was aimed at G2F, not G2M. Yes, there is some out there, but it's still the female characters that dominate.

    There is that too. Also, we get all these great environments from Stonemason, but, we don't get anyone to populate them with. He's done that lovely Victorian London set, but, what is it without the Victorian London population and traffic? One needs to complement the other and I can't see the Iray craze for the figure in front of a blurry background lasting too much longer either.

    CHEERS!

  • marblemarble Posts: 7,500
    edited December 1969

    nDelphi said:

    I scratch my head, really. If you don't need V7 don't purchase her. She is not being forced on you or the market. In the end the market will definately decide and I bet on V7 or V8 and even V20.

    V7 doesn't mean your previous figures are made useless all of a sudden. You will see less PA support, but even V4 is getting a ton of new stuff.

    Open your mind to the world at large.

    DAZ 3D is a business catering to a large market. Most of that market doesn't hang out on the forums like we do.

    Agree with the first bit. Don't buy it if you don't need/want it. Or wait for the sales.

    Don't agree with the second bit. PA focus will inevitably move and the G2 stream will dry up. Unless, of course, enough people don't see much of an advantage in buying V7 and all her ancillary products and the demand for G2 remains high. Someone will spot that gap and sell G2 stuff either here or elsewhere. That happened with V4 but not with G1. It may well happen again with G2 especially as the Poser link has been broken with G3.

  • PulpArtstPulpArtst Posts: 88
    edited December 1969

    I'm a bit surprised to see V7, but it looks like a great model. I'm going to be slower on the uptake on this one though as I'm just now getting to the point of converting most of my older content to G2F and have a nice HD full of content to use first. How long ago was V6 released and I wonder if the release cycle is going to continue to be so fast?

  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited June 2015

    HeraldOfFire said:
    When Genesis 2 was first released, I had similar misgivings to those posted here. I worried that the Genesis content I'd invested so heavily in would quickly become obsolete and that the transition to a new figure would be too jarring to get used to. It wasn't.

    Looking back, I got very quickly accustomed to using Genesis 2 and she became the new staple in my runtime. Given that I was quick to judge the old G2F I'm cautious not to make that same mistake twice. With that in mind, I bought Victoria 7 to see what wonders await.

    First impressions are good so far. The toes have individual articulation and multiple joints. The face is nicely detailed with plenty of polys in the right places. In terms of backwards compatibility, she'll wear anything that Genesis 2 could wear via autofit, and the items I've tried so far fit very well even in unusual poses.

    Curiously, the Genesis 3 genitalia has it's own unique UV map rather than simply sharing the hip UV's like it's predecessors. That being said, it's also significantly more detailed than those earlier models too which goes some way towards explaining the change.

    All in all, I'm looking forward to seeing where they go with this new figure. I still use classic Genesis and Genesis 2 alike. While we will undoubtedly see a move towards G3F in the coming months, I expect G2F will continue to be supported until such time. Lest we forget, one of the major reasons there was such a big swing in favor of G2F is the ease at which you could develop items for her compared to Genesis.

    Given that G2F and G3F are about on par when it comes to developing for them, I don't expect a mass exodus towards the new figure to happen immediately. So wind down the panic stations, armageddon hasn't yet arrived :)

    I see you got some shoes to fit, or are they V7 shoes!? There were concerns expressed about those. I'm not sure about compatibility when it comes to older textures though as the image below shows that the textures are handled very differently with the torso being individual, the limbs individual and the ears being part of the head texture. If an older UV can be adapted to G3 remains to be seen.

    CHEERS!

    G3F_Textures.JPG
    640 x 480 - 259K
    Post edited by Rogerbee on
  • thrain9thrain9 Posts: 106
    edited December 1969

    @DAZ

    Lovely work. A very good upgrade; However:
    I will not use V7. I am a hobbyist, not a pro so...
    why?
    1. $$$
    2. clothing, hair etc. with minimal to no backward compatability,
    3-10. $$$$$$!
    Thanks anyway, keep up the good work. I may be able to afford a new set of figures somewhere around Genesis 9

  • ModernWizardModernWizard Posts: 904
    edited December 1969

    So does G3F have facial bones that allow for more precise posing and creation of expressions?

    --MW

  • BeeMKayBeeMKay Posts: 7,019
    edited December 1969

    DrPingy said:
    lee_lhs said:
    DrPingy said:
    Is there available a template for Genesis 3 and Vic 7?

    Yes, if you go to your product library, --> DAZ Studio 4.8 --> Genesis 3 Starter Essentials
    The Templates are available for manual download.

    Well hidden!

    Thank you very much.

    If there are more interesting things hidden?

    Now that you mention it... ;-P

    You'll find templates for most products available for manual download, so if you want to do your own materials, that's the place to go.

  • BeeMKayBeeMKay Posts: 7,019
    edited December 1969

    ModernWizard said:
    So does G3F have facial bones that allow for more precise posing and creation of expressions?

    --MW

    This might answer your question: http://www.daz3d.com/forums/viewreply/843620/

  • TomTombaTomTomba Posts: 29
    edited December 1969

    Leana said:
    TomTomba said:
    At least I hope the below indicates better cross-gender compatibility...


    COMPATIBILITY
    Genesis 3 content works across all Genesis 3 figures. What this means is that the same hair, dress, and shoes you place on your 22 year old slender cheerleader will still fit her fine as you morph her into a seven foot tall ogre with a massive physique or a tricycle riding toddler off for a romp in the yard.

    Maybe, but the technology page still lists Male and Female bases.

    Darn, guess I fast forwarded over that, and optimistically misread the compatibility info... buying content and add-ons for one base is expensive, for two, doubly so... hopefully male figures will be released sooner than later, so we can see if there are any economies with G3 :cheese:

  • Peter FulfordPeter Fulford Posts: 1,325
    edited December 1969

    This is all very well, but I want to know when we're going to see Taurette 7 for Genesis 3 Female HD.

    We need an articulated udder.

    http://www.daz3d.com/taurette-for-genesis-2-female-hd

    .

  • ModernWizardModernWizard Posts: 904
    edited December 1969

    lee_lhs said:
    ModernWizard said:
    So does G3F have facial bones that allow for more precise posing and creation of expressions?

    --MW

    This might answer your question: http://www.daz3d.com/forums/viewreply/843620/

    Wow, a rigged face! Maybe I can make my own expressions instead of buying extras...

    Or I'll just up-port all my morphs 'n' stuff from G2F...

    --MW

  • PulpArtstPulpArtst Posts: 88
    edited December 1969

    I'm actually OK with a complete break in compatibility between G3F and everything before it so long as the next half dozen Genesis going forward are compatible. Trying to get some of the old clothes to fit and converting the skin textures is a long and sometimes frustrating process.

    Daz, is the idea here that this new base will set the standard for several iterations?

    It would like to be able to label my library in two categories: Pre-G3F and Post-G3F and know that everything post will work perfectly on G3F+ for many years. It's not like my Pre-G3F content suddenly stopped working...

  • CybersoxCybersox Posts: 9,264
    edited June 2015

    Cypherfox said:

    It's not buying into a whole new way of thinking, or anything else like that. Your G2F stuff will work on it, except texture maps, but that's okay, it's like it's got a new UV anyway, and didn't they all? ;)


    Except for the fact that the whole "new UV for every figure" was one of the least successful aspects of the Genesis 2 figures, with practically no PA support for ANY of the new UVs except V6/M6. Given that I prefer to tweak all my figures to make them more unique, the lack of a path to make at least some older skins compatible means that every Gen7's is going to have an extremely limited genepool for quite a while.

    Which is fine. I see no reason to jump in until there's at least a Gen7 equivalent of Teen Josie and a decent selection of skins. By that time the Pro bundle + basic morph sets will regularly be going on sale for a reasonable 50%+ off and there will hopefully be some kind of GenX support, even if it's just converting morphs from Gen 6.

    Post edited by Cybersox on
  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited December 1969

    Another interesting thing I've noticed is that the surfaces for the eyes have changed. The tear is gone, the eye reflection (aka eye surface) is now eye moisture and the lacrimals appear to be part of the eye socket material. I don't think this means much backwards compatibility for textures either.

    CHEERS!

  • CybersoxCybersox Posts: 9,264
    edited December 1969

    valkeerie said:
    I use DAZ for storytelling, and buy mostly historical costumes (e.g. Victorian, Edwardian, uniforms etc). Since IRay I find the base figures look amazing and the clothes look rubbish by comparison. The realism has gone up a level but the clothes are stuck. Many simple poses require ludicrous amounts of time and ingenuity because clothes (even quite recent clothing) aren't morphing well. As a rule, trousers have to be painted on with pre-defined creases, and big dresses usually go ape when a character is posed, and they collide through chairs etc.

    So .. no problems at all with G2 figures, endless problems with G2 clothing.

    Guess what I would like? Speaking selfishly, and ignoring commercial reality? What would I like, something that would make a vast difference to me? Decent dynamic clothing and proper collision detection. It isn't rocket science. What I really don't need in any way whatsoever is a new G3 figure. It isn't going to take me anywhere I want to go.

    So I am pleased that DAZ is continuing to develop its products, but the clothing (unless you count endless variations on bikinis and spray-on fantasy) is increasingly unfit for purpose.

    Valkeerie


    Amen!
  • frBanfrBan Posts: 5
    edited June 2015

    Totally unexpected V7 !

    Well, well, well. V6 Pro was a 16 products bundle, V7 pro contains 13... Same price (without saving).

    Actually, I spend a lot of time correcting hair or clothes to have more realistic renders (exporting OBJ, doing custom morphs on a scene by scene basis : don't blame me, it's my hobby, not my job). It's particularly true with long hairs and clothes if my character has an unusual pose (i.e. is sitting, has his head widely turned or bended). Embedded morphs are usually totally inadequate.
    The problems come even worst with old products autofitted.


    So ... what is the interest of a perfect facial expression if hair are glued to the neck in a totally unnatural way (no gravity morph yet) ? What is the interest of a correctly bended shoulder if my old G1/G2 costume pokes through ?


    Sorry but :
    1. too expensive
    2. real issues (for me) not solved

    All I hope is that all the talented premier artists will continue to offer G2 compatible items for a while.

    Post edited by frBan on
  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 107,885
    edited December 1969

    Ippotamus said:
    Xenomorphine said:
    A default expressions pack has just turned up... That's rather odd not to include in the basic figure.

    And it seems, looking at the new clothing, that they are only designed for G3, with no G2-compatability.

    This is just an old fashioned money grab, plain and simple.
    $13.00 for basic expressions?
    Take a hike, DAZ.

    You have, as with previous generations, the tools to build expressions. The pack is, as far as I can tell, compound expressions, to save you time, not the basic components you need to start from.

  • a-sennova-sennov Posts: 331
    edited December 1969

    Zev0 said:
    Just static poses. By animated poses do you mean animated files? If so I think something like that is already in the works.

    Yes, .duf with animated pose preset.

  • SloshSlosh Posts: 2,391
    edited December 1969

    JartStar said:
    I'm actually OK with a complete break in compatibility between G3F and everything before it so long as the next half dozen Genesis going forward are compatible. Trying to get some of the old clothes to fit and converting the skin textures is a long and sometimes frustrating process.

    Daz, is the idea here that this new base will set the standard for several iterations?

    It would like to be able to label my library in two categories: Pre-G3F and Post-G3F and know that everything post will work perfectly on G3F+ for many years. It's not like my Pre-G3F content suddenly stopped working...

    This is probably one of the most intelligent and reasonable posts I've read this morning. Thank you for having a level head and for asking a very well thought-out question. I hope to see the new standards last for several generations, too. And trust me, a big part of my store involves converted uvs for one generation to the next, and not being able to do that for Genesis 3 has taken away some of my product possibilities, but I am so pleased with Genesis 3 and Victoria 7 that I don't feel bad about it.

  • surrender dollssurrender dolls Posts: 20
    edited December 1969

    Wow awesome surprise this morning, thanks Daz!

    I really look forward to using this next evolution of genesis, just picked up the Pro Bundle, Victoria 7 looks great in Iray!

  • a-sennova-sennov Posts: 331
    edited December 1969

    Tharcion said:
    TomTomba said:
    Seems like G3 is going to be cross-gender again which is welcome.

    Really? I don't see that.

    Looking into the Genesis3Female.dsf I do not see any sign of it. G2F has aliases that shows that she share her mesh with G2M. G3F doesn't, so G3M may have his own mesh as well :)

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