DAZ 3D Human Figures - A History

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  • GutoCraftsGutoCrafts Posts: 50

    This was very interesting to read.

    I'm amazed by how Daz Studio and the Genesis made creating new figures possible to amateurs like me.

  • I continue to find this a confusing naming structure when seeking assets, clothing etc.

    When they refer to a "generation" of charactor it does not equate to one of the charactor sets like G2, G3 or G8.  From above a Generation 6 is for Genisis 2 not "Genisis 6" which does not exist and so on. Many times an asset description may say for Victoria 4 but not mention the genesis version at all and I have to either try to recall (not doing well on that! ) or revert to some seach to find out what charactor Victoria 4 belongs to which is NOT G4F which, again, does not exist.

    Why the ppl at DAZ did not name things to include both the "Generation" and the "Charator" for instance Victoria 4.2 to indicate Gen 4 for Genisis 2. Would make searching for clothing, hair etc. much easier to filter.

  • SevrinSevrin Posts: 5,574

    I continue to find this a confusing naming structure when seeking assets, clothing etc.

    When they refer to a "generation" of charactor it does not equate to one of the charactor sets like G2, G3 or G8.  From above a Generation 6 is for Genisis 2 not "Genisis 6" which does not exist and so on. Many times an asset description may say for Victoria 4 but not mention the genesis version at all and I have to either try to recall (not doing well on that! ) or revert to some seach to find out what charactor Victoria 4 belongs to which is NOT G4F which, again, does not exist.

    Why the ppl at DAZ did not name things to include both the "Generation" and the "Charator" for instance Victoria 4.2 to indicate Gen 4 for Genisis 2. Would make searching for clothing, hair etc. much easier to filter.

    There's a compatibility matrix linked in the OP.  Just go by that.

  • LeanaLeana Posts: 8,898

    Victoria 4 was before the first Genesis, that's why there's no mention of the Genesis line on product pages for V4 items. Genesis was introduced as generation 5 of Daz figures.

  • mmitchell_houstonmmitchell_houston Posts: 2,430
    edited October 2019

    I continue to find this a confusing naming structure when seeking assets, clothing etc.

    When they refer to a "generation" of charactor it does not equate to one of the charactor sets like G2, G3 or G8.  From above a Generation 6 is for Genisis 2 not "Genisis 6" which does not exist and so on. Many times an asset description may say for Victoria 4 but not mention the genesis version at all and I have to either try to recall (not doing well on that! ) or revert to some seach to find out what charactor Victoria 4 belongs to which is NOT G4F which, again, does not exist.

    Why the ppl at DAZ did not name things to include both the "Generation" and the "Charator" for instance Victoria 4.2 to indicate Gen 4 for Genisis 2. Would make searching for clothing, hair etc. much easier to filter.

    It is not nearly as confusing as it seems. Michael and Victoria came first, then they were followed by the various Genesis models. This shakes down to this chronological order:

    1. Victoria / Michael
    2. Victoria 2 / Michael 2
    3. Victoria 3 / Michael 3
    4. Victoria 4 (and 4.2) / Michael 4
    5. Genesis Female / Genesis Male
    6. Genesis 2
    7. Genesis 3
    8. Genesis 8

     

    If you look at the numbers on the left, I think you can see why they skipped from Genesis 3 to Genesis 8. They realized that the numbering was getting more confusing, so skipping Genesis numbers seemed the easiest way to bring everything back into alignment. Not sure it worked, but it's a start.

    I hope this helps.

     

    (You are correct, they skipped Genesis 6).

    Post edited by mmitchell_houston on
  • LeanaLeana Posts: 8,898

    I continue to find this a confusing naming structure when seeking assets, clothing etc.

    When they refer to a "generation" of charactor it does not equate to one of the charactor sets like G2, G3 or G8.  From above a Generation 6 is for Genisis 2 not "Genisis 6" which does not exist and so on. Many times an asset description may say for Victoria 4 but not mention the genesis version at all and I have to either try to recall (not doing well on that! ) or revert to some seach to find out what charactor Victoria 4 belongs to which is NOT G4F which, again, does not exist.

    Why the ppl at DAZ did not name things to include both the "Generation" and the "Charator" for instance Victoria 4.2 to indicate Gen 4 for Genisis 2. Would make searching for clothing, hair etc. much easier to filter.

    It is not nearly as confusing as it seems. Michael and Victoria came first, then they were followed by the various Genesis models. This shakes down to this chronological order:

    1. Victoria / Michael
    2. Victoria 2 / Michael 2
    3. Victoria 3 / Michael 3
    4. Victoria 4 / Michael 4
    5. Victoria 4.2
    6. Genesis Female / Genesis Male
    7. Genesis 2
    8. Genesis 3
    9. Genesis 4
    10. Genesis 5
    11. Genesis 7
    12. Genesis 8

     

    (You are correct, they skipped Genesis 6).

    This list is wrong. There were no Genesis 4, 5, 6 or 7, Daz moved from G3 to G8. And V4.2 was just the latest update of V4, she shouldn’t be listed on her own.

    The actual “Generation list” is this:

    1. Victoria / Michael (1), also known as “millenium woman” and “millenium man”
    2. Victoria / Michael 2: basically V1 and M1 with more morphs. There were also kids figures (the first millenium boys and girls) and the first Stephanie in generation 2, they were separate figures.
    3. Victoria / Michael 3, and their friends Stephanie Petite 3, David 3, Aiko 3 and Hiro 3, the Freak, the Girl, and for kids the Young Teens (Luke and Laura), Preschoolers (Matt and Maddie) and Millenium Baby. Once again, all separate figures.
    4. Victoria / Michael 4, and Kids 4 were the base figures. Other generation 4 named base characters were shapes for those base figures.
    5. First version of Genesis (unisex), with Victoria 5, Michael 5 and the other “Name 5” base characters as shapes for Genesis.
    6. Genesis 2 Female and Male base figures, with Victoria 6, Michael 6 and other generation 6 named base characters 
    7. Genesis 3 Female and Male base figures, with Victoria 7, Michael 7 and the other “7” named base characters 
    8. Genesis 8 Female and Male base figures, with Victoria 8, Michael 8 and all the “8” characters.

    Daz switched to labeling Genesis with the generation number for the fourth Genesis figures because it was too confusing to have different numbers, especially since V4 content is still widely used (while generation 1, 2 and 3 are pretty much retired)

  • Leana said:

    This list is wrong. There were no Genesis 4, 5, 6 or 7, Daz moved from G3 to G8. And V4.2 was just the latest update of V4, she shouldn’t be listed on her own.

    The actual “Generation list” is this:

    1. Victoria / Michael (1), also known as “millenium woman” and “millenium man”
    2. Victoria / Michael 2: basically V1 and M1 with more morphs. There were also kids figures (the first millenium boys and girls) and the first Stephanie in generation 2, they were separate figures.
    3. Victoria / Michael 3, and their friends Stephanie Petite 3, David 3, Aiko 3 and Hiro 3, the Freak, the Girl, and for kids the Young Teens (Luke and Laura), Preschoolers (Matt and Maddie) and Millenium Baby. Once again, all separate figures.
    4. Victoria / Michael 4, and Kids 4 were the base figures. Other generation 4 named base characters were shapes for those base figures.
    5. First version of Genesis (unisex), with Victoria 5, Michael 5 and the other “Name 5” base characters as shapes for Genesis.
    6. Genesis 2 Female and Male base figures, with Victoria 6, Michael 6 and other generation 6 named base characters 
    7. Genesis 3 Female and Male base figures, with Victoria 7, Michael 7 and the other “7” named base characters 
    8. Genesis 8 Female and Male base figures, with Victoria 8, Michael 8 and all the “8” characters.

    Daz switched to labeling Genesis with the generation number for the fourth Genesis figures because it was too confusing to have different numbers, especially since V4 content is still widely used (while generation 1, 2 and 3 are pretty much retired)

    Wow. You were fast. I only had the incorrect list online for about three or four minutes before correcting it.

     

  • Noah LGPNoah LGP Posts: 2,342
    edited October 2019

    I prefer to say Millennium for the generations before Genesis.

    1. Millennium Woman Victoria / Millennium Man Michael
    2. Millennium Woman Victoria 2 / Millennium Man Michael 2
    3. Millennuim Woman Victoria 3 / Millennium Man Michael 3
    4. Millennium Woman Victoria 4.2 / Millennium Man Michael 4
    5. Genesis
    6. Genesis 2
    7. Genesis 3
    8. Genesis 8
    Post edited by Noah LGP on
  • Noah LGP said:

    I prefer to say Millennium for the generations before Genesis.

    1. Millennium Woman Victoria / Millennium Man Michael
    2. Millennium Woman Victoria 2 / Millennium Man Michael 2
    3. Millennuim Woman Victoria 3 / Millennium Man Michael 3
    4. Millennium Woman Victoria 4.2 / Millennium Man Michael 4
    5. Genesis
    6. Genesis 2
    7. Genesis 3
    8. Genesis 8

    I can definitely see a logic to that. But I don't do it because they kind of dropped the "Millennium Man" terminology with Michael 2.

  • Noah LGPNoah LGP Posts: 2,342
    edited October 2019

    Millennium Kids (Laura 3 and Luke 3) are 3rd generation, Michael 3 model is blmilman_m3.obj

    Millennium disappeared with the 4th generation but Michael 4 model is blMilMan_m4b.obj

     

    Post edited by Noah LGP on
  • Noah LGP said:

    Millennium Kids (Laura 3 and Luke 3) are 3rd generation, Michael 3 model is blmilman_m3.obj

    Millennium disappeared with the 4th generation but Michael 4 model is blMilMan_m4b.obj

     

    I was mostly referring to the marketing.

  • I think some of the confusion is that with Genesis they split the name of the figure from the name of the platform (mesh)

    Genesis came along and replaced Generation 4 (v4, m4, k4).  So now you have just one mesh and for that mesh you got the version 5 series of the figure shapes - V5, M5 etc etc and they were all mixy matchy regardless of gender

    Then came Genesis 2 Female and Genesis 2 Male got the version 6 figure names - V6, M6, etc  These got split back out to male and female versions so you can mix girls with girls and boys with boys.

    Genesis 3M and Genesis 3F therefor got the version 7 series of the shapes  - V7, M7, etc etc  Still split to male and female versions so you can mix girls with girls and boys with boys.

    At this point DAZ realised it was confusing *lol*

    So the next figure brought the base mesh number up to be Genesis 8 Male and Genesis 8 Female, with the version 8 shape names Michael 8, Victoria 8 and all of their 50? brothers and sisters

    Presumably going forward they will keep the platofrm version number and the shape version number matched up.

    .... My second DAZ store product was for Hiro 3 and came out at his launch. Some days I feel very very old.

    LM

     

  • TDBAGZTDBAGZ Posts: 134
    edited October 2019

    ... and then there was IRAY, GTX cards, Dforce, strandbased hair, Blender 2.8's new user interface, RTX Cards, Face Transfer... Making anything prior Genesis 3 maybe even Genesis 3 itself obsolete. Muah ha ha ha... 

    4.12 and beyond!!!... To the Future!!!!

    Post edited by TDBAGZ on
  • The last few comments above this post I'm making now were very helpful. Those should be added to the main page, so that they don't get lost.

    I am returning to Poser after a several year absence and several computer changes. I'm currently in the process of gathering together all my assets that I collected since the very beginning. I bought Poser in 95 when it first came out, so you can probably guess as to the amount of content I collected over the two decades. I'm also trying to get back up to speed on which models can be used with what, and wow, there is a lot to catch up on. This is a very helpful thread, so thank you! I just bought Poser 11 Pro and want to jump back in with new eyes and see what I can do with it now. The main reason for my return is that I'm getting into 3D printing and I want to see if I can combine the two. I already did a proof of concept print with zero post processing of the export, and it came out remarkably well. If anyone has suggestions, advice, tips and tricks, etc for turning Poser renders into 3D print ready STLs, I would love to hear them.

  • TDBAGZ said:

    ... and then there was IRAY, GTX cards, Dforce, strandbased hair, Blender 2.8's new user interface, RTX Cards, Face Transfer... Making anything prior Genesis 3 maybe even Genesis 3 itself obsolete. Muah ha ha ha... 

    4.12 and beyond!!!... To the Future!!!!

    Well, at least there are the converter programs, to allow us all to convert up to G8 most anything from before, must to keep them alive. ;)

  • Can't even begin to describe how utterly confusing this is for a (brand) newcomer to DAZ. It is beyond incomprensible how you're supposed to know configurations and what is compatible with what. 

    Case in point: I got a bunch of free shapes/materials yesterday (Candace) that was built on Stephanie 5 base - and I read that Stephanie five was compatible with Genesis base, but then I now read in here that Stephanie 5 was created from Michael?!?!?! WTF.

    So I load in the Base Gen character (thinking to myself: Ok, so it says Stephanie 5 is compatible on Genesis - cool, this should work then!) and try applying the Candace head shape and skin, but it maps totally wrong. So I go into change the UV Set and I'm given the options of either Victoria 4, Michael 4, The Kids 4, Gen male, and Gen female. I try ALL of them, nothing works.

    So now what? Do I indeed need to actually purchase Stephanie 5? Why doesn't Genesis Female base work????? It is CRAZY that you need endless multiple base characters in order for anything to happen, complete mine field and my entire experience of DAZ so far has been one of endless hours trawling through the shop and reading/watching tutorials instead of diving into it - the software is not difficult at all, but the compatability of characters/surfaces/textures (endless list) is just staggeringly frustrating.  

    Sorry (not sorry!) to vent, but I just want to throw my laptop out of the window right now. 

     

  • SevrinSevrin Posts: 5,574

    Can't even begin to describe how utterly confusing this is for a (brand) newcomer to DAZ. It is beyond incomprensible how you're supposed to know configurations and what is compatible with what. 

    Case in point: I got a bunch of free shapes/materials yesterday (Candace) that was built on Stephanie 5 base - and I read that Stephanie five was compatible with Genesis base, but then I now read in here that Stephanie 5 was created from Michael?!?!?! WTF.

    So I load in the Base Gen character (thinking to myself: Ok, so it says Stephanie 5 is compatible on Genesis - cool, this should work then!) and try applying the Candace head shape and skin, but it maps totally wrong. So I go into change the UV Set and I'm given the options of either Victoria 4, Michael 4, The Kids 4, Gen male, and Gen female. I try ALL of them, nothing works.

    So now what? Do I indeed need to actually purchase Stephanie 5? Why doesn't Genesis Female base work????? It is CRAZY that you need endless multiple base characters in order for anything to happen, complete mine field and my entire experience of DAZ so far has been one of endless hours trawling through the shop and reading/watching tutorials instead of diving into it - the software is not difficult at all, but the compatability of characters/surfaces/textures (endless list) is just staggeringly frustrating.  

    Sorry (not sorry!) to vent, but I just want to throw my laptop out of the window right now. 

     

    Candace for Stephanie 5 shows Stephanie 5 as a required product.  Also "for Stephanie 5" is right in the product name. That's pretty clear to me.  Sometimes required products aren't absolutely essential, but it's kind of a proceed at your own risk kind of situation.  Anyway, Steph 5 was only USD 5.59 a few days ago and she'll be on deep discount again soon.

    Anyway, I stick to G3 and G8 as a new-ish user.  They play together reasonably well, and all the materials they come with work with Iray.  They're also heavily discounted often enough that it's possible to accumulate a decent number of assets if you're patient.

  • DustRiderDustRider Posts: 2,469

    Can't even begin to describe how utterly confusing this is for a (brand) newcomer to DAZ. It is beyond incomprensible how you're supposed to know configurations and what is compatible with what. 

    Case in point: I got a bunch of free shapes/materials yesterday (Candace) that was built on Stephanie 5 base - and I read that Stephanie five was compatible with Genesis base, but then I now read in here that Stephanie 5 was created from Michael?!?!?! WTF.

    So I load in the Base Gen character (thinking to myself: Ok, so it says Stephanie 5 is compatible on Genesis - cool, this should work then!) and try applying the Candace head shape and skin, but it maps totally wrong. So I go into change the UV Set and I'm given the options of either Victoria 4, Michael 4, The Kids 4, Gen male, and Gen female. I try ALL of them, nothing works.

    So now what? Do I indeed need to actually purchase Stephanie 5? Why doesn't Genesis Female base work????? It is CRAZY that you need endless multiple base characters in order for anything to happen, complete mine field and my entire experience of DAZ so far has been one of endless hours trawling through the shop and reading/watching tutorials instead of diving into it - the software is not difficult at all, but the compatability of characters/surfaces/textures (endless list) is just staggeringly frustrating.  

    Sorry (not sorry!) to vent, but I just want to throw my laptop out of the window right now. 

     

    Unfortunately in this case, yes, you do need Stephanie 5 because Canadace does use the UV set for Stephanie 5. With Genesis(1) through Gennesis 3, the DAZ CharacterNameX (or named/numbered characters) typically had unique UV mapping. Some of the characters that require another character don't need the base character to work (they just don't look the same) because PA's started using the base Genesis(x) UV set. If you don't own the "required" base, and the product description doesn't mention it, it's always best to ask in the Commons to see if the base product is required.

    I think due to the issue you are experiencing, with Genesis 8 DAZ seems to have moved away from the custom UV's (the custom UV's for each character reduced texture distortion). If you don't need to use Candace now, watch the sales and you should be able to get Stephanie 5 really cheap (or free) in the next month or so. The price of old content is often greatly reduced.

  • LeanaLeana Posts: 8,898

    and I read that Stephanie five was compatible with Genesis base, but then I now read in here that Stephanie 5 was created from Michael?!?!?! WTF.

    Stephanie 5 was not created from Michael, she's a shape for Genesis.

    The first Stephanie, which was an independent figure released at the time of generation 2 figures, was based on the mesh for Michael 2.

  • Can't even begin to describe how utterly confusing this is for a (brand) newcomer to DAZ. It is beyond incomprensible how you're supposed to know configurations and what is compatible with what. 

    Case in point: I got a bunch of free shapes/materials yesterday (Candace) that was built on Stephanie 5 base - and I read that Stephanie five was compatible with Genesis base, but then I now read in here that Stephanie 5 was created from Michael?!?!?! WTF.

    So I load in the Base Gen character (thinking to myself: Ok, so it says Stephanie 5 is compatible on Genesis - cool, this should work then!) and try applying the Candace head shape and skin, but it maps totally wrong. So I go into change the UV Set and I'm given the options of either Victoria 4, Michael 4, The Kids 4, Gen male, and Gen female. I try ALL of them, nothing works.

    So now what? Do I indeed need to actually purchase Stephanie 5? Why doesn't Genesis Female base work????? It is CRAZY that you need endless multiple base characters in order for anything to happen, complete mine field and my entire experience of DAZ so far has been one of endless hours trawling through the shop and reading/watching tutorials instead of diving into it - the software is not difficult at all, but the compatability of characters/surfaces/textures (endless list) is just staggeringly frustrating.  

    Sorry (not sorry!) to vent, but I just want to throw my laptop out of the window right now. 

    I can completely sympathize with your situation. Yes, it is confusing. The reason for this is that – at least on the large scale – none of this was really planned. Yes, there are bits of logic scattered throughout the product lines, but the simple fact is that this is not something that was planned from the start, but something on which order had to be established after the fact (it's like anything in history). No doubt I'll get some kickback on that statement, but I'm right and no amount of arguing is is going to change the fact that, Yes, this is confusing because the naming and numbering system has evolved over time and there are definitely some oddities in it (particularly the habit of grafting  familiar character names onto the Genesis figures (Michael 5 is Genesis, etc.).

    So, my advice to you is this: relax and soak it in. You will eventually figure this out. When you have a question about requirements or limitations, ask someone in the forums. There are lots of knowledgeable people here willing to help out.

    (Oh, and be grateful that you don't use Poser: We have even MORE figures than you do, and their use is even more confusing!)

  • mavantemavante Posts: 734

    Genesis 2 (6th Generation) Bases

    DAZ Studio 4.x (Contains Genesis 2 Starter Essentials, including the base Genesis 2 Female and Genesis 2 Male figures)
    Victoria 6
    Gia 6
    The Girl 6
    Teen Josie 6
    Olympia 6
    Stephanie 6
    Giselle 6
    Aiko 6
    Lilith 6
    Mei Lin 6
    Belle 6
    Keiko 6

    Michael 6
    Teen Jayden 6
    Gianni 6
    Lee 6
    Brodie 6
    Minotaur 6 HD
    Reptilian 6 HD

     

    I didn't quote your entire post, but I'm very, very confused about why there is no mention about the "7th Generation"—or whatever it's called. For instance:

    Aiko 7

    The Girl 7

    Victoria 7

    Where do they fit into this fine madness?

     

  • chris-2599934chris-2599934 Posts: 1,519
    mavante said:

    Genesis 2 (6th Generation) Bases

    DAZ Studio 4.x (Contains Genesis 2 Starter Essentials, including the base Genesis 2 Female and Genesis 2 Male figures)
    Victoria 6
    Gia 6
    The Girl 6
    Teen Josie 6
    Olympia 6
    Stephanie 6
    Giselle 6
    Aiko 6
    Lilith 6
    Mei Lin 6
    Belle 6
    Keiko 6

    Michael 6
    Teen Jayden 6
    Gianni 6
    Lee 6
    Brodie 6
    Minotaur 6 HD
    Reptilian 6 HD

     

    I didn't quote your entire post, but I'm very, very confused about why there is no mention about the "7th Generation"—or whatever it's called. For instance:

    Aiko 7

    The Girl 7

    Victoria 7

    Where do they fit into this fine madness?

     

    The "seventh generation" are Genesis 3 figures. 

  • mavantemavante Posts: 734

    Thanks. Has the OP left the building? If not it would be a help to update the original post, given the thread's title.

  • ChoholeChohole Posts: 33,604

    He is still around, and still a member of the CV team.  You do have to remember that CV stands for Community Volunteer, they are just froum members, like you who have volunteered to extra stuff to help new members (and others).  They also have a real life and jobs etc to cope with as well.

  • mavantemavante Posts: 734
    Chohole said:

    He is still around, and still a member of the CV team.  You do have to remember that CV stands for Community Volunteer, they are just froum members, like you who have volunteered to extra stuff to help new members (and others).  They also have a real life and jobs etc to cope with as well.

    So do I.

    I didn't issue a command. I said, "it would be a help." And I stand by that.

    If I could update it, I would. But I can't, so I shan't.

  • mavante said:
    Chohole said:

    He is still around, and still a member of the CV team.  You do have to remember that CV stands for Community Volunteer, they are just froum members, like you who have volunteered to extra stuff to help new members (and others).  They also have a real life and jobs etc to cope with as well.

    So do I.

    I didn't issue a command. I said, "it would be a help." And I stand by that.

    If I could update it, I would. But I can't, so I shan't.

    Agreed. It was just a suggestion, and a good one at that.

  • ChoholeChohole Posts: 33,604
    mavante said:
    Chohole said:

    He is still around, and still a member of the CV team.  You do have to remember that CV stands for Community Volunteer, they are just froum members, like you who have volunteered to extra stuff to help new members (and others).  They also have a real life and jobs etc to cope with as well.

    So do I.

    I didn't issue a command. I said, "it would be a help." And I stand by that.

    If I could update it, I would. But I can't, so I shan't.

    Agreed. It was just a suggestion, and a good one at that.

    I am not saying it wasn't a good suggestion,  I am saying that you have to apprediate that he may be otherwise engaged.  He is aware it needs updating,  but finding time to do is another matter.

     

  • pwiecekpwiecek Posts: 1,377
    edited February 21

    This may have been stated somewhere but I can't find it.

    The Generation 2 young characters were packaged by Gender: Millenium Girls vs. Millenium Boys

    The Generation 3 were grouped by Age Young Teens (Luke & Laura) vs. Preschool (Matt & Maddie)

    Semi-OT: At one time there was a series of third party (Content Paradise I think) Poser characters referred to as G2. They have nothing to do with M2 or V2 and are definately not Genesis 2.

    Post edited by pwiecek on
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