I want V4 Products not V5 or V6. Planned Obsolescence Has To Stop.

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Comments

  • FauvistFauvist Posts: 1,305
    edited December 1969

    I'm not saying I don't like V5 or V6 or Genesis2 Female - I do like them. What I'm asking for is *****compatibility******. If a clothing model is being sold for V6, and it isn't being sold for V4 - you are sort of forced to buy the V6 one.

    You may be able to tell how many people are buying Genesis 2 Female products, but you can't tell how many people are not buying them.

    I'm tired of having to buy Creature Creator Morphs for 4th generation figures, then buy them again for Genesis 1 figures, and now have to buy them again - probably twice, for the Genisis 2 figures.

    Genesis was supposed to be the end of the road. Genesis was supposed to support all future morphs in it's "gene pool". Everything was suppose to fit Genesis - clothes, skin, morphs, poses. It wasn't true - was it.

    Now Genesis is obsolescent.

    The DVD industry was destroyed because movie studios wanted everyone in the world to buy Gone With The Wind on BlueRay. Well the public was fed up. They didn't rebuy everything they bought as a DVD. You can only use that marketing trick so many times before everyone catches on and refuses to go along with the "rebuy it now" strategy. What happened when the music industry got rid of vinyl records. Did everyone rebuy everything on CD? Or did they download it illegally off the internet?

    Published Artists - content creators, have no choice but to talk up Genesis2 Female. What are they going to say, "Oh, it's a huge failure, nobody is buying it.", no, they're going to say "Everybody is buying it. I'm making more money than I ever did. It's a huge unqualified success. It's leaving Genesis in the dust. The future is Genesis2 Female."

    Maybe it is. But couldn't it be possible to not alientate a huge segment of your bulyers time and time again? If all these little addons can remake content so you can use it with V4, then why can't DAZ build that into the content to begin with?

    It's already more than enough work to download and install a lot of content. Having to take extra steps to "convert" something is just too much to ask - especially for those of us who have hundreds or thousands of pieces of content.

    What if Mattel decided to make the Barbie Doll 22 inches tall? Do you think everyone is going to rebuy everything they've ever bought just to fit the new doll? No.

  • agent unawaresagent unawares Posts: 3,513
    edited December 1969

    Speculating on the ration of happy/unhappy posters to happy/unhappy members of the community at large is just plucking numbers out of the air, not generally a productive activity.

    When you compare sales to griping, and take into account the fact that DAZ employees have commented on it, it becomes a little more than speculation.

    Though to be fair, I'm pointing out this stuff happens with customers rather than the entire community. There could be plenty of people who dislike or have no use for DAZ content and have thus never touched it and would thus not impact anything measurable. I don't see how putting off releasing a new figure would win such over, though.

  • IgnisSerpentusIgnisSerpentus Posts: 2,351
    edited July 2013

    Fauvist said:
    I'm not saying I don't like V5 or V6 or Genesis2 Female - I do like them. What I'm asking for is *****compatibility******. If a clothing model is being sold for V6, and it isn't being sold for V4 - you are sort of forced to buy the V6 one.

    You may be able to tell how many people are buying Genesis 2 Female products, but you can't tell how many people are not buying them.

    I'm tired of having to buy Creature Creator Morphs for 4th generation figures, then buy them again for Genesis 1 figures, and now have to buy them again - probably twice, for the Genisis 2 figures.

    Genesis was supposed to be the end of the road. Genesis was supposed to support all future morphs in it's "gene pool". Everything was suppose to fit Genesis - clothes, skin, morphs, poses. It wasn't true - was it.

    Now Genesis is obsolescent.

    The DVD industry was destroyed because movie studios wanted everyone in the world to buy Gone With The Wind on BlueRay. Well the public was fed up. They didn't rebuy everything they bought as a DVD. You can only use that marketing trick so many times before everyone catches on and refuses to go along with the "rebuy it now" strategy. What happened when the music industry got rid of vinyl records. Did everyone rebuy everything on CD? Or did they download it illegally off the internet?

    Published Artists - content creators, have no choice but to talk up Genesis2 Female. What are they going to say, "Oh, it's a huge failure, nobody is buying it.", no, they're going to say "Everybody is buying it. I'm making more money than I ever did. It's a huge unqualified success. It's leaving Genesis in the dust. The future is Genesis2 Female."

    Maybe it is. But couldn't it be possible to not alientate a huge segment of your bulyers time and time again? If all these little addons can remake content so you can use it with V4, then why can't DAZ build that into the content to begin with?

    It's already more than enough work to download and install a lot of content. Having to take extra steps to "convert" something is just too much to ask - especially for those of us who have hundreds or thousands of pieces of content.

    What if Mattel decided to make the Barbie Doll 22 inches tall? Do you think everyone is going to rebuy everything they've ever bought just to fit the new doll? No.

    Genesis is only as obsolete as the ppl buying it (or a lack thereof) If ppl still buy the content, then its as current as gen 2. And in this case, I dont really see it becoming obsolete anyway. Some ppl like the dual base in one better than it split. So there are those that will prolly still favor genesis... and those that will move on to the latest.

    Also, Published artists, as stated in this thread before, will go where the money is. If their genesis content wasnt selling, do you think theyd be supporting it? No, they would have probably gone back to Gen 4, or maybe, they would have run away from supporting content instead, and did stuff that was stand alone. People have bills to pay, and no amount of convincing people, wishes and good intent will cash that check. All one needs to do to see that in action, is look at all the 3rd party figures that haven't made it in the scene.... no one supports what doesn't bring them money. And without support, those figures ultimately fail.

    And yes, actually.... I do lol I owned 50 barbie dolls as a kid.... and most of them we're the same blue eyed blondes theyre always based off of. The key, was that it came with something the others didnt/couldnt have. I suppose plenty could argue the validity of that thing in the case of Genesis 2.... but that merely is an individual opinion. And in this case, its not the best comparison anyway.... I paid for all my dolls.... Genesis itself is free.

    Post edited by IgnisSerpentus on
  • agent unawaresagent unawares Posts: 3,513
    edited December 1969

    Fauvist said:
    The DVD industry was destroyed because movie studios wanted everyone in the world to buy Gone With The Wind on BlueRay.
    Why would they? They already have it on DVD. They buy the new stuff on Blu-Ray, or special releases with extra content on Blu-Ray. I love the better picture and my disks not being scratched so easily by a bit of dust that got into the machine, personally.

    What if Mattel decided to make the Barbie Doll 22 inches tall? Do you think everyone is going to rebuy everything they've ever bought just to fit the new doll? No.


    However, we can look at it as Barbie essentially being one figure. Barbie's stuff doesn't fit Ken, his all looks oversized on her, and neither of them can do much with Polly Pocket items.
  • SiscaSisca Posts: 875
    edited December 1969

    The DVD industry was destroyed because movie studios wanted everyone in the world to buy Gone With The Wind on BlueRay. Well the public was fed up. They didn’t rebuy everything they bought as a DVD. You can only use that marketing trick so many times before everyone catches on and refuses to go along with the “rebuy it now” strategy. What happened when the music industry got rid of vinyl records. Did everyone rebuy everything on CD? Or did they download it illegally off the internet?

    Oh, so that's why I can't find any DVD's at the store anymore and Amazon's quit stocking them as well!
    /sarcasm off

    More hyperbole.

    If there is a big enough advantage in the eye of the consumer they'll re-purchase the content. Personally, I don't even own a BluRay player even though I can see a distinct improvement in quality from DVD to BluRay. My main reason is I don't purchase enough movies to warrant the cost of the player. In fact I don't watch enough movies to justify purchasing that many DVD's so I mostly stream the few I do watch.

    What happened when the record companies quit making records? People bought CD's. If you weren't trying to re-write history to support your point you'd realize that they didn't stop putting out records or tapes until the CD had enough market share. And yes, most people re-purchased the stuff they'd had on album in the CD format. Mainly because albums and tapes were fragile and prone to wear. In fact I know I bought a couple of albums in both vinyl and tape format and ended up replacing the tape several times due to wear long before CD's ever came out. I was quite happy to buy a CD and have it last forever.

    You see the CD came out in the 80's and was the format of choice through the 90's and Napster didn't come around until 1999. People couldn't jump from vinyl to downloading, it wasn't an option.

    If you're going to use other media upgrades and their "failure" to support your reasoning for Daz not continuing to upgrade their technology at least make sure the products you use actually failed.

  • TaozTaoz Posts: 8,180
    edited December 1969

    Fauvist said:
    The DVD industry was destroyed because movie studios wanted everyone in the world to buy Gone With The Wind on BlueRay.

    Why would they? They already have it on DVD. They buy the new stuff on Blu-Ray, or special releases with extra content on Blu-Ray. I love the better picture and my disks not being scratched so easily by a bit of dust that got into the machine, personally.

    Are Blu-Ray disks more resistant to scratches than DVDs? Just bought a Blu-Ray drive and it handles DVDs and CDs as well, so the basic technology seems to be the same.

  • IgnisSerpentusIgnisSerpentus Posts: 2,351
    edited December 1969

    Taozen said:
    Fauvist said:
    The DVD industry was destroyed because movie studios wanted everyone in the world to buy Gone With The Wind on BlueRay.

    Why would they? They already have it on DVD. They buy the new stuff on Blu-Ray, or special releases with extra content on Blu-Ray. I love the better picture and my disks not being scratched so easily by a bit of dust that got into the machine, personally.

    Are Blu-Ray disks more resistant to scratches than DVDs? Just bought a Blu-Ray drive and it handles DVDs and CDs as well, so the basic technology seems to be the same.

    Yeah, theyre scratch resistant. Also, higher density, so you can put an HD movie on them, for better picture quality (as well as all that extra content that comes with DVD's)

  • RCDescheneRCDeschene Posts: 2,764
    edited July 2013

    But the sad fact of the matter is... even with all the posts in this forum of ppl wanting male stuff, Scorpy God did not do that well at all. It wasnt awful, but.... it wasnt amazing either... it didnt even hit my personal goal for sets I do of that caliber (which, to be clear, is a min I have to make to recuperate the time spent) And the female counterpart (Serpent Goddess) did well too, so it wasn't exactly the genre that tanked. My first male set (Godspeed) however, was a rousing success, so I figured, hey, Ill support M4 more often. But after Scorpy God, I'm now not so sure.

    It just goes to show that the requests in this forum are, sadly, a vocal minority. Once again, I defer to my previous statement.... if u guys want support for something, u gotta buy it. Vendors go where the $$ is. And if we spend a month or two making a set that flops, we are not likely to spend that kind of time on something similar in the future.


    Like the others who stated there reasons for not buying scorpion God, I too had no use for it. Remember that the other thing that people here ask to see more of, aside from male stuff and kids, is EVERYDAY CLOTHING, clothing that is practical and relating to real people. Almost all the male stuff I see here, and hell, even at Rendo is usually a bit to stylized for my taste. Hell, I'd even take man-slutware if it was made available to me. This is what I LOVED about David 5's Pro Bundle.

    This is why Genesis 2 should have stayed unisex. Genesis has some nice outfits that can go either way, hell even if it was built for a specific gender, there were some articles that looked really great on the opposite. THOSE are the items I buy.

    Though, IgnisSerpentus's info of his sales has got me thinking... I have to ask you PA's, out of all the male wear that you do make, which actually sells relatively better? Is it everyday clothing? Specific genre's? Textures? Because if there are some gems in that pile, maybe it would be best to focus of that particular aspect when you make male items. See what that does.

    Post edited by RCDeschene on
  • IgnisSerpentusIgnisSerpentus Posts: 2,351
    edited July 2013

    But the sad fact of the matter is... even with all the posts in this forum of ppl wanting male stuff, Scorpy God did not do that well at all. It wasnt awful, but.... it wasnt amazing either... it didnt even hit my personal goal for sets I do of that caliber (which, to be clear, is a min I have to make to recuperate the time spent) And the female counterpart (Serpent Goddess) did well too, so it wasn't exactly the genre that tanked. My first male set (Godspeed) however, was a rousing success, so I figured, hey, Ill support M4 more often. But after Scorpy God, I'm now not so sure.

    It just goes to show that the requests in this forum are, sadly, a vocal minority. Once again, I defer to my previous statement.... if u guys want support for something, u gotta buy it. Vendors go where the $$ is. And if we spend a month or two making a set that flops, we are not likely to spend that kind of time on something similar in the future.


    Like the others who stated there reasons for not buying scorpion God, I too had no use for it. Remember that the other thing that people here ask to see more of, aside from male stuff and kids, is EVERYDAY CLOTHING, clothing that is practical and relating to real people. Almost all the male stuff I see here, and hell, even at Rendo is usually a bit to stylized for my taste. Hell, I'd even take man-slutware if it was made available to me. This is what I LOVED about David 5's Pro Bundle.

    This is why Genesis 2 should have stayed unisex. Genesis has some nice outfits that can go either way, hell even if it was built for a specific gender, there were some articles that looked really great on the opposite. THOSE are the items I buy.

    Though, IgnisSerpentus's info of his sales has got me thinking... I have to ask you PA's, out of all the male wear that you do make, which actually sells relatively better? Is it everyday clothing? Specific genre's? Textures? Because if there are some gems in that pile, maybe it would be best to focus of that particular aspect when you make male items. See what that does.

    Well, I will say straight up... I will never do everyday clothing. Im totally fantasy geared. To me, that would take all the fun right out of this. I will probably also never do kiddie stuff, either and rarely do things that are frufru or otherwise construed as cute (I feel like Im faking something lol) As anyone can see by my store, Im mainly armor-focused. I also do mostly darker stuff (and when not dark per se, its gritty) When u think of my stuffs, u should think... Erotic, exotic and a little psychotic LOL

    As far as male stats go, couldnt say to any degree.... other than the two packs I have (and already did kind of give those stats)

    But I can say... sex sells. Better than anything else, hence why there is such a preponderance of it. Though, I spose there are always exceptions.

    And btw... lol Im a chick.

    Post edited by IgnisSerpentus on
  • tsaristtsarist Posts: 1,393
    edited December 1969

    Sisca said:
    The DVD industry was destroyed because movie studios wanted everyone in the world to buy Gone With The Wind on BlueRay. Well the public was fed up. They didn’t rebuy everything they bought as a DVD. You can only use that marketing trick so many times before everyone catches on and refuses to go along with the “rebuy it now” strategy. What happened when the music industry got rid of vinyl records. Did everyone rebuy everything on CD? Or did they download it illegally off the internet?

    Oh, so that's why I can't find any DVD's at the store anymore and Amazon's quit stocking them as well!
    /sarcasm off

    More hyperbole.

    If there is a big enough advantage in the eye of the consumer they'll re-purchase the content. Personally, I don't even own a BluRay player even though I can see a distinct improvement in quality from DVD to BluRay. My main reason is I don't purchase enough movies to warrant the cost of the player. In fact I don't watch enough movies to justify purchasing that many DVD's so I mostly stream the few I do watch.

    What happened when the record companies quit making records? People bought CD's. If you weren't trying to re-write history to support your point you'd realize that they didn't stop putting out records or tapes until the CD had enough market share. And yes, most people re-purchased the stuff they'd had on album in the CD format. Mainly because albums and tapes were fragile and prone to wear. In fact I know I bought a couple of albums in both vinyl and tape format and ended up replacing the tape several times due to wear long before CD's ever came out. I was quite happy to buy a CD and have it last forever.

    You see the CD came out in the 80's and was the format of choice through the 90's and Napster didn't come around until 1999. People couldn't jump from vinyl to downloading, it wasn't an option.

    If you're going to use other media upgrades and their "failure" to support your reasoning for Daz not continuing to upgrade their technology at least make sure the products you use actually failed.

    Wow Sisca
    A little harsh?

    While I realise the other poster had a little confusion with his history, certainly you understood the gist of the argument.
    He could have very well used other formats for his arguments. Super VHS failed, as did DVD Audio & SuperCD (as far as being a successor to CD).

    That said, I like CDs, but also bought a ton of replacements for my tape & vinyl collection. Same with VHS to DVD. Haven't made the leap to BluRay.

  • FixmypcmikeFixmypcmike Posts: 18,760
    edited December 1969

    And btw... lol Im a chick.

    Correction: Iggy is female, but not a chick, unless you're talking Chicken-Raptor chicks.

  • IgnisSerpentusIgnisSerpentus Posts: 2,351
    edited December 1969

    And btw... lol Im a chick.

    Correction: Iggy is female, but not a chick, unless you're talking Chicken-Raptor chicks.

    LOL Well, being a snake, I might eat them.... you are what u eat hehe

  • agent unawaresagent unawares Posts: 3,513
    edited December 1969

    tsarist said:
    That said, I like CDs, but also bought a ton of replacements for my tape & vinyl collection. Same with VHS to DVD. Haven't made the leap to BluRay.

    The major advantage Blu-Ray has is that it can store about 10x the amount of information a DVD can. That means they can stuff in all the additional features they want and still have appreciable improvement in picture quality. I think the players support additional features as well, but frankly I never got into any of that. I just want to watch a movie and not have the player decide it's going to chew a circular line through it. :lol:

    They're excellent for storage too, but I think the SSDs have taken that over but good. I barely used my writer.

  • agent unawaresagent unawares Posts: 3,513
    edited December 1969

    And btw... lol Im a chick.

    Correction: Iggy is female, but not a chick, unless you're talking Chicken-Raptor chicks.
    Stop ruining my headcanon.

  • tsaristtsarist Posts: 1,393
    edited July 2013

    tsarist said:
    That said, I like CDs, but also bought a ton of replacements for my tape & vinyl collection. Same with VHS to DVD. Haven't made the leap to BluRay.

    The major advantage Blu-Ray has is that it can store about 10x the amount of information a DVD can. That means they can stuff in all the additional features they want and still have appreciable improvement in picture quality. I think the players support additional features as well, but frankly I never got into any of that. I just want to watch a movie and not have the player decide it's going to chew a circular line through it. :lol:

    They're excellent for storage too, but I think the SSDs have taken that over but good. I barely used my writer.

    I agree with you there. Blu-Ray can hold a TON of info and the image is a lot better.
    When I get a telly that will help me actually SEE the improvement, I'm picking up a Blu-Ray macine.

    Might replace a dozen films or so too.

    Post edited by tsarist on
  • IgnisSerpentusIgnisSerpentus Posts: 2,351
    edited December 1969

    tsarist said:
    tsarist said:
    That said, I like CDs, but also bought a ton of replacements for my tape & vinyl collection. Same with VHS to DVD. Haven't made the leap to BluRay.

    The major advantage Blu-Ray has is that it can store about 10x the amount of information a DVD can. That means they can stuff in all the additional features they want and still have appreciable improvement in picture quality. I think the players support additional features as well, but frankly I never got into any of that. I just want to watch a movie and not have the player decide it's going to chew a circular line through it. :lol:

    They're excellent for storage too, but I think the SSDs have taken that over but good. I barely used my writer.

    I agree with you there. Blu-Ray can hold a TON of info and the image is a lot better.
    When I get a telly that will help me actually SEE the improvement, I'm picking up a Blu-Ray macine.

    Might replace a dozen films or so too.

    I dont really go out of my way to buy blu-ray. Im perfectly content to get a fave movie on normal disk. But I have a 3DTV and 3D blu ray player, so for 3D movies, they have to be blu ray.

  • SiscaSisca Posts: 875
    edited December 1969

    tsarist said:
    Sisca said:
    The DVD industry was destroyed because movie studios wanted everyone in the world to buy Gone With The Wind on BlueRay. Well the public was fed up. They didn’t rebuy everything they bought as a DVD. You can only use that marketing trick so many times before everyone catches on and refuses to go along with the “rebuy it now” strategy. What happened when the music industry got rid of vinyl records. Did everyone rebuy everything on CD? Or did they download it illegally off the internet?

    Oh, so that's why I can't find any DVD's at the store anymore and Amazon's quit stocking them as well!
    /sarcasm off

    More hyperbole.

    If there is a big enough advantage in the eye of the consumer they'll re-purchase the content. Personally, I don't even own a BluRay player even though I can see a distinct improvement in quality from DVD to BluRay. My main reason is I don't purchase enough movies to warrant the cost of the player. In fact I don't watch enough movies to justify purchasing that many DVD's so I mostly stream the few I do watch.

    What happened when the record companies quit making records? People bought CD's. If you weren't trying to re-write history to support your point you'd realize that they didn't stop putting out records or tapes until the CD had enough market share. And yes, most people re-purchased the stuff they'd had on album in the CD format. Mainly because albums and tapes were fragile and prone to wear. In fact I know I bought a couple of albums in both vinyl and tape format and ended up replacing the tape several times due to wear long before CD's ever came out. I was quite happy to buy a CD and have it last forever.

    You see the CD came out in the 80's and was the format of choice through the 90's and Napster didn't come around until 1999. People couldn't jump from vinyl to downloading, it wasn't an option.

    If you're going to use other media upgrades and their "failure" to support your reasoning for Daz not continuing to upgrade their technology at least make sure the products you use actually failed.

    Wow Sisca
    A little harsh?

    While I realise the other poster had a little confusion with his history, certainly you understood the gist of the argument.
    He could have very well used other formats for his arguments. Super VHS failed, as did DVD Audio & SuperCD (as far as being a successor to CD).

    That said, I like CDs, but also bought a ton of replacements for my tape & vinyl collection. Same with VHS to DVD. Haven't made the leap to BluRay.

    I don't think it was overly harsh.

    He claimed the DVD industry failed - it hasn't. Sure BluRay is slowly but surely replacing it but I can still find almost any movie I want on DVD as well as BluRay. The exceptions being 3D or HD movies that require the increased storage space.

    S-VHS didn't really fail it just never fully replaced VHS. The advantages it provided weren't significant enough to force a market shift. Unlike DVD which was so much better in both quality and durability that once the players got down below the $100 price point everyone switched.

    Audio DVD and SuperCD only offered an increase in storage capacity and not an increase in quality. The music industry had no reason to switch to that because the average album was between 10 & 13 tracks and that fit on a standard CD quite easily. Besides by the time those were introduced (1999/2000) the iPod and other MP3 players were out and people were moving to that format. Which proves that portability trumps quality when it comes to audio for the masses because MP3 quality is noticeably worse than CD but people still prefer it.

    Even so it was only in the last couple of years that MP3's outsold CD by an appreciable amount and you can still get most new releases on CD if you choose. So the original point that everyone refused to buy CD and went to downloading the files illegally is complete hyperbole.

    I've said it several times in this thread. Expecting the technology to stop because you're satisfied doesn't work. If you hate what they've done with the new figures then don't buy them. Claiming that just because they were released everything you own is now garbage is just more hyperbole. Gen 4 figures are still widely used and supported, Genesis 1 is still widely used and supported. Even if that support were to stop tomorrow there are thousands of items available for those figures already. If Daz were to release DS 5.0 tomorrow and it only worked with Genesis 2/V6 it still wouldn't stop me from using DS 4.6. To claim that everything that worked fine yesterday is obsolete today is just plain silly.

  • FauvistFauvist Posts: 1,305
    edited December 1969

    Sisca said:

    Oh, so that's why I can't find any DVD's at the store anymore and Amazon's quit stocking them as well!
    /sarcasm off

    More hyperbole.

    I don't think it was overly harsh.

    He claimed the DVD industry failed - it hasn't. Sure BluRay is slowly but surely replacing it but I can still find almost any movie I want on DVD as well as BluRay. The exceptions being 3D or HD movies that require the increased storage space.

    You obviously don't read Variety or The Hollywood Reporter. This is from this weeks Hollywood Reporter: "In a career that began 30 years ago with Flashdance, Lynda Obst has been known as a producer with a keen eye for such smart, character-driven movies as Sleepless in Seattle, Hope Floats and Contact (her films have grossed $1.1 billion). But in what she calls Hollywood’s “New Abnormal,” the industry is dominated by VFX-laden tentpoles, franchises, sequels, prequels and reboots. Hollywood, she says, has drifted away from the type of movies she specialized in. Her new book, Sleepless in Hollywood: Tales From the New Abnormal in the Movie Business (Simon & Schuster), considers the profound changes in the industry — the collapse of DVD sales"
    http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/paramount-sherry-lansing-robert-evans-562053

  • FauvistFauvist Posts: 1,305
    edited December 1969
  • FauvistFauvist Posts: 1,305
    edited December 1969

    Sisca said:

    Even so it was only in the last couple of years that MP3's outsold CD by an appreciable amount and you can still get most new releases on CD if you choose. So the original point that everyone refused to buy CD and went to downloading the files illegally is complete hyperbole.

    This is from the Recording Industry Association of America - dated July 7 2013:

    "Q: What is the scope of the problem?

    Music theft is a real, ongoing and evolving challenge. Both the volume of music acquired illegally and the resulting drop in revenues are staggering. Digital sales, while on the rise, are not making up the difference.

    Consider these staggering statistics:

    -In the decade since peer-to-peer (p2p) file-sharing site Napster emerged in 1999, music sales in the U.S. have dropped 47 percent, from $14.6 billion to $7.7 billion.
    -From 2004 through 2009 alone, approximately 30 billion songs were illegally downloaded on file-sharing networks.
    -NPD reports that only 37 percent of music acquired by U.S. consumers in 2009 was paid for.
    -Frontier Economics recently estimated that U.S. Internet users annually consume between $7 and $20 billion worth of digitally pirated recorded music.
    -According to the Information Technology & Innovation Foundation, the digital theft of music, movies and copyrighted content takes up huge amounts of Internet bandwidth – 24 percent globally, and 17.5 percent in the U.S.
    -Digital storage locker downloads constitute 7 percent of all Internet traffic, while 91 percent of the links found on them were for copyrighted material, and 10 percent of those links were to music specifically, according to a 2011 Envisional study.

    While the music business has increased its digital revenues by 1,000 percent from 2004 to 2010, digital music theft has been a major factor behind the overall global market decline of around 31 percent in the same period.
    And although use of peer-to-peer sites has flattened during recent years, other forms of digital theft are emerging, most notably digital storage lockers used to distribute copyrighted music."

    http://www.riaa.com/faq.php

  • tsaristtsarist Posts: 1,393
    edited December 1969

    Fauvist said:
    You obviously don't read Variety or The Hollywood Reporter. This is from this weeks Hollywood Reporter: "In a career that began 30 years ago with Flashdance, Lynda Obst has been known as a producer with a keen eye for such smart, character-driven movies as Sleepless in Seattle, Hope Floats and Contact (her films have grossed $1.1 billion). But in what she calls Hollywood’s “New Abnormal,” the industry is dominated by VFX-laden tentpoles, franchises, sequels, prequels and reboots. Hollywood, she says, has drifted away from the type of movies she specialized in. Her new book, Sleepless in Hollywood: Tales From the New Abnormal in the Movie Business (Simon & Schuster), considers the profound changes in the industry — the collapse of DVD sales"
    http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/paramount-sherry-lansing-robert-evans-562053

    Thanks for posting this Fauvist

    I started to say something, but it seemed to me that anyone that hasn't noticed the collapse of DVD sales was either not looking or not invested in the industry.

    The loss of Hollywood Video and the crippling of Blockbuster were deadly blows to DVD sales. It really hurt the indie scene (I know this intimately) because those 2 outlets alone, plus the other video stores that were lost were a huge setback for the industry.

  • Satira CapriccioSatira Capriccio Posts: 523
    edited December 1969

    I don't buy dvd or blue ray at all. I'm quite content watching movies/series online. If it is never available online, I don't mind never seeing it.

    There are a few purchased movies I've watched more than once, but I'm more likely to read a book more times than I am to watch the same movie multiple times. Which is one of the reasons I stopped buying movies. That and ... I'm most decidedly cheap.

    I will admit I've watched the entire season of Firefly several times on Netflix, and I'm currently rewatching Rosemary and Thyme (also on Netflix). But the bulk of what I've seen just isn't worth seeing again.

  • FauvistFauvist Posts: 1,305
    edited December 1969

    I'm more likely to read a book more times than I am to watch the same movie multiple times.

    The exact same thing that did so much damage to the DVD and music industries is just starting to happen to the book industry. Illegally uploaded and downloaded books and magazines. Every bestseller on the current New York Times bestseller list can be downloaded illegally right now. Almost all the independant bookstores, and ALL the bookstore chains in the United States, England, and Australia (not Canada) are either out-of-business bankrupt, or on their way there.

  • IgnisSerpentusIgnisSerpentus Posts: 2,351
    edited July 2013

    Fauvist said:
    I'm more likely to read a book more times than I am to watch the same movie multiple times.

    The exact same thing that did so much damage to the DVD and music industries is just starting to happen to the book industry. Illegally uploaded and downloaded books and magazines. Every bestseller on the current New York Times bestseller list can be downloaded illegally right now. Almost all the independant bookstores, and ALL the bookstore chains in the United States, England, and Australia (not Canada) are either out-of-business bankrupt, or on their way there.

    I dunno if its fair to blame the demise of bookstores on illegally downloaded content in and of itself. I think the advent of kindle, nook and like type things is what killed that, mostly. Im sure it contributed, tho.

    Im bummed about that... I actually prefer books. But it is what it is. Progress happens. For every wonderful thing that goes out of style, there are 10 new wicky cool things that help you forget. I cant remember the last time I longed for a cassette tape lol

    Post edited by IgnisSerpentus on
  • FauvistFauvist Posts: 1,305
    edited December 1969

    Xena said:
    Would it be so impossibly difficult for DAZ to release a V4 version of any clothes they make for V6?

    Not 'impossible', no. But more work than it would be worth.
    You'd have to go back to the original mesh and reshape it for Victoria 4, re-rig it, create all new FBM's which takes a LOT of work, and then create the endless JCM's needed to get clothing to not poke through every five seconds.
    I know I would never, ever go back to the tediousness of creating for V4. Too much work for too little return.

    People who make clothing for humans and sell it - big companies, and tiny companies - make clothing in multiple sizes. Different waist sizes, different lengths, different neck sizes, different sleeve sizes - for the same garment. Shoemakers for humans make shoes in differnt sizes, with different widths. Companies who make bedding make it in multiple sizes for multiple size beds.

    Why? Because not everyone in the world has the exact same body, foot, or bed. To maximize sales, companies make everything in multiple sizes.

    And they don't moan "oh my God! It's so much work, so much hassle, you have to make completely different patterns, you have to make different templates, you have to buy differnt widths of materials, you have to pay thousands of more hours labour, it's too confusing, I don't have the time."

    Why does McDonalds sell salads? Why don't they just make Big Macs? Because not everyone in the world eats meat.

    And sometimes it's just good business to satisfy loyal customers by supporting them.

    I'm telling you that if the newer products being sold at DAZ were made for Victoria 4 *too* - I would buy them. I don't think I'm the only one. I'm also telling you that if you don't make them for V4, I'll shop elsewhere, or I will start making my own clothing with Marvelous Designer which is dynamic clothing (Marvelous Designer, by the way, has a brand new version being released in Beta very soon that you can download and use for free for a limited time and there may be a discount for you when the start selling it.)

    But you are right. If it's too much trouble for you, and don't believe enough people will buy it (how many people use V4?) then don't bother.

  • FauvistFauvist Posts: 1,305
    edited July 2013

    I dunno if its fair to blame the demise of bookstores on illegally downloaded content in and of itself. I think the advent of kindle, nook and like type things is what killed that, mostly. Im sure it contributed, tho.

    Kindle, Nook, and all other eReaders on the market hold digital books, usually in the form of .pdf files or the like. Where do you think these millions of readers are getting their digital files? Which are not encoded with security.

    Edit: don't make me search Publishers Weekly for a chart to prove it.

    Edit: maybe Kindle does encode books, but it doesn't matter.

    Post edited by Fauvist on
  • tsaristtsarist Posts: 1,393
    edited December 1969

    I dunno if its fair to blame the demise of bookstores on illegally downloaded content in and of itself. I think the advent of kindle, nook and like type things is what killed that, mostly. Im sure it contributed, tho.

    You're right. Illegal downloads didn't help (remember, some of those people would never BUY anything anyway), but they aren't the only reason for the decline of book sales. Kindle, Nook, etc really hurt bookstores. Also, Internet bookstores helped the decline too.

    I cant remember the last time I longed for a cassette tape lol


    I don't miss cassettes either. Especially, the crunchy sound the tape deck makes as it eats my tape.

  • IgnisSerpentusIgnisSerpentus Posts: 2,351
    edited July 2013

    Fauvist said:
    Xena said:
    Would it be so impossibly difficult for DAZ to release a V4 version of any clothes they make for V6?

    Not 'impossible', no. But more work than it would be worth.
    You'd have to go back to the original mesh and reshape it for Victoria 4, re-rig it, create all new FBM's which takes a LOT of work, and then create the endless JCM's needed to get clothing to not poke through every five seconds.
    I know I would never, ever go back to the tediousness of creating for V4. Too much work for too little return.

    People who make clothing for humans and sell it - big companies, and tiny companies - make clothing in multiple sizes. Different waist sizes, different lengths, different neck sizes, different sleeve sizes - for the same garment. Shoemakers for humans make shoes in differnt sizes, with different widths. Companies who make bedding make it in multiple sizes for multiple size beds.

    Why? Because not everyone in the world has the exact same body, foot, or bed. To maximize sales, companies make everything in multiple sizes.

    And they don't moan "oh my God! It's so much work, so much hassle, you have to make completely different patterns, you have to make different templates, you have to buy differnt widths of materials, you have to pay thousands of more hours labour, it's too confusing, I don't have the time."

    Why does McDonalds sell salads? Why don't they just make Big Macs? Because not everyone in the world eats meat.

    And sometimes it's just good business to satisfy loyal customers by supporting them.

    I'm telling you that if the newer products being sold at DAZ were made for Victoria 4 *too* - I would buy them. I don't think I'm the only one. I'm also telling you that if you don't make them for V4, I'll shop elsewhere, or I will start making my own clothing with Marvelous Designer which is dynamic clothing (Marvelous Designer, by the way, has a brand new version being released in Beta very soon that you can download and use for free for a limited time and there may be a discount for you when the start selling it.)

    But you are right. If it's too much trouble for you, and don't believe enough people will buy it (how many people use V4?) then don't bother.

    Ok you obviously have no idea what goes into making digital 3D clothing. No one here is whining or moaning. But we also are not accompanied by an entire dept (or sweat shop) that works for pennies making all these garments, nor do we employ a sewing machine. Before you accuse someone of moaning, maybe u should walk a mile in their shoes. Clothing is the most difficult and tedious content to make... ask anyone.

    Post edited by IgnisSerpentus on
  • FauvistFauvist Posts: 1,305
    edited July 2013

    Fauvist said:
    Xena said:
    Would it be so impossibly difficult for DAZ to release a V4 version of any clothes they make for V6?

    Not 'impossible', no. But more work than it would be worth.
    You'd have to go back to the original mesh and reshape it for Victoria 4, re-rig it, create all new FBM's which takes a LOT of work, and then create the endless JCM's needed to get clothing to not poke through every five seconds.
    I know I would never, ever go back to the tediousness of creating for V4. Too much work for too little return.

    People who make clothing for humans and sell it - big companies, and tiny companies - make clothing in multiple sizes. Different waist sizes, different lengths, different neck sizes, different sleeve sizes - for the same garment. Shoemakers for humans make shoes in differnt sizes, with different widths. Companies who make bedding make it in multiple sizes for multiple size beds.

    Why? Because not everyone in the world has the exact same body, foot, or bed. To maximize sales, companies make everything in multiple sizes.

    And they don't moan "oh my God! It's so much work, so much hassle, you have to make completely different patterns, you have to make different templates, you have to buy differnt widths of materials, you have to pay thousands of more hours labour, it's too confusing, I don't have the time."

    Why does McDonalds sell salads? Why don't they just make Big Macs? Because not everyone in the world eats meat.

    And sometimes it's just good business to satisfy loyal customers by supporting them.

    I'm telling you that if the newer products being sold at DAZ were made for Victoria 4 *too* - I would buy them. I don't think I'm the only one. I'm also telling you that if you don't make them for V4, I'll shop elsewhere, or I will start making my own clothing with Marvelous Designer which is dynamic clothing (Marvelous Designer, by the way, has a brand new version being released in Beta very soon that you can download and use for free for a limited time and there may be a discount for you when the start selling it.)

    But you are right. If it's too much trouble for you, and don't believe enough people will buy it (how many people use V4?) then don't bother.

    Ok you obviously have no idea what goes into making digital 3D clothing. No one here is whining. But we also are not accompanied by an entire dept (or sweat shop) that works for pennies making all these garments, nor do we employ a sewing machine. Before you accuse someone of whining, maybe u should walk a mile in their shoes. Clothing is the most difficult and tedious content to make... ask anyone.

    What's going to happen when 3D clothing *is* made in a sweatshop?

    I've made 3D clothing for my own use using 3D modeling software - although it was Poser dynamic clothing, which I understand is 1000 times easier to make than DAZ conforming clothing.

    If I can edit an entire feature film on my laptop, then it seems to me that some PhD computer genius can come up with an instant clothing conversion script.

    Post edited by Fauvist on
  • IgnisSerpentusIgnisSerpentus Posts: 2,351
    edited December 1969

    Fauvist said:
    Fauvist said:
    Xena said:
    Would it be so impossibly difficult for DAZ to release a V4 version of any clothes they make for V6?

    Not 'impossible', no. But more work than it would be worth.
    You'd have to go back to the original mesh and reshape it for Victoria 4, re-rig it, create all new FBM's which takes a LOT of work, and then create the endless JCM's needed to get clothing to not poke through every five seconds.
    I know I would never, ever go back to the tediousness of creating for V4. Too much work for too little return.

    People who make clothing for humans and sell it - big companies, and tiny companies - make clothing in multiple sizes. Different waist sizes, different lengths, different neck sizes, different sleeve sizes - for the same garment. Shoemakers for humans make shoes in differnt sizes, with different widths. Companies who make bedding make it in multiple sizes for multiple size beds.

    Why? Because not everyone in the world has the exact same body, foot, or bed. To maximize sales, companies make everything in multiple sizes.

    And they don't moan "oh my God! It's so much work, so much hassle, you have to make completely different patterns, you have to make different templates, you have to buy differnt widths of materials, you have to pay thousands of more hours labour, it's too confusing, I don't have the time."

    Why does McDonalds sell salads? Why don't they just make Big Macs? Because not everyone in the world eats meat.

    And sometimes it's just good business to satisfy loyal customers by supporting them.

    I'm telling you that if the newer products being sold at DAZ were made for Victoria 4 *too* - I would buy them. I don't think I'm the only one. I'm also telling you that if you don't make them for V4, I'll shop elsewhere, or I will start making my own clothing with Marvelous Designer which is dynamic clothing (Marvelous Designer, by the way, has a brand new version being released in Beta very soon that you can download and use for free for a limited time and there may be a discount for you when the start selling it.)

    But you are right. If it's too much trouble for you, and don't believe enough people will buy it (how many people use V4?) then don't bother.

    Ok you obviously have no idea what goes into making digital 3D clothing. No one here is whining. But we also are not accompanied by an entire dept (or sweat shop) that works for pennies making all these garments, nor do we employ a sewing machine. Before you accuse someone of whining, maybe u should walk a mile in their shoes. Clothing is the most difficult and tedious content to make... ask anyone.

    What's going to happen when 3D clothing *is* made in a sweatshop?

    If I can edit an entire feature film on my laptop, then it seems to me that some PhD computer genius can come up with an instant clothing conversion script.

    They did. Its called Genesis. And even THAT cant do everything. You still have to model it... map it.... rig it... do a bazillion morphs for it (and in the case of geni, at least replace ones that don't look right) JCM it.... texture it.... package it. Good luck with that script lol

This discussion has been closed.