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For which surface? The gums or the teeth?
I would say both. If you look in the mirror you will see that the saliva leaves a more direct wet gleam on them. What I'm seeing with your images is the gleam is very smoothed out...
And sharper reflections on the teeth that are always wet! also the surface of the teeth is not flat , add some turbulences to break down the flat reflections the same for the gums , the level of reflection on gums an teeth are actually the same .. unless you make some nice bumps maps for both it will be hard to get out something from flat surfaces
OK. I think I see what you mean.
Here's are some updated renders. In the second I'm trying to use the 2nd layer specular as a coat (simulating saliva) on both the teeth and gums. No fresnel though for now. :)
Turbulence should be doable with bump maps, but I try to avoid adding reflections since I don't like how raytraced reflections are done in DS.
the first one almost there.. looks much better already, the gums color is to vibrant try to get is closer in the lip color as much as possible
Thanks for the input(s). How about these? As you can see in the closeup renders, there's quite of bit of bump on the teeth and gums.
They look great,
This thread might be of help:
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/33118/
Have you got Dental Plan!?
CHEERS!
Thanks. I am aiming for white teeth, but you should be able to change the diffuse color to add some tint. The goal is to have a base preset that can be tweaked as need be later on.
I don't have Dental plan, since I generally create my own morphs.
You might be able to do it with the specular 2 channel in US2.
CHEERS!
the teeth need bigger bumps sort of slightly turbulence , this way it will break down the glossy
look the image below
http://www.dentalaegis.com/media/24378/
P.S one more
http://smilesatfrance.com/userfiles/image/4.6_resize.jpg
I was about to say the same since the second specular channel have a great options for right reflections
Cool,
Your smile would be great for textures!
CHEERS!
I'm already using the first and second specular.
I plugged in the same bump map to the second layer bump channel. It breaks the specular a bit and pretty much acts as a specular map. I didn't save the close up view (doh), but here's a closeup shot with another angle.
They look just right to me.
CHEERS!
The final setup with more intense ambient light.
I'm happy now. :)
wow wowie nice skin. Teeth look good but too perfect, same with the face, too symmetrical. Great lighting.
Thanks.
Well, we can always change the symmetry and tint the teeth a little. :)
It's just so nice to see that DAZ Studio and 3delight can play with the big boys. When I look at that, it's almost like it was in vray 2.0 or something (vray 3 for max have much more beautiful SSS, on par with Arnold).
Yeah I just pointed those out as many people forget about the little details that make realism more real. LOL
That is it wowie and something I have wanted to prove for a while. 3Delight is a great render engine. I have seen Lux and Octane renders that could have been done in 3Delight no problem at all.
Ah, permit to add a little bit of correction. It's not just 3delight, it's DAZ Studio!!!
I couldn't agree more. I've seen just as much bad renders with Luxrender and Octane as I have with any other renderer (including 3delight).
I still wish we have much better interface to the renderer though. Or at least a energy conservation shader that's flexible enough. I don't even mind if it's just a modified Phong/Blinn shader.
Btw, any of you tried Disney's BRDF Explorer yet? I downloaded the Windows version, but everytime I load a BRDF (from MERL 100), the app crashed.
Yes sorry, Daz Studio indeed. The UI makes for a fun and enjoyable workflow. I started at 2.3 and for me this what we have now is so much better. It is my favourite program to use by far.
I am at the stage of learning that only recently I understood what BRDF was and way it is so much better so that would be a no to Disney’s BRDF Explorer. ;)
If you and Wowie can pull off some great tutorials between you, we'll really be cooking with gas! Wowie, that last render was outstanding.
CHEERS!
Thanks a lot.
All of the information and comments/critiques in this thread helped though. Looking back, all the elements are already present but I don't think anyone have put them together and try to analyze what works and what doesn't.
For me, the first piece of the puzzle was Takeo's post about physically plausible shader in Renderman. It made me think of structuring materials closer to what is generally considered 'physically correct'. Mustakettu's info on fresnel rolled the ball the correct way - there's just no way to do specular correctly without fresnel. That's the main reason I jumped ship to using UberSurface2. The shader also allowed much more flexibility due to its layered nature. And of course, Hellboy's render was a great inspiration - it really made me think that believable human skin with just DAZ Studio and 3delight is possible.
The most important piece tying all of them is probably the info I 'stumbled' upon concerning linear workflow and gamma correction. Combined with all the above, it allowed me to tweak lights and materials more consistently. I do wish texture vendors paid more attention to their gamma settings though. I don't know if this is a bug or not, but with gamma correction on, some control textures (mostly, specular maps) pretty much lose all their details with gamma correction enabled (converted to linear color space).
The setup still have some problems with the eyes - I haven't been able to figure out how to properly mix the eye reflection/cornea surface to give more believable looking eyes. Haven't quite understand how refraction/specular/fresnel fit together with US2.
I use what Spyro does with the eyes in this thread:
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/6376/P75
CHEERS!
It's not the shine. I probably should have explained it better - it's getting the iris details to match real life eyes. I believe you need to set refraction for the cornea only and probably a bump/displacement map for the iris. Here's an example of what I'm talking about.
Ah, I see,
I've always found these settings useful:
"So you’ll need to work those dials! Here’s the eye with a texture applied (3DCelebrity’s Genesis from DAZ), the EyeCorneaBulge morph set to 40%, the EyeIrisSize to -10% and the EyeIrisBulge to 5%. The shape is much better!"
That's from V4 Eyes Workshop by John Hughes aka Nysalor. It's a .pdf but I've long since lost the link. There were some nice eye textures in the freebies at Renderosity the other day too. G2F and M eyes have the same UV's and Gen 4 UV's work with them too.
CHEERS!
That is what I do wowie, cornea only for reflections and of course Fresnel
I have recently finally understood Gamma correction etc with the help Mustakettu and others but Mustakettu had the final piece of the puzzle. My last two major renders were both done with Gamma Correction On at 2.20. I then adjust the mats to suit. My last render, in my render thread, as I didn't need much saturation added like I normally have to do in Photoshop, +5 I went for, I normall have to go as high as +10 to get richer colours. Yes I had to make some adjustments to the some mats but Stonemason/StreetWear didn't need much adjustment, The Courtyard didn't need touching at all. Well apart from some Sub-D on the plants.
Yes. I use to do this too with Gen4 since they have the dials. But I work exclusively with Genesis2 now and they don't have them.
This is as close as I've gotten to what I wanted.
The corneal bulge is there, as is iris size. I couldn't find one for the other iris morph, but, there is one for Iris Correction so I used that instead.
CHEERS!
Yes, the cornea outward bulge is there but I think what's really needed is convex/concave shape of the inner side (the one closer to the iris). It would make things a lot easier since you can use that instead of relying solely on refraction settings.
Here's a wireframe look with and without the iris correction and cornea bulge morphs (dialed in at 1). I've highlighted the eye reflection so we can see the outline of the lens/eye.
I see, well, it's better than nothing and they end up looking good still.
CHEERS!