September 2017 – DAZ 3D New User Challenge – Focus/DOF

mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 14,998

Are you new to the 3D World? Are you at the beginning stages of learning 3D rendering? Have you been around for a little bit but feel you could benefit from some feedback or instruction? Have you been around awhile and would like to help other members start their creative journey? Well then come and join the fun as we host our newest contest...

"Focus/Depth of Field"

This month's focus will be on Depth of Field/Focus.

Depth of Field is basically controlling what part of the image is in sharp focus. A couple of explanations, from the world of photography (so not everything is applicable, but the definitions and basics do apply when rendering).

http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tutorials/depth-of-field.htm

http://digital-photography-school.com/understanding-depth-field-beginners/

Also, keep in mind all the various items covered over the past several months, because things like Portraits can greatly benefit from applying DoF.

So far this year we have covered the following topics:

Composition

Lighting

Posing

Action & Props

Scenes and Landscapes

Portrait Rendering

Inspiration:

Tips and Examples:

Studio:

http://flipmode3d.com/depth-of-field-daz-studio/

http://www.versluis.com/2015/04/how-to-render-with-depth-of-field-in-daz-studio/

http://www.sharecg.com/v/52258/browse/3/PDF-Tutorial/DAZ-Studio-Tutorial-Depth-of-Field

http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/19195/daz-depth-of-field-settings-a-general-starting-point

Poser:

http://www.keindesign.de/stefan/poser/dof_p5.html

http://www.trekkiegrrrl.dk/DOFtut1.htm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNTpR_qiA1Y

Bryce:

http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/3855/

Carrara:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gliniNqq8_k

Useful Tools:

Poser: DoF Script http://www.sharecg.com/v/85624/browse/8/Script/Easy-DoF-for-poser

Other Helpful Links:

When following tutorials, be cognizant of the different applications (Bryce, Daz Studio, Poser, Carrara Blender, etc.) and different render engines (3Delight, Iray, Reality, etc). Techniques for one may not apply directly to another. If you have some favorite portrait lighting and composition tips, please share them in this WIP thread.

Composition Golden Ratio helpers:
Bryce
DAZ Studio (Also, DS has a built in Rule of Thirds guide; just select Show Thirds Guide in the Viewport context menu)

Don't forget to look at previous themed contests where information and hints are available.

For a list of the current contest rules, please see this thread : Challenge Rules.

Post edited by DAZ_ann0314 on
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Comments

  • Here's my start for this month. Yet again running in the shadows with the start of a new crew.

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  • Kismet2012Kismet2012 Posts: 3,200

    Here's my start for this month. Yet again running in the shadows with the start of a new crew.

    Interesting start Shinji.  It might be the angle but his right foot looks like it is intersecting the floor. 

     

    Can't wait to see the rest of the crew when it shows up.

     

  • Got the rest of the crew in their rough positions, and the new version rendering now. Went and removed the table that was next to my first crew member becouse two of the new crew members would have been compleatly out of view otherwise. Added a third member of the five new crew members in the lower area looking for information like one of the two who'd have been hidden by said table is doing. While that's going on, my first character and the remaining two new crew members are covering the three doors leading into the room. In fact to make sure I wasn't way off on the respective aiming of each of the ones covering the doors, I went so far as to create new cameras and parent them to the crew members, and as I tweeked their position/rotation I was viewing things from their respective camera to see where they had their gub aimed even though we don't see any of the doors in question.

     

    Sorry about rambling, and any spelling mistakes I had if any, but it's about 12:30 in the morning where I am as I type this.  So off to bed, and I'll go posting version b in the morning after it's done rendering, and I'm awake enough to go about doing so.

  • Here we go. Changes are listed in lastnights post.

    sept2017b.png
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  • daybirddaybird Posts: 314

    Here we go. Changes are listed in lastnights post.

    Don't like the light here so much. The yellow color looks flat and unnatural.

    What I really miss is some action in the scene. 
    It looks like a static pic and maybe the position of the middle woman in the front is not logical. She came up the stairs and took this position, to guard the area? I think she should run or sneak in our direction.

    The scene has great potential, so hurry up. Lot's of work to do. wink

  • HighElfHighElf Posts: 52
    edited September 8

    So here is my approach to the theme of the Month. "Zahlen-Krimi" (Crime Numbers). I set the f/stop of the camera to the same as in the tone mapping of the render settings '8'. Also I set the shutter and the ISO to a value of 100. That's why the scene is a little bit bright. I tried to understand some things of the DoF, so I tried to show it in a more playfull way. And I hope you like mysteries as I do. :) 

    I've placed the numbers in a specific way. The '1' is exactly the middle if the focus. The '2' is just behind the edge of the focus and the numbers '3' and '4' are placed at a equal-ish distance to show the fall off of the sharpness.

    The picture, right now, is WIP. There are some things I don't get yet. Like the strange shadow in the flashlight or the small reflection at the bottom ground. Also I'm a little but confused by the degradation of the sharpness. It degresses so fast. oO And please don't look too close at some shaders, I've mixed and matched some Gen1, Gen2 and Gen8 stuff here. XD

     

    Zahlen_Krimi

    Zahlen_Krimi_WIP.jpg
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    Post edited by HighElf on
  • daybirddaybird Posts: 314
    HighElf said:

    So here is my approach to the theme of the Month. "Zahlen-Krimi" (Crime Numbers). I set the f/stop of the camera to the same as in the tone mapping of the render settings '8'. Also I set the shutter and the ISO to a value of 100. That's why the scene is a little bit bright. I tried to understand some things of the DoF, so I tried to show it in a more playfull way. And I hope you like mysteries as I do. :) 

    I've placed the numbers in a specific way. The '1' is exactly the middle if the focus. The '2' is just behind the edge of the focus and the numbers '3' and '4' are placed at a equal-ish distance to show the fall off of the sharpness.

    The picture, right now, is WIP. There are some things I don't get yet. Like the strange shadow in the flashlight or the small reflection at the bottom ground. Also I'm a little but confused by the degradation of the sharpness. It degresses so fast. oO And please don't look too close at some shaders, I've mixed and matched some Gen1, Gen2 and Gen8 stuff here. XD

     

    Zahlen_Krimi

    Nice touch with the bloody hand on the warddrobe.yes

    I think you should move the camera angle, so that the man and the yellow 1 sign  lines up with the rule of third lines. ( how to activate see attachment)

    I find the pool of blood a little bit to big. I think he should show us, that the victim lay there for a longer time and looses much blood, but the fine splashes around him cause the impression there should be also splash on the warddrobe.

     

    Rule of Third.jpg
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  • HighElfHighElf Posts: 52
    edited September 8
    2 to 3 Liters. To be exact. :) But I can play with the splatter. I places One of the Points in the blue Fingerprint. Nur I guess the policeman is the more obvious Choice. I will play with that either after my workshift
    Post edited by HighElf on
  • daybird said:

    Here we go. Changes are listed in lastnights post.

    Don't like the light here so much. The yellow color looks flat and unnatural.

    What I really miss is some action in the scene. 
    It looks like a static pic and maybe the position of the middle woman in the front is not logical. She came up the stairs and took this position, to guard the area? I think she should run or sneak in our direction.

    The scene has great potential, so hurry up. Lot's of work to do. wink

    Like I mentioned in my post while my curent version was rendering, there are three doors leading into the room my crew is in. The three members on the upper level are covering each of those doors becaouse the crew's been detected and guards are on the way. Problem is, that while they know that the guards are in route, they don't know what door(s) the enemies will be using to enter, so they have guns on each of the doors to try and hold the guards off when they arive.

     

    Sorry about the quick ramble, but I have to be out the door to head into work in about 10 minutes, I'll see what I can do when I get home this evening. I agree with you though on the lights, I was using the campfire settings from the Real Lights for DAZ Studio Iray. shader set, and they don't work.

  • daybirddaybird Posts: 314
    daybird said:
    HighElf said:

     

    The picture, right now, is WIP. There are some things I don't get yet. Like the strange shadow in the flashlight or the small reflection at the bottom ground. Also I'm a little but confused by the degradation of the sharpness. It degresses so fast. oO And please don't look too close at some shaders, I've mixed and matched some Gen1, Gen2 and Gen8 stuff here. XD

    I suspect the shadow in the light of flashlight is the reflection of the bed, or better saying, the wardrobe has a reflecting surface and the bed appeared through the light on him.

     

  • HighElfHighElf Posts: 52
    edited September 8

     

    daybird said:
    daybird said:
    HighElf said:

    The picture, right now, is WIP. There are some things I don't get yet. Like the strange shadow in the flashlight or the small reflection at the bottom ground. Also I'm a little but confused by the degradation of the sharpness. It degresses so fast. oO And please don't look too close at some shaders, I've mixed and matched some Gen1, Gen2 and Gen8 stuff here. XD

    I suspect the shadow in the light of flashlight is the reflection of the bed, or better saying, the wardrobe has a reflecting surface and the bed appeared through the light on him.

     

    That can be. I will try some settings or another wood shader preset. May be that got rid of this shadow.

    Post edited by HighElf on
  • HighElfHighElf Posts: 52
    edited September 9

    So I fiddled with quite a few things.

    - The blood puddle is now smaller and repositioned, to fit an abdomial injury and a blood stained hand.

    - I've shifted and turned the shield with the '1' a littlebit, to make it a little bit more outstanding.

    - Changed the camera Angle so that the glowing fingerprint isn't the point of interest. Now it's the policeman

    - The shadow in the flashlight cone, gives me some headdache. It's not a reflective thing. I changed the position of the lamp in different ways, and the patten moves with it. Right now I think, that's a behaviour of the smaller brighter cone or the particles in the light b/c the flashlight is too close at the door.

    - started to applay some more current shader presets on the uniform. (the leather parts)

    Zahlen-Krimi_WIP02.jpg
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    Post edited by HighElf on
  • Here's version c. Due to getting a late start on working on the darn thing last night, the only change I can conferm is to the settings on the overhead lights to something that feels more like what I'm going for.

    sept2017c.png
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  • ricswikaricswika Posts: 108
    edited September 9

    I'm not really a New User, but saw the contest and thought it would be a good time to focus on DOF. I don't have any problems controlling DOF; I do have a hard time deciding on how much DOF is just right. Too much, and you loose a lot of the surface detail and background. Too little, and there is no focal point. Here I bracketed the DOF from f5.6 to f56 to see the range of options available.

    I am leaning towards f/35 to f/56 because I want to focus on the entire figure, not just the face. At f/56 you can still see the focus change along the legs and you can see all of the detail on the skin and stockings.

    • Title: East Witch on Broom
    • S/W: Daz Stuido Iray - no post work
    • G2F
    • Storybook Bundle - textured stockings, shoes and skin myself building on supplied files

     

    imageimageimageimageimageimage

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    Post edited by ricswika on
  • Kismet2012Kismet2012 Posts: 3,200

    A really interesting series ricswika. It really shows the differences between the settings.  I find my eye stays focused on the Witch's face in the first version (f5.6).  With each version following, and the more of her that comes into focus my eye travels over more of the image. 

    A great example of the power of DOF.

  • Kismet2012Kismet2012 Posts: 3,200

    Here's version c. Due to getting a late start on working on the darn thing last night, the only change I can conferm is to the settings on the overhead lights to something that feels more like what I'm going for.

    I like the light colour better in this verison.  I agree it was too yellow in the prior version.  It looks a little dark.  Is that because it needed more time to render?

  • Kismet2012Kismet2012 Posts: 3,200
    HighElf said:

    So I fiddled with quite a few things.

    - The blood puddle is now smaller and repositioned, to fit an abdomial injury and a blood stained hand.

    - I've shifted and turned the shield with the '1' a littlebit, to make it a little bit more outstanding.

    - Changed the camera Angle so that the glowing fingerprint isn't the point of interest. Now it's the policeman

    - The shadow in the flashlight cone, gives me some headdache. It's not a reflective thing. I changed the position of the lamp in different ways, and the patten moves with it. Right now I think, that's a behaviour of the smaller brighter cone or the particles in the light b/c the flashlight is too close at the door.

    - started to applay some more current shader presets on the uniform. (the leather parts)

    Is the scale of the room off compared to the policeman and the figure's outline?  The bed and wall panels seem quite large but that could be the style of the room.

     

  • HighElfHighElf Posts: 52

    Yeah it's the style of the room paired with the perspective of the camera. The room itself is proper scaled for Gen8 models, as far as I can see. Btw. I've xperimented a little bit with the flash light, and found out that this pattern is part of the light. I've tested it in different environments and on different materials, and it always appears. Currently I suspect the fake cone light and the particles in it.

    *wait for the new render to be completed*

  • ricswikaricswika Posts: 108

    A really interesting series ricswika. It really shows the differences between the settings.  I find my eye stays focused on the Witch's face in the first version (f5.6).  With each version following, and the more of her that comes into focus my eye travels over more of the image. 

    A great example of the power of DOF.

    Thanks. It is hard, to decide, in a vacuum, on how much DOF is right. If you are telling a story, at least you have some reason to use either a narrow or deep focus. When you are just making an image, it comes down to what looks more interesting. After spending so much time getting the surfaces right, it is so hard to put them out of focus. But I know the imagination of the viewer will still fill in the missing detail even when out of focus. It is hard to put yourself in the place of the viewer after working so closely.

    So yes, I think as an image by itself, the witch is more effective and interesting with only the face in focus.

  • ricswikaricswika Posts: 108
    HighElf said:

    So I fiddled with quite a few things.

    - The blood puddle is now smaller and repositioned, to fit an abdomial injury and a blood stained hand.

    - I've shifted and turned the shield with the '1' a littlebit, to make it a little bit more outstanding.

    - Changed the camera Angle so that the glowing fingerprint isn't the point of interest. Now it's the policeman

    - The shadow in the flashlight cone, gives me some headdache. It's not a reflective thing. I changed the position of the lamp in different ways, and the patten moves with it. Right now I think, that's a behaviour of the smaller brighter cone or the particles in the light b/c the flashlight is too close at the door.

    - started to applay some more current shader presets on the uniform. (the leather parts)

    Is the scale of the room off compared to the policeman and the figure's outline?  The bed and wall panels seem quite large but that could be the style of the room.

     

    Agree. What focal length lens are you using?

  • ricswika said:

    I'm not really a New User, but saw the contest and thought it would be a good time to focus on DOF. I don't have any problems controlling DOF; I do have a hard time deciding on how much DOF is just right. Too much, and you loose a lot of the surface detail and background. Too little, and there is no focal point. Here I bracketed the DOF from f5.6 to f56 to see the range of options available.

    I am leaning towards f/35 to f/56 because I want to focus on the entire figure, not just the face. At f/56 you can still see the focus change along the legs and you can see all of the detail on the skin and stockings.

    • Title: East Witch on Broom
    • S/W: Daz Stuido Iray - no post work
    • G2F
    • Storybook Bundle - textured stockings, shoes and skin myself building on supplied files

     

    imageimage

    Ultimately, it all comes down to what you the artist likes and wants to use as a focus for your image.  We all have different tastes.  For example, if it had been me, I would have chosen one of these two DOFs as I like how they focus on the face and the rest of her sort of blurs out at different degrees.  That being said, f56 is a nice image with a good DOF for what you described as your goal of wanting the whole witch in sharp focus.  The DOF in the background is nicely done at the setting.  I thought it was an interesting exercise to see what such small changes to DOF can do to an image.

     

     

    HighElf said:

    So I fiddled with quite a few things.

    - The blood puddle is now smaller and repositioned, to fit an abdomial injury and a blood stained hand.

    - I've shifted and turned the shield with the '1' a littlebit, to make it a little bit more outstanding.

    - Changed the camera Angle so that the glowing fingerprint isn't the point of interest. Now it's the policeman

    - The shadow in the flashlight cone, gives me some headdache. It's not a reflective thing. I changed the position of the lamp in different ways, and the patten moves with it. Right now I think, that's a behaviour of the smaller brighter cone or the particles in the light b/c the flashlight is too close at the door.

    - started to applay some more current shader presets on the uniform. (the leather parts)

    Is the scale of the room off compared to the policeman and the figure's outline?  The bed and wall panels seem quite large but that could be the style of the room.

     

    I think it is the style of the room.  I recognize that room as I considered getting it when it first came out.  Here is the promo shot for it and it shows the same proportions as this render.

    @HighElf  The render looks good, but I have a hard time focusing on any one thing in the render other than the police officer which is kind of awkward for that type of scene.  Not a problem with the police officer being the focus.  I think it's the back view of the officer that is giving me issues.  I wonder what you happen if you changed the camera angle so the you had a better view of the officer's face with the blood and the fingerprint in the background?  I guess it depends on your ultimate goal with the image.  If you just want a crime scene, I would pull back more, and change the focus off of the police officer.  If you want a crime scene, but have more focus on the officer and his reaction to the scene, whatever that might be, you should to focus on his face instead of his back.  Right now I see a good image, but nothing specific that really has the focus of the scene.

    I hope that helps.  Please remember that these are just suggestions.  Ultimately, your vision of what the final image should be should always take precedence over any suggestions given.

  • HighElfHighElf Posts: 52

    I wanted him, to be just a distraction. ;) I'm more interested in the crime scene as such and the sharpness falloff showen by the numbers. I will see, what I can do with an other camera angle. And a few more details to the crime itself. *throw the last render out of the "windows 8"*

  • Here's version d. Mostly I was changing render settings to try and lighten things up a little without making things too bright. I also dubbled the max time and boosted the max samples up to 15000, (not that that helped it reached the max time way before it met the max samples.)

    Total Rendering Time: 4 hours 1 minutes 52.81 seconds

    sept2017d.png
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  • LomrikLomrik Posts: 53
    edited September 13

    Something I am working on.

    runner1.jpg
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    Post edited by Chohole on
  • NoswenNoswen Posts: 50
    edited September 13

    Never used the DoF setting before, so here is my first attempt at the entry for this month, somewhat related to my picture for last month's smiley

    Combat Testing

    I did originally have another fallen opponent, but that went into CPU rendering mode, so had to remove one of them, then had to start making things out of camera view invisible as well to squeeze it into the GPU (GTX 1070).

    Combat Testing.jpg
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    Post edited by Chohole on
  • daybirddaybird Posts: 314
    edited September 13
    Lomrik said:

    Something I am working on.

    Great work with this scene.

    For my feeling the DoF is perfect balanced and I really like the colors and the contrast between the woman and the nature.
    She pulls the eyes automatically in her direction.yes

    Post edited by daybird on
  • daybirddaybird Posts: 314

    First time, that I try to use motion blur with Daz. The picture is only a testrender.(pic 1)

    One big question. Can I do that only in 3Delight? When I try it in Iray, it only renders the current frame and ignores the timeline.(pic 2)

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  • Kismet2012Kismet2012 Posts: 3,200
    daybird said:

    First time, that I try to use motion blur with Daz. The picture is only a testrender.(pic 1)

    One big question. Can I do that only in 3Delight? When I try it in Iray, it only renders the current frame and ignores the timeline.(pic 2)

    Unfortunately, Motion Blur does not work in Iray.

  • Kismet2012Kismet2012 Posts: 3,200
    Noswen said:

    Never used the DoF setting before, so here is my first attempt at the entry for this month, somewhat related to my picture for last month's smiley

    Combat Testing

    I did originally have another fallen opponent, but that went into CPU rendering mode, so had to remove one of them, then had to start making things out of camera view invisible as well to squeeze it into the GPU (GTX 1070).

    A really interesting scene.  At the moment my eye is drawn to the arm, hand and boot of the person flying through the air.  Part of that could be the DOF settings but taking the hitters face out of the shadows may also help.

  • Here's version e. Only change is giving the rightmost lady on the upper level some primitive cybernetic eyes. I mean some old-chrome eyes.  You can see them a glow if you look.

    sept2017e.png
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