The Realism Challenge - Biased VS Unbiased Showdown

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  • DustRiderDustRider Posts: 2,385
    edited December 1969

    Kyoto Kid said:
    dustrider said:
    There are some really amazing renders here, especially those in the past two pages. It makes Octane look really appealing :)

    I looks like Cycles might be a good option as well, I'm really impressed with the last image posted by 3doutlaw.

    I've been playing with Reality 3 and Lux the past couple of weeks, but I'm not even close to what y'all are doing yet. At least I'm finally getting some use out of Poser 2012 (never bee able to get along very well with Poser lighting). I'm getting closer to the results I can get with Carrara now, but my focus isn't photo realism, just realistic 3D.

    The link below is to my second render using Reality3, not as good as the images posted here, but I thought I'd share as I learn. Warning, the image has "nudity". I really like the way Reality3 handles the conversion of the skin shaders. Lux is great render engine, just sloooowww.
    http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=2434136


    ...worked with 2010 on the old system. Ran pretty well in 32 bit compared to S3Advanced. I particularly liked the ability to render in background mode the Queue Manager as it made best used of the limited memory resourced I had. I could also use Occlusion and Ray Tracing which in 3Delight would be a quick trip to a crash.

    I do hear you about Poser's lighting system. I find Daz to be much more intuitive and more like working with actual stage lighting. Then there's the ability by one click to view though a spotlight like a camera for fine tuning.

    I have Reality 2.5 for Daz which will mean an entirely different learning curve with lighting as it approaches the task more from a photographer's, rather than theatrical lighting tech's angle. I messed around with 35mm photography but not at a truly professional level and most of my work was out of doors usually photographing events like airshows, races, kite festivals, etc. Also going to need to learn a lot more about surface properties, something when I worked with oil paints or picked up the old Richo SLR wasn't much of a concern other than if I could see it, I could paint or shoot it.

    Waiting for the Daz version of R3 so we can get SSS to help with skin tones (and make rendering go even slower).

    I've got Reality 2.5 for DS too, and will jump on Reality3 for DS as soon as it comes out. I haven't used Reality that much with DS because I can actually get decent lighting in DS fairly easily, and the render times are a bit faster. I've dabbled with Luxus a bit as well, and it has some really nice features, but I like Reality3 better so far. I still prefer Carrara though, but it's been a lot of fun to finally use Poser 2012 :red: without fighting with the lighting.

    I have zero art or photographic training, I just do this for fun. I'm obviously not nearly as talented as most of the people here, or ar rendo, rdna, deviant art, etc. But, I am continually amazed when I actually create something that someone else likes!! It's kind of like "Wow, I actually made that?", cause I'm definitely no artist!!

  • Type 0 NegativeType 0 Negative Posts: 316
    edited May 2013

    Hello,

    Just by looking at these, can you all tell what these were rendered with?

    What render engine or engines did I use to create these images?

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    Post edited by Type 0 Negative on
  • daveleitzdaveleitz Posts: 459
    edited December 1969

    Hello,

    Just by looking at these, can you all tell what these were rendered with?

    I like the one on the bottom, right the best.

  • LindseyLindsey Posts: 1,858
    edited December 1969

    So impressed with the OctaneRender demo, sprung for a standalone and Daz plugin licenses with my tax return. Still have lots to learn. Hollywood Hills HDRI environment courtesy of sIBL Archive. Sean on a M5/F5 character.

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  • BobvanBobvan Posts: 2,604
    edited December 1969

    DS R2 Lux for a few sold commissions http://bobvan.deviantart.com/art/Coming-attraction-366713511?q=gallery:bobvan&qo=0 click on DA link for large files

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  • BobvanBobvan Posts: 2,604
    edited December 1969
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  • TjebTjeb Posts: 507
    edited December 1969

    @Type 0 Negative:

    All four look incredibly good. I've used R2/Luxrender and I've used Octane.
    But I can't tell what is what.
    I'm guessing: you used all four: 3Delight, Firefly, Luxrender, Octane.

  • Type 0 NegativeType 0 Negative Posts: 316
    edited December 1969

    tjeb said:
    @Type 0 Negative:

    All four look incredibly good. I've used R2/Luxrender and I've used Octane.
    But I can't tell what is what.
    I'm guessing: you used all four: 3Delight, Firefly, Luxrender, Octane.

    Thanks for guessing, I hoped there would be several guesses.
    Answer is; they were all done in DS4.5 with 3Delight.
    I was testing myself. I wanted to see if anyone could tell if my renders were Biased or Unbiased.
    and Thanks for the compliment daveleitz68

    We have two groups of people around these forums. Those who swear by unbiased renderers like Lux (Reality) or Octane and those who are adamant they can produce the same results in their biased software of choice (Poser, Studio, Carrara, Bryce etc.)

    So the challenge is simply this. Don't argue your case but render it. Show us that you are indeed better able to use your software of choice than the next guy is able to use his.


  • hzrhzr Posts: 192
    edited May 2013

    Here is some good old fashioned V-Ray for you.

    I have tons of shots that are probably better than this, but since I am mostly rendering adult stuff, these wouldnt be tame enough to be posted here ;)

    I am by no means a pro in this, but in my oppinion v-ray has the best of both worlds. It comes close to unbiased quality but you can tweak it so it will only take a fraction of the time in complex scenes. Especially indoor scenes are really taking long on unbiased render engines, but with v-ray you get these done quite fast if done correctly.

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    Post edited by hzr on
  • ThomasB_79ThomasB_79 Posts: 49
    edited December 1969

    Some pictures from Modo (biased) engine

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  • Joe CotterJoe Cotter Posts: 3,234
    edited May 2013

    fasttam said:
    Some pictures from Modo (biased) engine

    Wow! Very nice :)

    It is all beautiful, but the skin and water in particular stand out for me. How much work did you have to do to the surfaces to get them looking like that? I would be interested in anything you cared to share, especially regarding the skin and water :)

    Post edited by Joe Cotter on
  • maraichmaraich Posts: 423
    edited December 1969

    I'd be interested in learning that too.

  • BobvanBobvan Posts: 2,604
    edited December 1969
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  • BobvanBobvan Posts: 2,604
    edited December 1969
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  • BobvanBobvan Posts: 2,604
    edited December 1969
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  • ThomasB_79ThomasB_79 Posts: 49
    edited May 2013

    Gedd said:
    fasttam said:
    Some pictures from Modo (biased) engine

    Wow! Very nice :)

    It is all beautiful, but the skin and water in particular stand out for me. How much work did you have to do to the surfaces to get them looking like that? I would be interested in anything you cared to share, especially regarding the skin and water :)

    The water is just a preset from Modo's materials library. :-P
    The skin shader it's not difficult because Modo has a very easy to setup SSS. Also has a material setup system easy to understand, at least for me.
    Here is the skinFace material. 4 maps control the defuse color, the bump, the specular (reflections) amount and the SSS amount.
    The "render" you see upper left is the real time preview render window.

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    Post edited by ThomasB_79 on
  • Joe CotterJoe Cotter Posts: 3,234
    edited December 1969

    Wow, thanks... so the real answer is just get Modo ;p

  • DimeolasDimeolas Posts: 191
    edited May 2013

    ..

    Post edited by Dimeolas on
  • Rashad CarterRashad Carter Posts: 1,775
    edited December 1969

    That's probably going to get removed. Personally I hope it doesn't but it might be just a little bit too much. Nice work though, very nice especially in the folds of the skin.

  • Joe CotterJoe Cotter Posts: 3,234
    edited December 1969

    Yes I agree, very nice :)

  • ChoholeChohole Posts: 33,308
    edited May 2013

    I do apologise, but after much debate we did indeed decide that the image should probably be removed until such time as we gain some Content Advisory filters.

    Post edited by Chohole on
  • DimeolasDimeolas Posts: 191
    edited December 1969

    ...my fault, I had forgotten that i`m in the wrong place...

  • ChoholeChohole Posts: 33,308
    edited December 1969

    It's not that you are in the wrong place, it is just that we don't have content filters, much as we wish we did.

  • RNRDV8RNRDV8 Posts: 3
    edited December 1969

    I've only used a biased renderer so I can't really say anything negative about unbiased renderers ,but, when Mike was told he would be rendered unbiased he was left with a bad taste in his mouth.

    Here's a quick one from mentalray.

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  • Laticis ImageryLaticis Imagery Posts: 403
    edited December 1969

    There is much room for improvement here but this is my first real attempt at using Area Lights in DS.

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  • Kevin SandersonKevin Sanderson Posts: 1,603
    edited December 1969

    pete.c44 said:
    Here is an animation done with Octane Render. Yes, there was a bit of postwork in AE.But a lot of the footage is "as is".


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Hf0CuzCGok&feature=youtu.be


    I don't even want to think how long that took to render. Evening doing a simple unbiased render on Lux took me nearly a whole day for just a few seconds of footage.

    My semi-informed guess is it's not as long as you're thinking by a long shot. Paul posted 300 s on the YouTube page, so that means when Octane hit 300 s the image was done and on to the next. They were also smaller low res frames. Depending on his Nvidia card, and especially if he was using the direct lighting kernel, it could be well under a minute a frame.

  • mCasualmCasual Posts: 4,300
    edited December 1969

    3doutlaw said:
    ...and then there is Cycles via mcjTeleblender :) Does a pretty nice render in 8 minutes. (CLICK HERE for bigger)

    wow that looks so great !

    ( the silver lining of being in the ditch in L.A. is that the lighting is good )

  • kalazarkalazar Posts: 415
    edited December 1969

    Here's a quick render in Daz4 with Reality, Done with two lights and no tweaking or postwork . This took 15 min in Reality

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  • Joe CotterJoe Cotter Posts: 3,234
    edited December 1969

    The horses look very nice, but the shadows have a reflection similar to water... it looks like some setting isn't quite right there.

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