Loading...
> >

Please Daz....more info on your character product promos...

AllenArtAllenArt Posts: 7,140
edited May 2019 in The Commons

Would it be so difficult to do what other PA's do and show what the character looks like with NO makeup, a picture of all the eye colors or a picture of all the makeups? Showing the character with different expressions, poses and outfits shows me nothing really about the character that I'd like to know.

Thanks for listening.

Laurie

Post edited by AllenArt on
«13

Comments

  • Sfariah DSfariah D Posts: 25,703

    I would like a textureless render of the character to show off the morph.

  • mindsongmindsong Posts: 1,693
    Miss Bad Wolf said:

    I would like a textureless render of the character to show off the morph.

    +++

    Not just for characters - I really like the textureless/clay renders of all products, as they usually show exactly what I can expect in my purchase. I like the usual promo renders too, as they indicate the potential use in competent hands, but the textureless renders 'show the goods'.

    --ms

  • AllenArtAllenArt Posts: 7,140
    edited May 2019

    Well, in the case of Kala, what eye colors has she got? What do her makeups look like? Is what's shown in each unrelated render promo all of them? So many unanswered questions...

    I also like to see the clay render as well, as well as closeups of the hands and feet. Daz used to do this....what happened?

    If I want to see pretty pictures of the character in different poses, hairstyles and clothes, I can wait for after it's release and follow the announcement thread images or look at the gallery. Before I buy I'd like to see what exactly it is I'm buying as the clothes and hair used in the promos may never make it to my hard drive ;).

    Laurie

    Post edited by AllenArt on
  • Sfariah DSfariah D Posts: 25,703
    mindsong said:
    Miss Bad Wolf said:

    I would like a textureless render of the character to show off the morph.

    +++

    Not just for characters - I really like the textureless/clay renders of all products, as they usually show exactly what I can expect in my purchase. I like the usual promo renders too, as they indicate the potential use in competent hands, but the textureless renders 'show the goods'.

    --ms

    True for products with new geometry or morphs to add.  If it is just a texture product with nothing really added to the geometry shape then it is not needed.  For example a new scene for the PC would be cool to see textureless version but the texture addons without new props would not need it.

    Actually there is one site that I sometimes visit that does 3D objects but only have one promo picture per item.  It is like they rendered only one image and gave no more thought to it.   At least at Daz we have more than one promo per item.

  • Sfariah DSfariah D Posts: 25,703

    I want a close up render of the teeth, not just a pretty smile but a good idea of what the teeth look like.

    AllenArt said:

    Well, in the case of Kala, what eye colors has she got? What do her makeups look like? Is what's shown in each unrelated render promo all of them? So many unanswered questions...

    I also like to see the clay render as well, as well as closeups of the hands and feet. Daz used to do this....what happened?

    Laurie

    I agree that would be great too.

  • mindsongmindsong Posts: 1,693
    Miss Bad Wolf said:
    mindsong said:
    Miss Bad Wolf said:

    I would like a textureless render of the character to show off the morph.

    +++

    Not just for characters - I really like the textureless/clay renders of all products, as they usually show exactly what I can expect in my purchase. I like the usual promo renders too, as they indicate the potential use in competent hands, but the textureless renders 'show the goods'.

    --ms

    True for products with new geometry or morphs to add.  If it is just a texture product with nothing really added to the geometry shape then it is not needed.  For example a new scene for the PC would be cool to see textureless version but the texture addons without new props would not need it.

    Actually there is one site that I sometimes visit that does 3D objects but only have one promo picture per item.  It is like they rendered only one image and gave no more thought to it.   At least at Daz we have more than one promo per item.

    good points - I find that most figure vendors tend to highlight their texture sets (makeups, etc.) well, but the figure (and hair) 'clay' renders are probably only included 20-30% of the time. Many DAZ orig outfits and some props/place have nice clay renders along with their traditional promos, which I really like.

    cheers,

    --ms

  • OdaaOdaa Posts: 1,548
    edited May 2019

    Special brownie points to Dark-Elf for mentioning what lightset was used for Elina's promo art in the "additional products used" section: https://www.daz3d.com/de-elina-for-kala-8

    Post edited by Odaa on
  • MimicMollyMimicMolly Posts: 2,114

    This is more about certain PAs, but "Not all options shown" makes me more reluctant to purchase the products in question. I don't remember which G8 base it was, but the character had some extra morphs that weren't listed on the "What's Included".

    Also, kinda sad that I must look at the HD add-on just to get a look at the clay render of the base resolution morph. :|

  • outrider42outrider42 Posts: 3,679
    I think perhaps the thread title should refer to product promo images just to make the point more clear. Like "More information in promo renders, please".

    And yes, I am in full agreement. I thought makeup and eye color images were pretty much mandatory, they certainly should be. And of course, a makeup free face should count as a makeup option on that list.
  • DripDrip Posts: 1,136
    edited May 2019

    In the case of non-figure objects, like clothes, weapons, vehicles, and sometimes even interiors, I'd like a render showing the different materialzones as well. A mediocre item can turn out to be an awesome versatile asset thanks to a logical set of material zones, while something that may look awesome on the promos can end up collecting dust because it's too much a hassle to adjust some details.

    Post edited by Drip on
  • TaozTaoz Posts: 9,732
    AllenArt said:

    Would it be so difficult to do what other PA's do and show what the character looks like with NO makeup, a picture of all the eye colors or a picture of all the makeups? Showing the character with different expressions, poses and outfits shows me nothing really about the character that I'd like to know.

    Thanks for listening.

    Laurie

    +1

  • GoggerGogger Posts: 2,308
    AllenArt said:

    Would it be so difficult to do what other PA's do and show what the character looks like with NO makeup, a picture of all the eye colors or a picture of all the makeups? Showing the character with different expressions, poses and outfits shows me nothing really about the character that I'd like to know.

    Thanks for listening.

    Laurie

    +1

    "Makeup Option 0" should be a basic requirement.

  • Male-M3diaMale-M3dia Posts: 3,581
    MimicMolly said:

    This is more about certain PAs, but "Not all options shown" makes me more reluctant to purchase the products in question. I don't remember which G8 base it was, but the character had some extra morphs that weren't listed on the "What's Included".

     

    It could have been an "anatomical element" morph that can't be shown or linked from the page. My products have extras that fall under that category.

  • CybersoxCybersox Posts: 8,760
    Gogger said:
    AllenArt said:

    Would it be so difficult to do what other PA's do and show what the character looks like with NO makeup, a picture of all the eye colors or a picture of all the makeups? Showing the character with different expressions, poses and outfits shows me nothing really about the character that I'd like to know.

    Thanks for listening.

    Laurie

    +1

    "Makeup Option 0" should be a basic requirement.

    + 1 cubed.

    The thing is, it's very clear that DAZ is more interested in pictures that look interesting than in pictures that actually show all the details of the product.  While I generally dislike the overall look of the Renderosity site, I think they do a better job of showing what the product really looks like, especially when it comes to things like skin textures. 

  • Male-M3diaMale-M3dia Posts: 3,581
    edited May 2019
    Cybersox said:
    Gogger said:
    AllenArt said:

    Would it be so difficult to do what other PA's do and show what the character looks like with NO makeup, a picture of all the eye colors or a picture of all the makeups? Showing the character with different expressions, poses and outfits shows me nothing really about the character that I'd like to know.

    Thanks for listening.

    Laurie

    +1

    "Makeup Option 0" should be a basic requirement.

    + 1 cubed.

    The thing is, it's very clear that DAZ is more interested in pictures that look interesting than in pictures that actually show all the details of the product.  While I generally dislike the overall look of the Renderosity site, I think they do a better job of showing what the product really looks like, especially when it comes to things like skin textures. 

    But those vendors make way less money than they would here. Not everything that one would request makes an item sell more.

    Post edited by Male-M3dia on
  • TaozTaoz Posts: 9,732
    Male-M3dia said:
    Cybersox said:
    Gogger said:
    AllenArt said:

    Would it be so difficult to do what other PA's do and show what the character looks like with NO makeup, a picture of all the eye colors or a picture of all the makeups? Showing the character with different expressions, poses and outfits shows me nothing really about the character that I'd like to know.

    Thanks for listening.

    Laurie

    +1

    "Makeup Option 0" should be a basic requirement.

    + 1 cubed.

    The thing is, it's very clear that DAZ is more interested in pictures that look interesting than in pictures that actually show all the details of the product.  While I generally dislike the overall look of the Renderosity site, I think they do a better job of showing what the product really looks like, especially when it comes to things like skin textures. 

    But those vendors make way less money than they would here. Not everything that one would request makes an item sell more.

    I don't really think customers care much about that. They just want to know what they are buying.

  • MimicMollyMimicMolly Posts: 2,114
    edited May 2019
    Male-M3dia said:
    MimicMolly said:

    This is more about certain PAs, but "Not all options shown" makes me more reluctant to purchase the products in question. I don't remember which G8 base it was, but the character had some extra morphs that weren't listed on the "What's Included".

     

    It could have been an "anatomical element" morph that can't be shown or linked from the page. My products have extras that fall under that category.

    I found the base, it was Edie 8 https://www.daz3d.com/edie-8 . She has separate nose and ear morphs like Ollie, but they're not listed on her product page, while his has them.

    Ollie 8 page, for comparison: https://www.daz3d.com/ollie-8

    I can understand lack of product detail for anatomical elements, but this wasn't the case here.

    EDIT: Teen Josie 8 was missing the separate eyelash morph that makes them big on the product page too, and these are just the ones I know of because I own them. Can't say the same for other base characters that I don't own yet. https://www.daz3d.com/teen-josie-8

    Post edited by MimicMolly on
  • CybersoxCybersox Posts: 8,760
    Male-M3dia said:
    Cybersox said:
    Gogger said:
    AllenArt said:

    Would it be so difficult to do what other PA's do and show what the character looks like with NO makeup, a picture of all the eye colors or a picture of all the makeups? Showing the character with different expressions, poses and outfits shows me nothing really about the character that I'd like to know.

    Thanks for listening.

    Laurie

    +1

    "Makeup Option 0" should be a basic requirement.

    + 1 cubed.

    The thing is, it's very clear that DAZ is more interested in pictures that look interesting than in pictures that actually show all the details of the product.  While I generally dislike the overall look of the Renderosity site, I think they do a better job of showing what the product really looks like, especially when it comes to things like skin textures. 

    But those vendors make way less money than they would here. Not everything that one would request makes an item sell more.

    You can say that, but the problem with that statement is that there are quite a few high profile artists who were here and then moved there, and there are artists who were there, moved here, and then moved back again, and there are those who maintain a catalog at both stores.  Clearly some vendors do better at one store than others and vice versa, and the benefits aren't necessarily always financial.  Either way, would you argue that having more information up front is NOT of potential benefit to the consumer?        

  • LyonessLyoness Posts: 1,610
    Cybersox said:
    Male-M3dia said:
    Cybersox said:
    Gogger said:
    AllenArt said:

    Would it be so difficult to do what other PA's do and show what the character looks like with NO makeup, a picture of all the eye colors or a picture of all the makeups? Showing the character with different expressions, poses and outfits shows me nothing really about the character that I'd like to know.

    Thanks for listening.

    Laurie

    +1

    "Makeup Option 0" should be a basic requirement.

    + 1 cubed.

    The thing is, it's very clear that DAZ is more interested in pictures that look interesting than in pictures that actually show all the details of the product.  While I generally dislike the overall look of the Renderosity site, I think they do a better job of showing what the product really looks like, especially when it comes to things like skin textures. 

    But those vendors make way less money than they would here. Not everything that one would request makes an item sell more.

    You can say that, but the problem with that statement is that there are quite a few high profile artists who were here and then moved there, and there are artists who were there, moved here, and then moved back again, and there are those who maintain a catalog at both stores.  Clearly some vendors do better at one store than others and vice versa, and the benefits aren't necessarily always financial.  Either way, would you argue that having more information up front is NOT of potential benefit to the consumer?        

    not all options shown...
    that refers to gens, translucency presets, bump presets, no brow presets, 3dl presets, extra shine presets or lips or nails, maybe extra eyelash color presets, etc  you see what I mean?
    If it's a major point, then it's shown.  Daz insists on it. But all these smaller kinds of presets are the ones that some people categorize under "not all options shown"
    I never use the phrase and I am certain that every single preset that I make is included in the "What's Included and Features" section.  It is for everyone.
    so do not worry that you are missing out on something good..

  • AllenArtAllenArt Posts: 7,140
    edited May 2019
    Taoz said:
    Male-M3dia said:
    Cybersox said:
    Gogger said:
    AllenArt said:

    Would it be so difficult to do what other PA's do and show what the character looks like with NO makeup, a picture of all the eye colors or a picture of all the makeups? Showing the character with different expressions, poses and outfits shows me nothing really about the character that I'd like to know.

    Thanks for listening.

    Laurie

    +1

    "Makeup Option 0" should be a basic requirement.

    + 1 cubed.

    The thing is, it's very clear that DAZ is more interested in pictures that look interesting than in pictures that actually show all the details of the product.  While I generally dislike the overall look of the Renderosity site, I think they do a better job of showing what the product really looks like, especially when it comes to things like skin textures. 

    But those vendors make way less money than they would here. Not everything that one would request makes an item sell more.

    I don't really think customers care much about that. They just want to know what they are buying.

    Agreed. Like I said, I'd prefer to see what I'm buying in promos. If/when I wanna see pretty pictures I'll go and look in the galleries. Isn't that what they're for? The first thing I wanna see is the makeup selection, because if it's "trowel-worthy", it's a hard pass.

    Laurie

    Post edited by AllenArt on
  • MazhMazh Posts: 476

    One thing Daz does and PA's (mostly ?) don't, if it is a HD character, I'd love to see a clay render.

  • Male-M3diaMale-M3dia Posts: 3,581
    edited May 2019
    Cybersox said:
    Male-M3dia said:
    Cybersox said:
    Gogger said:
    AllenArt said:

    Would it be so difficult to do what other PA's do and show what the character looks like with NO makeup, a picture of all the eye colors or a picture of all the makeups? Showing the character with different expressions, poses and outfits shows me nothing really about the character that I'd like to know.

    Thanks for listening.

    Laurie

    +1

    "Makeup Option 0" should be a basic requirement.

    + 1 cubed.

    The thing is, it's very clear that DAZ is more interested in pictures that look interesting than in pictures that actually show all the details of the product.  While I generally dislike the overall look of the Renderosity site, I think they do a better job of showing what the product really looks like, especially when it comes to things like skin textures. 

    But those vendors make way less money than they would here. Not everything that one would request makes an item sell more.

    You can say that, but the problem with that statement is that there are quite a few high profile artists who were here and then moved there, and there are artists who were there, moved here, and then moved back again, and there are those who maintain a catalog at both stores.  Clearly some vendors do better at one store than others and vice versa, and the benefits aren't necessarily always financial.  Either way, would you argue that having more information up front is NOT of potential benefit to the consumer?        

    Also there is a limit on the amount of promo images that are used, so as Lyoness said, the major items will be covered but they may come up on a limit on the promos they can use to use to display the product... or the image that may have covered that particular item was rejected in final review. There isn't just one reason why everything could not be covered in promos. There's a lot of nuance in promo making and it's not as straightforward as some think.

    Post edited by Male-M3dia on
  • LyonessLyoness Posts: 1,610
    Male-M3dia said:
    Cybersox said:
    Male-M3dia said:
    Cybersox said:
    Gogger said:
    AllenArt said:

    Would it be so difficult to do what other PA's do and show what the character looks like with NO makeup, a picture of all the eye colors or a picture of all the makeups? Showing the character with different expressions, poses and outfits shows me nothing really about the character that I'd like to know.

    Thanks for listening.

    Laurie

    +1

    "Makeup Option 0" should be a basic requirement.

    + 1 cubed.

    The thing is, it's very clear that DAZ is more interested in pictures that look interesting than in pictures that actually show all the details of the product.  While I generally dislike the overall look of the Renderosity site, I think they do a better job of showing what the product really looks like, especially when it comes to things like skin textures. 

    But those vendors make way less money than they would here. Not everything that one would request makes an item sell more.

    You can say that, but the problem with that statement is that there are quite a few high profile artists who were here and then moved there, and there are artists who were there, moved here, and then moved back again, and there are those who maintain a catalog at both stores.  Clearly some vendors do better at one store than others and vice versa, and the benefits aren't necessarily always financial.  Either way, would you argue that having more information up front is NOT of potential benefit to the consumer?        

    Also there is a limit on the amount of promo images that are used, so as Lyoness said, the major items will be covered but they may come up on a limit on the promos they can use to use to display the product... or the image that may have covered that particular item was rejected in final review. There isn't just one reason why everything could not be covered in promos. There's a lot of nuance in promo making and it's not as straightforward as some think.

    "There's a lot of nuance in promo making and it's not as straightforward as some think."

    We have a lot of rules that we must follow when presenting our products.  We cannot just do anything.

     

  • MazhMazh Posts: 476

    There seems to be a new rule for HD morphs, clay renders with underwear only... :)

  • GoggerGogger Posts: 2,308
    edited May 2019

    Oops, I posted this image over in Kala 8 is here.

     

    Anyway, Kala 8 right out of the box, default Iray skin (no makep?) "Kala 8 All Maps" from the IRAY materials folder, with default eyelashes. Sahel Signature smile because someone said they wanted to see her teeth. BOSS Lighting System.

    image.png
    1920 x 1200 - 2M
    Post edited by Gogger on
  • GoggerGogger Posts: 2,308
    edited May 2019

    Here's a screenshot of the Kala 8 IRAY folder if it helps anyone:


     

    Kala_8_IRAY.jpg
    790 x 827 - 188K
    Post edited by Gogger on
  • WonderlandWonderland Posts: 6,740
    Lyoness said:
    Male-M3dia said:
    Cybersox said:
    Male-M3dia said:
    Cybersox said:
    Gogger said:
    AllenArt said:

    QWould it be so difficult to do what other PA's do and show what the character looks like with NO makeup, a picture of all the eye colors or a picture of all the makeups? Showing the character with different expressions, poses and outfits shows me nothing really about the character that I'd like to know.

    Thanks for listening.

    Laurie

    +1

    "Makeup Option 0" should be a basic requirement.

    + 1 cubed.

    The thing is, it's very clear that DAZ is more interested in pictures that look interesting than in pictures that actually show all the details of the product.  While I generally dislike the overall look of the Renderosity site, I think they do a better job of showing what the product really looks like, especially when it comes to things like skin textures. 

    But those vendors make way less money than they would here. Not everything that one would request makes an item sell more.

    You can say that, but the problem with that statement is that there are quite a few high profile artists who were here and then moved there, and there are artists who were there, moved here, and then moved back again, and there are those who maintain a catalog at both stores.  Clearly some vendors do better at one store than others and vice versa, and the benefits aren't necessarily always financial.  Either way, would you argue that having more information up front is NOT of potential benefit to the consumer?        

    Also there is a limit on the amount of promo images that are used, so as Lyoness said, the major items will be covered but they may come up on a limit on the promos they can use to use to display the product... or the image that may have covered that particular item was rejected in final review. There isn't just one reason why everything could not be covered in promos. There's a lot of nuance in promo making and it's not as straightforward as some think.

    "There's a lot of nuance in promo making and it's not as straightforward as some think."

    We have a lot of rules that we must follow when presenting our products.  We cannot just do anything.

     

    Which is ironic, because in general, I find PA promos so much better than Daz Original ones. Are they not following their own rules?

  • OdaaOdaa Posts: 1,548

    Gogger: thank you, very useful. Holy cow, what exactly are the henna options in this set, some kind of geograft?

  • TaozTaoz Posts: 9,732
    Male-M3dia said:
    Cybersox said:
    Male-M3dia said:
    Cybersox said:
    Gogger said:
    AllenArt said:

    Would it be so difficult to do what other PA's do and show what the character looks like with NO makeup, a picture of all the eye colors or a picture of all the makeups? Showing the character with different expressions, poses and outfits shows me nothing really about the character that I'd like to know.

    Thanks for listening.

    Laurie

    +1

    "Makeup Option 0" should be a basic requirement.

    + 1 cubed.

    The thing is, it's very clear that DAZ is more interested in pictures that look interesting than in pictures that actually show all the details of the product.  While I generally dislike the overall look of the Renderosity site, I think they do a better job of showing what the product really looks like, especially when it comes to things like skin textures. 

    But those vendors make way less money than they would here. Not everything that one would request makes an item sell more.

    You can say that, but the problem with that statement is that there are quite a few high profile artists who were here and then moved there, and there are artists who were there, moved here, and then moved back again, and there are those who maintain a catalog at both stores.  Clearly some vendors do better at one store than others and vice versa, and the benefits aren't necessarily always financial.  Either way, would you argue that having more information up front is NOT of potential benefit to the consumer?        

    Also there is a limit on the amount of promo images that are used, so as Lyoness said, the major items will be covered but they may come up on a limit on the promos they can use to use to display the product... or the image that may have covered that particular item was rejected in final review. There isn't just one reason why everything could not be covered in promos. There's a lot of nuance in promo making and it's not as straightforward as some think.

    Well that limit seems to be pretty high, one of the latest products has 24 promos. I think you can easily cover any subject a customer might want to know about within that limit. Many clothing products don't have anything as simple and obvious as a promo showing the backside of the clothing, so it's not necessarily about numbers but also about relevance. 6 promos can be enough for me, if they are relevant, but some may have 12 and not a single one showing the backside of the clothing.

  • mwokeemwokee Posts: 1,275
    This is a common theme in one form or another. Many PA's are good artists and bad salesmen.
This discussion has been closed.