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Looking for dForce fabric settings

dlm4001dlm4001 Posts: 205
in The Commons

Does anyone know of a list of dForce settings for different fabric types (by fabric types)?  (Ir an explanation of how to get different fabric looks in simulations.  I am playing with gravity and density, but still not get the look I am after.  I am looking for lightweight nylon like a windbreaker or atheletic jacket.   (ripstop or similar material)  Seems like I can across a list of settings to get different types fo fabrics once, but I can not find it now. 

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  • algovincianalgovincian Posts: 2,670
    dlm4001 said:

    Does anyone know of a list of dForce settings for different fabric types (by fabric types)?  (Ir an explanation of how to get different fabric looks in simulations.  I am playing with gravity and density, but still not get the look I am after.  I am looking for lightweight nylon like a windbreaker or atheletic jacket.   (ripstop or similar material)  Seems like I can across a list of settings to get different types fo fabrics once, but I can not find it now. 

    There was a list of settings for the old optitex dynamic cloth. Unfortunately, with dForce the fabric properties are not independent of the geometry. I’m on a phone right now so it’s hard to go into more detail, but hopefully this answers your question a bit.

    - Greg

  • 3Diva3Diva Posts: 11,996

    This post might be helpful as it covers what some of the different settings in dForce does: https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/3250046/#Comment_3250046

    Actually, that whole thread is really helpful and has a lot of great info - though the thread is quite long. One of these days I hope to get around to reading it all. lol

  • dlm4001dlm4001 Posts: 205

    Thanks for that thread pointer Divamakeup.  I browsed it and it looks very educational.  I will begin reading it more completely tonight.

    I understand the cloth properties in Marvelopus Designer well enought to get the the desired effects.  For some reason, everything I simulate in dForce takes on the properties of a "slinky fabric" or a "springy fabric".  When I get the fabric more stiff, it takes on the property of a heavier fabric like denim. I am trying to simulate stiffer lightweight fabrics like ripstop, tafetta. .  I almost had it but then it would blow up around 95%.  I backed off some settings and then it looked like... wet lightweight fabric.  So I decreased the gravity.. and then it did not drape well.   I need to invest some time with some expreiements and read the thread you provided.  

    I was hoping someone who understood fabric "hands " had already modeled different fabric types. Maybe we should start a thread for dForce Fabrics and Settings.and as people get good simulations for a specific fabric they can post the settings.  

  • 3Diva3Diva Posts: 11,996
    dlm4001 said:

    Thanks for that thread pointer Divamakeup.  I browsed it and it looks very educational.  I will begin reading it more completely tonight.

    I understand the cloth properties in Marvelopus Designer well enought to get the the desired effects.  For some reason, everything I simulate in dForce takes on the properties of a "slinky fabric" or a "springy fabric".  When I get the fabric more stiff, it takes on the property of a heavier fabric like denim. I am trying to simulate stiffer lightweight fabrics like ripstop, tafetta. .  I almost had it but then it would blow up around 95%.  I backed off some settings and then it looked like... wet lightweight fabric.  So I decreased the gravity.. and then it did not drape well.   I need to invest some time with some expreiements and read the thread you provided.  

    I was hoping someone who understood fabric "hands " had already modeled different fabric types. Maybe we should start a thread for dForce Fabrics and Settings.and as people get good simulations for a specific fabric they can post the settings.  

    A thread for different fabric settings sounds great. :) 

  • algovincianalgovincian Posts: 2,670
    edited July 2018

    Here's a quick illustration of what I was trying to explain before - from left to right, the plane has 32, 64, and 128 divisions (default surface simulation params for all of them):

    As you can see, the lower poly mesh is stiffer. You can control stiffness by varying the geometry density, but there can't be any standard surface parameters for certain types of cloth without a known, standard geometry density, if you catch my drift . . .

    Hope this explains things a bit better.

    - Greg

    3-spheres.png
    1280 x 720 - 520K
    Post edited by algovincian on
  • dlm4001dlm4001 Posts: 205
    edited July 2018

    That does explain things very well.  If I got a nylon fabric working well on a very dense poly model, and then someone tried the same settings on a less dense model, the result would be different. Thanks for that information! 

    The fabric (cloth sim) is slinky on my current model because the poly count in my mesh is very high. I think I will retopologize it in Zbrush just to see the difference.

    Thanks

    Post edited by dlm4001 on
  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,366

    It would be nice if DAZ released OFFICIAL cloth stiffness settings like Nylon, Denim, Leather, Silk, Cotton, Wool and so on.  We have official default shaders for 3Delight and iRAY and since these settings are built into the Surface tab it would be nice to have cloth defaults.  They give us toys and then leave us to figure it out...as always!  LOL 

  • algovincianalgovincian Posts: 2,670
    edited July 2018
    dlm4001 said:

    That does explian things very well.  If I got a nylon fabric working well on a very dense poly model, and then someone tried the same settings on a less dense model, the result would be different. Thanks for that information! 

    The fabric (cloth sim) is slinky on my current model because the poly count in my mesh is very high. I think I will retopologize it in Zbrush just to see the difference.

    Thanks

    Bingo! You’ve got it. Please post your results if you can so we can all see/follow your progress (and hopefully learn something).

    - Greg 

    Post edited by algovincian on
  • RGcincyRGcincy Posts: 2,862

    It turns out that many of the dForce surface parameters are not independent variables. Not only are they affected by resolution, but also some interact with each other. Besides resolution, the way the mesh comes together at an end (for example an open pipe versus a closed cylinder) will require different settings. I'm still trying to puzzle my way through it as you can tell by my dForce thread.

  • SorelSorel Posts: 1,412
    Yeah trying to get string necklaces to be dynamic is proving a struggle for me.
  • maikdeckermaikdecker Posts: 3,037
    RAMWolff said:

    It would be nice if DAZ released OFFICIAL cloth stiffness settings like Nylon, Denim, Leather, Silk, Cotton, Wool and so on.  We have official default shaders for 3Delight and iRAY and since these settings are built into the Surface tab it would be nice to have cloth defaults.  They give us toys and then leave us to figure it out...as always!  LOL 

    I bet they are working on that already... probably discussing the price for the bundle devil

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,366

    Hey, I'd pay $20.00 ++ for that esp if it's a Merchant Resource!  

  • ChoholeChohole Posts: 33,604
    edited July 2018


    https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/203081/dforce-start-here#mesh_resolution

    Post edited by rbtwhiz on
  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,366

    Hmmm, getting an error code 403 from your link Cho!  

  • AlmightyQUESTAlmightyQUEST Posts: 2,006
    EcVh0 did release the dforce master set which is designed to have a number of fabric type presets. Though as was pointed out in this thread, the difference in mesh density makes it impossible to really have a single "correct" setting for any material type.
  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,366

    Thanks for fixing the link Rob.  So I know the resolution of the digital cloth is going to cause variations in how it folds, flows and drapes but isnt' there some way to set up cloth settings PER resolution.  So say one wants a silk then there would be settings for the various resolutions.  I know every modeler, including me, TRIES to keep the resolutions as close to what the main figure's resolution is so perhaps you can base it on that.  Then when there is Sub-D applied then another perhaps for that 4-upped resolution.  

  • algovincianalgovincian Posts: 2,670

    Like others surely have, I've tried to compensate for variations in mesh density by adjusting the surface dForce settings. No success getting a dense mesh (geometry) to be stiff so far using surface settings alone. As I'm certain others have noticed, adding too much stiffness in the surface params leads to blow-ups real fast.

    Check out the first post in this thread for a video of some cloth utilizing a different approach:

    https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/264616/stiffler-s-mom-stiff-cloth-using-dforce

    Still in early experimantal stages, but it's interesting - especially how much energy seems to be stored (loop it and watch the sphere on the right in particular).

    - Greg

  • nicsttnicstt Posts: 11,715
    edited July 2018

    Mesh density affects cloth and leather too. Or the real-world equivalent of it.

    Tighter weave of the thread, the thread type; what treatment the thread or cloth has, all has an affect. With leather, the thickness and the tanning process play their part.

    Edit:

    Oh, and while I think about it; the age, how clean, the stitching or knot types. And then there is how dry or wet, and if the the liquid is water (clean or dirty, or in some way contaminated).

    Post edited by nicstt on
  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,366

    Yea, totally.  I get it.  Still would be nice to have some semi accurate settings that give folks a starting point for various types of cloth.  I mean sometimes when one is playing with the settings it's just too much of a guessing game!  

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