Daz inc. innovating,imitating or stagnating??

takezo_3001

I usually don't buy the "Daz is not an animation program, it's a compositing one" logic for the simple fact that daz characters are too well boned/JCM'd that they are perfectly made for animation, it's just that the lacking (But improved) IK system, character lag if they're wearing any clothing, to scrub the animation timeline makes animation tedious/impossible with clothing, even posing lags if your character's wearing anything!

I mean you constantly need to unfit all clothing/eyelashes/brows/wearable if you want it to pose/scrub properly...

And don't get me started on puppeteer's lag issues as well, but even with all those issues, there are improvements being done, as it's still better than it was 2 years ago, and as far as character creation, DAZ far exceeds anything from IClone's or turbosquid's obscenely overpriced offerings, I suppose if DAZ had animation suite similar to IClone's then that would open up a new user base!

takezo_3001

double post

Bobvan

My latest installation and update of G8 files has broken G8F for me now really slow to load and 12 runs buggy on my laptop so no not moving forward IMO..

Gordig

Sevrin said:

marth.e said:

I'm convinced that the best thing that DAZ could do right now is what Ubisoft just did. Ubisoft replaced their in-house digital content creation tool (DCC) with Blender.

 

Blender not only is free.  It is also a very stable, more agile development environment supported by open source. If DAZ would adopt the same workflow as Ubisoft did then they could forget about spending a significant amount of time and resources to maintain and improve the core of Daz Studio and focus on what they do best: selling 3d rigged figures and 3d content and also invest their efforts on research and exploration of new tools instead of always trying to catch up with what the competition is doing.

 

Blender 2.8 is a very powerful piece of software. Cycles render is as good as any of the top renders in the market. EEVEE, as a real time render, is a game-changer. Blender also has super powerful modeling, sculpting, uv editing, texturing, rigging (with real IK), anmation, painting and even simulation and dynamics tools. And not just that: blender evolves rapidly at the speed of the CGI industry.

 

Daz, as Ubisoft did, could then forget about trying to include any of those core features inside DAZ Studio and just focus on adding their very specialized tools and 3d rigged figures.

If Blender was the best option for Ubisoft, one of the video game giants in the world, and if they are willing to use it in production why not DAZ. 

 

Martha E.

The analogy between Ubisoft and Daz3d is based on an incorrect premise.  Ubisoft is using Blender internally in game development.  They're not making tools to give away for free.  A better analogy would be between Ubisoft and Daz customers, and there's nothing stopping us from using Blender on our own.

There are a lot of things Daz could do, but they have limited time and resources and need to allocate them in such away as to best service and expand their store customer base, and keep their PAs interested.  PAs depend on Daz for their livelihoods.  Those are their priorities, and there's not enough public information for most of us to be able to second-guess Daz's decision-making process.

I really don't understand why so many people seem to want Daz Studio to become something completely different than it is. The quote you're responding to is especially baffling. What does that person think Daz is, or does, that "replac[ing] their in-house digital content creation tool (DCC) with Blender" is even meaningful as a concept? I'm all for improving DS functionality and adding new features, but Daz is a very effective tool for what I need it to do.

Masterstroke

As long as one single frame takes me at least one hour to render, i won' t shed a single thought about animation capabilities in DAZ Studio.

Subtropic Pixel

Masterstroke said:

As long as one single frame takes me at least one hour to render, i won' t shed a single thought about animation capabilities in DAZ Studio.

But is that the fault of DS?

takezo_3001

Masterstroke said:

As long as one single frame takes me at least one hour to render, i won' t shed a single thought about animation capabilities in DAZ Studio.

Are you using Iray? For animation I use considerably less samples and time, (so it takes about 35-50 secs per frame, still alot for a 400-500 frame animation but at least it's not over an hour) and just rely more on the denoiser filter, but for my 1920x1440 single pics it takes me over an hour to render, so I can relate, I don't see why it can't be both; an animation, plus compositing studio.

kyoto kid

Subtropic Pixel said:

kyoto kid said:

SadKitty_Carrara said:

DAZ studio is actually getting increased use by me as features are added

I openly admit that

can it replace Carrara yet in my workflow 

a resounding no way

will it ever? If they added all the stuff so many are vehemently opposed to as it complicates things for their simple click load render a pretty girl workflow maybe

a DAZ studio  full 3D suite edition with a pricetag could possibly solve this as those same objectors hate the idea of paying for studio too

by full 3D suite I mean vertex room, terrain, trees particle generation etc like Carrara and maybe Hexagon and Bryce features too

indeed it could in effect be Carrara/Hexagon/Bryce features integrated into DAZ studio and I think many would buy it as then all DAZ content would work in it unlike Carrara 

I doubt it will ever happen but I certainly wish it could

...that would likely lose me only because I couldn't afford it on my meagre SS budget. 

I'm sure they won't do that because they'll no doubt solicit your opinion n the matter first. 

But seriously...I know you've been in business before, and in IT even!  And from that experience, I know you've learned that organizations must continually improve and advance their offerings in order to survive.  One way I look at it is that failing means a lot MORE people will be hurt.  But that drive to remain competitive sometimes means that older products or ways will need to be ended in favor of the new ones. 

I know that's not very helpful to somebody in your situation, but it is a fact of life.  Frugal is admirable.  But "meager" can be a harsh and terrible master.

...what Sad Kitty outlined sounds like Daz becoming more like Vue, which I also cannot afford.  

if the resources are just not there there is no way to benefit from such an "advancement." The issue is that should they no longer offer a "free" full featured version like they do now, it will leave those without the necessary financial resources out. 

The entire reason I chose Daz over Poser 11 years ago was because I didn't have to pony up 250$ at the outset and a basic content package for the software was available as well as there was no fixed time limit to test it out. That was a major "selling" point.

 

WendyLuvsCatz

kyoto kid said:

Subtropic Pixel said:

kyoto kid said:

SadKitty_Carrara said:

DAZ studio is actually getting increased use by me as features are added

I openly admit that

can it replace Carrara yet in my workflow 

a resounding no way

will it ever? If they added all the stuff so many are vehemently opposed to as it complicates things for their simple click load render a pretty girl workflow maybe

a DAZ studio  full 3D suite edition with a pricetag could possibly solve this as those same objectors hate the idea of paying for studio too

by full 3D suite I mean vertex room, terrain, trees particle generation etc like Carrara and maybe Hexagon and Bryce features too

indeed it could in effect be Carrara/Hexagon/Bryce features integrated into DAZ studio and I think many would buy it as then all DAZ content would work in it unlike Carrara 

I doubt it will ever happen but I certainly wish it could

...that would likely lose me only because I couldn't afford it on my meagre SS budget. 

I'm sure they won't do that because they'll no doubt solicit your opinion n the matter first. 

But seriously...I know you've been in business before, and in IT even!  And from that experience, I know you've learned that organizations must continually improve and advance their offerings in order to survive.  One way I look at it is that failing means a lot MORE people will be hurt.  But that drive to remain competitive sometimes means that older products or ways will need to be ended in favor of the new ones. 

I know that's not very helpful to somebody in your situation, but it is a fact of life.  Frugal is admirable.  But "meager" can be a harsh and terrible master.

...what Sad Kitty outlined sounds like Daz becoming more like Vue, which I also cannot afford.  

if the resources are just not there there is no way to benefit from such an "advancement." The issue is that should they no longer offer a "free" full featured version like they do now, it will leave those without the necessary financial resources out. 

The entire reason I chose Daz over Poser 11 years ago was because I didn't have to pony up 250$ at the outset and a basic content package for the software was available as well as there was no fixed time limit to test it out. That was a major "selling" point.

 

because the world should revolve around what you only want? 

WendyLuvsCatz

fact

there was DAZ studio3 advanced and pro when I started 2009

I did not buy advanced until about 2 years later when discounted to a dollar PC sale

never could afford the $500 pro

pro never became free until DS4 after initially costing money too

some got refunded but due to the complicated way I bought advanced and addons I never actually did but admittedly only around $50 in my case

p0rt

kyoto kid said:

Subtropic Pixel said:

kyoto kid said:

SadKitty_Carrara said:

DAZ studio is actually getting increased use by me as features are added

I openly admit that

can it replace Carrara yet in my workflow 

a resounding no way

will it ever? If they added all the stuff so many are vehemently opposed to as it complicates things for their simple click load render a pretty girl workflow maybe

a DAZ studio  full 3D suite edition with a pricetag could possibly solve this as those same objectors hate the idea of paying for studio too

by full 3D suite I mean vertex room, terrain, trees particle generation etc like Carrara and maybe Hexagon and Bryce features too

indeed it could in effect be Carrara/Hexagon/Bryce features integrated into DAZ studio and I think many would buy it as then all DAZ content would work in it unlike Carrara 

I doubt it will ever happen but I certainly wish it could

...that would likely lose me only because I couldn't afford it on my meagre SS budget. 

I'm sure they won't do that because they'll no doubt solicit your opinion n the matter first. 

But seriously...I know you've been in business before, and in IT even!  And from that experience, I know you've learned that organizations must continually improve and advance their offerings in order to survive.  One way I look at it is that failing means a lot MORE people will be hurt.  But that drive to remain competitive sometimes means that older products or ways will need to be ended in favor of the new ones. 

I know that's not very helpful to somebody in your situation, but it is a fact of life.  Frugal is admirable.  But "meager" can be a harsh and terrible master.

...what Sad Kitty outlined sounds like Daz becoming more like Vue, which I also cannot afford.  

if the resources are just not there there is no way to benefit from such an "advancement." The issue is that should they no longer offer a "free" full featured version like they do now, it will leave those without the necessary financial resources out. 

The entire reason I chose Daz over Poser 11 years ago was because I didn't have to pony up 250$ at the outset and a basic content package for the software was available as well as there was no fixed time limit to test it out. That was a major "selling" point.

 

you wouldn't need to spend $250 or so on Daz, the free version will probably always exist, along with the pro version, there will just be a creator version with all the needed plugin's bundled with it and all registered with a single payment

Leana

SadKitty_Carrara said:

fact

there was DAZ studio3 advanced and pro when I started 2009

There was a DS3 advanced, but no Pro. Pro was introduced with DS4. 

WendyLuvsCatz

Leana said:

SadKitty_Carrara said:

fact

there was DAZ studio3 advanced and pro when I started 2009

There was a DS3 advanced, but no Pro. Pro was introduced with DS4. 

ah yes was content creation tools I chose Poser 7 instead

drzap

marth.e said:

I'm convinced that the best thing that DAZ could do right now is what Ubisoft just did. Ubisoft replaced their in-house digital content creation tool (DCC) with Blender.

 

Blender not only is free.  It is also a very stable, more agile development environment supported by open source. If DAZ would adopt the same workflow as Ubisoft did then they could forget about spending a significant amount of time and resources to maintain and improve the core of Daz Studio and focus on what they do best: selling 3d rigged figures and 3d content and also invest their efforts on research and exploration of new tools instead of always trying to catch up with what the competition is doing.

 

Blender 2.8 is a very powerful piece of software. Cycles render is as good as any of the top renders in the market. EEVEE, as a real time render, is a game-changer. Blender also has super powerful modeling, sculpting, uv editing, texturing, rigging (with real IK), anmation, painting and even simulation and dynamics tools. And not just that: blender evolves rapidly at the speed of the CGI industry.

 

Daz, as Ubisoft did, could then forget about trying to include any of those core features inside DAZ Studio and just focus on adding their very specialized tools and 3d rigged figures.

If Blender was the best option for Ubisoft, one of the video game giants in the world, and if they are willing to use it in production why not DAZ. 

 

Martha E.

Except for the fact that Ubisoft is made up of industry professional artists who are used to dealing with sophisticated and complicated software and Daz Studio is targeting mainly the hobbyist, point and click market.  Unless you are talking about using Blender as an additional Daz Studio "Pro", Daz3d would have to completely reorient their market position and strategy because Blender isn't nearly as easy to use as Daz Studio.   They would lose huge portions of their original base.  That is "why not DAZ".

Richard Haseltine

Leana said:

SadKitty_Carrara said:

fact

there was DAZ studio3 advanced and pro when I started 2009

There was a DS3 advanced, but no Pro. Pro was introduced with DS4. 

There was a bundle that included the Content Creation Tools, I think that might have had Pro in the name.

Diomede

Daz inc is the company.

Bryce is one of Daz Inc's programs.  Carrara is one of Daz Inc's programs.  Hexagon is one of Daz Ic's programs.  Studio is one of Daz Inc's programs.

 

Adding dynamic hair to Studio is imitating an older edition of Carrara, version 6, I believe.

Bryce and Carrara are stagnating.  Hexagon may be getting a useful touch up.

I hope the development for the Studio program continues.  Some of it is imitating other programs, such as Carrara.  Some of the figure-related stuff is innovating.  All of the Studio development is good stuff, whether it is imitating or innovating. 

I hope we Carrara users can be forgiven for wondering how big and wonderful the Carrara community would be if Daz Inc had decided to make Carrara free instead of Studio (entirely discretionary for Daz Inc), and then used the development time to improve Carrara's hair tools (starting from more advanced base), improve the (insert category) tools...  But that is water under the bridge.

takezo_3001

Richard Haseltine said:

Leana said:

SadKitty_Carrara said:

fact

there was DAZ studio3 advanced and pro when I started 2009

There was a DS3 advanced, but no Pro. Pro was introduced with DS4. 

There was a bundle that included the Content Creation Tools, I think that might have had Pro in the name.

That was the main reason why I bought both advance AND pro... character creation was/is a major selling point for me and why I stuck with Daz well over others because at that same time you still had to morph single body parts via the V4 route if you wanted to make a FBM, not so with Gns1 this was the first time we were able to bring the entire character to morph an any way you wanted! (Just as long as you kept the UVs intact)

Genesis was/is such a game changer, Genesis is STILL light years ahead of V4/IClone/La Femme characters and while La Femme is a major improvement over V4/poser's figures, she's still a step down from genesis 6/7/8! Her joint bends are still unnatural just as with V4, but unlike V4 she's still being developed so who knows what the future might bring...

wolf359

Deleted buy author.

kyoto kid

SadKitty_Carrara said:

kyoto kid said:

Subtropic Pixel said:

kyoto kid said:

SadKitty_Carrara said:

DAZ studio is actually getting increased use by me as features are added

I openly admit that

can it replace Carrara yet in my workflow 

a resounding no way

will it ever? If they added all the stuff so many are vehemently opposed to as it complicates things for their simple click load render a pretty girl workflow maybe

a DAZ studio  full 3D suite edition with a pricetag could possibly solve this as those same objectors hate the idea of paying for studio too

by full 3D suite I mean vertex room, terrain, trees particle generation etc like Carrara and maybe Hexagon and Bryce features too

indeed it could in effect be Carrara/Hexagon/Bryce features integrated into DAZ studio and I think many would buy it as then all DAZ content would work in it unlike Carrara 

I doubt it will ever happen but I certainly wish it could

...that would likely lose me only because I couldn't afford it on my meagre SS budget. 

I'm sure they won't do that because they'll no doubt solicit your opinion n the matter first. 

But seriously...I know you've been in business before, and in IT even!  And from that experience, I know you've learned that organizations must continually improve and advance their offerings in order to survive.  One way I look at it is that failing means a lot MORE people will be hurt.  But that drive to remain competitive sometimes means that older products or ways will need to be ended in favor of the new ones. 

I know that's not very helpful to somebody in your situation, but it is a fact of life.  Frugal is admirable.  But "meager" can be a harsh and terrible master.

...what Sad Kitty outlined sounds like Daz becoming more like Vue, which I also cannot afford.  

if the resources are just not there there is no way to benefit from such an "advancement." The issue is that should they no longer offer a "free" full featured version like they do now, it will leave those without the necessary financial resources out. 

The entire reason I chose Daz over Poser 11 years ago was because I didn't have to pony up 250$ at the outset and a basic content package for the software was available as well as there was no fixed time limit to test it out. That was a major "selling" point.

 

because the world should revolve around what you only want? 

...no, just saying not all of us have the financial resources for making major purchases, period.

The current version of Daz is more than sufficient for my illustration needs.  If it becomes the last "free" version (which I doubt), then that is what I'll continue using. I have other software resources, both open source and subscription, that offer the additional tools I need. 

L'Adair

nonesuch00 said:

I saw previews for that movie (Steve Carell) & it's awful. Although as a cartoon fan I like the effort made on the 3D CGI.

I disagree.

I watched that movie a couple nights ago on HBO. I loved the movie. The graphics were great, but the storyline, taking us into the mind of a traumatized individual, was very well done. It really showed how the lines between reality and his make-believe world were blurred.

So let's just agree to disagree, and remain friends… Okay?

kyoto kid

p0rt said:

kyoto kid said:

Subtropic Pixel said:

kyoto kid said:

SadKitty_Carrara said:

DAZ studio is actually getting increased use by me as features are added

I openly admit that

can it replace Carrara yet in my workflow 

a resounding no way

will it ever? If they added all the stuff so many are vehemently opposed to as it complicates things for their simple click load render a pretty girl workflow maybe

a DAZ studio  full 3D suite edition with a pricetag could possibly solve this as those same objectors hate the idea of paying for studio too

by full 3D suite I mean vertex room, terrain, trees particle generation etc like Carrara and maybe Hexagon and Bryce features too

indeed it could in effect be Carrara/Hexagon/Bryce features integrated into DAZ studio and I think many would buy it as then all DAZ content would work in it unlike Carrara 

I doubt it will ever happen but I certainly wish it could

...that would likely lose me only because I couldn't afford it on my meagre SS budget. 

I'm sure they won't do that because they'll no doubt solicit your opinion n the matter first. 

But seriously...I know you've been in business before, and in IT even!  And from that experience, I know you've learned that organizations must continually improve and advance their offerings in order to survive.  One way I look at it is that failing means a lot MORE people will be hurt.  But that drive to remain competitive sometimes means that older products or ways will need to be ended in favor of the new ones. 

I know that's not very helpful to somebody in your situation, but it is a fact of life.  Frugal is admirable.  But "meager" can be a harsh and terrible master.

...what Sad Kitty outlined sounds like Daz becoming more like Vue, which I also cannot afford.  

if the resources are just not there there is no way to benefit from such an "advancement." The issue is that should they no longer offer a "free" full featured version like they do now, it will leave those without the necessary financial resources out. 

The entire reason I chose Daz over Poser 11 years ago was because I didn't have to pony up 250$ at the outset and a basic content package for the software was available as well as there was no fixed time limit to test it out. That was a major "selling" point.

 

you wouldn't need to spend $250 or so on Daz, the free version will probably always exist, along with the pro version, there will just be a creator version with all the needed plugin's bundled with it and all registered with a single payment

...yes, that makes sense.  I doubt they'd drop their "free" track as it is still the "gateway" for sales of mesh content, resource content, and individual plugins, which again Daz makes the majority of their revenue from.  That model has worked well for them for over a decade.  Should I need a custom model, I'll turn to Blender 2.8.  If I need to sculpt small facial details, I have the free version of Sculptris.  For post production I have become pretty adept with Gimp over the years (which also supports Photoshop brushes). 

As long as whatever future version of the Daz free programme has what 4.12 already includes, (along with resource content/plugins which are still sold separately), that would be more than enough to suit the needs of people like myself who only do single frame illustrations and character design. The only time I ever use the animation timeline is for motion blur effects in 3DL (and even that takes an extremely long time to render on my old hardware). 

nonesuch00

L'Adair said:

nonesuch00 said:

I saw previews for that movie (Steve Carell) & it's awful. Although as a cartoon fan I like the effort made on the 3D CGI.

I disagree.

I watched that movie a couple nights ago on HBO. I loved the movie. The graphics were great, but the storyline, taking us into the mind of a traumatized individual, was very well done. It really showed how the lines between reality and his make-believe world were blurred.

So let's just agree to disagree, and remain friends… Okay?

Sure, but the movie was still awful.

nemesis10

nonesuch00 said:

L'Adair said:

nonesuch00 said:

I saw previews for that movie (Steve Carell) & it's awful. Although as a cartoon fan I like the effort made on the 3D CGI.

I disagree.

I watched that movie a couple nights ago on HBO. I loved the movie. The graphics were great, but the storyline, taking us into the mind of a traumatized individual, was very well done. It really showed how the lines between reality and his make-believe world were blurred.

So let's just agree to disagree, and remain friends… Okay?

Sure, but the movie was still awful.

See if you can find Marwencol (currently available on iTunes) which is the excellent documentary that Welcome to Marwen was based and a much superior film....

p0rt

kyoto kid said:

p0rt said:

kyoto kid said:

Subtropic Pixel said:

kyoto kid said:

SadKitty_Carrara said:

DAZ studio is actually getting increased use by me as features are added

I openly admit that

can it replace Carrara yet in my workflow 

a resounding no way

will it ever? If they added all the stuff so many are vehemently opposed to as it complicates things for their simple click load render a pretty girl workflow maybe

a DAZ studio  full 3D suite edition with a pricetag could possibly solve this as those same objectors hate the idea of paying for studio too

by full 3D suite I mean vertex room, terrain, trees particle generation etc like Carrara and maybe Hexagon and Bryce features too

indeed it could in effect be Carrara/Hexagon/Bryce features integrated into DAZ studio and I think many would buy it as then all DAZ content would work in it unlike Carrara 

I doubt it will ever happen but I certainly wish it could

...that would likely lose me only because I couldn't afford it on my meagre SS budget. 

I'm sure they won't do that because they'll no doubt solicit your opinion n the matter first. 

But seriously...I know you've been in business before, and in IT even!  And from that experience, I know you've learned that organizations must continually improve and advance their offerings in order to survive.  One way I look at it is that failing means a lot MORE people will be hurt.  But that drive to remain competitive sometimes means that older products or ways will need to be ended in favor of the new ones. 

I know that's not very helpful to somebody in your situation, but it is a fact of life.  Frugal is admirable.  But "meager" can be a harsh and terrible master.

...what Sad Kitty outlined sounds like Daz becoming more like Vue, which I also cannot afford.  

if the resources are just not there there is no way to benefit from such an "advancement." The issue is that should they no longer offer a "free" full featured version like they do now, it will leave those without the necessary financial resources out. 

The entire reason I chose Daz over Poser 11 years ago was because I didn't have to pony up 250$ at the outset and a basic content package for the software was available as well as there was no fixed time limit to test it out. That was a major "selling" point.

 

you wouldn't need to spend $250 or so on Daz, the free version will probably always exist, along with the pro version, there will just be a creator version with all the needed plugin's bundled with it and all registered with a single payment

...yes, that makes sense.  I doubt they'd drop their "free" track as it is still the "gateway" for sales of mesh content, resource content, and individual plugins, which again Daz makes the majority of their revenue from.  That model has worked well for them for over a decade.  Should I need a custom model, I'll turn to Blender 2.8.  If I need to sculpt small facial details, I have the free version of Sculptris.  For post production I have become pretty adept with Gimp over the years (which also supports Photoshop brushes). 

As long as whatever future version of the Daz free programme has what 4.12 already includes, (along with resource content/plugins which are still sold separately), that would be more than enough to suit the needs of people like myself who only do single frame illustrations and character design. The only time I ever use the animation timeline is for motion blur effects in 3DL (and even that takes an extremely long time to render on my old hardware). 

if Daz Inc are wise the future of Daz would probably be something like :

 

Free = Allow's scripts but no plugins

Pro = Allow's scripts & Plugins

"Creator" = Bundled with all Daz Inc plugins, which are all in the future plugin category on the Daz Store. there would probably be 100s of plugins if people could actually find them

wolf359

drzap said:

marth.e said:

I'm convinced that the best thing that DAZ could do right now is what Ubisoft just did. Ubisoft replaced their in-house digital content creation tool (DCC) with Blender.

 

Blender not only is free.  It is also a very stable, more agile development environment supported by open source. If DAZ would adopt the same workflow as Ubisoft did then they could forget about spending a significant amount of time and resources to maintain and improve the core of Daz Studio and focus on what they do best: selling 3d rigged figures and 3d content and also invest their efforts on research and exploration of new tools instead of always trying to catch up with what the competition is doing.

 

Blender 2.8 is a very powerful piece of software. Cycles render is as good as any of the top renders in the market. EEVEE, as a real time render, is a game-changer. Blender also has super powerful modeling, sculpting, uv editing, texturing, rigging (with real IK), anmation, painting and even simulation and dynamics tools. And not just that: blender evolves rapidly at the speed of the CGI industry.

 

Daz, as Ubisoft did, could then forget about trying to include any of those core features inside DAZ Studio and just focus on adding their very specialized tools and 3d rigged figures.

If Blender was the best option for Ubisoft, one of the video game giants in the world, and if they are willing to use it in production why not DAZ. 

 

Martha E.

Except for the fact that Ubisoft is made up of industry professional artists who are used to dealing with sophisticated and complicated software and Daz Studio is targeting mainly the hobbyist, point and click market.  Unless you are talking about using Blender as an additional Daz Studio "Pro", Daz3d would have to completely reorient their market position and strategy because Blender isn't nearly as easy to use as Daz Studio.   They would lose huge portions of their original base.  That is "why not DAZ".

This √

Sven Dullah

I really really don't get why some people have this obsession to turn DS to a paid for application. If you have too much money, make a donation! I'm sure it will fall in good hands.

kyoto kid

Sven Dullah said:

I really really don't get why some people have this obsession to turn DS to a paid for application. If you have too much money, make a donation! I'm sure it will fall in good hands.

...

kyoto kid

p0rt said:

kyoto kid said:

p0rt said:

kyoto kid said:

Subtropic Pixel said:

kyoto kid said:

SadKitty_Carrara said:

DAZ studio is actually getting increased use by me as features are added

I openly admit that

can it replace Carrara yet in my workflow 

a resounding no way

will it ever? If they added all the stuff so many are vehemently opposed to as it complicates things for their simple click load render a pretty girl workflow maybe

a DAZ studio  full 3D suite edition with a pricetag could possibly solve this as those same objectors hate the idea of paying for studio too

by full 3D suite I mean vertex room, terrain, trees particle generation etc like Carrara and maybe Hexagon and Bryce features too

indeed it could in effect be Carrara/Hexagon/Bryce features integrated into DAZ studio and I think many would buy it as then all DAZ content would work in it unlike Carrara 

I doubt it will ever happen but I certainly wish it could

...that would likely lose me only because I couldn't afford it on my meagre SS budget. 

I'm sure they won't do that because they'll no doubt solicit your opinion n the matter first. 

But seriously...I know you've been in business before, and in IT even!  And from that experience, I know you've learned that organizations must continually improve and advance their offerings in order to survive.  One way I look at it is that failing means a lot MORE people will be hurt.  But that drive to remain competitive sometimes means that older products or ways will need to be ended in favor of the new ones. 

I know that's not very helpful to somebody in your situation, but it is a fact of life.  Frugal is admirable.  But "meager" can be a harsh and terrible master.

...what Sad Kitty outlined sounds like Daz becoming more like Vue, which I also cannot afford.  

if the resources are just not there there is no way to benefit from such an "advancement." The issue is that should they no longer offer a "free" full featured version like they do now, it will leave those without the necessary financial resources out. 

The entire reason I chose Daz over Poser 11 years ago was because I didn't have to pony up 250$ at the outset and a basic content package for the software was available as well as there was no fixed time limit to test it out. That was a major "selling" point.

 

you wouldn't need to spend $250 or so on Daz, the free version will probably always exist, along with the pro version, there will just be a creator version with all the needed plugin's bundled with it and all registered with a single payment

...yes, that makes sense.  I doubt they'd drop their "free" track as it is still the "gateway" for sales of mesh content, resource content, and individual plugins, which again Daz makes the majority of their revenue from.  That model has worked well for them for over a decade.  Should I need a custom model, I'll turn to Blender 2.8.  If I need to sculpt small facial details, I have the free version of Sculptris.  For post production I have become pretty adept with Gimp over the years (which also supports Photoshop brushes). 

As long as whatever future version of the Daz free programme has what 4.12 already includes, (along with resource content/plugins which are still sold separately), that would be more than enough to suit the needs of people like myself who only do single frame illustrations and character design. The only time I ever use the animation timeline is for motion blur effects in 3DL (and even that takes an extremely long time to render on my old hardware). 

if Daz Inc are wise the future of Daz would probably be something like :

 

Free = Allow's scripts but no plugins

Pro = Allow's scripts & Plugins

"Creator" = Bundled with all Daz Inc plugins, which are all in the future plugin category on the Daz Store. there would probably be 100s of plugins if people could actually find them

..one question about the "free" version parameters. What happens to users who have already purchased various plugins and have the serial #s for.  Do they just lose access to them without any compensation?

I would look at the breakdown more like: 

"Basic" (free as it is now) = allows scripts but no plugins.

"Pro" (free as it is now) = bundled with basic scripts and the plugins that are already included with the current version, as well as supports additional plugins purchased in the Daz store.

"Creator" or "Deluxe" ($$$)  = bundled with all Daz plugins.

takezo_3001

Sven Dullah said:

I really really don't get why some people have this obsession to turn DS to a paid for application. If you have too much money, make a donation! I'm sure it will fall in good hands.

This^ I already paid for it anyways...

p0rt

kyoto kid said:

p0rt said:

kyoto kid said:

p0rt said:

kyoto kid said:

Subtropic Pixel said:

kyoto kid said:

SadKitty_Carrara said:

DAZ studio is actually getting increased use by me as features are added

I openly admit that

can it replace Carrara yet in my workflow 

a resounding no way

will it ever? If they added all the stuff so many are vehemently opposed to as it complicates things for their simple click load render a pretty girl workflow maybe

a DAZ studio  full 3D suite edition with a pricetag could possibly solve this as those same objectors hate the idea of paying for studio too

by full 3D suite I mean vertex room, terrain, trees particle generation etc like Carrara and maybe Hexagon and Bryce features too

indeed it could in effect be Carrara/Hexagon/Bryce features integrated into DAZ studio and I think many would buy it as then all DAZ content would work in it unlike Carrara 

I doubt it will ever happen but I certainly wish it could

...that would likely lose me only because I couldn't afford it on my meagre SS budget. 

I'm sure they won't do that because they'll no doubt solicit your opinion n the matter first. 

But seriously...I know you've been in business before, and in IT even!  And from that experience, I know you've learned that organizations must continually improve and advance their offerings in order to survive.  One way I look at it is that failing means a lot MORE people will be hurt.  But that drive to remain competitive sometimes means that older products or ways will need to be ended in favor of the new ones. 

I know that's not very helpful to somebody in your situation, but it is a fact of life.  Frugal is admirable.  But "meager" can be a harsh and terrible master.

...what Sad Kitty outlined sounds like Daz becoming more like Vue, which I also cannot afford.  

if the resources are just not there there is no way to benefit from such an "advancement." The issue is that should they no longer offer a "free" full featured version like they do now, it will leave those without the necessary financial resources out. 

The entire reason I chose Daz over Poser 11 years ago was because I didn't have to pony up 250$ at the outset and a basic content package for the software was available as well as there was no fixed time limit to test it out. That was a major "selling" point.

 

you wouldn't need to spend $250 or so on Daz, the free version will probably always exist, along with the pro version, there will just be a creator version with all the needed plugin's bundled with it and all registered with a single payment

...yes, that makes sense.  I doubt they'd drop their "free" track as it is still the "gateway" for sales of mesh content, resource content, and individual plugins, which again Daz makes the majority of their revenue from.  That model has worked well for them for over a decade.  Should I need a custom model, I'll turn to Blender 2.8.  If I need to sculpt small facial details, I have the free version of Sculptris.  For post production I have become pretty adept with Gimp over the years (which also supports Photoshop brushes). 

As long as whatever future version of the Daz free programme has what 4.12 already includes, (along with resource content/plugins which are still sold separately), that would be more than enough to suit the needs of people like myself who only do single frame illustrations and character design. The only time I ever use the animation timeline is for motion blur effects in 3DL (and even that takes an extremely long time to render on my old hardware). 

if Daz Inc are wise the future of Daz would probably be something like :

 

Free = Allow's scripts but no plugins

Pro = Allow's scripts & Plugins

"Creator" = Bundled with all Daz Inc plugins, which are all in the future plugin category on the Daz Store. there would probably be 100s of plugins if people could actually find them

..one question about the "free" version parameters. What happens to users who have already purchased various plugins and have the serial #s for.  Do they just lose access to them without any compensation?

I would look at the breakdown more like: 

"Basic" (free as it is now) = allows scripts but no plugins.

"Pro" (free as it is now) = bundled with basic scripts and the plugins that are already included with the current version, as well as supports additional plugins purchased in the Daz store.

"Creator" or "Deluxe" ($$$)  = bundled with all Daz plugins.

I would'nt know, its a hypothetical situation and I do not work for Daz Inc, I guess the free version user's would have the choice of not upgrading

Daz only need's to add CUDA processing to the viewport to make the animation better then cinema 4D and 1000% faster to animated every object in a scene, you have to pay for something somewhere