Bone orientations are changed when exporting a figure with FBX format

Ricskusz

Hi,

I want to use 3ds Max to pose a Genesis 2 figure. I exported the character to FBX from Daz, and then I imported it to Max. Everything looks fine, except the bone orientations. When I bend a bone in Max, it bends in a different angle than in Daz.

As you can see, the shin bone bends in a different angle. This is not good for me, because I need the bones to bend the exect same way in Max as in Daz (for skin morphing purposes).

Is there any way to fix this?

Singular3D

I had a similar problem in Cinema 4D. Maybe this is the same.

In the FBX Daz provides a default bone orientation. Cinema 4D for instance ignores this and so all bones point into a certain default direction (e.g. the lower shin bone points downwards)

I corrected this manually in Cinema 4D, but had another issue, because the rotation system in Cinema 4D is based on quaternions and not XYZ. This can be dealt with Python scripts, but that's cumbersome. I don't use Max, but this can be an issue, as other programs have similar problems. Just check the bone orientation after the import. If it is different than in Daz, this should be the reason.

Ricskusz

Singular3D said:

I had a similar problem in Cinema 4D. Maybe this is the same.

In the FBX Daz provides a default bone orientation. Cinema 4D for instance ignores this and so all bones point into a certain default direction (e.g. the lower shin bone points downwards)

I corrected this manually in Cinema 4D, but had another issue, because the rotation system in Cinema 4D is based on quaternions and not XYZ. This can be dealt with Python scripts, but that's cumbersome. I don't use Max, but this can be an issue, as other programs have similar problems. Just check the bone orientation after the import. If it is different than in Daz, this should be the reason.

I don't think this is the problem. The XYZ orientations are the same in Daz as in Max (e.g. bending the shin bone in Daz is the same as rotating it on its X axis in Max, so the X axis is the same in Daz as in Max). My problem is that the axes are just slighty off.

Ricskusz

This problem is not exclusive to Genesis 2, I tested this with Genesis 3, and it's the same.

pdr0

It works the same way as DS with the same exported FBX in motionbuilder and maya .

So it might be an FBX interpretation issue in the other programs.

I would have expected similar results across Autodesk products

 

 

 

Ricskusz

Ok, so I tried to export and import FBX with a bunch of different settings, but non of it worked. My last hope is to rotate each bones pivot point in Max. Unfortunately I can't figure out, how the get the exect rotation values of a bone (XYZ rotations) in Daz. The posing menu is not good, because everything is at 0 there.

Richard Haseltine

The Tool Settings pane with the Joint Editor tool active should give the information.

Ricskusz

Richard Haseltine said:

The Tool Settings pane with the Joint Editor tool active should give the information.

Thank you, I've found it.

Padone

Ricskusz said:

Ok, so I tried to export and import FBX with a bunch of different settings, but non of it worked.

I'd also try to import animations to see if they play fine. It may also be some jcms that are not exported to fbx. Also G1 G2 use triax for weighting that is not exported to fbx.

Daedalus-7

I tried the following: 

1) Exporting a G8F fbx from DAZ (with no animation) and re-importing it Daz. All joints were properly placed and everything seems fine. In Cinema 4D the joints are moved. 

2) As above, but with animation. DAZ gives an error while importing. In C4D I get a strange deformation of the body, and the animation bones seem to be inverted (right shoulder moves instead of left, etc).

Conclusion:

A) DAZ exports badly FBX animations.

B) Do your animations in DAZ. If you want to use Mixamo animations in DAZ, you need motionbuilder, but you still have to do some tweaking to the skeleton (in MOBU) to make it work [once you do it, you can easily stramline the process). 

C) Once you are done with all animations on several layers (face, hands, etc), export as Alembic (with SubD).

D) Import in C4D, add Cameras, Lights, materials and VFX and, finally render using your favorite renderer. 

E) Postwork, done!  

jeronimocollares

daedalus7 said:

I tried the following: 

1) Exporting a G8F fbx from DAZ (with no animation) and re-importing it Daz. All joints were properly placed and everything seems fine. In Cinema 4D the joints are moved. 

2) As above, but with animation. DAZ gives an error while importing. In C4D I get a strange deformation of the body, and the animation bones seem to be inverted (right shoulder moves instead of left, etc).

Conclusion:

A) DAZ exports badly FBX animations.

B) Do your animations in DAZ. If you want to use Mixamo animations in DAZ, you need motionbuilder, but you still have to do some tweaking to the skeleton (in MOBU) to make it work [once you do it, you can easily stramline the process). 

C) Once you are done with all animations on several layers (face, hands, etc), export as Alembic (with SubD).

D) Import in C4D, add Cameras, Lights, materials and VFX and, finally render using your favorite renderer. 

E) Postwork, done!  

In other words, become a millionaire, spend a fortune on software to export a simple character to Max, C4d, etc ...

Daz is really working ...

jab12zak12

Hi

I'm new in daz.

It's 2024 and i ihope sb find the answer

I have this issue either, i look at the orientation of the daz bone (axis) comparing to the bone itself and I think it is not alined to the bone!!!

especially when you animate or move the bone.

In most of software like Daz there is local,world and gimbal coordinate system but as here in the below picture when you rotate the uparm the Axis keep the same.

And it looklike daz export this Fix Axis as fbx .

any help?

Thanks in advance