January 2018 New User 3D Art Challenge - Composition

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  • ChameoChameo Posts: 294
    edited January 2018

    This one's an alternate to something I was working on for another challenge. It might benefit from a tighter crop, but... I included one with guide lines to show what I had in mind when I was positioning my two ladies.

     

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    Post edited by Chameo on
  • daybirddaybird Posts: 564
    Tynkere said:

     

    This Is Not An Offical Entry

    Diagonal lines can form imaginary triangles.  “Triangulation” can help “frame in” your subject, or whatever you want viewer to take a second glance at.

    Starting from the top of garage, one diagonal goes to her neck/shoulder, across chest to arm that’s at same angle with garage.  Follow it (hopefully) to his shoulder & down where he’s giving the ‘thumbs up.’ 

    His arm is more or less at same diagonal.  (Don’t want to be too obvious about it.)  If lucky, the eye follows from his elbow to the little bird on the moped.  Why is the bird even in there right?  In real life, it would fly away.  It's there to hopefully get viewer to stop scanning left.  The eye might glance up the vertical line of house.  Hopefully the eye gets redirected by diagonal of house’s roof back to Vicky. 

    Now they are “framed” or grouped.  I usually wouldn’t be so obvious about it.  Looks too ‘posed’ for lack of better word, but hopefully explains concept.  Diagonals can be very useful when done more subtly imo...   

    Hope that made sense.  “Modern house” is a fun set, and I’m really enjoying “Old Chap.”  smiley

     

    Motion Blur:

    I’m hoping someone will chime in here and help us.  Would open up a lot of possibilities.  Here’s hoping you can pull it off.  That way I can use it too. devil

    Thanks everyone, for putting up with long post.  Last time at playing 'art teacher' -- promise!

    --Bruce

     

     

    Hey, don't make your words true. Teachers are always welcome here. I like such short hints and explanations.

    I'm fascinated from such things. Unfortunately I'm too dumb, to think at such useful things, when I build up, my scenes.

  • daybirddaybird Posts: 564
    Chameo said:

    This one's an alternate to something I was working on for another challenge. It might benefit from a tighter crop, but... I included one with guide lines to show what I had in mind when I was positioning my two ladies.

     

    Hi Chameo,same here. Great use of lines in your work. 

    The scene looks very funny. :)

    But why sits the frog on the had? I thought magicians pulls them out of them. ;) 

     

  • Kismet2012Kismet2012 Posts: 3,563
    Chameo said:

    This one's an alternate to something I was working on for another challenge. It might benefit from a tighter crop, but... I included one with guide lines to show what I had in mind when I was positioning my two ladies.

     

    The first thing that jumps out at me is their feet.  You have cut them off.  Unless that was something you were referring to when you mentioned the crop.

    Fun scene.

     

  • LinwellyLinwelly Posts: 3,975

    @everybody, there was a question about motion-blurr at some point, but I couldn't find the original question. As Kismet already mentioned, true motionblurr can only be done in 3delight at this point but there are some neat little gimmics that can help the impression, so please can you post the original question and context again, maybe there are some options

  • NoswenNoswen Posts: 310
    Linwelly said:

    @everybody, there was a question about motion-blurr at some point, but I couldn't find the original question. As Kismet already mentioned, true motionblurr can only be done in 3delight at this point but there are some neat little gimmics that can help the impression, so please can you post the original question and context again, maybe there are some options

    I think this came from my comment originally. I'm planning to motion blur the background and keep the bike and figure unblurred to give the impression of speed and movement, I had been planning to do this with two renders and postwork plus combining the images, though I've never even tried this before so not sure how well it will work.

  • daybirddaybird Posts: 564
    Noswen said:
    Linwelly said:

    @everybody, there was a question about motion-blurr at some point, but I couldn't find the original question. As Kismet already mentioned, true motionblurr can only be done in 3delight at this point but there are some neat little gimmics that can help the impression, so please can you post the original question and context again, maybe there are some options

    I think this came from my comment originally. I'm planning to motion blur the background and keep the bike and figure unblurred to give the impression of speed and movement, I had been planning to do this with two renders and postwork plus combining the images, though I've never even tried this before so not sure how well it will work.

    Great idea, I tried it by myself in a render I did a while ago. My goal was to create a feeling of movement at her cape, the hair and the city.

    After I failed to do it in Iray I finally used Gimp to create the effect. With more or less success. ^^ (see attachment)

    But if I remember right, than Shinji had used a motion blur tool for Iray and can maybe tell you more about that.

    On Patrol 15.10.17.jpg
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  • daybirddaybird Posts: 564
    edited January 2018

    I still work and struggle with the scene. As all can see,I have removed the girl in the foreground, because I had the feeling, she draw too much attention away from my main char. 
    Not sure about the focus and the ratio. What I have tried, is to guide the viewers attention with the staring of all people, to the Orc. 
    I'm still not pleased with a few shader (especially at the M3 in the background) and still fail to implement a few puddles on the ground, but I'm happy, that I could create, with the great scatter tool, the forest in the background.

     

     

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    Post edited by daybird on
  • NoswenNoswen Posts: 310

    @daybird: Still looks pretty good, after adding two more figures to the scene so it's not empty I'm currently trying to delete anything and everything I can off camera so my graphics card will be able to render it, once I've got that done I'll see if I can manage the motion blur.

    For the orc scene my eyes are drawn towards the character right in the foreground, I'm feeling maybe the orc is in too much shadow and the white top is drawing the eye? I don't know.

  • NoswenNoswen Posts: 310
    edited January 2018

    Finally got the scene working again. So here is a quick rendering of stage 2 with hair sorted a bit more plus two people added in the background.

     

    Joyride 2.jpg
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    Post edited by Noswen on
  • LinwellyLinwelly Posts: 3,975

    @Noswen thanks for getting that back up, I see you already used DOF, that is a good thing. what you can try is use a bit of lens distortion on your camera. I used that in this render: I made it a link so you can go to the full resolution, which is far more impressive. I will need to look up in the scene file which lens distortion type I used, I believe it was cylindrical, then experiemnt around how much you want. don't be shocked when the the scenes seems to get lost in space, you can readjust with focal distance, its a lot of try and error though

  • NoswenNoswen Posts: 310

    @linwelly: Wow, that looks great! I'll put the motion blur idea on hold for the moment and play around with lens distortion first.

  • NoswenNoswen Posts: 310

    @linwelly: Wow, that looks great! I'll put the motion blur idea on hold for the moment and play around with lens distortion first.

  • daybirddaybird Posts: 564
    Noswen said:

    @daybird: Still looks pretty good, after adding two more figures to the scene so it's not empty I'm currently trying to delete anything and everything I can off camera so my graphics card will be able to render it, once I've got that done I'll see if I can manage the motion blur.

    For the orc scene my eyes are drawn towards the character right in the foreground, I'm feeling maybe the orc is in too much shadow and the white top is drawing the eye? I don't know.

    Funny, I thougt the same as I stopped the render. I try to get the shadow out of her face and try another color for his shirt.

     

    Linwelly said:

    @Noswen thanks for getting that back up, I see you already used DOF, that is a good thing. what you can try is use a bit of lens distortion on your camera. I used that in this render: I made it a link so you can go to the full resolution, which is far more impressive. I will need to look up in the scene file which lens distortion type I used, I believe it was cylindrical, then experiemnt around how much you want. don't be shocked when the the scenes seems to get lost in space, you can readjust with focal distance, its a lot of try and error though

    Cool effect Linwelly!

    I have wondering so often, for what the different lens distortions may useful. This is a impressive demonstration. :)

  • NoswenNoswen Posts: 310
    edited January 2018

    When you said the scene might get lost I wasn't quite expecting something like this!

    This is cylinder, only uploading this just to show what happens with the default settings on cylindrical distortion.

    Joyride - cylinder.jpg
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    Post edited by Noswen on
  • LinwellyLinwelly Posts: 3,975
    Noswen said:

    When you said the scene might get lost I wasn't quite expecting something like this!

    This is cylinder, only uploading this just to show what happens with the default settings on cylindrical distortion.

    LOL, that might have been a tad much. I have to correct myself though, I changed the Lens thickness to 5 in the example above and left the other lens settings to default respectively the distortion to none. Then I adjusted with framewidth

  • TynkereTynkere Posts: 538
    edited December 2018

    OK.  So here is fix to his hair, and give kiddo back her “grown-up” size coffee cup.  : )

    Also added a wooden handle to the gear thing on the drafting table.  Think that will be enough playing with new surfaces.

    Other comments and suggestions welcome of course.  Otherwise, guess this is final for January because... Skip down to Linwelly & Noswen... Messing the camera up is even more fun than smushing things. ; )

    @ Chameo

    Ha!  Kiss Mr. Frog and he turns into Prince Charming again?  Kind of looks like a fun New Year's inspired theme with the frizzles around him.  And that was an alternate?  Sheesh!

    @ Daybird

    Coming along nicely.  I like the steps in lower RH corner.  

    One observation.  You’re kind of stuck doing the challenge with one arm tied behind your back.   “The Orc Undies Challenge!”  : 0 !

    So here’s a thought if hasn’t already occurred to you...

    Why not just raise the waistline in photoshop or image editor?  Then you would be free to do whatever you want as far as moving actors around without having to “strategically” place one of them.  That said, I like kiddo in foreground.  Point of her war axe is almost right at his nose. I’d be leaning my head back too...

    @ Linwelly

    Some very powerful tools!  I’ve spent all day at it with some interesting renders.  Most of them are abstract, and it's nice to know you can do NPRs in IRay.  Thank you very much.  yes

    @ Noswen

    I owe you and Linwelly one.  Needless to say, this is not an official entry...  Yes, you could just do this in an image editor.  Yes, it's probably a terrific waste of time.

    But it's very satisying when you're having fun deliberately messing with the camera, and stumble onto something.   Then, go a little further and get it to work. 

    Zombie Cam!

    “Vent them into space!  We Can’t!  The doors are stuck!  Oh Noooo!  We’re all gonna die!”

    WIth that, uhm... Think it's time for 'speedy exit' I had mentioned somewhere.  smiley

    @ Everyone

    Best wishes on this month's Challenge!

    --Bruce

    ---
    Edit: Weeding out old imgur files.  PM broken links.

    Post edited by Tynkere on
  • daybirddaybird Posts: 564
    Tynkere said:

    OK.  So here is fix to his hair, and give kiddo back her “grown-up” size coffee cup.  : )

    Also added a wooden handle to the gear thing on the drafting table.  Think that will be enough playing with new surfaces.

    Other comments and suggestions welcome of course.  Otherwise, guess this is final for January because... Skip down to Linwelly & Noswen... Messing the camera up is even more fun than smushing things. ; )

     

    @ Daybird

    Coming along nicely.  I like the steps in lower RH corner.  

    One observation.  You’re kind of stuck doing the challenge with one arm tied behind your back.   “The Orc Undies Challenge!”  : 0 !

    So here’s a thought if hasn’t already occurred to you...

    Why not just raise the waistline in photoshop or image editor?  Then you would be free to do whatever you want as far as moving actors around without having to “strategically” place one of them.  That said, I like kiddo in foreground.  Point of her war axe is almost right at his nose. I’d be leaning my head back too...

    Well done Bruce and with such a nice cup of whatever, the inspiration will soon flow again! ;)

     

    Ah yes, my "Orc Undies Challange!" *hrhr*... That would be a funny competition for the next month.

    Needless to say, you caught me. I thougt a few times what I should/could do with her ähh.. *cought* pant. I'm a total noob in Gimp and so I never considered it to try it with that. Unfortunately I'm not sure if I have time for another try.

  • daybird said:
    Noswen said:
    Linwelly said:

    @everybody, there was a question about motion-blurr at some point, but I couldn't find the original question. As Kismet already mentioned, true motionblurr can only be done in 3delight at this point but there are some neat little gimmics that can help the impression, so please can you post the original question and context again, maybe there are some options

    I think this came from my comment originally. I'm planning to motion blur the background and keep the bike and figure unblurred to give the impression of speed and movement, I had been planning to do this with two renders and postwork plus combining the images, though I've never even tried this before so not sure how well it will work.

    Great idea, I tried it by myself in a render I did a while ago. My goal was to create a feeling of movement at her cape, the hair and the city.

    After I failed to do it in Iray I finally used Gimp to create the effect. With more or less success. ^^ (see attachment)

    But if I remember right, than Shinji had used a motion blur tool for Iray and can maybe tell you more about that.

    The script that I brought up is Motion Blur for Iray sold here at Daz by DraagonStorm. It's on the pricy side though, $25.95 right now so it might not be for everyone.

  • Kismet2012Kismet2012 Posts: 3,563
    daybird said:
    Noswen said:
    Linwelly said:

    @everybody, there was a question about motion-blurr at some point, but I couldn't find the original question. As Kismet already mentioned, true motionblurr can only be done in 3delight at this point but there are some neat little gimmics that can help the impression, so please can you post the original question and context again, maybe there are some options

    I think this came from my comment originally. I'm planning to motion blur the background and keep the bike and figure unblurred to give the impression of speed and movement, I had been planning to do this with two renders and postwork plus combining the images, though I've never even tried this before so not sure how well it will work.

    Great idea, I tried it by myself in a render I did a while ago. My goal was to create a feeling of movement at her cape, the hair and the city.

    After I failed to do it in Iray I finally used Gimp to create the effect. With more or less success. ^^ (see attachment)

    But if I remember right, than Shinji had used a motion blur tool for Iray and can maybe tell you more about that.

    The script that I brought up is Motion Blur for Iray sold here at Daz by DraagonStorm. It's on the pricy side though, $25.95 right now so it might not be for everyone.

    I didn't realize there was a product for that.  Thank you for sharing Shinji.  Now if I can just get my brain to remember this stuff.

     

  • HighElfHighElf Posts: 176
    edited January 2018

    So, finally some free time to work on my picture again. And I got a new toy to play with. An Intuos Pen by Wacom. :D

    I tried something else on this one. I hope it helped a little bit with the faces. :D

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    Post edited by HighElf on
  • Kismet2012Kismet2012 Posts: 3,563
    HighElf said:

    So, finally some free time to work on my picture again. And I got a new toy to play with. An Intuos Pen by Wacom. :D

    I tried something else on this one. I hope it helped a little bit with the faces. :D

    I had to go back and find your original image to compare.  I see you made a slight adjustment to the male figure's head.  (Not sure if you did that for this version or a previous version.)  It has him looking her directly in the eye. 

    The overall lighting is much more subdued but you still have some nice highlights, just not as strong as before, that still gives that romantic feel to this image.  The only thing I miss from those earlier lights is the highlight on her hair.  But that might become a distraction to the focus on thier faces.

    Nice work.

  • HighElfHighElf Posts: 176
    edited January 2018

     

    daybird said:

    I still work and struggle with the scene. As all can see,I have removed the girl in the foreground, because I had the feeling, she draw too much attention away from my main char. 
    Not sure about the focus and the ratio. What I have tried, is to guide the viewers attention with the staring of all people, to the Orc. 
    I'm still not pleased with a few shader (especially at the M3 in the background) and still fail to implement a few puddles on the ground, but I'm happy, that I could create, with the great scatter tool, the forest in the background.

     

     

    I really like this one. And screw you daybird. Right now I'm installing Skyrim again to play an ork warrior. I wanted time to work on my pic. ;) Yes the backround works quite well in your pic. Puddles and water as a whole are always things I struggle with, too.

    Post edited by HighElf on
  • daybirddaybird Posts: 564
    edited January 2018
    HighElf said:

     

    daybird said:

    I still work and struggle with the scene. As all can see,I have removed the girl in the foreground, because I had the feeling, she draw too much attention away from my main char. 
    Not sure about the focus and the ratio. What I have tried, is to guide the viewers attention with the staring of all people, to the Orc. 
    I'm still not pleased with a few shader (especially at the M3 in the background) and still fail to implement a few puddles on the ground, but I'm happy, that I could create, with the great scatter tool, the forest in the background.

     

     

    I really like this one. And screw you daybird. Right now I'm installing Skyrim again to play an ork warrior. I wanted time to work on my pic. ;) Yes the backround works quite well in your pic. Puddles and water as a whole are always things I struggle with, too.

    Your pic looks well done, so no problem to spend some time in Skyrim. ;)

    Ah, yes Skyrim... I played it for now 4-5 times and reached nearly 1000h playtime, but never solved to finish it. I alway get lost in the sub quests and Add-On from the community.

    Post edited by daybird on
  • HighElfHighElf Posts: 176

    I brought the Rim-Light back to an higher intensity in this version. Currently I can't decide, if I prefere the more subtle version or the brighter rim. XD Oh and Yes I adjusted his eyes a little bit more. Not sure if I hit the right spot this time.

     

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  • NoswenNoswen Posts: 310
    edited January 2018

    Two images created, background motion blurred via GIMP, and combined. My first ever attempt smiley

    For some reason though the bike now seems to be floating sad I need to work out what I did wrong, I wasn't expecting to need to re-align the bike as both rendered images that make this up have the same dimensions.

    Joyride 3.jpg
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    Post edited by Noswen on
  • LinwellyLinwelly Posts: 3,975
    daybird said:
    Noswen said:
    Linwelly said:

    @everybody, there was a question about motion-blurr at some point, but I couldn't find the original question. As Kismet already mentioned, true motionblurr can only be done in 3delight at this point but there are some neat little gimmics that can help the impression, so please can you post the original question and context again, maybe there are some options

    I think this came from my comment originally. I'm planning to motion blur the background and keep the bike and figure unblurred to give the impression of speed and movement, I had been planning to do this with two renders and postwork plus combining the images, though I've never even tried this before so not sure how well it will work.

    Great idea, I tried it by myself in a render I did a while ago. My goal was to create a feeling of movement at her cape, the hair and the city.

    After I failed to do it in Iray I finally used Gimp to create the effect. With more or less success. ^^ (see attachment)

    But if I remember right, than Shinji had used a motion blur tool for Iray and can maybe tell you more about that.

    The script that I brought up is Motion Blur for Iray sold here at Daz by DraagonStorm. It's on the pricy side though, $25.95 right now so it might not be for everyone.

    I didn't realize there was a product for that.  Thank you for sharing Shinji.  Now if I can just get my brain to remember this stuff.

     

    From what I understand that product won't give you the smooth motionblurr as we get it with 3DL.

    @Noswen, Nice first stab at that! If you will continue with that direction you micht want to render the bike and the background  seperately as an additional layer ( ending with three renders, you witll need one with all of it to move thing to their designes places.

    I guess it started floating through the direction in which you moved the background for the motionblurr

  • daybirddaybird Posts: 564
    Noswen said:

    Two images created, background motion blurred via GIMP, and combined. My first ever attempt smiley

    For some reason though the bike now seems to be floating sad I need to work out what I did wrong, I wasn't expecting to need to re-align the bike as both rendered images that make this up have the same dimensions.

    I find this effect looks pretty cool. Now I feel the power and the speed of this machine.yes

  • HighElfHighElf Posts: 176
    Noswen said:

    Two images created, background motion blurred via GIMP, and combined. My first ever attempt smiley

    For some reason though the bike now seems to be floating sad I need to work out what I did wrong, I wasn't expecting to need to re-align the bike as both rendered images that make this up have the same dimensions.

    Neat, that is, how a powerful engine should be shown. :) Reminds me a little bit of both, AKIRA and TRON.

  • NoswenNoswen Posts: 310

    Thanks for the comments everyone. Following up on my image I believe I know what's happened (but haven't tried any sort of rendering to check it).

    What I have at the moment for the previously posted picture: -

    Render 1: The character and the bike only

    Render 2: Everything else

    Posted picture: Render 1 + Render 2, with Render 2 motion blurred in GIMP.

    The problem is probably that the bike is above 'ground' level in render 1 because the road has height to it! surprise And with that the road isn't there to keep the shadow starting where the wheel is instead of an inch or so away in the render's scale.

    @linwelly: I'm not really understanding you with why I'd need 3 renders with one of them for moving them to their designated places? Also it floated before the motion blur (I kept the motion blue to be the angle of the road as best as I could judge).

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