3Delight Surface and Lighting Thread

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  • wowiewowie Posts: 2,029
    edited April 2015

    The set has a lot of textures and surfaces. I do wish those chairs have more surface zones though. Plus having one section so I can just use instances for the others. I'll probably do it myself once I have some extra time.

    The entire set is lit by one UE and 10 linear point lights (1 to light the steps, 3 for the center area and 3 for each of the tracks), with generally the same settings. The idea is to include just four lights, arranged in a square orientation. If you need more, just create more lights and copy the settings. For a small scene like Jack Tomalin's Classic Deco room, 4 lights is enough.

    I know it doesn't look the same like the promo shots, but I generally like a well lit scene.

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    Post edited by wowie on
  • NoName99NoName99 Posts: 322
    edited December 1969

    mjc1016 said:
    If you are using the sphere for a background or providing an environment for reflections, any writing will be 'mirrored' because the sphere is turned inside out and rotated which basically means it is also out of sync with the 'world' coordinates...both DS itself and what 3DL thinks are the 'world'. Basically that is one reason it's so hard and many thought that IBL didn't exist in DS for so long.

    Every attempt I've seen to make a 'sky'/'world'/etc dome/sphere has some sort of alignment issue....

    And I think the problems are compounded by the surface shaders used on the the sphere...basically all that is needed is a color/texture map and a visibility option. and a way to actually align it to the 'world'.

    Here is the EnvSphere with a 'new' shader applied (3DL defaultsurface) and negatively scaled (-100%..to turn it inside out, again) and rotated around the x-axis by 180. Then I applied the new shader. The the light is Envlight2.. This looks to be the best alignment I've seen yet, at least in this direction...I haven't checked the angle from the horizontal yet.

    The second image is a quick render, inside the sphere...notice the writing is correctly oriented...

    This is some really good information. I thought about scaling to -100 to flip it inside out, but hesitated for some reason.

    I'm thinking that maybe an HDRI can be flipped before converting to tdlmake with a .tiff extension?

    I can open an HDRI in after effects, but I'm not sure of I can modify it and save/render back to an HDRI.

    I'm going to try this tomorrow morning.

  • NoName99NoName99 Posts: 322
    edited December 1969

    wowie said:
    The set has a lot of textures and surfaces. I do wish those chairs have more surface zones though. Plus having one section so I can just use instances for the others. I'll probably do it myself once I have some extra time.

    The entire set is lit by one UE and 4 linear point lights (1 to light the steps), with generally the same settings. The idea is to include just four lights, arranged in a square orientation. If you need more, just create more lights and copy the settings. For a small scene like Jack Tomalin's Classic Deco room, 4 lights is enough.

    I know it doesn't look the same like the promo shots, but I generally like a well lit scene.

    Now that is Photoreal.......very nicely done.

  • wowiewowie Posts: 2,029
    edited April 2015

    dinopt said:

    Now that is Photoreal.......very nicely done.

    Thanks. Just need to fine tune and package this. It's not arch viz quality, but I was aiming for a good balance between believability, render times and flexibility. Render time for a 1920x1080 version was around 5 min.

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    Post edited by wowie on
  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited December 1969

    That looks brilliant, as do the other renders. That Darius skin looks amazing! So is it the lights you're working on or the whole thing?

    CHEERS!

  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited December 1969

    I've now found a backdrop prop that can be scaled much larger and, judging by the camera views, the lights are all inside it. It doesn't have a separate floor so I can't do that reflective trick, but, I think the renders look better. I worked out that the Bounce lights were the UberArea lights and what the others were, so I could apply those presets to them. Below is Rob with Light Set 1 with the Cool preset applied.

    I've also got that Country House HDRI and tiff so I may have a crack at replicating that Gia lighting. It was annoying in the video that he didn't have the parameters tab open when he was positioning them so I can't copy down any translation settings! Still, I'll give it a go anyway.

    CHEERS!

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,414
    edited April 2015

    Possibly, hopeful thinking. May that Gia lighting have been included with Gia6 Pro? I was also curious about the settings not shown in the vid, and the surface settings mentioned as well. I vaguely remember looking for the Gia hair textures shown in the video and not seeing them in my run-time. I kind of expected that by getting the 'Pro' pack, that I would be able to recreate the figure outfit and hair as shown on the cover promo, lol. What the bleep, where is it, lol.
    https://youtu.be/msw2KyQBlug

    Ironically it was the same with Olympia Pro. Several figures are shown in the promos with a green mat on the outfit, and that particular mat was not included in the Pro Pack. I did eventually stumble across the outfit color add-on pack, months later. grumble, grumble, grumble, lol.
    (EDIT)
    Well given that there is a comment on the vid, from over a year ago, asking about where to get the tutorial mentioned in the vid... And it has gone unanswered. Well there you go. No hare preset as shown in the vid. No outfit textures as shown in the vid. And no tutorial. A moment I would love to be wrong about something.

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    Post edited by ZarconDeeGrissom on
  • scorpioscorpio Posts: 8,533
    edited December 1969

    The Pro and starter bundle never (IIRC) have the textures for the outfits included, they are a separate purchase and usually released at the same time. As for the tutorials sorry can't help.

  • wowiewowie Posts: 2,029
    edited April 2015

    Rogerbee said:

    That looks brilliant, as do the other renders. That Darius skin looks amazing! So is it the lights you're working on or the whole thing?

    Darius is AWESOME! :)

    To answer your question - both. Just like in physically based renderers, you need a good light setup and proper materials to be close to photorealistic. It's not by all means acurate or even correct, but if you stick to some solid concepts, you can do amazing things with 3delight (just look at Chappie, it was rendered with 3delight for Maya) and DAZ Studio.


    I've now found a backdrop prop that can be scaled much larger and, judging by the camera views, the lights are all inside it. It doesn't have a separate floor so I can't do that reflective trick, but, I think the renders look better. I worked out that the Bounce lights were the UberArea lights and what the others were, so I could apply those presets to them. Below is Rob with Light Set 1 with the Cool preset applied.

    Glad to see you've caught the concepts. The render looks a lot like mine. :)

    Post edited by wowie on
  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,414
    edited December 1969

    The Pro and starter bundle never (IIRC) have the textures for the outfits included, they are a separate purchase and usually released at the same time. As for the tutorials sorry can't help.
    That would be nice, where is it, lol. :lol:

    There is no add-on pack for Nightfever Hair, let alone one that includes the preset mention in that vid.
    http://www.daz3d.com/nightfever-hair

    And the rest, I gave up looking along time ago, before they changed the store layout to include related add-on items. I suspect, like the hair, the presets mentioned in the video, is not available for purchase or download anywhere.

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,843
    edited December 1969

    wowie said:
    dinopt said:

    Now that is Photoreal.......very nicely done.

    Thanks. Just need to fine tune and package this. It's not arch viz quality, but I was aiming for a good balance between believability, render times and flexibility. Render time for a 1920x1080 version was around 5 min.
    ...what are your system specs to get that kind of render time with UE at that resolution?

  • wowiewowie Posts: 2,029
    edited April 2015

    Kyoto Kid said:

    ...what are your system specs to get that kind of render time with UE at that resolution?

    Core i7 4770K with 8 GB of RAM on a 64 bit Windows 8 Pro. I'm still on DAZ Studio 4.7.0.12.
    Renderer options are pretty much set at default. I only changed Progressive Rendering (Enabled), Gamma Correction (Enabled), Gamma (2.2), Bucket Order (ZigZag) and Max Ray Trace Depth (8).

    I've already shared my UE2 settings in the other thread.

    Post edited by wowie on
  • edited December 1969

    I didn't know about this model. Light is a HDRI only.

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  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,843
    edited April 2015

    wowie said:
    Kyoto Kid said:

    ...what are your system specs to get that kind of render time with UE at that resolution?

    Core i7 4770K with 8 GB of RAM on a 64 bit Windows 8 Pro. I'm still on DAZ Studio 4.7.0.12.
    Renderer options are pretty much set at default. I only changed Progressive Rendering (Enabled), Gamma Correction (Enabled), Gamma (2.2), Bucket Order (ZigZag) and Max Ray Trace Depth (8).

    I've already shared my UE2 settings in the other thread.
    ...ahh, progressive rendering on 4.7 is faster than in 4.8 for some reason. You also have a newer i7 than I (mine is an old Nehalem/Bloomfield - first generation). Interesting you only have 8GB memory and don't have it crash.

    Currently rendering a 1,600 x 1,600 scene using an HDR set with UE that also has motion blur (5 frames), reflectivity DZFire's Real Metals, Supershine Top Coat) and hair with heavy transmaps. Currently 68% complete after 14 hours.

    Shading rate at 0.2 all, other render settings at default (including ray trace depth).

    Post edited by kyoto kid on
  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited December 1969

    wowie said:
    Rogerbee said:

    That looks brilliant, as do the other renders. That Darius skin looks amazing! So is it the lights you're working on or the whole thing?

    Darius is AWESOME! :)

    To answer your question - both. Just like in physically based renderers, you need a good light setup and proper materials to be close to photorealistic. It's not by all means acurate or even correct, but if you stick to some solid concepts, you can do amazing things with 3delight (just look at Chappie, it was rendered with 3delight for Maya) and DAZ Studio.


    I've now found a backdrop prop that can be scaled much larger and, judging by the camera views, the lights are all inside it. It doesn't have a separate floor so I can't do that reflective trick, but, I think the renders look better. I worked out that the Bounce lights were the UberArea lights and what the others were, so I could apply those presets to them. Below is Rob with Light Set 1 with the Cool preset applied.

    Glad to see you've caught the concepts. The render looks a lot like mine. :)

    I binned that backdrop, it turns out that the one I had was best, I just scaled it to what was in the Gia video. Looking forward to seeing that set and lights when they're done.

    CHEERS!

  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited April 2015

    Possibly, hopeful thinking. May that Gia lighting have been included with Gia6 Pro? I was also curious about the settings not shown in the vid, and the surface settings mentioned as well. I vaguely remember looking for the Gia hair textures shown in the video and not seeing them in my run-time. I kind of expected that by getting the 'Pro' pack, that I would be able to recreate the figure outfit and hair as shown on the cover promo, lol. What the bleep, where is it, lol.
    https://youtu.be/msw2KyQBlug

    Ironically it was the same with Olympia Pro. Several figures are shown in the promos with a green mat on the outfit, and that particular mat was not included in the Pro Pack. I did eventually stumble across the outfit color add-on pack, months later. grumble, grumble, grumble, lol.
    (EDIT)
    Well given that there is a comment on the vid, from over a year ago, asking about where to get the tutorial mentioned in the vid... And it has gone unanswered. Well there you go. No hare preset as shown in the vid. No outfit textures as shown in the vid. And no tutorial. A moment I would love to be wrong about something.

    Apart from the textures, everything else in that video works. Ok, I didn't have the exact same backdrop and I didn't use Gia, but, I did use all the colours and lights they did. I'm not convinced that the Gia in the video used the shader she comes with, on the V6 I used, I used a MAT for Anna from Photo Studio Kit 2 which uses UberSurface2 and the skin looks much more like it does in promos.

    So, I can now replicate DAZ promos if I so wish....and sometimes I do.... sometimes I don't....

    CHEERS!

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    Post edited by Rogerbee on
  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited April 2015

    Mmmm, just tried Anna's standard MAT and I think it works better with the lights. I'll give Gia a go sometime. It also helps when you use the DAZ angles!

    CHEERS!

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    Post edited by Rogerbee on
  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited December 1969

    Oh yeah, I just made a cool discovery when looking in the Daz Store for Gia’s bikini (The String Bikini for V6), you can get it in the Day At The Beach bundle, which is currently FREE!! I didn’t see it till I scrolled down to the bottom of the store page for the bikini! That saved me $17.95 for the bikini and $49.95 for the whole bundle, nice! It isn’t in the Freebies bit of the store either, odd!

    CHEERS!

  • NoName99NoName99 Posts: 322
    edited December 1969

    Rogerbee said:

    I've now found a backdrop prop that can be scaled much larger and, judging by the camera views, the lights are all inside it. It doesn't have a separate floor so I can't do that reflective trick, but, I think the renders look better. I worked out that the Bounce lights were the UberArea lights and what the others were, so I could apply those presets to them. Below is Rob with Light Set 1 with the Cool preset applied.

    I've also got that Country House HDRI and tiff so I may have a crack at replicating that Gia lighting. It was annoying in the video that he didn't have the parameters tab open when he was positioning them so I can't copy down any translation settings! Still, I'll give it a go anyway.

    CHEERS!

    Great looking render!

  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited December 1969

    Oh, by the way, I think I've worked out the deal with the bikini texture on Gia. I don't think there was a texture on it at all, the guy went to 'Diffuse Colour' and hit None. If you look at all the other textures for that bikini, the straps are always different colours. Let's render and see...

    And behold! Yup, the cheeky artist hit None and saved the MAT! Mystery solved folks!

    CHEERS!

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  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited December 1969

    Solved Olympia 6 and V6 too, select Bra in Surfaces and apply the Chrome shader from Shader Mixer, job done!

    CHEERS!

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  • mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 15,001
    edited December 1969

    Been playing around with the Envsphere with the changes I made. Had one render I was working on, but just couldn't get the car to 'fit' the background. But on that one, it was pretty evident that shadows and reflections were lining up 'properly'. And with the carpaint shader I was using, even the secondary lights in the HDR were showing up as distinct bright spots/lights and not just as reflections from the sphere.

    Here's one with an 'industrial' light set up...the only light is envlight2.

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  • NoName99NoName99 Posts: 322
    edited December 1969

    mjc1016 said:
    Been playing around with the Envsphere with the changes I made. Had one render I was working on, but just couldn't get the car to 'fit' the background. But on that one, it was pretty evident that shadows and reflections were lining up 'properly'. And with the carpaint shader I was using, even the secondary lights in the HDR were showing up as distinct bright spots/lights and not just as reflections from the sphere.

    Here's one with an 'industrial' light set up...the only light is envlight2.

    Looks good. Is that background the sphere, or is it part of the scene?

  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited December 1969

    Looks great, some might say it's a bit dark, but, it looks like all the car parks I've been in.

    CHEERS!

  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,414
    edited April 2015

    Rogerbee said:

    Solved Olympia 6 and V6 too, select Bra in Surfaces and apply the Chrome shader from Shader Mixer, job done!

    CHEERS!

    OK, that's cool, thanks. from what I've looked at from the AElflaed's silver to that shader mixer one and including many others. Mapped or ray-traced, it needs an environment to be reflected.

    Now granted it has been a while, tho I don't recall there being anything beyond that backdrop. one wall and a floor, nothing else to be reflected by ray-trace. So dose the silver bikini need a 'Mapped' environment? or is it just set to black beyond the lights, and left on ray-trace?
    (EIDT)
    Let me watch that vid again, and I need coffee, lol. I'm missing something here from my former frustration of trying to follow that vid.

    Post edited by ZarconDeeGrissom on
  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited December 1969

    Here's a nice big render of V6, note the reflective floor, that's not in the promos, but, it's a nice little trick I picked up from Wowie.

    CHEERS!

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  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited December 1969

    Rogerbee said:

    Solved Olympia 6 and V6 too, select Bra in Surfaces and apply the Chrome shader from Shader Mixer, job done!

    CHEERS!

    OK, that's cool, thanks. from what I've looked at from the AElflaed's silver to that shader mixer one and including many others. Mapped or ray-traced, it needs an environment to be reflected.

    Now granted it has been a while, tho I don't recall there being anything beyond that backdrop. one wall and a floor, nothing else to be reflected by ray-trace. So dose the silver bikini need a 'Mapped' environment? or is it just set to black beyond the lights, and left on ray-trace?
    (EIDT)
    Let me watch that vid again, and I need coffee, lol. I'm missing something here from my former frustration of trying to follow that vid.

    I don't know, there is nothing else in the scene, but, I'm sure the cups are picking up a reflection of her torso.

    CHEERS!

  • mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 15,001
    edited December 1969

    dinopt said:
    mjc1016 said:
    Been playing around with the Envsphere with the changes I made. Had one render I was working on, but just couldn't get the car to 'fit' the background. But on that one, it was pretty evident that shadows and reflections were lining up 'properly'. And with the carpaint shader I was using, even the secondary lights in the HDR were showing up as distinct bright spots/lights and not just as reflections from the sphere.

    Here's one with an 'industrial' light set up...the only light is envlight2.

    Looks good. Is that background the sphere, or is it part of the scene?

    It's the sphere.

  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,414
    edited December 1969

    Rogerbee said:
    Possibly, hopeful thinking. May that Gia lighting have been included with Gia6 Pro? I was also curious about the settings not shown in the vid, and the surface settings mentioned as well. I vaguely remember looking for the Gia hair textures shown in the video and not seeing them in my run-time. I kind of expected that by getting the 'Pro' pack, that I would be able to recreate the figure outfit and hair as shown on the cover promo, lol. What the bleep, where is it, lol.
    https://youtu.be/msw2KyQBlug

    Ironically it was the same with Olympia Pro. Several figures are shown in the promos with a green mat on the outfit, and that particular mat was not included in the Pro Pack. I did eventually stumble across the outfit color add-on pack, months later. grumble, grumble, grumble, lol.
    (EDIT)
    Well given that there is a comment on the vid, from over a year ago, asking about where to get the tutorial mentioned in the vid... And it has gone unanswered. Well there you go. No hare preset as shown in the vid. No outfit textures as shown in the vid. And no tutorial. A moment I would love to be wrong about something.

    Apart from the textures, everything else in that video works. Ok, I didn't have the exact same backdrop and I didn't use Gia, but, I did use all the colours and lights they did. I'm not convinced that the Gia in the video used the shader she comes with, on the V6 I used, I used a MAT for Anna from Photo Studio Kit 2 which uses UberSurface2 and the skin looks much more like it does in promos.

    So, I can now replicate DAZ promos if I so wish....and sometimes I do.... sometimes I don't....

    CHEERS!I think, even mention at about 2:07 -ish into the vid. Using the stock mats that gia comes with. The view-field did change between 4.6 and 4.7, so no things will not look exactly the same there. Tho Gia did turn out quite close to her appearance in the Promo as in my lineup tests.


    Yea, I like to test stuff I buy, by first trying to replicate a promo image. perhaps not exact environment and lights. Tho hair figure and outfit, yes. I want to see the figure render, and turn out close to what is in the promos, and absolutely no 'Missing files' or pure white rendered surfaces, lol.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,414
    edited December 1969

    Rogerbee said:

    Here's a nice big render of V6, note the reflective floor, that's not in the promos, but, it's a nice little trick I picked up from Wowie.

    CHEERS!

    absalutely, lol.
    looks good, and yes, we all like the polished tile look at times.
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