Review System
DivaDolly
Posts: 93
in The Commons
DAZ 3D SHOULD HAVE A "REVIEW SYSTEM/STARSYSTEM" SO THAT BUYERS CAN DECIDE WHOSE PRODUCTS ARE THE BEST/OR MOST POPULAR TO BUY. I'VE SPENT A SMALL FORTUNE AND TO BE HONEST
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Comments
They don't, and they shouldn't.
Define "best." I don't do many fantasy renders. Does that mean fantasy items are bad?
Agreed!
Uhmm, but why would you rate a product you did not buy? I think it would be a nice feature that people who have actually bought a product could rate it.
Let's put it the other way: "How on Earth is it the best product in the store, when it's a fantasy item, and I don't render fantasy?" ;)
Any such rating in this industry is extremely subjective.
There is a sort option that lets you see the current most popular items. Other than that... how do you define popular? The most people have bought it? I can already tell you that it'll be one of the oldest items in the store. Does that make all new items bad?
Rendo has a review system, including comments and stars. I don't really read them. I can see how they might help inform a buyer, but I don't personally use them for this hobby.
Once in a while, I'll look at the reviews in Rendo, but 95% of the time, all I need to see is in the images and the list of morphs. There's usually not enough of a volume of reviews to make the observations worthwhile to me. I don't tend to trust star ratings when there are only a few responses.
Otherwise, my interests are such a tail-end case, it's better to ask in the forums if I have a niche concern.
At rendo I find them useful only if its a product that doesn't list DS but a reviewer says that it works in DS and to what extent.
@Ati Of course we can't decide what's best item in the store, but it would be useful to sort items by category. For example filter by figure and order by rating. I've done quite a lot of shopping in Unity store also, and I really like it that people can actually leave reviews of the products there. Also there's links to forum threads etc. Just because you don't like the idea, does not really make it bad. Lots of people do use those ratings/reviews.
That exists here, too with the browser addon: https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/106296/announcing-daz-deals-browser-add-on/p1
You can see all the discussion related to a particular item and you can make an informed decision about buying it based on what other people think, or what issues they are having. So if you are interested in what people think of a product, then this does that. However, it's not a rating system.
You can't tell me what the best car is. The best for what purpose? Do I want to race? Do I want to carry people? Do I want to start a moving company? People use items from the store for different things. Some items work perfectly well for something, and they don't for another. This doesn't make the item bad in any way. It's just not for that particular purpose.
The vast majority are terrible at distinguishing personal tastes and circumstances from absolutes. This would make a review system no more than an excuse to flog out prejudices and petty feuds.
I enter into evidence: like, everything. (gestures toward the world)
Providing a single specific case in which reviews are not useful is, I feel, being deliberately obtuse. Although most buyers will be looking for certain types of product, this does not ever mean there is no circumstance in which they will have two otherwise similar products between which to make an (only partially informed) buying decision.
Two similar characters, two similar hairs, two similar t-shirts... there are cases in which, yes, someone might actually benefit from hearing the thoughts of other buyers.
This isn't necessarily to say that I think that a review system is necessarily a good idea (frankly, if Daz is going to overhaul their store, I'd put other things further up the priority list, particularly as most reviews tend to work out as either 1 star or 5 stars), but I have an objection to an argument that boils down to "Well, I don't like it, so other people are wrong to agree that they do".
The promos probably act as a review to many buyers, which is also the reason why a kind of review system might not be such a bad idea. There are a lot of wonderful products in the Daz store that are done a tremendous disservice due to bad promo art.
We live in a time of the 5 star rating, and I'm pretty sure most people when they buy most anything online look to see which products have the highest positive rating, and I think most know how to judge if a bad rating is actually deserved or not.
To iterate more the rating system, I'll try to make an example how it "could" work. Lets use those fantasy items you don't use, but for example I was looking as an example.
At first we have 500 pages of products, and that would take a lot of time to go through if you are just looking for fantasy items. Fortunately Daz has couple filter functions, where you can filter your search results:
So if I only want to see fantasy items, I'll just use genre and voila, only 86 pages left.
Now imagine if we also had rating dropdown, where we could choose it to show for example only 4-5 start product, and I'd probably be down to 10 or pages. Is there a possibility that I miss some really great fantasy items that nobody ever cared to rate? Yes, of course there is, but I already take that same risk when I choose to show only fantasy items. There also could be great fantasy items in Sci-fi category etc...
And you know what, this new dropdown would take absolutely nothing away from any user who does not wish to use it. Nobody forces people to rate items, and nobody forces them to use that new filter either. Maybe Ati, Pedro or FSMCDesigns would not like to use this new functionality, but for me or DivaDolly it would be a nice addition. Daz Studio is constantly being developed, so why not the webshop?
Uhh, there was lots of post while I was making my new search functionality :)
@Ati Anyways, rating system's job is not to tell anybody what is the best car or what is the best fantasy item. It's there only to show what other people thought about the product. There can be 100 5-star cars, and if you want to use those ratings when you make your own decision, they are there. It just tells that some other liked the product. It's perfectly fine if you want to buy previously 1-star rated car, and then give it 5 star rating. It's your opinion.
@Oso3D It's getting really old to always expect that people are going to behave in the worst possible way. If somebody hates you so much, that they are willing to buy your products to give them bad ratings, that's easy money. Keep on doing what you do, and cry all the way to the bank
I'm for review systems in general. For art items though? I don't feel this would add much value to the customer. A refund policy is way better and pretty generous for unenrcrypted digital items.
How would anyone other than me know what a good product for me is? Why would anyone care that I find a particular animation set very good so I give it 5 stars, when they don't do animation? Why would I want to exclude an item from a sale just because some people didn't like the color of the shirt and gave it only 3 stars?
I honestly think that the current method gives you enough to go on. You can see the promo images. You can see what others have done with the product in the gallery. You can see what they do with it on the forum. You can see what issues they have with it--if any. All from the product page. Without any subjective rating.
Then again, this is my opinion. Which is also subjective. ;)
While that is a very useful feature of Daz Deals, it does rely on people properly linking the product in the gallery/forum, which they frequently do not. There's a fair few store pages where the add-on would have it that I'm the only person to ever upload a render of that product.
(And frankly, I wouldn't consider many of my renders to be good reviews for products. I'm weird).
Agreed, Almighty. The ease of not personally liking things so returning it is... a million times better than a review system, even if a review system was run by analytical highly trained reviewers.
Mendoman: You are picking only one of several issues I raised.
Look at forum threads. There are NUMEROUS times when a customer has misunderstood what a product was and thought it was broken. In a thread or customer service, at least the person can potentially find a solution. With a review system that person is likely to leave a review based on their misunderstanding.
Most people lack the capacity to separate their tastes from absolute truths, and also the ability to communicate what their tastes are. This is sometimes malicious, but very often isn't. But it's noise in the review system.
Finally, some products change or get updated. How do you manage a review that doesn't apply to the new version?
It's just a big mess that provides no real advantages over the present system (IE: refund, forum), and a number of disadvantages (misleading potential customers).
I'd like a review system now that dForce garments are a thing. I cannot begin to count the number of "dForce" items I've bougt only to have them explode during simulation no matter how I try to run the sim. Seeing others reporting problems and no update would be enough to save me the hassle of buying it, trying to use it, getting disgusted and having to file a refund request.
Plus requires additional staff to moderate reviews, and make sure they are not biased/bought/from the competition. (Just look at the number of reviews getting taken down from Amazon every single day.)
You have been trawling the Amazon reviews again, haven't you?
"The postman didn't ring the doorbell and instead left the product out on the porch where the dog peed on it. Terrible product, one star!"
That's the thing though. if you posted reviews about the dforce products that explode on you and i read it and assumed that was how it is, then i wouldn't purchase that item. In my experience, I have had nearly zero experiences with dforce items and exploding. Wouldn't it be better for the user to try it for themselves and see how it works instead of warning them off it in the first place. How many times have we all seen a use come into the forum saying a certain product is broken and it's a piece of crap when 90% of the time it's the users fault either thru misuse or system issues.
When I post reviews at Rendo it's for the PAs sake and not for potential customers
THIS! Exactly this!
I like product reviews personally and I tend to get a lot of info from critical reviews especially those on amazon.
But that will not fly here, due to the culture, so I just talk about stuff behind the scenes.
I find Qa here growing more lax, so it would certainly help me to know not to buy a product that may have some flaw that I can’t live with. Or it could be helpful to see if the pros outweigh the cons.
I can parse out personal opinion from things I find valuable... so some may argue certain reviews have no merit, I tend to find most commentary about things to be more useful than the lack of it.
I’d limit reviews to owners of a product.
I don't. Products need hundreds of reviews (only from those who have purchased). Even after they have those hundreds of reviews, some you're going to disagree with.
We deal with visually-based products; the best reviews are those that have images, meaning forum posts where users all post their efforts. I have bought a number of products based on what users have posted.
If I don't like an item, I can return it, no questions asked.
I've never seen any with enough reviews tbh.
I love reading reviews. I get what some are saying about some reviewers but we live in a world where we are used to yelp and amazon reviews, and I would hope many if not most of us can tell when opinions are wharped or baseless etc. Certainly forum threads on products are very very helpful to me when they provide details of a user's experience. However, even as I read those, I certainly never take what is written as being 100 percent accurate or true for every user. I understand skill level counts, for example. One person may not be able to make something work, while another can. As a review reader, one should and probably does take all that into consideration. There is no reason to think someone reading reviews is going to be 100 percent influenced by a review - reviews are more like one factor/consideration/piece of information relevant to a purchase decision.
There should be a review system. I spend thousands on amazon and base my purchases on reviews. Anyone who rejects a review system is scared of reviews. If a vendor is top notch they welcome reviews and all the stars it brings, shining a light on their glory. True talent welcomes reviews and inferior artists dread them. I say bring on the reviews. Shine the light on the gems.
Edit: As an example: As an author I get trolls that never buy my book, never read it but do reviews to get benefits that the algoriitm allows them. The Daz review should exclude PA's because they tend to support their community come hell or high water.Reviews should identify the buyer and identify the purchase as authentic. It should also show a count nreviews and positive vs negative reviews which helps identify and ignore pessimists who find nothing good in everything. Like a signature 100 reviews +90 -10 or -90 +10. There should be screenshots and a detailed explanation as to why the product sucked or shimmered or shone.Don't make it easy. Make it like a support ticket.