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Regarding a wireframe image, it lterally takes all of 5 seconds to render. Literally switch to wireframe in the viewport, under render tab switch to viewport, click render. Done. Its not hard to do. In fact, maybe that would be enough to discourage AI spammers.
Yep, I would lead a charge to have the gallery removed if it was reduced to a visual shopping list for strangers rather than a place to display my artistic bent. If it remained, I would require viewers to pay an amount to view my images for my forced labor. I think it is great if people find inspiration in my images but I am not some personal shopper.
@Joanna This quote from the previous page.
"...even if I was to acknowledge it as a "tool," there is a difference between using AI to enhance image and using AI to spit out an image and maybe (because some images didn't even have that much) slapping on tiny 3d product in front of a huge AI-generated background. And as much as it might bring some people joy of not doing much (any) work and having a picture, the latter isn't really about 3d products, and Daz sells 3d products, not gen-AI. There are plenty of spaces where people can share their AI results. Asking for AI to be present in a Daz 3d store is like insiting that a company selling watercolor paints and brushes should allow oil paintings and quilts in their gallery."
I had a couple of thoughts.
slapping on tiny 3d product in front of a huge AI-generated background. And as much as it might bring some people joy of not doing much (any) work and having a picture
This part reminded me of how Daz users place their 3D rendered character in front of an actual picture- inserted in Daz Studio as a billboard OR added in post. So once again it'd be a moment - where it's fine if the picture came from anywhere, but if the source of the picture was AI, then it's an illegal violation of the art rules.
not doing much (any) work and having a picture
That part is a statement about a workflow. Does anyone know how difficult it is to make a Daz-rendered person match an actual picture backdrop and look anywhere near convincing?
Perspective, shadows, lighting, tone, DOF, scale- even the pixel density matters. That actually is a lot of work.
a company selling watercolor paints and brushes should allow oil paintings and quilts in their gallery
And this part.
Is it Daz's gallery or my Gallery? Becuase Daz can upload their own pictures or pick the ones that exemplify their sales quest. My stuff is to show my art, not convince other people to use Daz.
And for marketing purposes, Daz should show the curious potential customer a curated list of the THE BEST DAZ ART. And not the random stuff someone just uploaded.
If Daz wants to benefit from my art, then they should make it more SHARE friendly, which I think they are. The worst idea to to make the Gallery a marketing hub. The USERS should be doing the marketing by sharing their work.
AND- if someone shares their Daz-render-enhanced-by-AI works -> it works just as well as a sales-pitch. "Yeah, you can do this too- if you combine Daz with AI- just like me".
And that person would be interested in jumping into the Daz + AI workflow. Daz still benefits.
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And my last food for thought is about the Iray Rendering engine.
So, what you actually made was the image in the textured mode. That's actually the work YOU MADE.
From there, you process it, render it through the Iray engine. Daz Studio Iray does the heavy lifting and turns the scene you made into, for some, the finished piece.
So again, if IRAY takes my textured image and enhances it by doing all those calculations, it's okay. But if I feed my art into an AI rendering filter, it's a violation of some more art rules.
I'd be curious to compare a screen shot of the raw scene in Daz Studio, the Iray enhanced version and then the Iray version enhanced by AI result and see where the most drastic changes are.
Oh and I think this could all be fixed with a filter.
Don't want to see AI-enhanced Art? Click the filter button and , um not see it.
Most Facebook groups have rules about being able to see the Daz in the art no matter what techniques you use.
Artists were enhancing their Daz renders way before AI.
The only thing worse than blind hate for AI is blind love for AI. AI has effects beyond "the art". Try upgrading a computer today so you can run Daz and your AI models. Costs a lot, doesn't it?
In the freebie competitions I found the process of getting links to all the freebies very onerous, so it'd be similar in the Gallery to the point I'd go from 'rare' to 'never' usage. Then.. What if you have DAZ software like Cararra and actually model most of the stuff yourself? No links possible. Furthermore, the main DAZ source item could well be the base figure. DAZ origin figure, the rest could be non-DAZ. Does that then kicked out of the gallery for 'insufficient content/links'?
Regards,
Richard
If you:
a) know you're planning to upload it to the gallery and thus actually remember to do it when you've done rendering, so you don't later have to reload the scene (likely taking several minutes).
b) weren't rendering them out as part of a batch job with a tool that does not support the idea of changing render modes back and forth.
c) weren't having to composite the image out of multiple different passes for technical reasons, and would then have to redo all the compositing for the wireframe versions too.
Another thing that is very much not hard to do is prompt "please redo this image in the style of an untextured 3D wireframe".
Most of the major AI models can now produce fairly convincing imitations of the Daz Studio style and also reasonably convincingly do style changes, such as to look like wireframes. (The problem with any AI detection method like "we need to see your WIPs" is that once a method like that becomes commonplace, people get increasingly good at training/prompting AI to bluff those methods).
Will those wireframes be perfect? Probably not - not yet at least. But they will likely be good enough to require close inspection to tell that, no, that isn't actually a Genesis topology on that model. Now, that's still reasonably practical when it comes to using it to try and catch AI entries to a contest, because there all you really have to do is scrutinise a few potential winners to decide if any of them need to be disqualified, but it's not going to be a concrete way to screen hundreds of entries a day to the site gallery.
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I don't like the gallery hosting AI, but I don't think this is a good way to catch it.
Honestly, right now, a better method would be having the system give some favour to uploads that tag products (such as by doing what I said by featuring the renders on product pages) because renders tagging products is a somewhat trickier method to spoof than simply "wireframe plz" - it would mean specifically including references of the products in your AI workflow, which is more hassle than spitting out fake wireframes. That, to an extent, delists anyone uploading AI there.
More tagging is also something Daz should really want anyway, to help advertise the products. However, that would ideally need to be combined with improvements in tagging, because right now (or well, back when you could actually upload there), the system was awkward. It would only ever find anything if you got the name spelt exactly right (the number of times I had to specifically look up whether a product name was spelt "Scifi" "Sci Fi" or "Sci-Fi", as there is no fuzzy matching) and there was also no way to tell if you'd actually picked the right one of several similarly named products until you'd completed the upload and could check out the thumbnail selection.
(What would be good is if there were integration between a tool to spit out a list of products used in a render, and the gallery so that you could just upload a "products used" list to do it for you. Alas, these tools can't catch poses, as those don't leave any references in a scene file, but it's a start).
Hello, Fabiana!!
What a wonderful surprise to hear from you!! I am such a fan!! You have been so kind to me since I have been making 3d art.
I even purchased your products from 3D Commune!!! You gifted me many times with your products!!!
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Ok, my two cents on AI. I do not like any gallery bombarded with AI only art.
HOWEVER, I use AI to create props. I have purchased some props from Renderosity and I am fairy certain they were made with either Meshy AI or Tripo AI...or something like it. I tried to change a texture and it was one of the crazy texture maps that AI creates LOL
I now live on a very fixed budget and make some of my props with AI.
I cannot do the type of postwork that really talented artists do. I have tried. I tried to learn Lightroom. I purchased pre-made sets for it on Etsy. I just could NOT get the look I wanted.
So, I use AI to enhance my work because I am NOT talented :(
I use AI to change colors of textures. I use AI to remove hair sticking through a hat.
I use backgrounds I made with AI.
I use AI to give me ideas. Then, I combine my thoughts with AI.
I have spent around $50,000 in the last 25 years on 3d products. I would miss vacations to get paid so I had the money to spend on 3d products. I asked family and friends to give me money instead of presents so I could spend it on 3d products.
I have spent $20,000 just at Daz3d!!
Full Price Value: $121,641.00
Current Value: $69,581.37
Total Spent: $20,410.13
I think I should be able to use a little AI to make my work better. I will show my before and after work. I will show what products I have used.
First image is 3Delight from 2014, 2nd is Iray test from 2023, 3rd is Google Gemini 3 doing basically nothing but enhancing image technical parameter and prompting for more human realistic features. The last is going full bore AI.
Nice to see the progression. What fun :) Good for you!
I like seeing what AI can do to my hard work, as well :)
First image is 3Delight from 2014, 2nd is Iray test from 2023, 3rd is Google Gemini 3 doing basically nothing but enhancing image technical parameter and prompting for more human realistic features. The last is going full bore AI.
What's scary is, in a blind test I wouldn't be able to tell which is which.
And, if you told me the last one was a Daz Render, I'd believe you.
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As far as the Gallery goes, it could be a simple pop-up that reminds the uploaders that Daz-centric artworks are when the Daz Gallery is reserved for.
And you make the uploads check a box that the image...
And then whatever the standard is going to be.
A) Daz pure render no post work
B) Daz Render + Post Work
C) Daz Render + Post AI Filter
D) Daz + AI Generated Elements
And then, instead of trying to be the AI Policy enforcers, you let the viewers of art decide their filters.
You can switch to 'Traditionnal' and you should not see pictures with AI elements or AI generated ones.
Even without doing that, AI pictures rarely get at the top of the Trending or Popular category.
You can also ask, either directly the artist in their gallery, or everyone else on the forum, if one item is exactly what you're looking for.
Not as fast or as convenient than having the full list, but it is time consumming to list every product used under a picture and it should stay something people are doing because they want to, not something mandatory.
On top of that, it's just something impractical to enforce by the gallery moderator team and I think people would either stop sharing renders (even without a complete list or any list, it's still a way to show what's possible and you may recognize something used in a way you didn't though about), the used products list would end only listing products like Genesis 9 Starter Essentials or would simply have wrong products listed, picked at random.
In theory, yes, but as Daz no longer has any AI products, and AI generations are now in direct conflict with their primary business model, it simply doesn't make good sense for Daz to continue to allow those uploads and thus it would be pretty strange to continue to have sections and filters for it.
AI elements or enhancements *maybe*, but pure AI generations? What does Daz get out of having those in their marketing gallery?
(Emphasis mine).
At present (even disallowing for commenting being suspended at the moment), you really can't, because there's no notifications on any comments, and I'm exceedingly unlikely to find them on anything that I posted more than a couple of days ago (and even if I do find them, it's probably months afterwards and now the other person won't see the answer).
I can understand that in certain cases, AI can expand the limits of what you or the software can do. However, I do not want to see AI on Daz. The whole point of the gallery is to showcase Daz products and the users who create from them. Adding AI to the mix detracts from that and devalues the work that has gone into creation.
I think the gallery should be limited to show artwork that used Daz assets from Bryce, Carrara Hexagon and Studio - using additional assets from other sources may be OK if they are additional and not the main thing.
More important seems to me that a functional gallery will appear. Meanwhile, we have been waiting since mid April without any comment from Daz.
Two and a half months with NO new gallery posts is worthy of ridicule. In the U.S. South, it would be called "country." In Singapore, it would be called "kampong." In London's East End, it would be called "mickey mouse." Among black Americans, it would be called "trifling."
Apparently Daz no longer wants a gallery. Maybe it'll come back some day, maybe it won't. The previous version was awful compared to many other online galleries, so maybe it's actually not such a big loss. And the longer it's gone , the less it will matter. Unfortunate for those who liked the previous gallery, but the world is still spinning.
Don't tell the flat earthers, they'll be scared of falling off the edge
"The irony is that the 'full bore AI' image is achievable in Daz Studio, making it a good example of why I don't think AI image generation should be including in a gallery for Daz Studio works."
"I can understand that in certain cases, AI can expand the limits of what you or the software can do. However, I do not want to see AI on Daz. The whole point of the gallery is to showcase Daz products and the users who create from them. Adding AI to the mix detracts from that and devalues the work that has gone into creation."
Following that logic, do you believe that the gallery (If/when) reopened, should never allow any image that has any postwork done in Photoshop, GIMP, or Paint Shop Pro? That is basically all that was done using AI in any of the images, and a background can be pulled easily from the internet. All of the items in all of the images were rendered using V4 era models.
I think that the direction of the business model Daz plans, is shown in the "AI Solutions" link in the black Daz3D bar at the top of the page. I'm simply doing a similar thing, on a smaller scale, for my own enjoyment, with models I already own.
I don't agree with the stance that running an image through an AI image generator is the same as doing post work.
No one knows what the actual Daz stance is on this. This thread is a house of speculation and invented narrative. The only thing we do know is, the gallery is closed to new submissions and apparently no longer linked on the main menu.
I'm just giving just a solution for the perceived flood of AI pictures, using the tools of the current gallery, not my position in favor or against allowing these pictures.
If you answer under the message of someone else, that person can see if there is a reply using the 'Pages with Replies to [name]' link visible on their gallery homepage (to bad message left under our pictures don't count as replies to us).
Before the gallery was frozen, I though about trying to put a message on top, asking for people leaving a comment to leave one under that message, so that I could see someone answered but I forgot to test it with my last picture.
And at worse, the forum is still here.
I suppose by Main menu, you're speaking about the menu opening after clicking on the orange icon? It's actually still visible here if you're opening that menu on Daz homepage (so https://www.daz3d.com/) but is now replaced by a link to our Product Library elsewhere.
Otherwise, it's still the first link in the 'Community' menu, and there is still some activity (some of my pictures are still getting Like as an example, and it's likely true for the pictures of other people) and while there isn't any new pictures, the system is pulling pictures from the past, so if someone is looking for inspirations or arts, they're likely to see something they either never saw or at worse, it will be a trip down memory lane.
No one knows what Daz has in store, so we will have to wait to see if the report of the gallery's desmise were, or not, exagerrated
That's very comprehensive in coverage, @elor and changes nothing of my main point. The bulk of this thread is speculation and invented narrative. And you're right, too. We'll have to wait to see how this turns out.
Please back off from the argumnets over AI, we have already had numerous discussions of the topic (many of which ended up locked).
Sounds good to me.
I speculate that Daz soon©®™ reopening will be >1yr (that is, after April 14, 2027) and a low, but (slightly) >0 proablity of being less than 5ys.
How about we just ban AI completely, worldwide?
Stop building all these data centres and battery storage banks that are needed for them. Then we can enjoy reasonable RAM and GPU prices again.