Working Props...
eclark1849
Posts: 211
in The Commons
I'm mostly a Poser modeler, but from time to time, I include DS in my workflow. Plus knowing how you guys feel may help some DS modeler out so...
I just finished modeling some bedroom furniture and the drawers are all individual and work separately. But is that actually necessary? Does anyone really care if the dresser drawers or cabinet doors work? It doesn't take that much more effort for the drawers although the doors do take a little extra effort, but I'm really curious to know if the extra effort for this bit of realism is wasted or appreciated.
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Comments
It is always nice if things work...these days customers appreciate the extra efforts.
+1 for functioning props. They can provide greater flexibility in both creativity and storytelling.
Yes, that extra effort is appreciated.
I am sure that 99% of the time people including furniture in a render the draws/doors etc are closed, however in that 1% of the time you need one or more to be open, then it is a real pain if this can not be done. I think for large items, in particular wardrobes, opening doors are a must.
Well of course, how could you go to Narnia if the wardrobe's door doesn't open?
Does importing an articulated prop into DS from Poser, reset the origin? What's up with that?
I don't think so... But I'm not sure how you mean importing... Usually I make stuff into a PP2 and add it to DS's Poser runtime... I had one model that I vaguely recall giving a problem with origin... It was on an aircar I made, with a flight control yoke with different joints and the steering shaft was at an angle... I think the steering shaft kept resetting to a horizontal position... But I think in the end it was something stupid I did and not actually either DS or Poser's fault...
Mostly stuff seems to stay where I set it... But I also tend to parent stuff, so that might make a difference if you are not.
By the way are you taking about World origin, or like when you reset the center point of a joint?
If you are having a problem with hinges, you could try my lazy trick... I hate using the joint editor in poser... When I make a hinged door, I create a tiny pin or cylinder within the hinge, where the pivot point (or center of rotation) would be... When I import everything into Poser, I parent the door to that... I make that pivot pin invisible and name that part and its y axis dial "Door: Open/Close".
Its simpler to set up the part in the modeler for me and makes stuff hinge more precise... It's more parts, but less fussy. If this is a terrible description, you could DL my "Simple Room" prop (ShareCG) and look at the door hinge in it.
In a personal sense, I like props that work, and I try to always make them work when I can.
In a professional sense there is zero point in building in features you can't market directly through the promos. Do you have time/space to do a render that shows the drawers or cupboards open? Then sure, go for it. Otherwise a lot of users will just shrug and buy it anyway if it looks cool. This 100% explains why a lot of things have gorgeous textures and no movement features. Movement features don't add to a product's value unless you can advertise them adequately.
Opening drawers and doors are a great bonus, but I'll admit - I mostly see it as a bonus. At least for smaller drawers/doors. Wardrobes do indeed need to open.
Most often what happens when a product doesn't have those features is is I'll say "that looks cool" and buy it, then sometime down the road try to use it in a scene where I need the drawer open, find that it doesn't, and then go digging through my library for something that does. So it probably won't change my purchasing *that* product, but it may affect if I buy something else in the future. (Knowing that on the last product by vendor X I bought, the drawers didn't open, I may wait for a better sale/not bother for the next product by vendor X in case it's missing some rarely used but useful feature.)
The way we do it now is if it can be rigged it is.
Some things I really need to work. Others don't bother me so much. Lately I have wanted to do renders of showers. Not having shower knobs which turn and are stuck at off really kills the realism. I will now be returning sets that don't have essential parts I need which function.
I love it when doors and drawers actually work. If I'm on the fence about buying a product and I know it has working parts, that will tend to push me over to put it in my cart. However, if the piece is cool enough or the style matches what I like in a prop or hits that part of my brain that says I must have, I'll buy it without working parts.
LOL, I can't recall ever paying attention to shower knobs before
as someone that models lots of my own props and knows nothing of rigging, I guess ever becoming a PA is out of the question, LOL
I created a prop from Doctor Who once, a center console for his TARDIS from one of the sets used on the show. His consoles are always hexagonal but this variant was a steampunky old victorian looking thing and the console had little lids over the controls, as if it was a hexagonal victorian writing desk. SInce it's a hexagon all the lids were angled off the X/Y axes so I dutifully aligned all the axes in the joint editor so they opened and closed properly and saved it out but yeah, it got all wonky going into Poser and vice versa with the orientations resetting and the lids not working correctly. I never did get it to work properly with one prop for both apps. I'm sure there's a way but I never figured it out.
I don't have that problem EC....how are you importing your objects and what do you have checked?
Laurie
Actually, it wasn't imported. I simply opened the file from the Poser library. It was something I had done in Poser, can't remember what it was, but when I tried to open the file in DS the joint origin had reset it self.
You are honestly better off learning to rig in DS. You can still use the poser rigging system for your mechanical props in DS but the tools in DS are very powerful and easy to use.
i never noticed before because I have never attempted to render a scene with actual running water before... but after attempting to do a shower scene with the water turned on it looked mighty odd to have the knobs not function at all especially in modern sets
If im paying for it, I want it to work. Dosent mean ill use it, but I wont buy it in the first place if I find out the drawers dont work.
One way to cut down the number of moving parts, but still have functionality, is to use a morph to open/close each drawer. So for a wardrobe with 2 doors and 6 drawers, rather than 9 body parts, you have 3, with 6 morphing drawers*.
* Note that any morph for an object which rotates - ie. a door - looks horrible at anything but 100%. But on sliding objects (Ztrans), it's fine
However, this means the drawers are limited to opening/closing. If someone wants to lay a drawer on the floor, they can't. You have to decide how many people would want to go that extra step.
That is importing, it uses the DzPZ3Importer plug-in.
Nowadays, if we made props that did NOT have full functionality, we'd CERTAINLY hear about it on the forums.