Show Us Your Iray Renders. Part II
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...agh, reminder bots must be going on Spring Break of something, Missed darn near an entire page.
Mec4D, really loving what you are doing with the armour.
Alex L: that looks almost like a movie still.
Dustrider: Nice scene. The bloom effect really does work well. Have to play with it sometime.
Getting late, been working up characters for the train platform. Need a good raincoat for an older woman.
So, I see that here is another thread on renders, but specifically for IRay rendered images, so I will post some of my images, here, using IRAY. I am using the Environmental setting of Dome and Scene for the first three. The next set I am using the Dome and Sky Environmental setting. In my bedroom scenes, I am trying to show that Natailia is considering that maybe bending over in front of her bedroom window is not such a great idea when awakening and slumbering around, or in the evening when suddenly a car pulls up into the driveway. On the stone steps, she is outside and with the sky and dome setting, i have created some shadowing. Changing to add some haze, the shadowing disappears but a nice warm tone is brought out. Unfortunately, the order of the images did not upload like I wanted, but I think you can figure out which is which.
So, here is Natailia up close using the Environment setting of Sky and Dome with some haze and the environment setting Dome and Scene in IRAY rendering.
WOW, that is truly photorealistic. However for some reason I am not getting the same lighting results when using the Pixar campus HDRI or any other HDRI for that matter. I place the HDRI as the Envioronment map, should I also be using that same map in other places like diffuse or specular channels.
Thanks, as any help or advice would be appreciated.
:-)
WOW, that is truly photorealistic. However for some reason I am not getting the same lighting results when using the Pixar campus HDRI or any other HDRI for that matter. I place the HDRI as the Envioronment map, should I also be using that same map in other places like diffuse or specular channels.
Thanks, as any help or advice would be appreciated.
:-)
Are you using one of the .exr files in the Environment map (not the .jpg)? That is the only place I put it. You may want to try rotating the dome to get the lighting coming from the direction you want it.
Are you using one of the .exr files in the Environment map (not the .jpg)? That is the only place I put it. You may want to try rotating the dome to get the lighting coming from the direction you want it.
Thanks Barbult for your reply. I am using the .exr file in the Environment map, and some Iray skin texture settings as recommended for my characters, but it still does not look as photorealistic as Mec4D or Alex L renders.This is what made me wonder if the HDRI files were being used anywhere else in the character texture settings. Maybe Mec4D and Alex L are using the same skin texture settings as both their renders look identically photorealistic.
Cheers. :-)
Yeah I shared the skin settings with Alex as we working on the best effects and each of us adjust it individual to the skin textures , plus you need to use tone mapping for desire effect.
I set the Environment map value to 2.20 , rotate the dome so the right light hit the models, also scaled the finite sphere to 9
I use my old M4 textures from the Hunk Megapack and Alex used the Huntsman head textures
I am still not finished with my setup adjusting things and making new kind of specular than usual
Bellow just last test with very fine specular that is broken down by itself to produce the right effect and not by bump maps or normal maps , it is the top micro layer , the skin textures does not have it
Are you using one of the .exr files in the Environment map (not the .jpg)? That is the only place I put it. You may want to try rotating the dome to get the lighting coming from the direction you want it.
Thanks Barbult for your reply. I am using the .exr file in the Environment map, and some Iray skin texture settings as recommended for my characters, but it still does not look as photorealistic as Mec4D or Alex L renders.This is what made me wonder if the HDRI files were being used anywhere else in the character texture settings. Maybe Mec4D and Alex L are using the same skin texture settings as both their renders look identically photorealistic.
Cheers. :-)
Is there any chance you could share those settings? I understand if you say no because you are creating a shader to sell in the store or something. :)
I prefer not to share it in the public as I am still working on that , beside you will not have the all maps it needed as the standard maps used to date are different from what is used with this shader preset , my little invention lol
all settings are weighted with maps so if you copy it to another model surface with other textures it will not works anyway as the maps values correspond with each other in balance .
my early settings was just simple but i wanted more than that and got a new idea between
bellow are the model reflections without the diffuse, each pixel reflect the environment colors blending it better with it like the mirror dust, but correspond with the details of the normal and diffuse
the ears are using still the old specular method we usual setup , reflecting the colors in big areas overcast the skin with colors we don't want
the new specular are extracted from the diffuse color maps with own under tone so different for the skin area or eyebrows.
It is little complicated to explain in words , but just trying to find new ways to improve stuff for Iray.
Is there any chance you could share those settings? I understand if you say no because you are creating a shader to sell in the store or something. :)
Can you share HOW you create your specular maps Cath? Never seen one like that before. Your renders are just superb.
Many thanks Cath for your reply and explanation, and I respect that your settings are not for publicly sharing and still a work in progress. They are truly amazing, and I hope we will see some of your stunning old M4 textures like Eli and the Hunk Megapack re-released for Iray. They were great detailed texture sets and I would love to see them again but made available for Genesis 2 males.
Wishing you all the very best, and looking forward to any new characters you may be planning.
Musicplayer. :-)
Is there any chance you could share those settings? I understand if you say no because you are creating a shader to sell in the store or something. :)
That's like peeking under the tree before Christmas ;-) heheh. Just teasing. Cath & I have been working on photorealism projects like this for years together, as well as individually. You already know what a master she is across the board! Each of us has over 30 years of visual arts study & work experience apiece, all revolving around the understanding of how the physical world behaves & appears in the presence of light. No matter the display medium, sculpting, sketching, painting, photochemical (film) or photoelectric (video), they all represent capturing or emulating what happens when objects reflect, absorb, transmit, and bend light. The "secret" is actually simple..
(A) Observe what is actually happening when light interacts with the object you wish to reproduce in a medium;
(B) understand the tools being used to "render" that reproduction, and working with it's advantages / limitations; then
(C) apply your understanding to copy what you see before your eyes, and later in your head.
We've in a golden age now where we finally have the computing & technical power to get closer to C with less of B for the end user, the mythical "Make Art" button hehehe, but the work still has to be put in somewhere "behind the curtain" to make visual magic.
Here's a sample skin study I worked on in Iray with M4 geometry & skin textures (from Mec4D's "vintage" Eli Megapack), before Cath & I started our latest round of cooking in the laboratory here in OZ ;-)
Thanks Richard , until I am done I keep it to myself lol sorry buddy it is my new baby ;)
but what I did is extracting the luminosity from the color diffuse maps so I got the top reflective layer
usually we need bump maps or normal maps to break it down.. but this way it is already done without , so better detailed effect with lover resolution maps still generating the specular equal on the surface .
I could not generate enough details in normal maps to do this job , so that is so far best solution for the micro details, the level can be easy increase with the Glossy layered weight slider making it more dry or sweaty
bellow example with different Glossy layered weight , dry and oily
zoom in for better details
That's like peeking under the tree before Christmas ;-) heheh. Just teasing. Cath & I have been working on photorealism projects like this for years together, as well as individually. You already know what a master she is across the board! Each of us has over 30 years of visual arts study & work experience apiece, all revolving around the understanding of how the physical world behaves & appears in the presence of light. No matter the display medium, sculpting, sketching, painting, photochemical (film) or photoelectric (video), they all represent capturing or emulating what happens when objects reflect, absorb, transmit, and bend light. The "secret" is actually simple..
(A) Observe what is actually happening when light interacts with the object you wish to reproduce in a medium;
(B) understand the tools being used to "render" that reproduction, and working with it's advantages / limitations; then
(C) apply your understanding to copy what you see before your eyes, and later in your head.
We've in a golden age now where we finally have the computing & technical power to get closer to C with less of B for the end user, the mythical "Make Art" button hehehe, but the work still has to be put in somewhere "behind the curtain" to make visual magic.
Here's a sample skin study I worked on in Iray with M4 geometry & skin textures (from Mec4D's "vintage" Eli Megapack), before Cath & I started our latest round of cooking in the laboratory here in OZ ;-)
Hey Alex L,
The 'magic' you and Cath are doing is amazing, and thanks for the render of Eli. I am REALLY hoping he is going to appear under the christmas tree again for GM2 with Iray shaders..hint, hint :)
I think for me, your work is showing exactly what I suspected a few days ago, that there will be no "magic" shader buttons for skin textures in Iray. Each skin textures settings will need to be 'tailor made' for that particular artists texture set.
So far, here in the forums, we have been discussing adjusting every setting imaginable to achieve photorealism, but as your work shows, this is going to need a different approach, because the texture maps etc will all need to be made differently from how they were for 3Delight.
I get the feeling we have been chasing a rainbow regarding skin realism. So I am going to stop, and wait to see what you and Cath make available, because I do not have the expertise to make the maps etc to achieve the level of photorealism you both seem to have "discovered".
Great work, and I look forward to seeing more of your renders as your techniques progress.
Kind regards to you and Cath. :-)
I think some of what we've all hashed out is still useful -- there's still some stuff that adds to realism that's possible without exotic stuff. Like, we can get 80% of the way there with appropriate use of stuff like translucency and so on.
The rest requires a LOT more specialized work, but, hey, it's still an improvement.
I mean, I'm glancing at stuff I've done, and the early attempts vs. the polished later stuff is night and day.
Combined the better face I worked on with the LAMH hair. Showing the Xylia hair for comparison.
While the LAMH I did is... kind of a terrible haircut (sort of a 70s 'bad glam shot' thing), what I find gratifying is that it could be the same woman after getting her Xylia hair cut and mussed.
That's like peeking under the tree before Christmas ;-) heheh. Just teasing. Cath & I have been working on photorealism projects like this for years together, as well as individually. You already know what a master she is across the board! Each of us has over 30 years of visual arts study & work experience apiece, all revolving around the understanding of how the physical world behaves & appears in the presence of light. No matter the display medium, sculpting, sketching, painting, photochemical (film) or photoelectric (video), they all represent capturing or emulating what happens when objects reflect, absorb, transmit, and bend light. The "secret" is actually simple..
(A) Observe what is actually happening when light interacts with the object you wish to reproduce in a medium;
(B) understand the tools being used to "render" that reproduction, and working with it's advantages / limitations; then
(C) apply your understanding to copy what you see before your eyes, and later in your head.
We've in a golden age now where we finally have the computing & technical power to get closer to C with less of B for the end user, the mythical "Make Art" button hehehe, but the work still has to be put in somewhere "behind the curtain" to make visual magic.
Here's a sample skin study I worked on in Iray with M4 geometry & skin textures (from Mec4D's "vintage" Eli Megapack), before Cath & I started our latest round of cooking in the laboratory here in OZ ;-)
Hey Alex L,
The 'magic' you and Cath are doing is amazing, and thanks for the render of Eli. I am REALLY hoping he is going to appear under the christmas tree again for GM2 with Iray shaders..hint, hint :)
I think for me, your work is showing exactly what I suspected a few days ago, that there will be no "magic" shader buttons for skin textures in Iray. Each skin textures settings will need to be 'tailor made' for that particular artists texture set.
So far, here in the forums, we have been discussing adjusting every setting imaginable to achieve photorealism, but as your work shows, this is going to need a different approach, because the texture maps etc will all need to be made differently from how they were for 3Delight.
I get the feeling we have been chasing a rainbow regarding skin realism. So I am going to stop, and wait to see what you and Cath make available, because I do not have the expertise to make the maps etc to achieve the level of photorealism you both seem to have "discovered".
Great work, and I look forward to seeing more of your renders as your techniques progress.
Kind regards to you and Cath. :-)
...same applies to hair content as it is also is optimised for 3DL. There are hair shaders available for Iray but not for use with Daz.
Strand based hair (Garibaldi & LAMH) while very realistic looking, will not work in Iray (or any other unbiased render engine) without first converting to .obj format as it is 3DLdependent. This of course presents two new issues, it cannot be styled or posed after conversion, and would require a fairly robust system to handle the polygon load the case of long or thick hair. The other option, fibremesh hair, is also very "weighty" and so far has not impressed me as most examples I have seen the individual strands appear too coarse.
My workflow, with LAMH, is keep the hair stored primarily as a preset, and not to save files with it or the obj. I then store the shader info either in a hair cap or some other object.
Then, when I need to render, I save as a 'production' file, I load the preset, do any last minute styling (possibly save another preset instance), convert to Obj, add the shader, render, and when I'm done just close without saving.
I find trying to save scenes with LAMH in them tends to make the save files prone to going bad. Which is very annoying. But since I can't have that much LAMH going on in a scene ANYway, it's not so hard to just keep reloading presets as needed.
I save a production file to mitigate the danger of saving LAMH into my main project file and potentially having it go bad.
This is an awful lot of hoops, and if I can avoid using LAMH, I do... but the effect is REALLY COOL when it comes together.
...yeah, however because of the polygon weight for most of us it means sticking to a short hairstyle.
Not good when your character's have hair like this...
Finally got to do a portrait and focuse on the skin and hair, using most of the tips in these threads. Lighting only with HDRI Pixar (seems to become everybodies favorite). Background applied in photoshop.
... and sorry .... just can't get enough of the way Iray handles metal and such. HDRI lighting only.
That is some of the nicest LAMH hair that I've seen. It looks totally plausible to me.
I really like what you did with the hair shader there.
That is some of the nicest LAMH hair that I've seen. It looks totally plausible to me. I think they both look good. As for the Vintage, well, Xylia reminds me of a long past era of sorts (Queen Victoria ish?), or perhaps some show I had seen on PBS years ago (in a good way).
Thanks, barbult! I think the Iray renderer helps bring out a lot of detailed coolness in the hair.
...now that looks pretty good. End of Summer Hair?
Is the torus a prop that you already had? Did you shade it with the Immesive Iray shader?
I had noticed the final render lighting versus the viewport issue but I really don't know what I don't know so....
Good stuff everyone! Decided to put aside the HDRI and play with physical lights this time. This is just two square emitters and a point light on the back drop (cyclorama).
Cheers!
Looks awesome. I can't wait for this to go "General release" and get an upgrade to my video card... then I'll spend inordinate amounts of time cussing and screaming and then will finally, hopefully, have some settings I like for Bruno. Always wondered what he would look like in a superb rendering solution like this one. All the others leave me scratching my head but keeping up on these many threads for iRay I hopefully won't go into this completely dumbfounded! lol
Oh hey, we're doing scantily clad sexy poses? Here you go!
(As an aside, after some frustration at limited number of black hairstyles in store, I was pleased to find that it's VERY easy to do kinky or afro style hair with LAMH)