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I've been using Jack's render server for a while now, and can recommend it. Link:http://www.jacktomalin.com/iray
One thing to keep in mind re this new render offer:
Unless this new service will have a lot of machines with the mentioned specifics, you'll have waiting times, i.e. when people are uploading entire sequences for animation. Also, if peole start to get reckless, the render servers will get clocked up; 24GB of render card VRAM might sound a lot, but you can easily blow it out of the orbit with a couple of clothed G8 in high res and detailled surrounding, with a high res render dimensions. That will drop the render to CPU, and unless they have a built-in cut-off time for renders, it will render on CPU until the bitter end, blocking everything else. Just saying.
I have doubts that the Iray Servers will allow fallback to CPU, if that's even an option with Iray Server.
If Boost is like the Nimbix Iray Server, you'll need to take care to log out when done, so as not to incur excessive charges for time during which you are not actively using the service, but you can ask the Boost people about how they count your time.
You are right, it is stated in the description that you are responsible for logging out when you are done.
Concerning the fallback issue: Boost for DAZ suggests in its description to first use a CPU only setup and start uploading your scene. While uploading DAZ shows the size of the Data and so you can then choose your setup accordingly. E.g. If you want to render a single image, you choose vram size = 1.4 x render package.
Here is the link: https://docs.boostfordaz.com/using-boost-for-daz/setup-and-configuration/picking-a-gpu-for-rendering
The charge is for the server up time so includes the time it took to upload. The way their setup works is you choose what type of machine you want, and they spin up a private server for you to use (all automated) so there's no queuing or waiting for other folks' renders to finish.
Yes, the server you spin up via the web then put the credentials into your advanced render settings in DS. It's a slightly different render setup, but it's not complicated. The WP Guru has a video on YouTube going over the service.
Absolutely! That's one of the things I love about it. I use the render queue feature, so I send in a render and start the queue. Once it's uploaded I go to the next scene and upload that to the queue, then they'll all render out. You can set a timer for the server to go off automatically (though I don't think you can get renders from it if it's shut down since the servers are spun up on demand-- I'll have to check into that).
Jack's server is awesome!
Well, actually :D Everyone gets their own server. They're spun up on demand, so you're never waiting for other people to upload and render. It's always immediate. The only delays are your own upload times.
The point of the servers is that you won't need fallback. Just pick the server config that fits your project. And yes, you do need to log out (best practices), however they have a feature where you set the time that will pass before you automatically log out and shut down the server spun up for you.
I'm looking into what happens with renders if your server shuts down and you haven't downloaded them yet and I'll post an update.
If this works like other server share things I've used, they will have limited hardware, and perhaps virtualize servers with 'partial' access to GPU VRAM. That still means that several folks share the same physical machine if a lot of people use the service at the same time, and I wonder if that will cause any issues. Maybe someone who has used the service does know?
Every server is totally yours. They aren't shared. You get 100% of the resources you pay for.
I just tried it and am completely underwhelmed, it took 8 min just to upload the file (1.7gb) in Queue mode. (I have 120mb upload speed) now after 30 min I'm still waiting for the job to finish. I tried stream mode but before I could even hit Render Daz just sat and spun until i finally killed it after 20 min. Tried it twice, died each time.
So after 36 min It still hadn't finished and my session had timed out after an hour so i never did get to see my render. $3.89 CDN down the drain. Oh well lots of lessons learned
@attamat-llj: Are you sure you had enough vram?
On my PC? I have 8GB on my PC and the engine I chose had 16GB. I would have thought that this would have outperformed my PC's RTX2070.
And that, in itself, should answer the question of exactly where DAZ stands in the 3D world. Of course, DAZ was at SIggraph, their then new head honcho didn't know what Poser was either, so...
@attamat-llj: 16GByte is a lot but i don't know how complex your scene/lighting was, how high the resolution, and if you had some 4 to 8k maps or like oot hair... Thats why Boostfordaz wrote to first check the amount of vram you need by choosing CPU only and while uploading DAZ shows you the package size. That amount x 1.4 is what you need in vram.
https://docs.boostfordaz.com/using-boost-for-daz/setup-and-configuration/picking-a-gpu-for-rendering
EDIT: it you are queueing, you need not only 1.4 times package size vram but additionaly 3x package size Computer ram...
@ChaosDrgn apologies for the delay in getting back to you. At this point in time, charges begin as soon as your requested NVIDIA GPU is assigned to your session..so that includes the upload as well as the rendering. However, two things to keep in mind - (a) Currently a dedicated RTX4000 is priced at $1.40 an hour or $0.023 a minute. So depending on your project complexity, for example a 20 min upload and 10 min rendering would be approx. $0.70. And, (b) the first time you upload a project for rendering will take the longest. Any subsequent scene changes and uploads for that project during your same session will only upload the changes (as all the assets are already stored in the cache for you). It depends of course on the nature of those changes, but simple things like diff camera views or pose changes upload lightning fast. I hope that helps.
@attamat-llj we're sorry to hear of your recent experience with Boost for Daz. That is not typical. Would you be willing to open a private ticket on our Boost for Daz Discord Server (use #open-a-ticket thread) so we can get more details from you (like email address used). We'll then look into the detailed session logs and figure out what happened. Of course, we want to make sure that your experience with Boost for Daz is nothing less that amazing. May I invite you to connect with us at your convenience? Thank you!
So when I do the CPU only test it says the size of my file is 3.4GB which, according to the chart I need 8GB. The CPU I picked had 16GB of VRAM and 30GB of RAM
Did not get anything done... just the little Mac wheel "thinking" and a render window opened with nothing in it...
bummer.
was looking forward...
This is a great idea, and smart of Daz to officially partner with a company that specializes in cloud tech. Indeed, they do not just have a set number of computers built for Daz, that is not the case at all. This is a cloud company, and they have multiple clients and LOTS of hardware. So they built this operation with Daz to scale with the number of users. If 10 users jump on, then 10 computers are allocated to them. If 20 people jump on, then 20 computers, simple as that. This not like most streaming applications because you really cannot share rendering GPUs for Daz, that would create all kinds of problems. So the only way that people would need to wait is if the Daz users suddenly all hopped on at once in a massive number that overwhelmed their entire system. I am sure they have calculated their likely numbers, that is part of their job to make sure things go smoothly. If by chance the Daz users do somehow overwhelm them, then they would expand to meet those needs.
This being streaming there can be hiccups depending on your connection. You may have great internet, but location is important. This company is in Wyoming, so if that is very distant from you, that could impact your connection speed.
Anyway, I have a 3090 now so I am pretty happy with my machine, but I do have some questions.
1- Are there any restrictions on what is actually rendered? There can be some rather peculiar interests within the art field. Also some countries might have some different laws compared to the US on what content is acceptable, does Boost differ to US law or is this any concern at all?
2- I noticed the "Daz Benchmark" being referenced a few times for GPU speed. Is this an internal benchmark, or perhaps the benchmark scene found in the forum's Iray Benchmark Thread? If it is an internal benchmark, is there a place people can download and test it for themselves?
3- Does the version of Daz installed by the user matter? Can the user run an older version of Daz with an older Iray on the server?
4- Any possibility you guys can provide servers for the Daz forums so we do not have to deal with constant 502 errors anymore? (I am only half joking here, I got a 502 while writing this post.)
I have a RTX 3090 + RTX 2080, but I see Boost for DAZ advertising "DAZ IRAY BENCH - 4m 25s" and so I'm wondering how my home rig compares to Boost.
How do I do a DAZ Iray Bench?
Wait, NVM, found it, https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/341041/daz-studio-iray-rendering-hardware-benchmarking/p1
Under 4.1 and 4.2
Alright, so unless I made a mistake, my rig did the bench in 1 minute and 21 seconds which drastically outperforms the RTX 5000 option. I guess Boost probably isn't for me especially because I plan to do everything I can to get an RTX 4090 on day 1.
...curious as to what the system (not GPU) memory is that holds the scen file during rendering. Tried to get the FAQ up but it wouldn't open.
@attamat-llj: You are right, I don't understand why it didn't work. I hope customer service of BFD will be able to find out - good luck!
@Chaoticlock -sorry to hear of your recent experience. If you can get to our Boost for Daz Discord Server and open a ticket then we can the info we need to look into your logs and figure out what happened. We are eager to ensure you have an amazing experience with Boost for Daz.:-) May I invite you to open a ticket on Discord? We've got your back!
what are the download speeds into the Boost servers? I have 600mb upload speed ...well, it varies but normally over 500mb. I tried a lcoud service for file saving but their upload speed was capped at 25mb so it still took a century.
Hey @outrider42 - Thanks for your message! You are absolutely correct...each user on Boost for Daz is assigned a private GPU server of choice. You get 100% of whatever GPU you request . :-)
Took a stab at responding to your questions below
Q1- Are there any restrictions on what is actually rendered? There can be some rather peculiar interests within the art field. Also some countries might have some different laws compared to the US on what content is acceptable, does Boost differ to US law or is this any concern at all?
A1 > According to our Privacy policy we only capture aggregate data on users and usage and apply internationally-certified methods to keep you and your information secure and protected under US law (since currently the Boost for Daz servers are in the US). We do not have any visibility into what you actually render on Boost for Daz, and claim indemnification against the actual content that is being rendered. We recognize that the trust we place in our User community can be abused, but we choose to look to the individual user to be responsible for the viability and ethical nature of the content they render. We will - at all times - however support and align ourselves with the applicable laws and respond to all lawful requests from law enforcement authorities.
Q2- I noticed the "Daz Benchmark" being referenced a few times for GPU speed. Is this an internal benchmark, or perhaps the benchmark scene found in the forum's Iray Benchmark Thread? If it is an internal benchmark, is there a place people can download and test it for themselves?
A2> Yes, we use a the RayDant Benchmark to bench all the GPU's in Catalog. The little 'time stamp' you see in the GPU tile in the Boost for Daz catalog is the time to render that benchmark file. Here's the link to that Daz RayDant benchmark file. Feel free to download and test. We'll continue to broaden and deepen our NVIDIA GPU catalog so feel free to keep checking in :-)
Q3- Does the version of Daz installed by the user matter? Can the user run an older version of Daz with an older Iray on the server?
A3> The version of Daz Studio installed does matter. As of now Boost for Daz supports Iray Server 3.45 which in turn is supported by the following Daz Studio versions:
Anything before that - in theory - should be 'backward compatible' but not tested nor guaranteed. We encourage users to use the latest version of Daz Studio for the best experience with Boost for Daz.
Q4- Any possibility you guys can provide servers for the Daz forums so we do not have to deal with constant 502 errors anymore? (I am only half joking here, I got a 502 while writing this post.)
A4> Interesting idea - and thanks for thinking of us! However, our laser focus right now is to provide Daz artists everywhere - regardless of whether they create using a PC, Mac or Laptops - to get fast, affordable access to NVIDIA GPU acceleration, on tap. :-)
@kyoto kid - are you asking about where assets for the scene are held while the image is being rendered? If not, please clarify and we'll do our best to answer it. As far as we understand, the first time you upload a scene into Boost for Daz, it uploads the .duf file as well as all the supporting assets, textures, shaders etc. This first upload will take the longest, but any subsequent changes to the scene and corresponding uploads will be superfast as most of the digital files are stored in the cache (and don't need to be uploaded again). So changing cameras or poses and rendering again with Boost for DAz is fast and easy using a beefier GPU of your choice. Here's a link to our Gitbook documentation and knowledge base as an additional resource for you. This is updated frequently. Thanks.
@daveso The maximum non-datacenter speed reported so far is 800Mbs from home offices in Central US and England to the Boost for Daz servers. So your speeds should be more than sufficient. However, we've learned that upload times can vary and perception is reality. We've found that the major influencers on upload time are the size of final render package (+assets, textures, shaders etc), and the effective bandwidth of the connection route from your PC to the Boost for Daz servers currently centrally-located in Chicago. Here's more detail from our knowledge base on things that may impact Boost for Daz upload times. Let us know if you any more questions. Thank you!
...basically there is a slightly variable "rule of thumb that system memory should be 2 - 3 times the maximum VRAM of the GPU, which is of course dependent on the complexity and size of scene to be rendered. More detailed textures and certain special effects can take more memory at both levels. If there is not enough System memory to hold a scene it either goes into much slower swap mode or the process crashes. So for example to get the full use of an RTX A5000's VRAM (24 GB) system memory should need to be between 48 and 72 GB (which given how memory is configured tn today's systems [by factors of 2] would need to be 64 to 128 GB).
I tend to create fairly "epic" scenes that I plan to render in large format at high quality for creating fine art prints which can have a fairly large in system memory requirement. I tend not to resort to rendering in layers and compositing nor do a high degree of optimisation as it does affect the final render quality (hence I would be making use of the higher VRAM GPUs like the A5000 and A6000).
Hi @kyoto kid - thanks for your clarification. That helped!
On Boost for Daz, the amount of CPU RAM as well as the GPU VRAM are listed in the Variants once you click on a GPU tile in the Catalog....(see image) So if you feel like you need more RAM for a particular project, pick a x2 variant.
When you actually peek into the Iray Server Admin (under Resources) you'll find that about 1-2GB is taken up by the Hypervisor. So in the example of an A4000 x2 variant, out the 90GM RAM, you'll get effectively about 88 GM RAM (90-2GB). The good news is that unlike on a local machine there is no reduction of RAM with Windows or Daz mem overhead stuff! You'll also need about 1x-2x VRAM on your local machine just to create the 'render package'.
@kyoto kid, if you have specific needs outside of our current catalog, we'd love an opportunity to work directly with you. Happy for you to connect directly with our CTO so we can customize a setup that works for you...for example, we can put together a machine that can go over 512GB RAM!
Boost for DAZ by Infinite Compute
https://boostfordaz.infinite-compute.com/?trk_msg=HFKB0LNL7SOK33E0P7I3465970&trk_contact=5DG4EHVIVHUPBOEM1IMVEGTP3K&trk_sid=7CJR8DOC730QHFQIENENHQ5T84&trk_link=QQKLS95MDNRKF4MUV94LHQSS0C