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love the new dforce hair :)
Here a short testrender with the dForce Longdrape Hair
True. Yet we don’t want to rebuy the same hair, just with dforce physics built in.
You cannot create the strand based dForce hair unless you are a PA.
However, you do dForce hair like this - https://www.daz3d.com/classic-long-hair-with-dforce-for-genesis-8-females - but that requires modeling the hair in 3D modeling program first.
PA only.
Get if Free.
Which doesn't stop virtually every 3d platform on the planet from having strand based hair physics.
dForce Hair and dForce Cloth are mechanically different. You can use dForce Cloth on hair, but if you do the render times would be in the eons. dforce Hair is designed for hair and is insanely faster when used on hir. But it has the little issue that it is PA locked.
My lady, we are completely on the same page.
Daz has made some disions over the years I do not agree with.
Encrypted scripts.
Abandoning a unisex universal figures after Genesis.
HD morphs and what feels like the generational decimation of the Genesis figures to nessisitate their use.
These things annoy me but are legitimite decisions no matter how much they might urk me.
I understand that programers don't want thier scripts reverse engineered and resold, even if it makes it impossible to customize them (or leads to situations like GenX2)
I understand that while Genesis was easier on the user (and thier wallets) it was harder for artists.
I dislike the HD situation, but using subdivision and normals at least can reduce it from a glaring issue to a general annoyance.
Locking a fundimental (and long overdue) functionaly feature like basic hair physics on the otherhand is simply beyond ridiclious. There's wanting to earn a profit. They're a company. I get this. They need to keep the lights on and the sharholders happy. The problem is the kind of anti-consumer nonsense that waves in the direction of the EA, Activision, and their sort of shinanigans.
What's next?
PA only soft body physics?
PA only IK detection?
I'm almost expecting lootboxes.
????????????
Hmmm... mobile emojis don’t work on here...
Clearly not.
What were you trying to say?
We have been down this path before though so familiar at least
just unlike Simon from Optitex who owned the extremely expensive propiatary software needed DAZ at least has licensed it to Premier Artists do we get considerably more people to pester for what we want
But hey, at least we do get to buy stuff you guys make! It’s much easier than to make stuff ourselves. Quality products are what we want.
and I wonder if there’s a way to request certain hair styles on the forums somewhere...
We also need @joepingleton to become a PA
Of course they're going to reinvest in development. That's part of being a buisness.
This is a product long, long overdue. We had it with LAMH for years. Strand based hair and hair physics has been part of virtually every other rendering package for a long time, from Poser and Carrara, to dedicated playform like Maya, 3DS Max, and Blender.
And we want to be able ot actually properlly use the hair we create using the hair system.
And we want to be able to apply it in at least some manner to our preexsiting libraries if at all possible.
Thank you.
That hair also takes longer to simulate than render, looks very flat and lifeless, and takes up over a gig of space for a single hair. One of the points of strand based hair is to reduce the massive size of hair files.
Way I read it is that this is a shameless artficial scarcity situation.
No, we need Daz to rethink this terrible decision.
Note that the way creating hair for dForce hair works, you are EXTREMELY unlikely to 'just' get retreads of existing hairs. I mean, some hair may be similar, because, well, hair is sometimes similar, but will function a lot differently.
Also one of the neat things about dHair is that, at a user level, you can tweak stuff a lot. For example, if you are doing long shots or cartoons, you can increase the size of 'hairs' and reduce number of hairs. In fact, I think I'll experiment with that...
Actually, that is one of the things I find kind of weird in some of the modern CGI toon productions: they are highly stylized except the hair looks like it came out of a shampoo commercial, full and thick and bueatiful but certainly not toon style. It doesn't seem to quite fit. Look at the redhead below, her hair is really realistic, well done! But she's super stylized in every other way. Maybe I'm too sensitive but your ideas of fattening the strands, etc make sense for toons.
What I have observed with the dForce hair's that I've bought is that that it's pretty hard to adjust styling when conpared with geometry-based hairs (with or without d-force.) Since there is no geometry with dForce hair, I can't send it zbrush, modify strands, and re-run the simulation. Without an editor I can't do much with the PA's original strands (as opposed to the polygon strip type hairs) to suit the scene. I would be nice if DAZ gave us a way of more substantially editing & manipulating the hair's we buy, but maybe that's on the roadmap. I think by witholding the dforce hair editing tools, the unintended consequences is that they PA dforce hair products are harder to work with, and at least to me substantially less useful. Perhaps a tool that at least let us comb and position strands (without growing new ones) would be a big improvement in dforce hair functionality.
I'm quite pleased with this test.
I converted Eddie hair to PWToon, changed line width to 10, Hairs per cm2 to 10. Used my usual pwtoon settings, though for hair I generally shut off internal lines.
That’s a possibility. It’s probably not really ready enough for a full release to everyone.
plus if’s possibly that DAZ thought it’ll be too complicated for the causal DAZ user and decided to keep it for those that are experienced enough.
Yes, please share experiments with various combinations of stylized characters and strand-based hair. Sometimes stuff works, sometimes it doesn't, but I always appreciate the effort.
two examples from a different age
Captain Scarlet - check out hair with "the angels" and with "the bowties."
.
Mad Monster Party - rock'n roll skeletons with groovy hair, Phyllis Diller as the hostess with the mostest
I've thought about that, but after rigging and texturing a few original characters (and weightmapping, jcm, etc.) I'm trying to think what "too complicated" must mean... ;)
Here's an experiment with my oso lechuza...
Not really an excuse. They let us "normies" mess with a lot of advanced features. If they wanted to paywall based on experience, they could just make a Basic and Pro version. And you know, if it would give us normies access to the PA features... well shut up and take my money.
You think you could write a guide? Because that's all very high level stuff I'd love to know how to do.
In this case I tihnk I'd stick to your Geoshell hair.
I am irked that Daz made dforce hair PA only, nor have I been happy about HD being PA only. More and more I'm using other programs to supplement Daz (keyword being supplement), but I'll probably be a Daz user for life regardless. So I guess I can complain about this all I want, but no reason Daz should listen, since the trend is that I'm spending more money here, not less.
Yeah I am salty but fully understand the monetary reasons
it stops HW3D animals getting DAZ dynamic furs too
on the plus side as a Carrara user it won’t stop me furring them up to my hearts content
it will just either help me use DAZ studio less or spend more money if I wish to, my choice as is everyone’s basically nobody being Dforced into anything against their will!
DAZ income is PA driven en PA's income is PA driven as well. So it be only fair to give PA's as DAZ a chance to create hair of the dynamic variety. I'm totally stunned with the creative posibilities of this strand rendered hair....now I will be bying some DForced hair as well and see what can be done with that.....but the 4.11 update ROCK's. Deep bow to all the coders who must have put in a lot of overtime (hopefully of the paid variety) in order to shup this. I have hair physics and strand rendered hair in Blender as well and frankly, not to pleased with it. Will spend the weekend not reading GoT (which is a sacrifice believe me
) and checking out what can be done with this new version and SRH.
Greets,
I am not convinced this would stop the animals of HW3D, or any other vendor getting fur, since fur is typically short (at least in comparison to long human hair), it does not follow gravity so much, so for animals the strand based dynamic hair should be sufficent for animals, as we can see in creations by non-PAs like Joe Pingleton, and others, whose efforts have been posted earlier in this thread.
It will stop Dawn from getting long dForce hair however.
Don't forget that GenX2 is not a script, it is a plug-in, so the encryption of scripts is irrelevant for that product. The morph transfer system created by SingularBlue, as described in other threads, is a script.
We're not complaing about PAs getting the chance ot make dynamic hairs, we're upset that they've made it so ONLY PAs can do so.
In virtually every other piece of 3d software on earth worth mentioning these days hair physics is a base feature.
+1
I agree, it looks great; there just aren't enough options to position it before draping.
EDIT:
However, using a Dformer to make some adjustments works well; it is well worth the look once rendered.