January 2016 New User 3D Art contest “Composition” (WIP Thread)

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Comments

  • IceDragonArtIceDragonArt Posts: 12,334

    Composition is really my weak point with my work so some suggestions would be greatly appreciated :)

    Scooch her more to the left.  Because she is facing right she needs to be more to the left.  Love her hair.  Is this Iray or 3Delight?

     

  • IceDragonArtIceDragonArt Posts: 12,334
    dracorn said:

    Thanks for the comments, Fyreheart.  

    Actually, I want the tiger to be less obvious.  The piece will be titled "Distracted Pray," inviting the viewer to look for the pray and discover that the viewer IS the pray.  This is why the tiger is to one side and is not the main subject.

    I went ahead and shrank the blue butterfly - one of the reasons why it's huge is that the species has something like a 6-inch wingspan.  (Yes, I'm putting South American butterflies in the same picture as a tiger, but we won't go there).

    As to the business of the picture, I'm thinking I can solve that problem along with the flat appearance by reducing the ambient lighting.  That will put the background foliage further into the background and make the dappled lighting more prominent.  So I played around with the ambient lighting and the tiger's spotlight.  I also moved the foliage out of the tiger's face.  The end result is that the background foliage is a little darker so as to make the foreground plants lighter.  I also played with adding highlights in the upper right and around the tiger.  The tiger is darker, but I want the viewer to look for him.

    I'm still thinking about what I want to do with the foreground lighting.  If I soften the shadows, then I will loose some interest with the dappled lighting.  I wanted a shaft of light effect, but I need to research the documentation for Advanced Spotlight for 3Delight.

    I'm really liking this idea and looking forward to see how it goes

  • IceDragonArtIceDragonArt Posts: 12,334
    Teofa said:

    I was spinning around in perspective to fix some little issues and hit this view.  I like it. Let the other sit for another time.

    "Amin fina Yrch"   4.6 3Delight minor post.   Posted to my gallery, to fade into obscurity. 

     

    I like that it looks like they are coming to the edge of a cliff or mountain and something might be rising up over the edge at any moment.

  • TeofaTeofa Posts: 821

    thank you, Sonja.  Anticipation is the theme.

  • IceDragonArtIceDragonArt Posts: 12,334
    Teofa said:

    thank you, Sonja.  Anticipation is the theme.

    Its working lol.

  • Composition is really my weak point with my work so some suggestions would be greatly appreciated :)

    Scooch her more to the left.  Because she is facing right she needs to be more to the left.  Love her hair.  Is this Iray or 3Delight

    She is done in IRAY I don't do 3delight stuff any more the results just don't pop enough for me. I've moved her around a bit and added a backdrop so when that has rendered I will post it :)

  • TeofaTeofa Posts: 821
    edited January 2016

    deleted as promised.

    Post edited by Teofa on
  • TeofaTeofa Posts: 821
    edited January 2016

    Composition is really my weak point with my work so some suggestions would be greatly appreciated :)

    You will do fine.  It will be easier to grasp with a single figure, but is very important as that single figure is all the viewer has to look at.  You got the best advice already.

    Post edited by Teofa on
  • TeofaTeofa Posts: 821
    edited January 2016
    dracorn said:

    Thanks for the comments, Fyreheart.  

    Actually, I want the tiger to be less obvious.  The piece will be titled "Distracted Pray," inviting the viewer to look for the pray and discover that the viewer IS the pray.  This is why the tiger is to one side and is not the main subject.

    I went ahead and shrank the blue butterfly - one of the reasons why it's huge is that the species has something like a 6-inch wingspan.  (Yes, I'm putting South American butterflies in the same picture as a tiger, but we won't go there).

    As to the business of the picture, I'm thinking I can solve that problem along with the flat appearance by reducing the ambient lighting.  That will put the background foliage further into the background and make the dappled lighting more prominent.  So I played around with the ambient lighting and the tiger's spotlight.  I also moved the foliage out of the tiger's face.  The end result is that the background foliage is a little darker so as to make the foreground plants lighter.  I also played with adding highlights in the upper right and around the tiger.  The tiger is darker, but I want the viewer to look for him.

    I'm still thinking about what I want to do with the foreground lighting.  If I soften the shadows, then I will loose some interest with the dappled lighting.  I wanted a shaft of light effect, but I need to research the documentation for Advanced Spotlight for 3Delight.

    Tyger, Tyger, burning bright.

    I think you may be able to make him just a bit sneakier.  I never much cared for Camoflage art, but Bev Doolittle's early work was very well done.  I remember seeing "Two Indian Horses" the first time and being so baffled by the title I had to really look at the piece hard. 

    Enclosed a detail of that work.

    two_indian_horses_cut.jpg
    288 x 231 - 34K
    Post edited by Teofa on
  • Revised attempt any constructive criticism is welcomed!

    snakeysnakey2.jpg
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  • AtiAti Posts: 6,040

    Revised attempt any constructive criticism is welcomed!

    Her elbow is painfully cut into. Ouch. :) Move her a very little to the right, so we can see her entire elbow.

    Here's a quick image I found on where to crop and where not to crop: http://petapixel.com/2011/09/29/crop-guidelines-for-portrait-photography/

  • TeofaTeofa Posts: 821
    edited January 2016

    Revised attempt any constructive criticism is welcome

    Revised attempt any constructive criticism is welcomed!

    You can also use camera axis tilt.  I did a quick example with a lot of axis tilt as illustration. Not perfect, just to illustrate.  Axis tilt can be used to frame a pose and avoiding panning out or widening the image in some cases.  Mileage, of course, varies.

    On this I used a similar pose, starting with the elbow cut, and used tilt to remove that cut without changing the model or panning.

    axis tilt.jpg
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    Post edited by Teofa on
  • dracorn said:

    Thanks for the comments, Fyreheart.  

    Actually, I want the tiger to be less obvious.  The piece will be titled "Distracted Pray," inviting the viewer to look for the pray and discover that the viewer IS the pray.  This is why the tiger is to one side and is not the main subject.

    I went ahead and shrank the blue butterfly - one of the reasons why it's huge is that the species has something like a 6-inch wingspan.  (Yes, I'm putting South American butterflies in the same picture as a tiger, but we won't go there).

    As to the business of the picture, I'm thinking I can solve that problem along with the flat appearance by reducing the ambient lighting.  That will put the background foliage further into the background and make the dappled lighting more prominent.  So I played around with the ambient lighting and the tiger's spotlight.  I also moved the foliage out of the tiger's face.  The end result is that the background foliage is a little darker so as to make the foreground plants lighter.  I also played with adding highlights in the upper right and around the tiger.  The tiger is darker, but I want the viewer to look for him.

    I'm still thinking about what I want to do with the foreground lighting.  If I soften the shadows, then I will loose some interest with the dappled lighting.  I wanted a shaft of light effect, but I need to research the documentation for Advanced Spotlight for 3Delight.

    I like this image much better! I understood that you wanted to make the viewer slowly realize s/he is the prey, but I found myself looking for the tiger and not finding it until I realized the abstract shape to the right WAS the tiger with fluff in his face.

    In the latest version, the blue butterfly still grabs my attention, but no longer jumps out of the frame and pokes me in the eye, and as my eye travels across the frame I can recognize the tiger immediately. I'm looking forward to what you do with the lighting.

  • evilded777evilded777 Posts: 2,230
    edited January 2016
    dracorn said:

    Thanks for the comments, Fyreheart.  

    Actually, I want the tiger to be less obvious.  The piece will be titled "Distracted Pray," inviting the viewer to look for the pray and discover that the viewer IS the pray.  This is why the tiger is to one side and is not the main subject.

    I went ahead and shrank the blue butterfly - one of the reasons why it's huge is that the species has something like a 6-inch wingspan.  (Yes, I'm putting South American butterflies in the same picture as a tiger, but we won't go there).

    As to the business of the picture, I'm thinking I can solve that problem along with the flat appearance by reducing the ambient lighting.  That will put the background foliage further into the background and make the dappled lighting more prominent.  So I played around with the ambient lighting and the tiger's spotlight.  I also moved the foliage out of the tiger's face.  The end result is that the background foliage is a little darker so as to make the foreground plants lighter.  I also played with adding highlights in the upper right and around the tiger.  The tiger is darker, but I want the viewer to look for him.

    I'm still thinking about what I want to do with the foreground lighting.  If I soften the shadows, then I will loose some interest with the dappled lighting.  I wanted a shaft of light effect, but I need to research the documentation for Advanced Spotlight for 3Delight.

    I like this version a lot better.  You have already solved a lot of the "flatness".  There's much more depth to it, though it could maybe use a little more.

    About tigers: the orange coat helps them to blend in during the "golden hours" of late afternoon and evening...and they do actually "lie in wait". If you could change the character of the light.. more towards sunset, and bring the tiger closer to the ground...but that could just be me trying to insert what I learned about tigers.

    You mentioned "ambient light".  What are you using for ambient light? Also, what is providing the sun light?

    Wish I could help with the god rays, but that's just not an area I have ever had much luck.

     

    Post edited by evilded777 on
  • IceDragonArtIceDragonArt Posts: 12,334
    Teofa said:

    Revised attempt any constructive criticism is welcome

    Revised attempt any constructive criticism is welcomed!

    You can also use camera axis tilt.  I did a quick example with a lot of axis tilt as illustration. Not perfect, just to illustrate.  Axis tilt can be used to frame a pose and avoiding panning out or widening the image in some cases.  Mileage, of course, varies.

    On this I used a similar pose, starting with the elbow cut, and used tilt to remove that cut without changing the model or panning.

    Hmm I am going to try this out on a different project I am working on.  Totally unhappy with all of my attempts with the normal view so I am going to give this a go thank you! (nothing to do with the contest, nonetheless very helpful lol)

  • TeofaTeofa Posts: 821
    edited January 2016
    Teofa said:

    Revised attempt any constructive criticism is welcome

    Revised attempt any constructive criticism is welcomed!

    You can also use camera axis tilt.  I did a quick example with a lot of axis tilt as illustration. Not perfect, just to illustrate.  Axis tilt can be used to frame a pose and avoiding panning out or widening the image in some cases.  Mileage, of course, varies.

    On this I used a similar pose, starting with the elbow cut, and used tilt to remove that cut without changing the model or panning.

    Hmm I am going to try this out on a different project I am working on.  Totally unhappy with all of my attempts with the normal view so I am going to give this a go thank you! (nothing to do with the contest, nonetheless very helpful lol)

    I think it would be considered a composition aid.  I see tilted axis a lot in PA renders.   Oh.. for your other project.  Ok, I'm dense when it's -10 outside.

    Post edited by Teofa on
  • IceDragonArtIceDragonArt Posts: 12,334
    Teofa said:
    Teofa said:

    Revised attempt any constructive criticism is welcome

    Revised attempt any constructive criticism is welcomed!

    You can also use camera axis tilt.  I did a quick example with a lot of axis tilt as illustration. Not perfect, just to illustrate.  Axis tilt can be used to frame a pose and avoiding panning out or widening the image in some cases.  Mileage, of course, varies.

    On this I used a similar pose, starting with the elbow cut, and used tilt to remove that cut without changing the model or panning.

    Hmm I am going to try this out on a different project I am working on.  Totally unhappy with all of my attempts with the normal view so I am going to give this a go thank you! (nothing to do with the contest, nonetheless very helpful lol)

    I think it would be considered a composition aid.  I see tilted axis a lot in PA renders. 

    Oh I didn't mean it wasn't helpful for the contest theme just not for my personal two renders in the contest.  I am going to be using it with another project though. 

  • Changed up a few things and used some shaders but the image seems a bit grainy -_- back to the renderer

    snakey 2.jpg
    1373 x 1942 - 450K
  • dracorndracorn Posts: 2,180

    I like this version a lot better.  You have already solved a lot of the "flatness".  There's much more depth to it, though it could maybe use a little more.

    About tigers: the orange coat helps them to blend in during the "golden hours" of late afternoon and evening...and they do actually "lie in wait". If you could change the character of the light.. more towards sunset, and bring the tiger closer to the ground...but that could just be me trying to insert what I learned about tigers.

    You mentioned "ambient light".  What are you using for ambient light? Also, what is providing the sun light?

    Wish I could help with the god rays, but that's just not an area I have ever had much luck.

    I'm using 3Delight and Advanced Distant Light, Advanced Ambient Light and Advanced Spotlight.  Time of day, about 2 - 3:00 in the afternoon.  While I like the idea of sunset lighting, I would have to change the angle of the light as well as my background image to support it.  I am going to play with the light color, making it more golden in the foreground and adding a little blue to make the background recede a little more.

  • dracorndracorn Posts: 2,180
    Teofa said:

     

    Tyger, Tyger, burning bright.

    I think you may be able to make him just a bit sneakier.  I never much cared for Camoflage art, but Bev Doolittle's early work was very well done.  I remember seeing "Two Indian Horses" the first time and being so baffled by the title I had to really look at the piece hard. 

    Enclosed a detail of that work.

    Bev Doolittle ROCKS!  She's one of my favorite artists!  I usually don't have a problem seeing the hidden images in her work.  By the way, I was so inspired by Bev that I did a pen and ink of an old oak tree years ago and hid animals all through it.

    I'll keep working on the sneaky tiger. 

  • IceDragonArtIceDragonArt Posts: 12,334

    Changed up a few things and used some shaders but the image seems a bit grainy -_- back to the renderer

    This is much better. Cutting her off where you have in the latest looks a lot better and its beginning to feel more like a story to be told

  • dracorndracorn Posts: 2,180
    edited January 2016

    Here is another version.  I was playing around with the lighting.  I added some grass in the background and lights to blur the "edge of the world" into a transition with the background photo.

    Distracted Pray 1-11-16.jpg
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    Post edited by dracorn on
  • evilded777evilded777 Posts: 2,230
    dracorn said:

    I like this version a lot better.  You have already solved a lot of the "flatness".  There's much more depth to it, though it could maybe use a little more.

    About tigers: the orange coat helps them to blend in during the "golden hours" of late afternoon and evening...and they do actually "lie in wait". If you could change the character of the light.. more towards sunset, and bring the tiger closer to the ground...but that could just be me trying to insert what I learned about tigers.

    You mentioned "ambient light".  What are you using for ambient light? Also, what is providing the sun light?

    Wish I could help with the god rays, but that's just not an area I have ever had much luck.

    I'm using 3Delight and Advanced Distant Light, Advanced Ambient Light and Advanced Spotlight.  Time of day, about 2 - 3:00 in the afternoon.  While I like the idea of sunset lighting, I would have to change the angle of the light as well as my background image to support it.  I am going to play with the light color, making it more golden in the foreground and adding a little blue to make the background recede a little more.

    Yeah, changing the angle of the light could pose more problems that its worth.

    I'm not a huge fan of Advanced Ambient Light, but that's neither here nor there. I would not use its specular, though.

    I like the balance of the new version... but its starting to look flat again. Where, exactly, is the distant light pointing? Is it coming from the top right of the image angled towards the left? The shadows in the foreground are confusing me.

  • LinwellyLinwelly Posts: 4,086

    Okay, I am MUCH happier with the fire and the lighting.  Added a second person, re arranged everything.  suggestions welcome.  I do know his feet need to touch the floor and his pose is a bit stiff yet.  Not having his butt sink into the cushions is driving me nuts lol. I can do some of that in post work.  Am considering purchasing the breast and glute control soon as that kind of detail bugs me more than it probably should

     

    Wow you people have been busy, I will try and catch up, but I'm not sure, I might miss some render.

    This has gotten far, very nice. One thing the I might add is the he is floating a bit on that sofa, shoes not touching the ground. Give him some wheight by pushing him into the sofa. If you want to make it really good, try a dformer on the sofa surface on the spot where he is sitting. His other movements look a little stiff at the moment as well.

  • LinwellyLinwelly Posts: 4,086

    Reposed, some material tweaks

    I like this, it has a great story going on, compositionwise there is nothing to add. To nitpik there seems nothing to support the human in the tube in his position (porbably because its original is standing upright?) so maybe you can find something to support him, pose him deeper into the back of the tube (but that moves him to far away from being seen) or flatten the tube.

  • LinwellyLinwelly Posts: 4,086

    Changed up a few things and used some shaders but the image seems a bit grainy -_- back to the renderer

    Security16, great improvement, you had good advice there. And I simply love all those little snakeheads. What I miss is what she is interacting with, this doesn't mean you need somebody els or soemthing else in the render but her pose is very casual there, the hand on the hip is not fully placed there is it moving away or toward the hip? is she talking to someone? Then her hands and her eyes are not talking to the same person. If it is possible to move the snakeheads you can get aid from posing most of them as if looking into the same direction. Is she watching something, is she surprised, interested.. you name it. Where you go is yours to decide, these are just some ideas

  • LinwellyLinwelly Posts: 4,086
    dracorn said:

    Here is another version.  I was playing around with the lighting.  I added some grass in the background and lights to blur the "edge of the world" into a transition with the background photo.

    This is really impressive, putting all that green stuff there. I like the tiger being in that off position. I'm not sure about the light settings in this one, it feels a bit like the light comes from different directions, but I can not put a finger on it. One thing that comes to my mind, you might want to check is if the light settings in the background foto are similar enough to your scene lights, probably helps if you give the backdrop a tinti to the light yellow /greenish. Take this with a grain of salt, I'm not even sure what parts belong to the backdrop

  • evilded777evilded777 Posts: 2,230
    Linwelly said:

    Reposed, some material tweaks

    I like this, it has a great story going on, compositionwise there is nothing to add. To nitpik there seems nothing to support the human in the tube in his position (porbably because its original is standing upright?) so maybe you can find something to support him, pose him deeper into the back of the tube (but that moves him to far away from being seen) or flatten the tube.

    It is standing upright, its the camera that is tilted.

  • LinwellyLinwelly Posts: 4,086
    Linwelly said:

    Reposed, some material tweaks

    I like this, it has a great story going on, compositionwise there is nothing to add. To nitpik there seems nothing to support the human in the tube in his position (porbably because its original is standing upright?) so maybe you can find something to support him, pose him deeper into the back of the tube (but that moves him to far away from being seen) or flatten the tube.

    It is standing upright, its the camera that is tilted.

    Oh, ok that makes sense

  • IceDragonArtIceDragonArt Posts: 12,334
    edited January 2016

    Considering switching out the indoor scene with the girl and the guy for this one.  I spend more time on my laptop than I do on my pc and I'm not sure I will get the first one done in time (I know its only the 12th but trust me, I might not lol).  I know I need to work on the lighting a bit to get her face to show more.  and this is only rendered to 24%.  And i am going to have to photoshop the top of the hair. There was no way to get the hair to fit under the chainmaille so I just covered it up and left the forhead more like a head piece than an actual cowl.  May just photoshop the whole chainmaille hood since there is no option to just hide the hood.  And to be honest, this is much more the type of art that I like to do lol.  I will finish the other one with the suggestions given just because I need to learn how to do it and because I hate leaving things unfinished.  Just not sure I can do it on the pc in time.

    Joan.png
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    Post edited by IceDragonArt on
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