[Released] IBL Master - Image Based Lighting control for both renderers & a new IBL for 3Delight

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Comments

  • AllenArtAllenArt Posts: 6,810
    barbult said:

     

    On a related note, I came across this while looking for some wolf reference material:

    Awesome!

    - Greg

    You know, I had no idea wolves were quite THAT large o.O

    Laurie

  • 3dOutlaw3dOutlaw Posts: 2,465

    Wow, they are big!  ...and I am also pretty sure I would not let one lick my teeth.  LOL

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 39,120
    edited January 2018
    barbult said:
    kyoto kid said:
    barbult said:

    Well, I guess I'm doing something wrong with the 3Delight setup. I turned on Gamma Correction and set the gamma to 2.2. The HDRI is blown out (too bright) and the character is washed out looking, too. Shadows are not very dark. I don't see any ground shadows at all. I had to delete the hair entirely. Daz Studio would crash every time until I deleted the hair. The Iray version, which looks much better, took less than 10 minutes to render to 100% convergence. The 3Delight render took 26 minutes. 

    ...do you have a distant light for the sun?

    No, I don't have any conventional lights in the scene. I have the HDRI and one IBL Master boost light.

    I deleted my IBL Master Control from the scene and added a new one. I reset all of the 3Delight render settings to default except Gamma Correction On and gamma 2.2. I rendered again, and now I have the ground shadow and the character is less washed out. Something must have gotten messed up in my IBL Master Control the first time. The 3delight render finished in 3 minutes (not counting the optimizing images). It is a little rough, because the render settings were set back to default samples, etc. 

    It still doesn't look as nice as the Iray version. The light comes from the same direction, but the 3delight HDRI beach sand looks washed out compared to the Iray render. The character looks dark and dry. I'm sure some of this comes down to the (lack of?) quality of the 3delight materials provided for the character and the suitability of those materials for gamma correction. 

    ...what is the intensity setting of your Distant light?  There is also one control in the lighting parameters for teh IBL light calld Intensity Multiplier. it is set ot a default of 5.  Try adjusting that to see if it helps.

    Post edited by kyoto kid on
  • ParrisParris Posts: 392
    nowefg said:

    Great to see some folks getting positive results.

    On my side, I installed 4.10, the original release, and get another 3DL error msg. Happens at least twice on every render.

    2018-01-01 18:17:47.941 Rendering Image
    2018-01-01 18:17:47.957 WARNING: Script Error: Line 14
    2018-01-01 18:17:47.957 WARNING: TypeError: Result of expression 'Shader.addTransformBegin' [undefined] is not a function...

    Also, more for the bizarro happenings file,  I wasn't getting shadows either, (but had no light in the scene so that must be why,) but I wondered if the ground plane had gotten mis-placed or something, so I did a Ctrl D with the plane selected, send to floor, and the render got mega weird and took very very long. I actually stopped it after about 10 minutes, unfinished. Completely bizarre image, nothing like the hdr I was using.

    I'm going to go for the refund, for now. I don't see 3DL IBL as any way better than Iray, which I'm just finally getting used to, and have found that grouping my scene elements, so I can hide them with a single click, and then working with Iray drawstyle, quickly gets me where I need to go without needing a sphere to show me the back of my environment.

    Best to all who find IBL Master useful, though.

    You know I've been giving you a lot of love here since page 5, trying hard not to frustrate you, trying to be sympathetic and encouraging, trying to get you what you're after. And one of the first things I suggested, because of your specific circumstances, was that the least frustrating approach might just be for you to get a refund. I thought we were through the rough patch, but clearly we are not, so I'm glad you are now choosing to do what is best for you.

    Figuring out the best way to offer individualized help (hardware, experience level) is the hardest thing, so please forgive me if I have failed at it with you. Hindsight being 20/20, given the challenges of your requirements and experience level, I think it will be better in the future for you if you ask more questions and take less steps on your own with things you don't fully understand.

    One last attempt to clarify: It seems like you misunderstood what version of Daz Studio to install, and I'm sorry if my abbreviation of 4.10 confused you at some point. But I did quote the store page: "The Minimum supported version of Daz Studio is 4.10.0.113" and both Outrider42 and myself recommended you install the latest beta, because you didn't want to mess with your installation of 9.4. The error message you experience indicates you are working with a version of Daz Studio that came out before the changes were made.

  • IceDragonArtIceDragonArt Posts: 12,548

    I don't think most wolves are quite that large.  I imagine he is on the high end of the spectrum.  Most of the wolves I have seen in person are not quite that big.  Because he is like giant sized lol.  Wolves are amazing animals, and most definitely should not be exterminated!

  • barbultbarbult Posts: 20,252
    kyoto kid said:
    barbult said:
    kyoto kid said:
    barbult said:

    Well, I guess I'm doing something wrong with the 3Delight setup. I turned on Gamma Correction and set the gamma to 2.2. The HDRI is blown out (too bright) and the character is washed out looking, too. Shadows are not very dark. I don't see any ground shadows at all. I had to delete the hair entirely. Daz Studio would crash every time until I deleted the hair. The Iray version, which looks much better, took less than 10 minutes to render to 100% convergence. The 3Delight render took 26 minutes. 

    ...do you have a distant light for the sun?

    No, I don't have any conventional lights in the scene. I have the HDRI and one IBL Master boost light.

    I deleted my IBL Master Control from the scene and added a new one. I reset all of the 3Delight render settings to default except Gamma Correction On and gamma 2.2. I rendered again, and now I have the ground shadow and the character is less washed out. Something must have gotten messed up in my IBL Master Control the first time. The 3delight render finished in 3 minutes (not counting the optimizing images). It is a little rough, because the render settings were set back to default samples, etc. 

    It still doesn't look as nice as the Iray version. The light comes from the same direction, but the 3delight HDRI beach sand looks washed out compared to the Iray render. The character looks dark and dry. I'm sure some of this comes down to the (lack of?) quality of the 3delight materials provided for the character and the suitability of those materials for gamma correction. 

    ...what is the intensity setting of your Distant light?  There is also one control in the lighting parameters for teh IBL light calld Intensity Multiplier. it is set ot a default of 5.  Try adjusting that to see if it helps.

    I didn't add a distant light to my scene. Was one added by IBL Master that I am not aware of? I'll look at that multiplier. I left all those parameters at default settings. Thsnks for your suggestions.
  • MariaTortilliaMariaTortillia Posts: 46
    edited January 2018

    At last got it working, thanks to this thread. YOU MUST HAVE CMS RUNNING FOR THIS TO WORK (with the smart content tab open, click the hamburger menu icon in the top left corner and then start CMS) I have it off by default so I think this needs to be stated in the basic instructions

    Post edited by MariaTortillia on
  • AllenArtAllenArt Posts: 6,810

    At last got it working, thanks to this thread. YOU MUST HAVE CMS RUNNING FOR THIS TO WORK (with the smart content tab open, click the hamburger menu icon in the top left corner and then start CMS) I have it off by default so I think this needs to be stated in the basic instructions

    Except that Parris already stated that he didn't know why IBL Master would need CMS ;). When I wrote that, I had done TWO things. Since I didn't know which one worked, I put them both down so that people could try them and see if it worked for them.

    Laurie

  • ParrisParris Posts: 392
    barbult said:
    kyoto kid said:
    barbult said:
    kyoto kid said:
    barbult said:

    Well, I guess I'm doing something wrong with the 3Delight setup. I turned on Gamma Correction and set the gamma to 2.2. The HDRI is blown out (too bright) and the character is washed out looking, too. Shadows are not very dark. I don't see any ground shadows at all. I had to delete the hair entirely. Daz Studio would crash every time until I deleted the hair. The Iray version, which looks much better, took less than 10 minutes to render to 100% convergence. The 3Delight render took 26 minutes. 

    ...do you have a distant light for the sun?

    No, I don't have any conventional lights in the scene. I have the HDRI and one IBL Master boost light.

    I deleted my IBL Master Control from the scene and added a new one. I reset all of the 3Delight render settings to default except Gamma Correction On and gamma 2.2. I rendered again, and now I have the ground shadow and the character is less washed out. Something must have gotten messed up in my IBL Master Control the first time. The 3delight render finished in 3 minutes (not counting the optimizing images). It is a little rough, because the render settings were set back to default samples, etc. 

    It still doesn't look as nice as the Iray version. The light comes from the same direction, but the 3delight HDRI beach sand looks washed out compared to the Iray render. The character looks dark and dry. I'm sure some of this comes down to the (lack of?) quality of the 3delight materials provided for the character and the suitability of those materials for gamma correction. 

    ...what is the intensity setting of your Distant light?  There is also one control in the lighting parameters for teh IBL light calld Intensity Multiplier. it is set ot a default of 5.  Try adjusting that to see if it helps.

     

    I didn't add a distant light to my scene. Was one added by IBL Master that I am not aware of? I'll look at that multiplier. I left all those parameters at default settings. Thsnks for your suggestions.

    Yes, reducing the intensity of the IBLM Light is a good recommendation here (thanks kyoto kid). IBL Master can match lighting direction and quality of the light, but every HDRI is different as are Iray and 3Delight. So there is no way for IBLMaster to automatically match the brightness. It does not add another light to the scene, only the IBL.

    Also, you may be new to using Gamma Correction with 3Delight, in which case there are a few new things to be aware of. If it is too much fuss for you, remember you don't have to use GC if you like the default better. It's just that, if you are trying to get more "apples to apples" with Iray, then it's important to know that Iray does GC by default.

    Gamma Correction corrects how light and shadow are mixed with color. So many of the surface presets and scene lighting that is done without GC is essentially over compensating for the lack of GC (too bright).

    So you should reduce the intensity of lights, consider reducing SSS strength, consider turning off velvet all together.

    For more information on GC, you may find something in my thread on Gamma Correction helpful: https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/54913/approaching-realism-in-daz-studio-and-gamma-correction-demystified

    Also a new version which may be more likely to get updated by me is here:

    https://www.chrisparrishdesign.com/daz-studio/realism-daz-studio-3delight-and-gamma-correction-demystified/

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 39,120
    barbult said:
    kyoto kid said:
    barbult said:
    kyoto kid said:
    barbult said:

    Well, I guess I'm doing something wrong with the 3Delight setup. I turned on Gamma Correction and set the gamma to 2.2. The HDRI is blown out (too bright) and the character is washed out looking, too. Shadows are not very dark. I don't see any ground shadows at all. I had to delete the hair entirely. Daz Studio would crash every time until I deleted the hair. The Iray version, which looks much better, took less than 10 minutes to render to 100% convergence. The 3Delight render took 26 minutes. 

    ...do you have a distant light for the sun?

    No, I don't have any conventional lights in the scene. I have the HDRI and one IBL Master boost light.

    I deleted my IBL Master Control from the scene and added a new one. I reset all of the 3Delight render settings to default except Gamma Correction On and gamma 2.2. I rendered again, and now I have the ground shadow and the character is less washed out. Something must have gotten messed up in my IBL Master Control the first time. The 3delight render finished in 3 minutes (not counting the optimizing images). It is a little rough, because the render settings were set back to default samples, etc. 

    It still doesn't look as nice as the Iray version. The light comes from the same direction, but the 3delight HDRI beach sand looks washed out compared to the Iray render. The character looks dark and dry. I'm sure some of this comes down to the (lack of?) quality of the 3delight materials provided for the character and the suitability of those materials for gamma correction. 

    ...what is the intensity setting of your Distant light?  There is also one control in the lighting parameters for teh IBL light calld Intensity Multiplier. it is set ot a default of 5.  Try adjusting that to see if it helps.

     

    I didn't add a distant light to my scene. Was one added by IBL Master that I am not aware of? I'll look at that multiplier. I left all those parameters at default settings. Thsnks for your suggestions.

    ...most likely the HDR you sere using has it's own "sun".  What I did in mine was just apply the environnment's image to the sphere, not the entire HDR, as it is for Iray rather than 3DL.

  • ParrisParris Posts: 392
    kyoto kid said:
    barbult said:
    kyoto kid said:
    barbult said:
    kyoto kid said:
    barbult said:

    Well, I guess I'm doing something wrong with the 3Delight setup. I turned on Gamma Correction and set the gamma to 2.2. The HDRI is blown out (too bright) and the character is washed out looking, too. Shadows are not very dark. I don't see any ground shadows at all. I had to delete the hair entirely. Daz Studio would crash every time until I deleted the hair. The Iray version, which looks much better, took less than 10 minutes to render to 100% convergence. The 3Delight render took 26 minutes. 

    ...do you have a distant light for the sun?

    No, I don't have any conventional lights in the scene. I have the HDRI and one IBL Master boost light.

    I deleted my IBL Master Control from the scene and added a new one. I reset all of the 3Delight render settings to default except Gamma Correction On and gamma 2.2. I rendered again, and now I have the ground shadow and the character is less washed out. Something must have gotten messed up in my IBL Master Control the first time. The 3delight render finished in 3 minutes (not counting the optimizing images). It is a little rough, because the render settings were set back to default samples, etc. 

    It still doesn't look as nice as the Iray version. The light comes from the same direction, but the 3delight HDRI beach sand looks washed out compared to the Iray render. The character looks dark and dry. I'm sure some of this comes down to the (lack of?) quality of the 3delight materials provided for the character and the suitability of those materials for gamma correction. 

    ...what is the intensity setting of your Distant light?  There is also one control in the lighting parameters for teh IBL light calld Intensity Multiplier. it is set ot a default of 5.  Try adjusting that to see if it helps.

     

    I didn't add a distant light to my scene. Was one added by IBL Master that I am not aware of? I'll look at that multiplier. I left all those parameters at default settings. Thsnks for your suggestions.

    ...most likely the HDR you sere using has it's own "sun".  What I did in mine was just apply the environnment's image to the sphere, not the entire HDR, as it is for Iray rather than 3DL.

    That's a good point. I know some of DT's older HDRI presets do load with an extra light. Maybe some for Iray do to? If so, you can turn the extra light in the scene off or reduce it's intensity. But you should load the HDR onto the IBLM light. It wouldn't be IBL otherwise. 

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 39,120

    ...that is what I did for the bus stop scene.

  • barbultbarbult Posts: 20,252
    edited January 2018

    Thanks, Parris. I appreciate all the tips I can get! I think I've forgotten everything I used to know about 3Delight. I haven't touched it since Iray appeared.

    I am making some progress. I discovered that my IBL Master IBLMLight loaded with Specular Strength set to 0%. Increasing IBLMLight Specular Strength to 100% improved the character's skin appearance.  Since specularity was one of the advertised features, I was surprised to see it load at 0%. Maybe that was to make it default to a more UE2 type IBL??? Edit: Parris pointed out that specularity is included by default and the Specular Strength in the IBLMLight is a sceondary specular (as documented in the 3 planes instructions in the product.)

    I haven't tried changing the Intensity or Intensity Multiplier yet. Does lowering the IBLMLight Intensity reduce the light cast on my character as well as lower the brightness of the HDRI background? Do I need to compensate by increasing the boost light? 

    Lilinoe for Kalea Maui HDRI 3Delight IBLMLight specularity 100.jpg
    2000 x 1500 - 2M
    Post edited by barbult on
  • LianaLiana Posts: 1,035
    Parris said:

    Yes, reducing the intensity of the IBLM Light is a good recommendation here (thanks kyoto kid). IBL Master can match lighting direction and quality of the light, but every HDRI is different as are Iray and 3Delight. So there is no way for IBLMaster to automatically match the brightness. It does not add another light to the scene, only the IBL.

    Also, you may be new to using Gamma Correction with 3Delight, in which case there are a few new things to be aware of. If it is too much fuss for you, remember you don't have to use GC if you like the default better. It's just that, if you are trying to get more "apples to apples" with Iray, then it's important to know that Iray does GC by default.

    Gamma Correction corrects how light and shadow are mixed with color. So many of the surface presets and scene lighting that is done without GC is essentially over compensating for the lack of GC (too bright).

    So you should reduce the intensity of lights, consider reducing SSS strength, consider turning off velvet all together.

    For more information on GC, you may find something in my thread on Gamma Correction helpful: https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/54913/approaching-realism-in-daz-studio-and-gamma-correction-demystified

    Also a new version which may be more likely to get updated by me is here:

    https://www.chrisparrishdesign.com/daz-studio/realism-daz-studio-3delight-and-gamma-correction-demystified/

    Thanks I bookmarked those for more reading. I know I am not use to Gamma correction at all and need to learn more. Thanks for all your help and tips. :)

  • barbultbarbult Posts: 20,252
    edited January 2018
    Parris said:
    kyoto kid said:
    barbult said:
    kyoto kid said:
    barbult said:
    kyoto kid said:
    barbult said:

    Well, I guess I'm doing something wrong with the 3Delight setup. I turned on Gamma Correction and set the gamma to 2.2. The HDRI is blown out (too bright) and the character is washed out looking, too. Shadows are not very dark. I don't see any ground shadows at all. I had to delete the hair entirely. Daz Studio would crash every time until I deleted the hair. The Iray version, which looks much better, took less than 10 minutes to render to 100% convergence. The 3Delight render took 26 minutes. 

    ...do you have a distant light for the sun?

    No, I don't have any conventional lights in the scene. I have the HDRI and one IBL Master boost light.

    I deleted my IBL Master Control from the scene and added a new one. I reset all of the 3Delight render settings to default except Gamma Correction On and gamma 2.2. I rendered again, and now I have the ground shadow and the character is less washed out. Something must have gotten messed up in my IBL Master Control the first time. The 3delight render finished in 3 minutes (not counting the optimizing images). It is a little rough, because the render settings were set back to default samples, etc. 

    It still doesn't look as nice as the Iray version. The light comes from the same direction, but the 3delight HDRI beach sand looks washed out compared to the Iray render. The character looks dark and dry. I'm sure some of this comes down to the (lack of?) quality of the 3delight materials provided for the character and the suitability of those materials for gamma correction. 

    ...what is the intensity setting of your Distant light?  There is also one control in the lighting parameters for teh IBL light calld Intensity Multiplier. it is set ot a default of 5.  Try adjusting that to see if it helps.

     

    I didn't add a distant light to my scene. Was one added by IBL Master that I am not aware of? I'll look at that multiplier. I left all those parameters at default settings. Thsnks for your suggestions.

    ...most likely the HDR you sere using has it's own "sun".  What I did in mine was just apply the environnment's image to the sphere, not the entire HDR, as it is for Iray rather than 3DL.

    That's a good point. I know some of DT's older HDRI presets do load with an extra light. Maybe some for Iray do to? If so, you can turn the extra light in the scene off or reduce it's intensity. But you should load the HDR onto the IBLM light. It wouldn't be IBL otherwise. 

    Ah, I see now why KK is asking about the distant light for the sun. DT's old 3Delight HDR sets like Yosemite do add a distant light. It is best to just load the HDRI from those old sets into the IBL Master, rather than use those presets, I guess. But either way, that does not apply to the DT Iray HDRI I am using.  The Maui HDRI I am using in the beach scene was made for Iray. It does not include any additional lights. 

    Post edited by barbult on
  • ParrisParris Posts: 392
    edited January 2018
    barbult said:

    Thanks, Parris. I appreciate all the tips I can get! I think I've forgotten everything I used to know about 3Delight. I haven't touched it since Iray appeared.

    You're welcome!

    barbult said:

    I am making some progress. I discovered that my IBL Master IBLMLight loaded with Specular Strength set to 0%. Increasing IBLMLight Specular Strength to 100% improved the character's skin appearance.  Since specularity was one of the advertised features, I was surprised to see it load at 0%. Maybe that was to make it default to a more UE2 type IBL???

    The IBLM Light handle specular by default. That is a second optional specular with advanced capabilities. Did you know that there are 3 documents that load as plane props from the same directory as IBL Master? The one on Light Settings mentions this.

    barbult said:

    I haven't tried changing the Intensity or Intensity Multiplier yet. Does lowering the IBLMLight Intensity reduce the light cast on my character as well as lower the brightness of the HDRI background? Do I need to compensate by increasing the boost light? 

    On the 3Delight side, in addition to Boost Lights (which normally point strait towards the center of the scene), you can control the brightness of the background (3DLEnvSphere) in the Surface tab by adjusting Diffuse Strength and/or Ambient Strength. With 3Delight, I actually recommend controlling the background brightness this way, because a Boost Light will cast light on the sphere, where as with Boost Lights in Iray, the Dome background is unaffected.

    Post edited by Parris on
  • ParrisParris Posts: 392
    edited January 2018

    As I have a moment, I want to take this opportunity to thank everyone here who has contributed with questions and to those of you who have started to pitch in by helping each other with answers. Together we have created a wealthy resource of information which will continue to help others as time goes on. Great job!

    As time allows, I will try to consolidate FAQ at the beginning of this thread, and will be posting more on my website as well, so the key points will be preserved in case something ever happens to this thread. But please note (disclaimer): *** Free technical support for IBL Master provided by me in this thread is not included when you purchase this product. Like all products sold at Daz (unless otherwise stated by the author), official technical support is provided by Daz through the Help Center. ***

    Any effort I make to help beyond the documentation I provide is purely out of a desire to be helpful. I can't sustain the level of support I've provided here initially because I would go broke. So as questions start to become repeats, and instances indicate you didn't read the documentation I put in the same directory as IBL Master, or watch the video, etc., no problem smiley, but I will rely more heavily on folks helping each other. I hope you understand and I thank you for your support.

    Over time, I've noticed some assumptions made which confuse issues with Daz Studio versions or unfamiliarity with sciences like IBL and Gamma Correction, as problems with IBL Master. Please, please, try not to jump to conclusions. I've got a good track record for fixing things, so if something I've done is broken, I will fix it. This product has been very thoroughly tested over the course of a year. There are no known bugs, but there is some new technology in this and a bit new in DS as well as many new things unrelated which have been added to the versions of Daz Studio that support IBL Master. So there may be many things you have never experienced so far, which aren't actually caused by this product.

    For instance, if you didn't use HDRs before this, and you start using really big ones, you could be experiencing crashes as a result of over taxing DS and your system's available resources. I will say again though, that this product is just a lighting rig with some props attached and a new IBL light shader. It doesn't have the power to hose your system, break Daz Studio, or mess up your existing library. I hope that is reassuring. smiley

    Thanks All!

    Post edited by Parris on
  • barbultbarbult Posts: 20,252
    edited January 2018
    Parris said:
    barbult said:

    Thanks, Parris. I appreciate all the tips I can get! I think I've forgotten everything I used to know about 3Delight. I haven't touched it since Iray appeared.

    You're welcome!

    barbult said:

    I am making some progress. I discovered that my IBL Master IBLMLight loaded with Specular Strength set to 0%. Increasing IBLMLight Specular Strength to 100% improved the character's skin appearance.  Since specularity was one of the advertised features, I was surprised to see it load at 0%. Maybe that was to make it default to a more UE2 type IBL???

    The IBLM Light handle specular by default. That is a second optional specular with advanced capabilities. Did you know that there are 3 documents that load as plane props from the same directory as IBL Master? The one on Light Settings mentions this.

    barbult said:

    I haven't tried changing the Intensity or Intensity Multiplier yet. Does lowering the IBLMLight Intensity reduce the light cast on my character as well as lower the brightness of the HDRI background? Do I need to compensate by increasing the boost light? 

    On the 3Delight side, in addition to Boost Lights (which normally point strait towards the center of the scene), you can control the brightness of the background (3DLEnvSphere) in the Surface tab by adjusting Diffuse Strength and/or Ambient Strength. With 3Delight, I actually recommend controlling the background brightness this way, because a Boost Light will cast light on the sphere, where as with Boost Lights in Iray, the Dome background is unaffected.

    I love that you keep pointing back to the provided documentation, like the product page, video, and 3 planes.  yes (That is a serious comment; I'm not being sarcastic.). It lets users know what learning resources are available and maybe were overlooked.

    I know about those three documentation planes, and I have read them several times. I think the problem for me is that none of that makes much sense to novice or old, forgetful, 3Delight users. (Our problem - not yours. frown) It is not your job to completely educate us on 3Delight, but your help is much appreciated!!! The work, thought and cleverness you have put into this product is amazing.

    I really dislike that the only documentation included in the purchased product is those 3 planes. When I add them to my scene, they are not easily visible. I have to switch cameras, zoom and pan around to find and see them. Then hide them and switch cameras back again to continue with my scene work. I would much prefer a nice PDF that I can keep open in another window on an adjacent monitor. I understand why you made the planes, so people could find the documentation in the product, but a nice script link to open a PDF would have been preferable for me. I wonder if that is possible.

    Anyway, I am going to try your suggestions for lowering the 3Delight sphere brightness. Thanks for explaining the different ways that the boost light work in Iray vs. 3Delight. 

    Post edited by barbult on
  • barbultbarbult Posts: 20,252

    Note: I haven't had any Daz Studio crashes since I got rid of the Daz Connect installation of IBLMaster and am using the DIM installed version. I haven't tried transmapped hair or LAMH yet. 

  • ParrisParris Posts: 392
    edited January 2018
    barbult said:

    I know about those three documentation planes, and I have read them several times. I think the problem for me is that none of that makes much sense to novice or old, forgetful, 3Delight users.

    No worries, but please be more specific about what you don't understand, if possible. Is the concept of a second specular confusing? "None of that makes sense ..." is rather a broad stroke.smiley

    barbult said:

    I really dislike that the only documentation included in the purchased product is those 3 planes. When I add them to my scene, they are not easily visible. I have to switch cameras, zoom and pan around to find and see them. Then hide them and switch cameras back again to continue with my scene work. I would much prefer a nice PDF that I can keep open in another window on an adjacent monitor. I understand why you made the planes, so people could find the documentation in the product, but a nice script link to open a PDF would have been preferable for me. I wonder if that is possible.

    Certainly, I will add a PDF. Thank you for the reccomendation. However, I'm not sure if you are anticipating different content that will make things easier to understand somehow, or would just be satisfied with the same information in PDF form. This forum has given me some clues about what might need further explanation, though.

    In the mean time, you can have the documention open in another window by just opening the PNG files in an image viewer. You can find them in your Library, in Runtime > Textures > Parris > IBL Master.

    Post edited by Parris on
  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 39,120
    edited January 2018

    ...good suggestion (one of those "why didn't I think of that?" facepalms).

    Post edited by kyoto kid on
  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 39,120
    barbult said:

    Note: I haven't had any Daz Studio crashes since I got rid of the Daz Connect installation of IBLMaster and am using the DIM installed version. I haven't tried transmapped hair or LAMH yet. 

    ...the girls in the scene I am using both have trasnmapped hair.  I had to increase the opacity on Leela's hair as with Gamma Correction on and a Gamma rate of 2.2 it looked as thin and wispy as it did in Iray before making the same adjustment.

  • ParrisParris Posts: 392
    kyoto kid said:

    ...good suggestion (one of those "why didn't I think of that?" facepalms).

    Thank you. I have to admit, though, I kind of have to facepalm for not reccommending it sooner. Or maybe I did a few pages back ... It's starting to get fuzzy ...

  • 3dOutlaw3dOutlaw Posts: 2,465

    OK, had time for a very quick first attempt!  Not terrible, but I am sure I am missing some things...like she has no shadow cheeky and her skin shaders seem to have some "silver" in there, which is probably a surface issue. (...this is a default 3Delight render with IBL master, and a character of mine merged into the scene)  I'll give it some more time tonight, and see if I can make it better.  This was only literally a 10 minute setup, and a very quick render.  I'll switch to a more dramatic HDRI for the second test/update.

    (click for bigger)

    ATTEMPT 1

    ATTEMPT 2 (coming soon)

     

  • barbultbarbult Posts: 20,252
    Parris said:
    barbult said:

    I know about those three documentation planes, and I have read them several times. I think the problem for me is that none of that makes much sense to novice or old, forgetful, 3Delight users.

    No worries, but please be more specific about what you don't understand, if possible. Is the concept of a second specular confusing? "None of that makes sense ..." is rather a broad stroke.smiley

    barbult said:

    I really dislike that the only documentation included in the purchased product is those 3 planes. When I add them to my scene, they are not easily visible. I have to switch cameras, zoom and pan around to find and see them. Then hide them and switch cameras back again to continue with my scene work. I would much prefer a nice PDF that I can keep open in another window on an adjacent monitor. I understand why you made the planes, so people could find the documentation in the product, but a nice script link to open a PDF would have been preferable for me. I wonder if that is possible.

    Certainly, I will add a PDF. Thank you for the reccomendation. However, I'm not sure if you are anticipating different content that will make things easier to understand somehow, or would just be satisfied with the same information in PDF form. This forum has given me some clues about what might need further explanation, though.

    In the mean time, you can have the documention open in another window by just opening the PNG files in an image viewer. You can find them in your Library, in Runtime > Textures > Parris > IBL Master.

    Yes, "none" was not a helpful term. I should know better. Sorry. blush Thanks for asking for further clarification of my confusion.

    A better explanation is probably: I had a problem. My character's skin looked very dull and flat. It looked like the specular was missing. I know that the product says it provides specular, unlike UE2. I looked for how to turn specularity on, because the render didn't look like I was getting specularity. In the IBLM Light Settings documentation, the first mention of specular is the description of Specular Model. It says "The IBLM Light does specular already. This setting is only active when Specular Strength is set higher than zero."  The part about "does specular already" wasn't clear enough to make me understand that I should have been seeing specularity without doing anything to the default settings. I just thought it meant that it was an available feature, and I was still looking for how to turn it on. The part about the specular model "only active when Specular Strength is set higher than zero" still made me think I needed to set Specular Strength higher than 0 to get specularity. I thought that with no Specular Model, I would get no specularity. I was not at all clear about a "specular" and a "second specular", even though the Specular Strength says "second specular". The term "second specular" didn't mean anything to me at that point. Maybe it would have been clearer if Specular Strength was described before Specular Model, but I probably still would not have understood. In the context of your additional comments in this thread, about specular and second specular and the need to probably modify the character surface settings, rereading the specular documentation made more sense.

    This documentation of specular parameters on the IBLM Light didn't really help me understand how to solve my problem of the dull flat skin, though. Turning on second specular helped, but I was clueless to the fact that the first specular was not showing up, (perhaps due to bad skin surface settings).  I think my problem goes beyond the scope of simple definition of parameter settings. Maybe there needs to be a bit more explanation of the specularity provided by the IBLM Light and how object surface settings can imact that. I can understand though, if you feel that is out of scope.

    So, another specularity question: Do Specular Roughness and Specular Samples apply only to Second Specular or both. It is not stated in the parameter description.

  • barbultbarbult Posts: 20,252
    Parris said:
    kyoto kid said:

    ...good suggestion (one of those "why didn't I think of that?" facepalms).

    Thank you. I have to admit, though, I kind of have to facepalm for not reccommending it sooner. Or maybe I did a few pages back ... It's starting to get fuzzy ...

    I believe you did. I just now used Photoshop to combine the 3 images into a PDF. Now I have that as a handy reference.

  • LlynaraLlynara Posts: 4,770

    Wow, I should've watched that video first. Very clear and easy to understand. Thanks, Chris, for putting it together and for your patience. I didn't realize before that you could move and position the boost lights. I'm going to blame illness and go play again now that I'm feeling better.

  • ParrisParris Posts: 392
    barbult said:
    Parris said:
    kyoto kid said:

    ...good suggestion (one of those "why didn't I think of that?" facepalms).

    Thank you. I have to admit, though, I kind of have to facepalm for not reccommending it sooner. Or maybe I did a few pages back ... It's starting to get fuzzy ...

    I believe you did. I just now used Photoshop to combine the 3 images into a PDF. Now I have that as a handy reference.

    Very good. Ok, now everything you said makes sense and gives me a clear understanding of where improvement  can be made with the documentation on Specular. Thank you.

    barbult said:

    So, another specularity question: Do Specular Roughness and Specular Samples apply only to Second Specular or both.

    All specular settings refer to the second specular, which is optional. So you can get more specular reaction if you use the second specular, but it will be applied to every surface the light hits. So if you want oilier skin but not shinier clothing, for example, you should adjust the specular settings on the skin shader instead. 

  • ParrisParris Posts: 392
    Llynara said:

    Wow, I should've watched that video first. Very clear and easy to understand. Thanks, Chris, for putting it together and for your patience. I didn't realize before that you could move and position the boost lights. I'm going to blame illness and go play again now that I'm feeling better.

    Thank you for the compliment. By the way I saw your renders in the other thread. Looking good and thanks for reporting render times!

  • I'm still loving this product and I really like how well hair renders with the 3Delight..still very quick.  My only other question is sometimes the eyes just look odd in 3Delight.  I had another product that did this before and I returned it a long time ago.  I think it might just be an HDRI/3Delight issue for me.  Is this a "light too bright" on the eyes type deal or do I need to tweak the surface texture of the eye? Or do I need a helper light on the face in this instance?  Her eyes are supposed to be blue, but to me they look silvery-gray.   I don't have this issue in IRAY with the eyes just the 3Delight. 

    Ideas, tips, and tricks would be appreciated.  Thank you :)

    silver eye.PNG
    1081 x 600 - 1M
    Serein.jpg
    1650 x 2670 - 3M
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