How to Use dForce: Creating a Blanket, Draping Clothes on Furniture, and Much More [Commercial]

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  • RGcincyRGcincy Posts: 2,690
    edited December 2018

     

    65. Men’s Underwear. I’ve started digging into applying dForce to existing clothing. As most have experienced, it’s hit or miss. Now that there’s an ever increasing amount of dForce-designed clothing available in the stores, you could rely on that but most users will have an extensive back catalog of clothing they may want to use. I decided to start with some of the items that may be overlooked. In this section, I’ll look at underwear.

    a. The first one is Basic Wear Boxer Briefs that comes with Genesis 3 Starter Essentials. These are tight fitting conformed clothing that will move with the figure’s pose.

    b. Load a Genesis 3 male and the briefs.

    c. Go to the Parameters pane and turn on smoothing for the briefs.

    d. Set up an animated timeline with an exaggerated crouching pose at frame 12. I used Crouch Ready from DA Lucian 7 Shadow Pose Set.

    e. Add a dForce dynamic modifier and run with default surface settings. It works but you’ll see some separation from the waistband and the main body of the briefs. They will also be very tight fitting.

    f. I kept the waistband surface at default settings but changed the main surface to Stretch Stiffness 0.3, Bend Stiffness 0.2 and Contraction-Expansion Ratio to 110%. The latter gives a somewhat looser fit.

    g. The following sequence of frames compares the non-dForce results (left) with the dForce results (right):

    Frame 4: Looser fit with dForce

      

    Frame 8: dForce allows some folding of fabric by the hips and a less stretched texture pattern

      

    Frame 12: the full crouch

      

    You can use more or less Contraction-Expansion to vary the tightness of fit.

    h. Here are the same briefs but in a sitting pose. Contraction-Expansion Ratio was set to 105%. No dForce on left, dForce on right.

      

    i. The next item tested is BV Underwear from Beach Vibes Outfit for Genesis 3 Male(s).

    j. These exploded with default settings so I used dForce settings similar to the first example (step f) except Contraction-Expansion was 103%. You could get by just changing Bend Stiffness to 0.2.

    k. The following sequence of frames compares the non-dForce results (left) with the dForce results (right):

    Frame 4:

      

    Frame 8:

      

    Frame 12:

      

     

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    Post edited by RGcincy on
  • I have a sort of semi-related matter to the post above:

    What do you do when you want to have a character wearing older-product underwear underneath their older-product pants and then want to, say, pull their pants and underpants down to go to the bathroom?  Presumably you'd want the underpants to lay loosely inside the lowered pants that are also now hanging loosely around the character's ankles.  Similarly, you'd want to be able to deal with how it behaves when both pants and underpants are about at his knees as he's in the middle of bringing them down and is in the midst of bringing himself down into a seated position.  I tried to do something like this some while back, having done whatever the minimum was to apply dForce to both germents (and without really understanding yet the tweeks-and-twiddlings involved beyond just clicking to add dforce to the respective garments) and I'm really hazey on what options I'd set when applying dforce, but one or the other garment exploded, so I must have set something wrong somewhere.

  • nicsttnicstt Posts: 11,478

    Hi

    new to daz and trying to animate clothes with dforce. why is it that sometimes clothes immediately are torn in certain places as soon as you start simulating? im trying to simulate a rather loose piece of cloth and at the start of the simulation the loose parts start to fall down but as soon as there is a force that stops them from falling they get destroyed. how do you fix this?

    They are non-dforce clothes?

    If they aren't designed for dforce, then there can be issues, including those you describe.

  • RGcincyRGcincy Posts: 2,690

    What do you do when you want to have a character wearing older-product underwear underneath their older-product pants and then want to, say, pull their pants and underpants down to go to the bathroom?  

    Interesting question. Conceptually it's doable but it would depend upon the clothing items behavior. I'll have to take a look. 

     

    I'm really hazey on what options I'd set when applying dforce, but one or the other garment exploded, so I must have set something wrong somewhere.

    You probably didn't do anything wrong as many clothing items do that (explode or even worse, crash DS). I usually start by setting Stretch Stiffness to 0,3 and Bend Stiffness to 0.2 as that seems to help most items. I also set any collars, waistbands, buttons, pockets, strings, etc.surfaces to a Dynamic Strength of 0 (you can go back and change those to 1.0 later to see if it matters). Test each item of clothing separately to verify they will make it through without exploding or crashing (save whatever scene you setup before starting a sim in case it does crash). Watch for pinch points in poses and adjust to leave a little space.

  • DanaTADanaTA Posts: 12,303

    It would be nice if someone started a list of older clothing items that work well with dForce.  Just a thought.

    Dana

  • frankrblowfrankrblow Posts: 2,052
    DanaTA said:

    It would be nice if someone started a list of older clothing items that work well with dForce.  Just a thought.

    Dana

    Someone did, @DanaTAhttps://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/207066/dforce-verified-functional-clothing-out-of-the-box/p1

  • DanaTADanaTA Posts: 12,303
    DanaTA said:

    It would be nice if someone started a list of older clothing items that work well with dForce.  Just a thought.

    Dana

    Someone did, @DanaTAhttps://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/207066/dforce-verified-functional-clothing-out-of-the-box/p1

    Oh, thanks for that!

    Dana

  • RGcincyRGcincy Posts: 2,690
    edited January 2019

    What do you do when you want to have a character wearing older-product underwear underneath their older-product pants and then want to, say, pull their pants and underpants down to go to the bathroom?  

    This is what I came up with. Not perfect but shows it is possible. I'll writeup what I did for these particular clothing items.

    dForce toilet.png
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    Post edited by RGcincy on
  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 9,703

    Well that's uh.. impressive!  LOL 

  • RGcincyRGcincy Posts: 2,690

    Real life!  cheeky

  • RGcincyRGcincy Posts: 2,690
    edited January 2019

     

    66. Shorts and Swim Trunks. These are similar to the underwear covered in section 65.

    a. The first shorts I looked at are from Beach Vibes Outfit for Genesis 3 Male(s). There are five surfaces: Backpockets, BeltLoops, Button, Shorts, WaistBand.

    b. Add a dForce dynamic modifier.

    c. For all the surfaces except Shorts, set Dynamic Strength to 0.

    d. Set Stretch Stiffness to 0.3 and Bend Stiffness to 0.2.

    e. Run a simulation. I found that some vertices at the leg opening “stuck” and led to a few elongated polygons stuck to the leg (left image). Turning smoothing on for the shorts in the Parameters pane unsticks them but you can still see the points (right image), it’s just not attached to the leg anymore.

      

    f. To correct this, add a static dForce modifier to the G3M figure and set friction to 0 and set friction to 0.1 on the shorts surface. This will allow the fabric to slide more smoothly. You can also set Shear Stiffness to 0.55 to counteract the cloth being wrapped around the left knee. Either one alone seems to work but I applied both in the following simulation results.

    g. Here’s the results comparing no dForce on left and dForce on right.

    Frame 4:

      

    Frame 8:

      

    Frame 12: the dForce version show the fabric being pulled by the leg movement

      

    Frame 16: note how the left leg has pulled up towards the hip; this is caused by momentum from the figure’s posing. I would use frame 12 which was where the pose was set.

      

    h. Since frame 16 showed the left leg of the shorts gathering at the hip, you can counteract this by setting Shear Stiffness to 0. This actually will cause the fabric to elongate which hurts the appearance in earlier frames but helps in later frames. Here’s a comparison of 0.55 Shear Stiffness on left (what was used above) and 0.001 Shear Stiffness on right.

    Frame 1: note the elongation with 0 Shear Stiffness. Note how some gaps appear at the pocket and the zipper.

      

    Frame 4:

          

    Frame 8: the lower Shear Stiffness keeps more of the cloth over the knee but also leads to bigger gaps and more stretch between the legs

      

    Frame 12: the shorts remain longer as this style should

      

    Frame 16: the zero Shear Stiffness doesn’t show the gathering by the hip

      

       The moral of the story is the pose and posing dynamics (i.e., speed of change in the pose) will affect the results you obtain.

    i. Instead of shorts, here’s some swim trunks. These are from H&C Rash Guard Outfit for Genesis 3 Male. Add the dynamic dForce modifier and set Stretch Stiffness to 0.3 and Bend Stiffness to 0.2 as we did for the underwear and shorts.

    j. Using the same pose, you get something that looks like this at frame 16:

    No dForce: baggier, a gap near crotch

    dForce: more pulled in as you would expect from the legs spreading, right leg shows fabric hanging open rather than stuck up near leg

    Rendered scene:

    dForce bv shorts frame 11 stretched polygons.jpg
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    dForce bv shorts frame 16 - 0 shear.jpg
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    dForce swim trunks frame 16 no df.jpg
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    Post edited by RGcincy on
  • RGcincy said:

    What do you do when you want to have a character wearing older-product underwear underneath their older-product pants and then want to, say, pull their pants and underpants down to go to the bathroom?  

    This is what I came up with. Not perfect but shows it is possible. I'll writeup what I did for these particular clothing items.

    Thank you for being responsive on this.  That said, it would be useful to have a guide on how to have the underwear nested inside the pants, perhaps with the wasteband sticking out the top a little, but where the undies are largely countoured into the inside of the pants, the sort of thing that would result if someone pulled their pants and underpants down as one unit.  That's actually what I was picturing when I first asked about it.

  • mx90209mx90209 Posts: 69
    Praxis said:

    Used your idea of the "intruding cube" (attached Bouncing_Ball_02.duf)

    (Updated Nov 20 to render in IRay)

    This stuff is really impressive. How can we do our own polyline thingies? I read that we can both import and export them in Daz3D, so supposedly we don't need Cinema4D to accomplish this?

  • SzarkSzark Posts: 10,634
    edited January 2019

    I am finally getting around to using deforce but I am stumped and cannot find the answer YET.

     

    I have a static object already posed and everytime I hit simulate the object moves to a new position and thenmoves to where it has been placed and posed. I didn't set any key frames when placing and posing said figure. How to stop it from moving when I hit Simulate.

     

    Its ok I found the amswer, Turn OFF Start Bones From Memorized Pose

    Post edited by Szark on
  • By default the Simulation sets the figure back into its memorised pose, then moves it to the actual pose applied. Usually you want this - it makes sure there is no poke-through if the memorised pose is the zero pose - but if you don't you can turn the option off in Simulation Settings. You can chnage the memorised pose by applying the one you want, then going to Edit>Figure>Memorise>Memorise Figure Pose.

  • SzarkSzark Posts: 10,634
    edited January 2019

    I did try the later and it didn't work. SO I would have to save a pose first (as it was a custom pose) to reapply before Memorize Figure Pose? 

    Post edited by Szark on
  • Well, what are you wanting? if you just want to simulate in that pose (and don't think it will explode due to self-intersection) just turn off the Start From Memorised Pose setting in Simulation Settings.

  • SzarkSzark Posts: 10,634

    Thanks I appreciate your input Richard. I get it now.

    That is what I did and btw it is called Start Bones From Memorized Pose, I turned it off and bob your uncle :) Yeah it is just a simple drape of a plane over an object. A test of sorts to see if I can place duckweed on the back of a turtle. The Turtle itself is pretty dense, mesh wise so no problem there with exploding. I could have done it all in textures and normal mapping but hey I got to play with my new GC and learn this. :) I haven't been able to use deforce until now.

  • seamanqseamanq Posts: 29

    Thank you so much for posting this tutorial.  It was exactly what I needed, and did a good job of walking me through the steps to create a "blanket" to drape over my sleeping character, while draping realistically.  Your instructions worked perfectly right out of the gate, and I am using Daz 3D 4.10.  Thanks again.

  • seamanqseamanq Posts: 29
    seamanq said:

    Thank you so much for posting this tutorial.  It was exactly what I needed, and did a good job of walking me through the steps to create a "blanket" to drape over my sleeping character, while draping realistically.  Your instructions worked perfectly right out of the gate, and I am using Daz 3D 4.10.  Thanks again.

    Just as a side note, I was setting up a bed that was under a bunk bed, so I had to move everything out of underneath so that the "blanket" would not drape over the bunkbed frame.  In order to facilitate moving everything back, I set the blanket as the parent and made the character and bed the chiildren.  I was thus able to do the draping properly over the bed.  Once I got the draping done, I put the bed back into position, then "unparented" the character and bed from the draped blanket.  The character's shoulder was sticking out slightly from the blanket, but I followed your tip of raising the blanket on the Y-axis by a unit, and that fixed it.  Thanks so much for your contribution!

  • RGcincyRGcincy Posts: 2,690

    @seamanq  glad it's working for you and thanks for the feedback

  • PraxisPraxis Posts: 211
    edited January 2019
    mx90209 said:

    This stuff is really impressive. How can we do our own polyline thingies? I read that we can both import and export them in Daz3D, so supposedly we don't need Cinema4D to accomplish this?

    Sorry about the delay in responding - I've been without Internet for the last 3 weeks.

    Yes, you can create and use Polylines and dForce Add-Ons using just DAZ Studio - I used Cinema4D only because I already had a C4D script that did most of what was needed to create the .OBJ file containing the Polyline for this particular dForce Add-On.

    At present (unless I've missed something in the last 3 weeks), it requires use of some kind of DAZ Script - start here: generate_polyline_dynamic_surface_addon

    Please also read the existing discussions of dForce Add-Ons in this excellent thread: See the "dForce Add-On Modifier" section on Page 1 of this thread.

    You can create the .OBJ file I used in my example, load it into DAZ Studio, and set it up as a dForce Add-On Modifier for the Ball, all using just DAZ Script - Updated 18-Jan-2019: I have posted a Script that does this in the DAZ Script Developer Discussion Forum

    It should also be possible to load the generated Polyline geometry as an Add-On directly within DAZ Studio via Script (without creating an external .OBJ file and Importing it), but I have not yet been able to get this working correctly - when I do, I'll post it to the Script Forum as well, and update this post with a link to it (but don't expect this to happen for at least 3 weeks ).

    I expect that a number of PAs are working on products that will make this kind of thing easy to create and use, and that those products will start appearing within a month or two (but this is pure guesswork on my part - I have no inside knowledge of this).  Updated 18-Jan-2019: Existing products that appear to use dForce Add-Ons:

    P.

    Post edited by Praxis on
  • mx90209mx90209 Posts: 69
    edited January 2019

    Thank you Praxis! 

    Does anybody know if there's a way you can use entirely hard objects attached to something in dforce? Say a metal part in a piece of clothing. I know about the weight maps of course, but I mean when you want the object to parcipate in the simulation while being hard. For example moving about with the rest of the clothing without deforming like a piece of cloth.

    Post edited by mx90209 on
  • felisfelis Posts: 1,403
    mx90209 said:

    Thank you Praxis! 

    Does anybody know if there's a way you can use entirely hard objects attached to something in dforce? Say a metal part in a piece of clothing. I know about the weight maps of course, but I mean when you want the object to parcipate in the simulation while being hard. For example moving about with the rest of the clothing without deforming like a piece of cloth.

    My suggestion:

    * Make the hard object seperate piece(s).

    * Parent that piece to the d-force mesh by a rigid follower node

    * Simulate

  • RGcincyRGcincy Posts: 2,690

    This hammer drop describes adding a rigid follow node in step f

  • Digital Art LiveDigital Art Live Posts: 119
    edited January 2019

    We have another dForce webinar weekend (2 sessions) event planned for the 16th and 17th of February, with RGcincy leading us a little deeper into the newer experiments and discoveries associated on this thread. So if you'd like to see these explained in real time and have a chance to ask Richard questions on the spot, then please join us!

    https://digitalartlive.com/event/more-dforce-discoveries-for-daz-studio/

    dForce webinar event

     

    Post edited by Chohole on
  • RGcincyRGcincy Posts: 2,690
    edited January 2019

    I like to point our interesting uses of dForce found in other threads. Sven Dullah shows a city and cars being demolished using dForce. I haven't given this a try but the results are intriguing.

     

    Post edited by RGcincy on
  • MattymanxMattymanx Posts: 6,657

    Im sure if a wind node was added to the city, it would give a good enough result that it wouldn't take much to post process the rest of the destruction

     

    RGcincy,

    I just want to say thank you for this thread and all the info you posted from your own trials.  It has been a real help now that I have been using dForce more.

  • RGcincyRGcincy Posts: 2,690

    Thanks Mattmanx. I'm happy you find it helpful.

    Adding a wind node is a good suggestion. May make for a good hurricane or tornado scene.

  • RGcincyRGcincy Posts: 2,690
    edited February 2019

    After my post on momentum transfer, Praxis shared an animation of a bouncing ball. He recently posted a more elaborate example using moving cubes to cause a ball to bounce (this post shows how the cubes were positioned).

    Post edited by RGcincy on
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