Morphs from G3 to G8

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  • RedzRedz Posts: 1,372

    - Figures with just a head and body morph. Is it possible to copy over head and body separately? Or just as one figure morph?

    Yes no problem there


    - HD Morphs. Either from DAZ original figures or from vendor figures. Those are not possible to transfer, right?

    Not possible


    - Single morphs form packs like from Thorne (the various Ressource Kits) or Zev0. Those are possible, right?

    Yes


    - Interconnected morph kits with controllers like Age Control, Growing Up etc. Those are not possible to transfer?

    You can transfer all of the individual morphs or full body settings, but dials linked by ERC, no


    - Various helpers (projection morphs?) like those from SickleYield or Zev0?

    Not sure, perhaps somebody else knows?


    - Morphs connected to geografts like tails, horns etc. Possible but makes no sense as the geograft won't fit?

    The geograft won't work, so not really any point

  • marblemarble Posts: 3,861

    Hi there, will try out those tutorials and hope to be able to start transfering over morphs soon. Some questions as I'm not fully aware what is possible and what not:

    - Figures with just a head and body morph. Is it possible to copy over head and body separately? Or just as one figure morph?
    - HD Morphs. Either from DAZ original figures or from vendor figures. Those are not possible to transfer, right?
    - Single morphs form packs like from Thorne (the various Ressource Kits) or Zev0. Those are possible, right?
    - Interconnected morph kits with controllers like Age Control, Growing Up etc. Those are not possible to transfer?
    - Various helpers (projection morphs?) like those from SickleYield or Zev0?
    - Morphs connected to geografts like tails, horns etc. Possible but makes no sense as the geograft won't fit?

    Thanks for any info on this. I have a huge morph library for G3F so I might purchase some G8 updates someday nevertheless as long as they'll be reasonably priced (as far as I understand, it might be not that much work for a PA to port a product over) or adding additional features. Maybe a new Age Control or Growing up can make use of the new face posing/expression capabilities.

    I had several of those questions in mind too. Hope you get some answers.

  • Ki-JenKi-Jen Posts: 48
    edited June 2017
    Ki-Jen said:

    Ki-Jen, Did you use the updated method?

    At least, I downloaded and installed the new files from Redz. I hope I didn't accidently use the old version. But I will try again.

    Yes, sometimes it helps to try again and crosscheck everything blush. This is, how A6 legacy looks like with Redz method:

    G8 conversionOriginal

    The hip is still a bit wider and the shoulders are different, but arms and legs are straight now, which is the most important part for posing.

     

     

    G8Aiko6Full_RedZ2.jpg
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    Post edited by Ki-Jen on
  • Thankfully Redz has already answered most. Only one open actually is the one on "helpers"/projection morphs. I'm referring to products like:

    SY Universal Breast Helpers Genesis, Genesis 2 and Genesis 3 Female(s)

    Fit Control for Genesis 3 Female(s)

    Think those would be very helpful also for fitting G3F clothing better. There will probably G8F-versions but actually - as long as the PAs who did those won't offer cheap updates - I'm hoping to get the results by using the G3F-version without buying those things over and over again.

     

  • I tried Redz version but how do you get the eyelashes to be included? Also, everything works until the final save and restart. Then they all disappear.

  • RedzRedz Posts: 1,372
    Ki-Jen said:
    Ki-Jen said:

    Ki-Jen, Did you use the updated method?

    At least, I downloaded and installed the new files from Redz. I hope I didn't accidently use the old version. But I will try again.

    Yes, sometimes it helps to try again and crosscheck everything blush. This is, how A6 legacy looks like with Redz method (the left one, right is the original G3 morph):

    G8 conversionOriginal

    The hip ist still a bit wider and the shoulders are different, but arms and legs are straight now, which is the most important part for posing.

     

     

    Glad it's working better for you. I have to point out this is not 'my' method. I merely adapted what others here have discovered into a somewhat simplified tutorial. :) 

  • Singular BluesSingular Blues Posts: 729
    edited June 2017

    Regarding geografts, Because the meshes are the same, you could, in fact, port them over. But you have to know how make a geograft to do it. And odds are against being able to do it only with Autofit. You'll need a external 3d editor to get all the vertices aligned correctly to the G8 mesh. For grafts like tails, you also need to know how to fit items with different skeletons.

    Nothing would stop you porting over any helper morphs for a graft, but actually getting the graft to work on G8 would a highly technical affair.

    Worth noting, Like Kattey's original method, all of these methods (at least as far I have tested) introduce distortion in the eyeballs. As before, it seems the bigger the eyes, the worse it gets.

    So far, Redz's files seems be the best, when dealing with the more extreme cases. I'm working on something that might mitigate the issue, but I'm not hopeful, exactly. The eyes are similar enough that I'm not really sure why the results are coming back so terrible.

     

    Post edited by Singular Blues on
  • RedzRedz Posts: 1,372

    I tried Redz version but how do you get the eyelashes to be included? Also, everything works until the final save and restart. Then they all disappear.

    G8F has no eyelashes, they are provided as a separate conformer which loads with G8F or can be found under anatomy in the content library, so it's not possible to transfer those. 

    Have you been saving your morphs as described at the end of the tutorial? Also don't save them to your Connect library as there may be a conflict there. 

  • *Blinks.

    Well, it actually worked.

    There's the old saw, "if it's stupid, but it works, it's not stupid." Personally, I think that ought to be, "If it's stupid but it works, hey, at least it worked and we aren't dead, amIrite?"

    Well, what I did was, I pulled their eyes out.

    For G8, I moved her eyes clear out of her head, in a 3rd party editor. Then I moved the eye moisture and cornea (It's one part) away from the eye.

    For G3, I moved her eyes to the same place as G8's. In this case, I was careful to leave the tears in place. G8's tears are part ofthe Eyelash figure, and I didn't want them getting in the way. I moved the rest of the eye mositure to line up with where I placed G8's. I moved the pupil way off behind her head. G8's Iris and pupil are of one piece with the eye. G3's are not, and my thought was the pupil shape (Artists do funny thing with that handful of polygons) was the real culprit causing thing to go pearshaped in the eyes.

    Like I said, I wasn't hopeful. Seemed like a long shot, oversimplifed, line of BS I was selling myself on the basis of "why not?" It's my free time, I can tilt at windmills all I like.

    But it actually worked. For certain values of worked. At least with Aiko6. The eyes had to be moved Z0.15 but are otherwise free of distortion.

    I suppose logical thing to test next is if the eyes need be moved at all, or if it's just the pupils.

    If it is just the pupils, then it ought to be possible to make a correcting morph using studio alone.

  • Ki-JenKi-Jen Posts: 48
    Redz said:
    Ki-Jen said:
    <Snip>
    Ki-Jen said:
    Is there a way to create head morph conversions only, without changing the body at all? I tried with the Aiko 6 head morph, but the body is still changing a bit, even if I didn't morph anything there.

    Using Redz's method - My face morphs also affect G8's body - especially the shoulders.  I guess our clones are not perfect. 

    In the Morph Transfer Helper file, the G8F has the Genesis 3 female clone dialled in. This is because the morphs you are transferring were modelled on this base, so for the best fidelity of shape, I dialled it in. However, the base shapes are similar enough that I think you could get away without having the G3F clone dialled in. It's under parameters, hidden- clones. (You may need to enable show hidden properties in the drop down box of the parameters first). 

    If you dial this Genesis 3 Female to zero before proceeding with the tutorial as normal, then I think you can bring over the head morphs without affecting the G8F body. 

    Removing the clone greatly reduced the unwanted body changes, but they are still there, mostly at the shoulders.I tried zeroing the hidden pJCMShldrUp_90 morphs too, without success. Looks like the Transfer Utility is not almighty smiley.

    Redz said:

    I have to point out this is not 'my' method. I merely adapted what others here have discovered into a somewhat simplified tutorial. :) 

    I know. But comparing different conversion methods, I have to distinguish them somehow wink.

  • RedzRedz Posts: 1,372
    Ki-Jen said:
    Redz said:
    Ki-Jen said:
    <Snip>
    Ki-Jen said:
    Is there a way to create head morph conversions only, without changing the body at all? I tried with the Aiko 6 head morph, but the body is still changing a bit, even if I didn't morph anything there.

    Using Redz's method - My face morphs also affect G8's body - especially the shoulders.  I guess our clones are not perfect. 

    In the Morph Transfer Helper file, the G8F has the Genesis 3 female clone dialled in. This is because the morphs you are transferring were modelled on this base, so for the best fidelity of shape, I dialled it in. However, the base shapes are similar enough that I think you could get away without having the G3F clone dialled in. It's under parameters, hidden- clones. (You may need to enable show hidden properties in the drop down box of the parameters first). 

    If you dial this Genesis 3 Female to zero before proceeding with the tutorial as normal, then I think you can bring over the head morphs without affecting the G8F body. 

    Removing the clone greatly reduced the unwanted body changes, but they are still there, mostly at the shoulders.I tried zeroing the hidden pJCMShldrUp_90 morphs too, without success. Looks like the Transfer Utility is not almighty smiley.

    Redz said:

    I have to point out this is not 'my' method. I merely adapted what others here have discovered into a somewhat simplified tutorial. :) 

    I know. But comparing different conversion methods, I have to distinguish them somehow wink.

    The other way to remove the body effects of your morph is to favourite the head morph. Then in Tool settings- geomety editor, choose vertex mode, select the body vertices that you don't want included, then right click and select Morph editing - Clear selected vertices from favorites. Now ypur morph only affects the head and you can re-save it for future use. 

    Unusual head shapes with neck morphs may mess up head/body transition, but if you're careful, this can work very neatly. 

  • Odds are the distortions are being caused by G3F JCMS, not G8s. 

    There's not a lot you can do about that. It's the down side of relaying on a pose, similar to the issues caused by JCMs when fitting high heels but expaned to a whole figure.

    Also, G3F's shoulders are not exactly lined up with G8s.

    I spent an hour improving my clone, and I can say that even using my fit-to figure method leaves a bit of variance at the shoulders to elbows, down the back and across the butt. Nothing shrinkwrap modifier couldn't fix, except at the armpit. The point is, without that kind of fix, that's going to be another source of distortion.

  • BlueIreneBlueIrene Posts: 1,318
    edited June 2017

    G8, in response to critics who feel that she looks too old! :)

     

    G8_Growing_Up.png
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    Post edited by BlueIrene on
  • Ki-JenKi-Jen Posts: 48
    edited June 2017
    Redz said:
    Ki-Jen said:
    Redz said:
    Ki-Jen said:
    <Snip>
    Ki-Jen said:
    Is there a way to create head morph conversions only, without changing the body at all? I tried with the Aiko 6 head morph, but the body is still changing a bit, even if I didn't morph anything there.

    Using Redz's method - My face morphs also affect G8's body - especially the shoulders.  I guess our clones are not perfect. 

    In the Morph Transfer Helper file, the G8F has the Genesis 3 female clone dialled in. This is because the morphs you are transferring were modelled on this base, so for the best fidelity of shape, I dialled it in. However, the base shapes are similar enough that I think you could get away without having the G3F clone dialled in. It's under parameters, hidden- clones. (You may need to enable show hidden properties in the drop down box of the parameters first). 

    If you dial this Genesis 3 Female to zero before proceeding with the tutorial as normal, then I think you can bring over the head morphs without affecting the G8F body. 

    Removing the clone greatly reduced the unwanted body changes, but they are still there, mostly at the shoulders.I tried zeroing the hidden pJCMShldrUp_90 morphs too, without success. Looks like the Transfer Utility is not almighty smiley.

    Redz said:

    I have to point out this is not 'my' method. I merely adapted what others here have discovered into a somewhat simplified tutorial. :) 

    I know. But comparing different conversion methods, I have to distinguish them somehow wink.

    The other way to remove the body effects of your morph is to favourite the head morph. Then in Tool settings- geomety editor, choose vertex mode, select the body vertices that you don't want included, then right click and select Morph editing - Clear selected vertices from favorites. Now ypur morph only affects the head and you can re-save it for future use. 

    Unusual head shapes with neck morphs may mess up head/body transition, but if you're careful, this can work very neatly. 

    That works! In part 2 of your manual I loaded the previous created head morph with Morph Loader Pro, dialed the morph in and removed the unwanted vertices with the geometry editor as you described above. After that I continued with your manual and the result was a head morph, that didn't change anything of the body.

    Thank you very much!

    Post edited by Ki-Jen on
  • RedzRedz Posts: 1,372
    Ki-Jen said:
    Redz said:
    Ki-Jen said:
    Redz said:
    Ki-Jen said:
    <Snip>
    Ki-Jen said:
    Is there a way to create head morph conversions only, without changing the body at all? I tried with the Aiko 6 head morph, but the body is still changing a bit, even if I didn't morph anything there.

    Using Redz's method - My face morphs also affect G8's body - especially the shoulders.  I guess our clones are not perfect. 

    In the Morph Transfer Helper file, the G8F has the Genesis 3 female clone dialled in. This is because the morphs you are transferring were modelled on this base, so for the best fidelity of shape, I dialled it in. However, the base shapes are similar enough that I think you could get away without having the G3F clone dialled in. It's under parameters, hidden- clones. (You may need to enable show hidden properties in the drop down box of the parameters first). 

    If you dial this Genesis 3 Female to zero before proceeding with the tutorial as normal, then I think you can bring over the head morphs without affecting the G8F body. 

    Removing the clone greatly reduced the unwanted body changes, but they are still there, mostly at the shoulders.I tried zeroing the hidden pJCMShldrUp_90 morphs too, without success. Looks like the Transfer Utility is not almighty smiley.

    Redz said:

    I have to point out this is not 'my' method. I merely adapted what others here have discovered into a somewhat simplified tutorial. :) 

    I know. But comparing different conversion methods, I have to distinguish them somehow wink.

    The other way to remove the body effects of your morph is to favourite the head morph. Then in Tool settings- geomety editor, choose vertex mode, select the body vertices that you don't want included, then right click and select Morph editing - Clear selected vertices from favorites. Now ypur morph only affects the head and you can re-save it for future use. 

    Unusual head shapes with neck morphs may mess up head/body transition, but if you're careful, this can work very neatly. 

    That works! In part 2 of your manual I loaded the previous created head morph with Morph Loader Pro, dialed the morph in and removed the unwanted vertices with the geometry editor as you described above. After that I continued with your manual and the result was a head morph, that didn't change anything of the body.

    Thank you very much!

    Glad it worked. If converting over a bunch of head morphs, you can favorite them all at once to remove the body vertices so as to make it semi-automated. 

  • Higgo78Higgo78 Posts: 35
    edited June 2017
    Redz said:

     

    Post edited by Higgo78 on
  • Hey guys, that vertex stuff sounds a bit too heavy for me. Successfully transferd my first morph. Noticed that whereas it was a morph for a body part the posture changed a bit once I applied it to G8F. So maybe this is that vertex/vertices thing? Would not mind if one of you Guru's might add that to Redz tutorial.

    But for the moment thanks to everyone exploring or documenting the necessary steps for transfering morphs enabling even a noob like me to do it.

  • MelanieLMelanieL Posts: 4,666
    edited June 2017

    I'd like to give a big "Thank You" to everyone who has come up with transfer methods and assistance. Here's G8F with 50% Samira and 50% Bethany 7 (Samira skin).

    G8F-SamiraBethany.jpg
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    Post edited by MelanieL on
  • OK, here's a probably complete silly question but anyhow. In order to transfer a morph, one is asked to dial it in on G3F and then export it. What about morphs which can be dialed in and out meaning morphs that come with 0 but allow being set to either -100 or +100? Is it sufficient just to export them dialed in +100 or should one also export the other behavior?

  • Singular BluesSingular Blues Posts: 729
    edited June 2017

    OK, here's a probably complete silly question but anyhow. In order to transfer a morph, one is asked to dial it in on G3F and then export it. What about morphs which can be dialed in and out meaning morphs that come with 0 but allow being set to either -100 or +100? Is it sufficient just to export them dialed in +100 or should one also export the other behavior?

    Yes, it is sufficient.

    You don't have to do anything tricky. When you import the morph it will default to -100 to 100 regardless of what the original setting were.

    Post edited by Singular Blues on
  • OK, here's a probably complete silly question but anyhow. In order to transfer a morph, one is asked to dial it in on G3F and then export it. What about morphs which can be dialed in and out meaning morphs that come with 0 but allow being set to either -100 or +100? Is it sufficient just to export them dialed in +100 or should one also export the other behavior?

    Yes, it is sufficient.

    You don't have to do anything tricky. When you import the morph it will default to -100 to 100 regardless of what the original setting were.

    OK, thanks. So will it take over exact settings (i.e. I had one original morph with the scale of -50 to +100) or always default to -100 to +100 meaning one does have to set this before saving the new morph manually?

  • Ki-JenKi-Jen Posts: 48
    edited June 2017

    Hey guys, that vertex stuff sounds a bit too heavy for me. Successfully transferd my first morph. Noticed that whereas it was a morph for a body part the posture changed a bit once I applied it to G8F. So maybe this is that vertex/vertices thing? Would not mind if one of you Guru's might add that to Redz tutorial.

    But for the moment thanks to everyone exploring or documenting the necessary steps for transfering morphs enabling even a noob like me to do it.

    You don't need to be a guru to do that. In fact, I didn't even know, this "Geometry Editor" exists, before Redz mentioned it. To create a partial morph (head morph for example) without affecting the other parts of G8, try this:

    1. Follow Redz's manual until you have loaded and dialed in your transferred G3 morph into G8 ("If all went well your morph imported and will be in the parameters tab. Dial it in and check that G8F has morphed correctly." in "Part two").
    2. Go to your morph in the Parameters tab and click on the heart in the top right of the morph to mark it as a "favorite".
    3. Activate the Geometry Editor:
      Geometry Editor
    4. Right click on your Genesis 8 in the Viewport and select Selection Type - Vertex Selection.
    5. Right click again on G8 and select Selection Mode - Lasso Selection.
    6. Drag the lasso around everything of G8, that should NOT be part of your morph. For a head morph, select the entire body, for example. It should look like this:
      Geometry Editor in action
    7. Right click a 3rd time on G8 and select Morph Editing - Clear Selected Deltas from Favorits.
    8. Continue with Redz manual.
    GeometryEditor1.jpg
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    Post edited by Ki-Jen on
  • RajibRajib Posts: 17

    Thanks Redz. Your technique worked :). I was also having what Ati had mentionied. I still have distortions but minor stuff. Easy to handle in Zbrush.

  • gaiago57gaiago57 Posts: 13

    Hi, I tried the method from Redz and it work, but I have a lot of problems with poses. For example, if I move "Eyes Up / Down", the eyes will go inside or outside the head and that's scary frown, or if I change the "bend" of the arm, the shoulder will be completely distorted. Did I do something wrong ?

  • SickleYieldSickleYield Posts: 7,324

    Hi there, will try out those tutorials and hope to be able to start transfering over morphs soon. Some questions as I'm not fully aware what is possible and what not:

    - Figures with just a head and body morph. Is it possible to copy over head and body separately? Or just as one figure morph?
    - HD Morphs. Either from DAZ original figures or from vendor figures. Those are not possible to transfer, right?
    - Single morphs form packs like from Thorne (the various Ressource Kits) or Zev0. Those are possible, right?
    - Interconnected morph kits with controllers like Age Control, Growing Up etc. Those are not possible to transfer?
    - Various helpers (projection morphs?) like those from SickleYield or Zev0?
    - Morphs connected to geografts like tails, horns etc. Possible but makes no sense as the geograft won't fit?

    Thanks for any info on this. I have a huge morph library for G3F so I might purchase some G8 updates someday nevertheless as long as they'll be reasonably priced (as far as I understand, it might be not that much work for a PA to port a product over) or adding additional features. Maybe a new Age Control or Growing up can make use of the new face posing/expression capabilities.

    As far as I know, any kind of projection morphs cannot be transferred.

  • Octavia MoonOctavia Moon Posts: 45
    edited June 2017
    Redz said:

    This is my alternative method, but I've found it better than the transfer utility for body morphs especially

    Tutorial and helper scene/morphs included

     

    Updated the tutorial file that (hopefully) sorts out those fingernail issues. Let me know how you get on with it. And huge thanks to everyone providing ideas and feedback, We'll get there together :)

    DOWNLOAD REVISED FILES HERE

     

    You completely saved my sanity - Thank you so much for this. I've spent most of the day trying to make the other way work - with some horrific and surprising results, none of which resulted in transferring the morphs :)

    This is Cailin

     

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    Post edited by Octavia Moon on
  • Ki-JenKi-Jen Posts: 48
    edited June 2017

    Now with my favorite cutifier in place I can mix some G3 into G8. Here's Victoria 8 with 30% Aiko 6 head morph added:

    Vicky 8 with 30% Aiko 6

    CutifyDemo.jpg
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    Post edited by Ki-Jen on
  • lululee1lululee1 Posts: 187

    I tried to download the tutorial but I got a 404 message.

    Has it been moved somewhere else?

    Would really like to have it.

    Cheerio

    lululee

  • lululee1lululee1 Posts: 187

    Hi,

      Got it.

    Thnaks so much for the tutorial.

    Cheerio

    lululee

  • RedzRedz Posts: 1,372
    lululee1 said:

    I tried to download the tutorial but I got a 404 message.

    Has it been moved somewhere else?

    Would really like to have it.

    Cheerio

    lululee

    There's an updated version, the link is quoted two posts above yours.:) 

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