ZDG random Daz Studio discoveries and questions.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    So, it looks like some of the mats can be reused, even if there combined smaller units.

    PreTest of the 20cm thick 2M wide 7M long mat, for one end of the Balance beam floor, and double that length (AKA two of them end to end) for the Uneven Bars.

    Others, I'm not to sure about yet, like the 20cm thick 2M wide 4M long mat at the other end of the Balance beam floor.

    Yep, that is starting to look like a Gymnastics setup.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    Random tip with working in hex. When your adding loops or extruding stuff, whenever you notice odd shading where you just did something...

    The bonds between the faces broke, and there no longer connected. A good time to save and then "Average Weld" to get stuff back to normal. If you ignore it and keep trying to do stuff, the faces will drift apart and things will just get worse.

    So, I opted to extrude holes, as I already had a 7M long mat made. So I doubled the width, add some loops, and now I'm fitting holes to the Balance beam legs.

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  • Mustakettu85Mustakettu85 Posts: 2,933
    edited August 2016

    Yeah, I was going for the Purple Trance hair, specifically the Pitiless as the Sun episode (one of my favorites), but Orion hair, while being close, isn't really "it". So it's kinda placeholder. I'll make a better one in LAMH eventually. I haven't finished writing the fanfic yet, so there's still time =) And - thanks! There's a lot of dial and deformer time in that Trance.

    Found a screenshot from PatS. Hopefully it uploads fine (I'm not on the computer).

    BTW I was thinking about your ShareCG problem, and it's kinda strange they targeted you because there's a load of fanart stuff there (and I think the stargate itself in my runtime came from there). Anyway, have you tried uploading to dA? Quite a lot of people keep their free stuff there.

     

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    DA is somewhat of a pay per MB site to an extent (last time I looked) and the Brazier zip was just about 20MB in size. Something of that size probably would be better to put up at a cloud-storage site, tho that still has some potential complications. The nagging doubt is the lack of a reason, how can you do good if you don't know what it was that you did bad.

    As for the morph, yea, I can understand how that can take a lot of time. I've been fussing with the Beam legs and the mat most of the day just getting them to match up for the most part. And I've had my share of working of figure shape dial mixes, lol.

    I know, it need not be perfect, the actual mats have a bit of a gap there any way. I just want it to be close enough to look like it's meant to be that way.

    BTW, DA is very clear on one thing, it must be explicitly your creation, and Fisty did do quite a bit on that set. So it is not strictly mine according to the DA upload TOS.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    Alright.

    On that note, I should probably get some shut-eye. I'll work on the 10cm thick landing mat on the flip side.

    The landing mat is going to need to be a tad more flexible then the thicker mats. More mesh points to grab with a D-former, and the underside of the mat will need to be there unlike the thicker mats.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    Morning, whatever question pole that was that woke me up. I looked briefly at the list of scores on Google and it is horrendous to navigate. You can't open links in another tab to keep the list you were just looking at, and if you try to just go back to the list after looking at some scores you need to fumble threw the tree again to get to the list you were just looking at. In any case.

    I had some doubts about the mat dimensions as listed in the FIG specs, tho apparently that is what you get. I was under the impression that it was a tad wider around the beam, lol.

    The other thing I'm thinking about is an alternate beam. The pads on that one would work with the mats as is for the other one, so it's just a mater of baking the new leg pads up in hexagon. The end caps on the beam are not the same tho, so it would only be partial option at best.

    Thanks to some one else, there are a couple (not many) really nice photos of the JF beam, so it is possible if I ever get the ambition. And no, I'm not doing all that complex nuts and bolts under the leg pads, that's just excessive at best. Besides, I still need to make the vault landing pads and run-up area pads.

    (Photos and vid-screen-caps for reference only)

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    One small technicality. It's not a "Landing mat" as I was calling it, oops. Supplementary mat it is then.

    So, with the dimensions and a cup of coffee, I can get to work. Tho some of the mats look more like 2Mx6M rather then 2Mx4M mats, hmmm.

    I may go a tad longer then 4M depending how it looks in Hex, I'm more then OK with a larger safety margin.

    Or that may just be an illusion of viewing angle, lol.  2M x 5M perhaps, quite a curious optical illusion.

    And that looks more like the density I should have used on the larger mats, easy enough to adjust.

    That may be just enough to do it for the supplementary mat, possibly. The larger mats will need the mesh a tad denser tho.

    I am also having some minor doubts about the width of the mat under the beam as well.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    I'm still working on some stuff, tho for the sake of not leaving some out of the loop, here is some of the OBJ files I have so far that I think are done geometry wise. Assuming the link works at all.

    (Newer link posted on the next page if your reading this in the future)

    Quite frankly, it's just the OBJ files for most of the stuff I baked up so far. Import it to studio at 100% size and that is all there is to that at the moment. No textures or other stuff yet at all.

    Uneven Bars not included.

    I'm about to look at a geometric puzzle with diagonal surface zone borders on a grid surface of quads, lol.

    I need to somehow get a primary mesh line to trace out that landing area mark, and keep it evenly spaced quads for D-formers to grab.

    Without crashing hexagon, lol.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    Well, the not so elegant method is not all that horrendous with render anomalies so long as reflection is kept out of it in 3DL.

    forget about keeping it all quads, just run the line across for the surface zone boundary.

    There is a deformer on the mesh distorting the surface of each of them, it's triangular artifacts in the shading that I'm looking for.

    And yes, I have been thinking about the cloth (Leather or whatever) handles on the sides of the 'Supplementary mats', I'll get to that. Thing is, not all styles of the mats have handles, so it's excess geometry in some circumstances.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    WOW! talk about stubborn.

    I decided to take what should have been a couple of minutes to try something, and hex is not liking it at all. It refuses to select loops when more then two faces are selected to extrude them inward, and all the other ways to get there it just crashes. I take it there is no easy way to make a simple four toothed gear with a cylindrical outer surface on the gear teeth in hex?

    Yea, that's just not going to happen today. I'll need to sit down and calculate the XYZ locations of all the points around two cylinders and morph a cube by moving points around to get that done, **** that. lol.

    And on that note of Hex being stubborn, how do you twist something without it turning into an hour glass shape.

    I'll check that out later on.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    Alright, back to the mats.

    Well, it looks like that Run-up mat is about a CM or two thick. That was one of the things I could not find much at all on. the other being the dimensions and marking placement of the FX supplementary mat, I don't know if that is a 5cm or a 10cm thick mat. Until I dig up more info on the FX mat, there is nothing more I can do on that.

    The Vault on the other hand dose have quite a bit in the FIG pdf on the dimensions, so I can at least start that set of mats.

    This is going to be fun, working with something that long in Hexagon, lol.

    Getting there slowly, looks about the correct length. I still need to UV map the thing, and make the other vault mats.

    I think this is a good point to look at some numbers before I get in my own way, lol. The doubt being weather or not that unmarked part of 'carpet' before the starting line is part of the 25 meter run-up or not.

    Hmmm.

    That looks better, Ship-it! lol.  More like time to make more mats.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    And time for a new post to continue the progress of just how far I have not gotten yet.

    Not bad tho, not bad.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    Morning love (speaking to the computer while fumbling toward the coffee pot), what is today's update that will wipe out all the windows I had open to where I had left off last night.  KB3177723, a time zone update!? whatever, delay that to after you show me the weather and I get coffee...

    Sounds kind of like a cool opening to a sci-fi flick, lol.  Thankfully the computer did not respond to me talking to it this morning, so I know the universe is as it should be, lol. The time zone update being an adjustment for Egypt DST that dose not affect me here on UTC.

    In any case, I looked at the specs for the vaulting table last night, and realized just how tired I was, lol. Now I know why Hypnagogia went with a stack of 1940's wooden soda-pop crates, any one that can understand the 2016 FIG Vault specs at the end of there day is not human, lol. Yes, I'm going to work on the mats first as I wake up, before I attempt to tackle that Vaulting Table. Emphases on 'Attempt', I'm not sure I can do that in hex to be honest (I'm still a Hexagon n00b).

    I may add a center loop around the sides of the other mats, so they can be bulged out for some things, it's a thought at least.

    I sort of like that, I can go a little closer on the edge loops possibly. Another odd thought is I should probably rename the 'floor' to 'podiums' to reduce confusion with the FX floor  .

    As for other things, there is a big difference between stuff that looks good in observation only, and stuff figures can actually interact with in a scene.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    Command decision time, as neither approach will be easy. I can try to make a grid of evenly spaced quads around the diagonal zone marks and try to keep the diagonal line straight as I dice it up to make the quads. Or I can try to force a grid of quads to have that diagonal in it after the fact.

    Starting with the diagonal, looks straight before dicing it up. However as I add horizontal slices to the mat and move them to there exact location, that will drag the diagonal line all over the place.

    I'll then need to do a lot of trig to calculate where the points on the line need to be for the diagonal to be straight from end to end. That's going to be a few hours of mashing away on the pocket calculator at least.

    The second option sounds better if hex will let me put a line across the mat at an exact spot when it's made. It would require less maths, If Hexagon can do it at all. I may be able to overlay a copy of the mat to trace out the diagonal, After the grid of quads is made, possibly. I'll think I'll try that way instead, sounds easier.

    Something I better double check now before I move the quads around to line up with that 'stencil' of a sorts. With the FX border, the line is part of the 'in bounds' area and anything outside of the line is out of bounds. I better make sure it is the same for the Vault landing zone, or those lines need to be moved outward.

    Note, hover around the target point until the little square turns red, then click when it is red (not yellow or green), otherwise Average Weld will not be able to bond them into a single point and you'll end up with pentagons instead of triangles and quads. Pentagons are really bad for some shaders, tends to crash Daz Studio kind of bad thing.

    Not to say, keeping that Zone border from wandering with sub-D is going to be a bit of a challenge.

    hmmm. That just might be straight in a higher-dimensional universe

    Ha-HA! Success!

    Getting there.

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  • Mustakettu85Mustakettu85 Posts: 2,933

    That's a lot of love for gymnastics, Zarcon =)

    If you're unsure about dA ToS (albeit judging by the sheer volume of drawing/painting collaborations that are posted every day, a 3D collab should also be okay), you could always go DropBox or MediaFire. It would just mean you need some sort of a "storefront" like a blog or a freebie thread, so that people could actually find your stuff. From there you can link to wherever you want to store a given freebie.

  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    I'm not very athletic my self tho there is an appreciation. An incredibly long time ago (grade school) I was in a Dojo, and while I never made it past n00b-belt , I can understand the difficulty of many of the gymnastics routines that the athletes make look so easy. I was a sucker and purchased that "Gymnastics Equipment" set in the store, unfortunately much of it is only for 'observation' in a scene rather then being used. I'm just filling in the missing FIG compliant parts from that set to the best of my ability.

    Besides, it's a good excuse for practicing making surface zone lines that don't wander with Sub-D, lol.

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  • Mustakettu85Mustakettu85 Posts: 2,933

    Yeah, the "SubD-resistant" zoning is a challenge =)

    Most professional sports are crazy difficult, but gymnastics is one of those that really showcases this difficulty (unlike, say, fencing which looks "simple" - but only looks this way). I always get angry when my colleagues say I'm "athletic" simply because - unlike them - I can do a few push-ups. Nope I'm not. Aliya Mustafina is.

  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    yea, she can be somewhat intimidating and intriguing at the same time, lol.

    There just was no good pics of that JF beam with Aliya around that I could find back when I was looking for pics of balance beams. There are lots of pics out there of the athletes, not so of the apparatus. what is the FIG term for plural of 'apparatus', equipment, lol.

    Almost, I just have a few mistakes to fix on the lower 20cm thick mat, and to name the zones.

    Something I noticed when I went to UV map the mat in Headus. The "select loop" did not go all the way around when I went to move the loop closer to the edge in Hex, and I'm not sure it maters at all on the lower mat to be honest.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    (Newer link posted on the next page if your reading this in the future)

    I added the Vault landing mat obj files. I want to redo the other mats now so the sides can be bulged out with a d-former if needed. Hopefully Hex plays nice with adding the single loop around the sides of the mats.

    I am going to let you in on an evil little trick. That ZDG logo is not baked into any map in that render. It's an opacity map trick on a primitive plane placed one millimeter above the surface.

    Well, I did end up putting the zones and UV mapping back after adding the loop, what fun. That took longer then expected, time for some rest.

    indistinguishable from the above render with SubD on the mats, I like it.

    ... Zzzzzzz (face planted on keyboard)

    (EDIT 19Aug2016, fixed the width of the zone lines on the Vault landing supplementary mat in zip 007)

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    Morning y'all.  I've been thinking about how to pack this set up for Daz Studio, and I may go with three zips if it is significantly over 10MB in size.  One for the basic stuff including the 'FX' and 'V' stuff used by both MAG and WAG setups. And two more zips with the specific MAG or WAG components and floor setup scene subset DUFs. That way, if your not interested in one of the two setups, you need not have the extra stuff clogging up your runtime. For the moment it is only a thought tho.

    There is some equipment I'm not going to make and include with this for a few reasons. While the surface zones on the "Gymnastics Equipment" set in the store is horrendous at best for setting up Iray shader settings. Over all it is not that bad compared to how long it would take me to figure out how to make the stuff from scratch, case and point being the Uneven Bars. It took me months to cobble together daz studio primitives into an unruly scene tab mess that remotely looked like the following example.

    I was unable to locate a good photo of the floor connections for the cable tie-downs any where, so that essentially ended that. Besides, hypnagogia did not do that bad of a job on the Uneven Bars geometry for the most part. It just sucks *** that hypnagogia put the chrome metallic surface and the mat surfaces all on the same surface zone, making it impossible to dress up the equipment in the colors of your choice, or use it in Iray with Iray shaders. So I'm kind of at a dilemma with the stuff.

    I could probably make better equipment, if my skills were better and I had sufficient reference material to work from, and neither of are going to happen any time soon. I am going to cobble up something for the Vault Table, as wooden Soda-pop crates have not been used at the Olympics for a very very very long time, lol.

    It's just going to take a little bit of fussing around to figure out how best to make the shape of the thing in Hex.

    On a second thought, Extruding may be a better way then resizing loops on a cube, lol.

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  • KeryaKerya Posts: 10,943
     

    ... Zzzzzzz (face planted on keyboard)

     

    How long was the face plant time?

    *grin*

  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    ah, the face plant time was just long enough to start to get a sore neck, not that having keyboard impressions on the side of the face is much more comfortable, lol.

    Today I wasted around four hours looking for good pics of the 2004 and 2008 Olympic vault table, and I did not find much at all. From what little I did find, mostly desktop icons or blurry images in the background of something else, the 2012 Vault Table was quite different from the 2004, 2008, and 2016 vault tables.

    I did make some progress on the general shape of the thing, and spent around four hours fussing with the slope on the front of the vault table top.

    There is so much to work on still, not to say it is not remotely close to any FIG measurements yet. I'm just trying to get the mesh into a shape that is close first.

    I will admit that the 2012 vault setup did look very nice and more fluid, coherent even. I may very well attempt to at least mimic the base pad of that and try to keep the rest as simple as possible.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    Morning. Well, I looked at one idea for the base, and while I sort of like it, I worry that it would be to visually distracting, not to say I have doubts that the wedge shape actually agrees with the FIG spec. I also have some doubts about the safety factor of that downward slope on the landing side of the vault table base bat.

    I may move that vertical slope closer to the pillar and smooth it out a bit more. I also have another mistake that I just noticed a spec for, the stripes on the landing mat should be 5cm wide, not 10cm.

    I'll need to fix that, as that is kind of important, and moving lines around is not all that difficult in hex.

    OK, that emergency adjustment made to the vaulting landing mat and uploaded into OBJ zip 007, back fussing with the to the Vaulting table.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    Hmmm

    I sort of like the base a tad better like that. Now for the far more difficult task of getting the pillar and top to fit the FIG profile for the thing.

    The jig will not necessarily make things easier, it will just emphasize just how far off I am, lol.

    Back to the days when cars had class and style, Stealcase chairs were made of actual steel, and vacuum cleaners would often blow fuses in the fuse panel for the house. If they had Gymnastics Vault tables in the 1950's, this may have been a close approximation, lol.  Why dose Hexagon use the oddest of colors for surface zones, lol.

    I do sort of like the look tho, reminiscent of an age when people were proud of what they made in the workshops of the day.

    As for the other part of the curve, a rather unruly 600cm across cylinder on it's side jig. Getting there bit by bit.

    Now that is starting to look like a Vaulting table. Still a bit rough on the edges, it's a WIP.

    I have no idea if that 300cm radius curve is supposed to be on the 'tong' that way, tho it appears to be close to the resemblance of the out of focus "desktop icons" I've been able to find that show that curve from above. It's been a long day, I'll work on this more after some rest.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    Morning, a bit of a funny off topic of a sorts that I hope not to many are offended by, as it is the sad truth. Often I run across this when I get fed up by narrators going on and on and on about some routine by some athlete that is never shown, so I go searching for a vid of it. This morning it was a tad different, tho the same sad state of affaires. I just stumbled across something called the Russian cup, so I decided on a whim to look for more, and that was a mistake.  The vids all suffer the same exact problem that plague other countries that are not completely off the map. Every single one of them was 360p motion blur taken from a hand held cell phone inadequate for capturing the movement of the athlete even if the camera was not shaking in some ones hands. To be fair it is not just one country either, it's just about everyone on all 'eight' continents on earth going back to the days of Pangaea, lol.

    There are some very worth while foreign aid organizations out there from disaster relief to food aid efforts. I think getting good quality filming equipment to other countries should be another one, because we can not rely on some (NBC) to adequately cover some events and the other countries apparently need better filming equipment, lol.

    Why do so many insist on wasting the internet with videos that are so horrible that it is impossible to tell what it is a video of. lol.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    Yes, I'm still working on the vault table. The sides of the table top had (and still do) a lot of nasty surface shading artifacts without sub-D, and there was a bit of curve I'm was still tweaking a bit to get it a tad smother without Sub-D.

    I'm redoing the UV mapping and I need to add another surface zone as well. Honestly the thing looks horrible up close without sub-D, tho I do have other concerns as well after reading about some stuff from the past four Olympics, and sifting threw the FIG apparatus norms pdf.

    In both 2004 and 2008 athletes had been injured on vault, and one contributing factor mentioned was the height of the vaulting table. I think it would be wrong to say that the table at the 2012 Olympics was a better design, because the available data is circumstantial at best. The athlete that was injured this year (2016) just so happened to miss out on the 2012 Olympics because of an injury. Not to say, we are human and mistakes do happen.

    What I find most disturbing is that height bit. In the FIG docs it is very clearly stated that the height is above the floor that the apparatus is sitting on and not the top of the mats, for the balance beam and the uneven bars. However I have not noticed anything like that regarding the vault table, nothing I have read so far indicates the height of the run-up surface, and nothing regarding weather that 125CM is above the floor or the top of the run-up surface.

    I have no clue what it is supposed to be, and am only guessing for the sake of making something for CG renders. My worry is that someone will assume that I know more then I do and attempt to make a vaulting table based on the measurements of my CG prop. I can not stress enough that I have more questions then knowledge regarding tha Vault setup.

    (Edit) I did find a line that I must have skimmed past a million times over the past month that indicates what the height is based on, however it is still unclear about the run-up surface indicating a max height only for that. And I'm equally unsure how that effects the height of the landing mats. So my height dimensions may be completely wrong after all.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    I'll update the zip in a bit, after I rotate the run-up rug the correct direction, lol. I think it's starting to look good now.

    I have a few minor things to do as well, like the block that marks the start of the vault run and some other simpler things (that will not be in the zip, as I've yet to make them).

    Yes, much better then it was a few days ago.

    (Newer link posted on the next page if your reading this in the future)

    That is essentially the WAG setup, for the most part.

    That is starting to look like something, I better start thinking about the Daz folder path for the set parts now.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    A bit of a reality check for the past two days of looking for reference material for something rather minor apparently.

    A quick search specifically for "Gymnastics vault start block" returned nothing of the topic, so I resorted to sifting threw some vids to see what was there, and I must say I am surprised. Clearly there is something from the men's 2012 gymnastics that is oddly absent during the women's vault finals. Going all the way back to the 1996 Olympics it apparently was a simple yellow foam padded block of some kind. In Rio 2016 I'm not sure what that is to be honest, tho nothing more then a marker apparently.

    And that's it, 2000, 2004, 2008 had no such visible block of any kind at the start of the vault run in any of the vids I looked at. A simple daz studio primitive will probably do just fine if you must have that.

    And that brings me to the next thought, that track cam. It was a great innovation back in the days of PAL and NTSC television when it was difficult to manually keep the athlete in focus during the run up to the vault (They did not have auto focus back then, lol). However the last time I have ever seen vid from that track cam was back in the 1980's, and while it would have been good in the early 2k's with over compressed digital video, it has essentially remained unused in all the broadcasts I've seen of late.

    That vault track cam is not used, it is cluttering up the gymnastics floor, and it is in the way of the judges on that side of the podium, I think it is time to delete the thing from the gymnastics floor. I will not be including that useless track-cam thing in my gym set.

    Now that tray of chalk for chalking up feet, that looks simple enough to make, I will conjure up something for that and the triangular signs as well.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited August 2016

    Life has been 'interesting' the past few days and progress has been slow at times.  First off, a while ago I had upgraded the graphics driver for an Iray test of the GT740 card and it had some detrimental side effects that made life painful at best. Quite literally, everything had sporadic stuttering from video playback to anything involving the windows desktop. Not only that, music vids would not even play with a consistent BPM making simple things unpleasant. It was as bad to use the workstation as Steve at Gamers Nexus described the gameplay of No Man's Sky, except it was everything on the computer just as bad as you can see in this video.

    Thankfully for me at least, and thanks to Jay, while I was catching up on stuff the past two days I noticed a off ball hint in one of Jay's vids that appears to be the culprit.

    Apparently the default power setting for new nVidia drivers when updated is some form of go-to-sleep power saving mode that makes the computer unusable for day to day activities. The instant I checked the setting eluded to by Jay, and fixed that, the computer came back to life.

    Video playback, the View field in Studio and Hexagon, and the desktop stopped sporadically pausing. Not to say, music vids now play at the proper BPM. Apparently nVidia's Power saving mode is just a tad to aggressive for the GT740 and GT730.

    And that is not the only thing that I've been fumbling threw, as the new 1440 display is also giving me a tad bit of discomfort as well. This is the first time in over ten years that I had to deal with monitors of different resolutions while trying to multitask. 1440 vertical vs 1200 vertical is just off enough to make sliding windows between monitors a bit of a chore, lol.  Also the 16-by-9 ratio 1440 display also has some oddities when full screening youtube vids, as the play bar stuff at the bottom of the screen obscures the bottom of the vid, something I have never had to deal with before, Aghhhhhhh, lol.  If only the 1440 display was a tad taller, I HATE this wide screen display junk.

    And on a side note, I've been thinking about the style of chalk trays for that gym set, and weather or not I should have a second mesh layer in the tray for the chalk.

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  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited September 2016

    OK, I spent the day looking at some stuff, and there is a few reasons I'm not all that thrilled by some of the 'Hype' going around about new stuff. I guess the most frightening to me is the power changes in the new PCI express interface vs my experience with motherboard power.

    Motherboard manufacturers are having a difficult enough time getting 120 watts of clean power to the processor, how the *** are they going to get 300 watts to each PCI slots!? (Correction at the end of the post)  I will not say what I had to bump that v-core up to just to get a stable +100MHz over-clock (Half the turbo boost of the FX8350), tho I'm sure it took a year or more off the life of the processor and motherboard. And that sort of brings me to the other two camps boasting new stuff. The FX8350 has eight calculators cruising along at 4.0GHz (that's 32,000 MIPS or 32 GIPS), I'm just not going to be impressed with less then that, and it will take much more then that to get me interested in buying a new processor. Nothing released the past year caught my interest, and let me show you why.

    100MHz more gets you 9 more Cinebench points, or only 22 seconds less render time in 3delight on a 17m 55.92s render.

    That's it, there charging ridicules prices for something that is not compatible with older motherboards, and offers squat more performance then the older processors. I say squat, because things like AoA shaders on HD figures face-plant the top end PCs for over half an hour in spot renders setting up scenes. decreasing that face-plant time by only a few seconds with a brand new four-thousand-dollar CPU just is not worth it at all. Especially when that four thousand dollar processor requires a brand new thousand dollar motherboard and equally expensive memory. In all honesty, IF I had that kind of money I would not be wasting my time with the junk offered by intel and amd for the past few years, I would call IBM and get a complete NUMA Power system, seriously.

    The AoA shader on many HD figures face-plants for around 45 minutes on the FX8350, that's around 86.4 Tara-Operations (per generation-7 HD figure) total AoA subsurface scatter precompute work load (Before the scene actually starts to render). To get that face-plant time under five minutes to make it usable for setting up scenes, the processor would need to deliver around 288 GIPS minimum (or 288 GigaFLOPS in a different language). 288 GIPS from 32 GIPS is a huge increase in performance that Nothing that Intel or Amd has is anywhere close to that kind of CPU 'power'. To put that in prospective, I would need to put no less then Nine FX8350's at stock speed (72 cores at 4GHz) into a single computer that can run Daz Studio, or overclock a single FX8350 from the stock 4GHz up to an insane 36GHz just to get 288 GIPS out of it.  I even doubt that Zen will be a major improvement over the FX8350, because 3delight needs more faster calculators, not more hands trying to use the same calculator, lol.

    The minimum requirement for generation 7 HD figures may as well read "You must have a minimum 320 GigaFLOPS computer that runs Windows to use HD figures in 3delight, over half a TaraFLOPS recommended".  Despite that being the performance of a twenty year old supercomputer, At the rate of stagnation today, I would be surprised to see such a PC in the next ten years from Intel or Amd.

    That concludes today's off topic ramblings, lol.

    (Edit 2016Sep01) It appears that that 300 watts from the motherboard was a human error confusing 'Card' for PCI motherboard connector. PCIe 4.0 will still be only 75 watts from the motherboard, not 300 watts. The 300 watts was in reference to the total power from all the connectors to a card.

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