Poser is still king...apparently.
Griffin Avid
Posts: 3,758
So, on another forum, I recieved this comment for my comic series:
Dont see many Poser comics around! Nice work!
Oh my! So it seems, despite all the available 3D assets and tools and engines and...and....POSER is still the # 1 go to product for all things 3D.
What's interesting is, even if you say Daz Studio...people assume, that's where you buy the stuff, but Poser is where the magic happens.
Usually, when people get far into reading, they then switch and ask about gaming engines like Unreal and/or Unity or such....
And even they got Poser People in there....
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We had a long thread somewhere on here about the 'stigma' of Poser-looking-Art. Not sure if that's still true in 2018.
Now, with all the different rendering engines and so much post work being done- it's actually pretty rare to find something super raw.
But I digress...
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Comments
for a long time, 'poser' was used as an adjective to describe all of this style 3d work. It doesn't necessarily refer to the software.
Exactly. It's like saying Xerox or Coke (in the south) or Kodak. There are companies that have completely gone out of business but their names are still used to refer to something they were known for instead of the generic name.
="Which software did you use for rendering your comic story?"
="I used DAZ Studio for it."
="Wha... hugh?"
="DAZ STUDIO!!!"
="AHHH, Dad's studio, and what software?"
="<sigh> I used... ahm Poser, I used Poser for it.<damit>"
="Ahh Poser, heard of it."
oH yeah "Pass the Kleenex"
Dad's Studio....lol
I remember that in marketing classes and how that was the goal of 'branding'.
To have such a strong association...
Come to think of it, whenever I see animated 3D models used in TV commercials, I do wonder about the source of the figures.
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It's story time and there was a novel/comic writer who kept asking about my stuffs.
[there was a chance that I'd be working with him]
He liked my stuff, but apparently someone was in his ear about my alleged creative process.
I was real annoying because he asking about HOW I make my stuff.
"No, no what do you render in?" I'm like Daz Studio lets you render.
"No, um where do you get your characters?" The Daz store sells figures.
"So who made the figures?" They have artists that sell the characters and you can make your own. I made a lot of my characters.
"So who hired the artists?" Well, I guess Daz, the store, does cause it sells their stuff.
"So who owns Daz?" As far as I know they are an independent company and own...themselves.
"So you don't use Poser, in any way" No, I have a copy, but never use it. I know what it is, but no, I don't use Poser.
"But you have Poser?" Yes.
"So it's Poser, that's what I figured"
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So apparently
a) Poser was a little too easy to use and subtracted from any artistic credit and...
b) there's cracked versions of Poser floating about and that was a major concern of his.
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I have since seen him at a Comicon-event and he was much nicer. He even contacted me later, but I have no real interest and write my own stuff.
If I was quicker on my feet, I should have grilled him about what software he uses to write his novels in.
Dude sounds like a doche canoe and probably would have been difficult to get any pay out of anyways. I'm betting you dodged a bullet there, Pal.
No kidding! Sheesh!
Even my 70+ parents "got" it. When I explained it to them, I absolutely said to my dad, "You remember Poser, yeah?" and he said, "Oh yeah! Is that what you use?" "No, but it's kind of like that." "Oh, ok cool."
LOL!!!
My own view is that Poser is struggling and Daz Studio has many more users these days. It might not have the wider recognition, but I think commercially it is winning.
DAZ studio doesn't have much name brand recognition I'm afraid. They should work a bit harder on improving their brand recognition.
I think it's similar to how 'googling' is now a term for searching on the internet regardless of search engine, and 'photoshopping' is now a term for photo editing regardless of photo editing software, 'poser' has now become a term for rendering prepurchased assets, regardless of software used for rendering.
What it gets down to is content, all the bells and whistles don't mean a thing if you got nothing to render. So go with the best content!
Maybe we should get us some Daz Studio Ambassador Logo's/thumbnail/picture
Maybe Daz should just rebrand to Dad's Studio. It's definitely more catchy.
Then you can explain that it's somewhat comparable to Poser, but actually more similar to old fashion photography, with how lighting works and that lower quality renders (actually, they've just run too short) can even look realisticly grainy.
The program itself does need recognition.
The Daz genesis models are well known and widely used
by many professionals who post over on CGsociety
perhaps not for final VFX shots in the Marvel movies
but certainly more well known and more used than the native poser figures like Paul & pauline or any of the Hiveware lot
,whos names escape me atm.
Daz is now selling entire figures in native Maya format.
Poser 11 exports to FBX however I personally see ZERO interest amongst animators in other online communities, in using a poser native figure for anything.
i'd guess, there's more daz dedicated content out there
That having been said, the 10-25% price increases of late on new products (yes, I'm one of those who has noticed) combined with less stacking discounts, etc. (except for flash sales) means one has to pony up more mula to buy stuff (compared to daz of the recent past and also other sites that will remain unnamed), which is not a good money making strategy and will result in overall turnover losses if you ask me. With regard to my buying habits, I've already become far more selective about what I purchase, which has resulted in lost sales to DAZ. Artists deserve more money where justified, but there is an argument to be made for higher volume sales (by way of strategic, lower pricing) being able to more than offset lower pricing.
TBH, my spending is going down as well, but mostly due to there just isn't much that interests me going into the store anymore. Either too niche or just over the top stuff I'll never, ever use. There have been some nice things certainly, but all in all, the shine is gone as far as Daz releasing things I think I can't do without. I can do without more and more these days. LOL
Laurie
same here ... been learning to live without those things I don't absolutely need. If I don't see a specific use for a project, I forgo purchasing things ... many things that I would have just bought and put aside for possible use in the future. BTW I love your freebies Luarie ... high quality excellent creations. Thank You!
I was gonna buy Rarestone's new girl....had her in my cart...twice. Then realized I haven't even used Pei yet. So I relegated her to the wishlist bin ;). It's just crazy to keep shelling out for stuff I might never get to.
And you're welcome :). Glad you find them to be of some use :)
Now, what all this has to do with Poser, I dunno. LMAO. I HAVE Poser, does that count? LOL
Laurie
i have poser 9.0, so i think i'm legit too ... lol
I remember downloading Poser ... back when it first came out ... while I was in art school. And using dialup. Which took ... days. (Wow - I'm old).
I tinkered around with it. But really didn't invest the time and money until DAZ. I have no desire to check out Poser again at this point.
Yeah, I'm doing the same thing. The higher prices and the fact we really don't own anything is driving me to buy less. We are buying licences not products. We really don't own anything Daz the company and the creators of the content own their content. Consequently, we cant use the content any way we want because it does not belong to us. That plus the price increse is making me a hobbiest think very hard on what I am willing to spend my money on.
You can render it and sell those however you want. You just can't redistribute the content without an extra license.
Licences are not a DAZ only thing. Whether you are on a Mac or PC, you don't own the operating system and can't do with it as you please... you own a license.. and that's the same with all the programs on your computer, videogames and the phone apps you've bought.
Which, you know, is why I totally identify myself as "crazy." I think I need a support group. Also, I second the upvote for your awesome freebies!
Just about everything digital is licensed and not owned. You can use content that you purchase to make your own art, but you can't resell someone else's content as your own. Because it isn't yours. You do, however, pay for the ability to render it pretty much any way you want. The reason you can't use a "standard license" item in a game (and, therefore, why extended/game licenses are a thing) is because when selling your game, you must INCLUDE the actual geometry of the item, not just a picture of it. (If a game engine is going to render it, that engine needs all of the figure data.) Content artists only allow this when compensated accordingly, not in small part because their work can be ripped from the game as 3-D data file, which opens the door to piracy.
As for the rest, I agree with the "Poser is like Kleenex" thought. Also, DAZ is still committed (THANK YOU!) to not slamming the door on using old, pre-genesis (i.e., Poser Runtime Structure) content. As someone who evolved with the software -- once a die-hard Poser user and now almost exclusively a DS user, I'm sort of blind to how much of Poser's legacy is still alive in DS. I showed a friend how to use DAZ Studio this summer and I had the darndest time explaining the Poser Runtime Structure. On the one hand, you don't really need to know much about it if you're only using newer DAZ content. On the other hand, there's this HUGE, very established Poser freebie repository spread out over the internet. I had a devil of a time trying to explain A) why Poser materials were in the pose folder, B) why hair was in the character/figure, prop, and hair folder, C) why you couldn't freely move folders within the Runtime folder, and D) how .dsf and .duf files were different.
I can see how a Poser user could transition to DAZ fairly easily. But honestly don't know how a DAZ user could jump into Poser. It's just a bizarre setup. I know why, and I am as comforable in it as a fish in water, but if I hadn't started out there, I'd think the people who use it were a few fries short of a Happy Meal...
these days, cant watch a utoob clip without being treated to a daz ad.
dinosaur ad is cute.
as a carrara user doesnt excite me so much lol cheers on the dforce
I recently had a comment on one of my animation
quote: "looks like all your videos were made in iClone but for some reason there's no mention about it in your credits"
My reply" There is no mention of Iclone because all my animations are created with daz studio software. www.daz3d.com I did mention software used in my video descriptions Thanks for watching, Appreciate the comments :)"
well it just went down hill from there.
Probably because some snob thinks because you didn't have to give up an arm, leg and your firstborn for the software that it's not worth using ;).
Laurie
..mine as well, partly because I am on a fixed retirement income, partly because I am satisfied with G3 and see little reason to invest in a whole new figure line, and partly due to just about everything today having only Iray materials.
I've been with Poser since version 6, and I've never even come close to making the switch to DS. I'm quite confident that I could if I really wanted to, but for now, I'm just too lazy to take the time acclimating myself to a new program when the one with which I already have years of experience does everything just as well if not better than DS. So I currently use Poser Pro 11 almost exclusively, with DS being on my system just so I can access post-V4/M4 content and bring it into Poser.
If a guy on Renderosity named Willdial hadn't figured out how to export a fully functional Genesis 3 (and by extension, Genesis 8) into Poser, I might have been forced to make the switch when I finally decided it'd be worthwhile to upgrade to Genesis 8 as my primary base figure (I stuck with Genesis 1 for much longer than most simply for the whole both-sexes-in-one-base feature).
In a way, though, I suspect I am paying a bit for my inertia. Even with Willdial's rather simple export method (and maybe one or two others, such as FBX), it doesn't seem like there's as much overlap as there used to be between Poser users and Daz base figure users. This means that my one and only product in the Renderosity Marketplace, a G8F character pack made specifically for Poser, likely appeals only to a niche market and thus isn't as profitable as it otherwise might be.