Art, the arts, CGI comics, Graphic Arts, AI and everything else.

Griffin AvidGriffin Avid Posts: 3,829
edited December 2025 in Art Studio

Who?: Griffin Avid (Drew Spence) - Approaches comics from a general ART perspective. Fine Arts background (BA in Fine Arts) and Graphic Arts.

What? CGI comics, using rendered images as a foundation of your work and from there going wherever you want.

When? 2015 Started using Daz Studio and released a bunch of comics and graphic novels since then. Did a bunch of workshops in the Daz Store with Digital Art Live about comics, from A to Z.

Where?: The Dynamic Univserse. I've been doing music and art since...well a really long time time. 

Why?: I think most of us could use a little boost and help to keep from making a lot of early mistakes (that I made).

----------------------------------

1) Calibrate your monitors. I still see people sharing dark renders in art groups- where you can't really see the details. There's several hardware devices that you can use to correct your monitor- to display proper brightness/contrast, color, etc.

If I don't, what happens? Your work will not look consistent across devices, and print dark- since most people have their computer control the settings and it's set for "reading emails brightness". 

2) Sequential Art is not the same as making kool pictures. They are separate. Expressing an event through a series of images is a developed skill. If someone gets confused panel-to-panel, you have an issue.

3) The rules of Art (and comics) still apply to you. Just because you are using rendered images does not mean that the generally accepted conventions do not apply to you. Break rules when you need to and you should rarely need to.

Readers will have expectations on how a comic will function. This is true for layout and presentation. Keep it easy to read. 99.9% of the Good Art and Design Rules apply to making good comic art as well.

4) Story still matters. Flashy art is enough to get the initial engagement- even a sale. But the story is what will remain. If the story isn't worth telling across multiple mediums, it's probably not a strong enough story. If it only works with the CGI approach, then it should be worked harder to say more. A cool idea is not a cool story.

5) Get a Mentor. Find someone who is doing or has done what you want to do. Books and YouTube are great resources, going to a source is just as valuable (if not more valuable).

6) Get an Editor. Find someone who edits as a service and have them go over your work. Don't take it personal. Stop with the attitude, stop with the ego and just address/fix it.

07) Accept that "Styles" evolve over time. If you hunt for perfection, you will forever be 'almost ready'. Artists grow and change as they develop and gain new experiences. This leads to many not liking their earlier work. Well, guess what? Whatever you do now will someday be your earlier work

08) Start small and grow BIG. Do not make your most epic story idea first. Make some good pages. Make a good short story. Work your way up to a good comic/graphic novel. Learn from what you've already done. DO NOT START WITH A SERIES.

09) Do not make comics for other people who make comics. You want respect from your peers, not sales.

10) Respect Retailers and Readers. Their opinion matters. Take your book/work to them and get feedback. If you're nervous or want super-truthful feedback. Tell them it's your friend's book. lol

More to come.

Post edited by Griffin Avid on

Comments

  • I think a reason for overly dark images is nothing to do with poorly calibrated hardware, but just the fact that if you made the image youself, you see it differently to somebody else. You know exactly what's going on. You know that shadow is somebody's arm and that other one is just a tree. The fact that you know what you're looking at means that it appears perfectly clear to you, whilst the reader remains (literally) in the dark.

    One trick I do to avoid over-dark images is to look at the thumbnails. If I can't see what's going on in a thumbnail (worst case, it just looks like a black square!) it's probably too dark. Of course, like any rule, it can be broken for effect, but you should be doing that deliberately, not by accident!

  • David RDavid R Posts: 463
    edited November 2025

    chris-2599934 said:

    I think a reason for overly dark images is nothing to do with poorly calibrated hardware, but just the fact that if you made the image youself, you see it differently to somebody else. You know exactly what's going on. You know that shadow is somebody's arm and that other one is just a tree. The fact that you know what you're looking at means that it appears perfectly clear to you, whilst the reader remains (literally) in the dark.

    One trick I do to avoid over-dark images is to look at the thumbnails. If I can't see what's going on in a thumbnail (worst case, it just looks like a black square!) it's probably too dark. Of course, like any rule, it can be broken for effect, but you should be doing that deliberately, not by accident!

    As someone who's created images on one computer and viewed them on another, I can say, yes, the brightness and contrast varies from machine to machine and monitor to monitor.   Not sure what the solution is, if any.

    Post edited by David R on
  • David RDavid R Posts: 463

    Griffin Avid said:

    Who?: Griffin Avid (Drew Spence) - Approaches comics from a general ART perspective. Fine Arts background (BA in Fine Arts) and Graphic Arts.

    What? CGI comics, using rendered images as a foundation of your work and from there going wherever you want.

    When? 2015 Started using Daz Studio and released a bunch of comics and graphic novels since then. Did a bunch of workshops in the Daz Store with Digital Art Live about comics, from A to Z.

    Where?: The Dynamic Univserse. I've been doing music and art since...well a really long time time. 

    Why?: I think most of us could use a little boost and help to keep from making a lot of early mistakes (that I made).

    ----------------------------------

    1) Calibrate your monitors. I still see people sharing dark renders in art groups- where you can't really see the details. There's several hardware devices that you can use to correct your monitor- to display proper brightness/contrast, color, etc.

    If I don't, what happens? Your work will not look consistent across devices, and print dark- since most people have their computer control the settings and it's set for "reading emails brightness". 

    2) Sequential Art is not the same as making kool pictures. They are separate. Expressing an event through a series of images is a developed skill. If someone gets confused panel-to-panel, you have an issue.

    3) The rules of Art (and comics) still apply to you. Just because you are using rendered images does not mean that the generally accepted conventions do not apply to you. Break rules when you need to and you should rarely need to.

    Readers will have expectations on how a comic will function. This is true for layout and presentation. Keep it easy to read. 99.9% of the Good Art and Design Rules apply to making good comic art as well.

    4) Story still matters. Flashy art is enough to get the initial engagement- even a sale. But the story is what will remain. If the story isn't worth telling across multiple mediums, it's probably not a strong enough story. If it only works with the CGI approach, then it should be worked harder to say more. A cool idea is not a cool story.

    5) Get a Mentor. Find someone who is doing or has done what you want to do. Books and YouTube are great resources, going to a source is just as valuable (if not more valuable).

    6) Get an Editor. Find someone who edits as a service and have them go over your work. Don't take it personal. Stop with the attitude, stop with the ego and just address/fix it.

    07) Accept that "Styles" evolve over time. If you hunt for perfection, you will forever be 'almost ready'. Artists grow and change as they develop and gain new experiences. This leads to many not liking their earlier work. Well, guess what? Whatever you do now will someday be your earlier work

    08) Start small and grow BIG. Do not make your most epic story idea first. Make some good pages. Make a good short story. Work your way up to a good comic/graphic novel. Learn from what you've already done. DO NOT START WITH A SERIES.

    09) Do not make comics for other people who make comics. You want respect from your peers, not sales.

    10) Respect Retailers and Readers. Their opinion matters. Take your book/work to them and get feedback. If you're nervous or want super-truthful feedback. Tell them it's your friend's book. lol

    More to come.

    I'd love to know how to grow.  I've received some extremely positive feedback from individuals, leading me to beleive that I could grow to a larger audience.  Any ideas on  how to do that? 

  • the brightness and contrast varies from machine to machine and monitor to monitor.   Not sure what the solution is, if any.

    Calibrate your monitor and create work that doesn't push the edges of readibility and clarity and it will look fine across devices. 

    Use reference images for your own set up. Aside from measuring, you can compare the average against your work.

    I could grow to a larger audience.  Any ideas on  how to do that?

    This honestly sounds like a business question. That's a broad and general question, so the answer would be generic.

    There's a 1,000 videos, articles, blogs and books about marketing, promotions and even networking.

    I don't give business advice, but you would need SPECIFIC advice tailored to you exact situation, goals and needs.

    --------------------

    This thread is made for people getting started...

     

  • Griffin AvidGriffin Avid Posts: 3,829
    edited November 2025

    11) Organize your ideas and assets. The CG comic springs out a bit differenty than traditionally (drawn) artworks, but many parallels exist. A comic is basically a still frame of animation and the CG comic is a still frame from a CG animation- much closer to movie making. You build a cast of characters, wardrobe (dressing/outfitting them), choosing/building sets/locations. Matching your scenes to your script, and then assembling pages.

    As I've stated in workshops, your script is a living document that keeps changing and growing over time. You will most likely make a Master Document for your work that has the full description, names of all characters, places and props- basically it's a Guide Book for your own work(s). The planning stage may contain a list of items from the Daz Store (or where else) or assets you intend to use. This is a good practice, as the name of the item might be hard to remember or find in the future. As you work, there can be a Master Folder that has the primary copy of all important assets. That's where you would save the final version of a character or repeating object(s) that you plan to reuse. Using your Browser to bookmark items in catergories is also a method of easy organization.

    12) Test Everything. Never rely on a first impression or your imagination for how things will work. If you plan to use a location, open the location and explore it. This is like scouting a location. for the most part, you may find unforseen limitations (nonfunctional doors, missing walls, difficult camera angles, glued-together props, etc) or new story ideas may arrive once you see the details and features. Render your character, dressed and ready to go. Test poses, expressions, etc.

    13) Use a naming system and stick to it. For my first comic, all my Daz-Scene-saves were named by describing what was happening in the scene, not according to the section of script. So later, when I needed to go back and reload a scene it was very hard to find out what image matched what saved scene. As long as your convention is consistent and easy to follow, you should be fine. A scene could be called 01Opening_01Splashpage. The next scene you save could be called 01Opening_02HesSleeping. The 'Opening' is the first section and the 01Splashpage is pretty obvious. The scene in your script, the Daz Scene Save and the image name should link. So the first section of your comic is called The Opening in your script. Having a proper system will also allow you to jump around and render out different sections of the story without getting lost.

    This is the first image I rendered for Force Six called 'Car above Both TEST (great lighting)'. I think it's called great lighting because I figured out how to use an HDRI. This was the early days of Iray and so many products used Domes that would not work with Iray and render black.

    Force Six Image Pull Season I

    Another too-dark image.

    Force Six Season 1 Image

    Then here is the reworked page from some time later when Post Work was heavily used tio fix lighting issues, poke through, etc...

    Corrections are next.

    Car above Both TEST (great lighting).png
    1920 x 1080 - 3M
    0_CorrectSize_01.png
    2475 x 3225 - 8M
    Car above Luoise Alexi Side.png
    1920 x 1080 - 2M
    Post edited by Griffin Avid on
  • David RDavid R Posts: 463
    edited November 2025

    You have a friggin' mountain of content.  Where should I start?

    Post edited by David R on
  • Good Question.

    Wishlist and Wait for them to go on sale.

    1. Daz Start Up- it covers the basic and is for beginners. 

    https://www.daz3d.com/startup-vital-tips-in-getting-started-with-daz-studio

    2. Comic Book Foundation - when you're ready to dive in and start.

    https://www.daz3d.com/comic-book-creation--foundation-course-part-1

    4. Daz Mastery - because at the end, you should probably be pushing your Daz-use toward power-user and really getting the most out of the software/environment.

    https://www.daz3d.com/daz-studio-mastery--tutorial-set

    5. Comic Creation- The images are supplied already and it's the excercises to make a story (with a narritive goal) out of them. It's the easiest to get into as everything is supplied, but needs the most imagination to complete.

    https://www.daz3d.com/comic-book-creation-kit-part-1

    Everything else is directed at an exact process or goal- like lighting or post work, and covers...real specific workshops. 

  • Griffin AvidGriffin Avid Posts: 3,829
    edited November 2025

    Corrections. Part of the clean-up process for CG artists using 3D models (and the CG environment) is checking for errors.

    These are some of the common errors to look for.

    Floating feet - It can be difficult to see where your character's feet meet the ground. There is a function to move your character's feet to the ground.

    Edit/Figure/Move to Floor 

    Move to Floor

    You can make adjustments and re-render or move the shadow under the feet using post work.

    Arched feet/Flat Feet- Many pose presets place the character's feet in a high heeled foot position. It's a giveaway when your character is standing flatly but the feet are still in the high-heeled pose. Also happens in reverse. Character wearing heels and a non-matching foot pose. Fixes include choosing the ankle and ...

    Edit/Figure/Zero/Zero Selected Item(s) Pose

    Move to Floor

    * You can also choose Zero Poses from your library and add them to favorites to reset hands and feet for fast edits.

    (Most pose products in the store will have a Reset or Zero pose included among the poses) OR just pick a foot pose matching the wear of the character.

    Poke Through- Occurs when overlapping clothing layers 'poke through' in certain places. A shirt sleeve may poke through a jacket. A foot or sock may poke through a shoe. There is usually an adjustment morph on the two items which can be adjusted to pull the shirt tighter and make the jacket "looser" by expanding. Sometimes it makes the outer clothing item balloon out and not fit nicely. This can be fixed in Post or, if all else fails -a drastic measure for the advanced is to make a second copy of the shirt (add it twice) and use the Geometry editing tool to cut out the poking polygons. Always SAVE before you try this. lol The reason you'd make a duplicate of the worn shirt is, once you cut the shirt you can't undo the edit. One shirt is made invisible and is still there in case you need to show the shirt later on. Almost NEVER cut the polygons of figures as they are high-poly and will almost always tax your system.

    Shirt pokes through

    Using Tool/Geometry Editor (Marquee selection to choose the shirt parts the poke through), then right click to...

    Geometry Selected for the shirt

    Shirt parts are cut away.

    Shirt poke is gone

    Eye Sore - Characters not looking at each other or the right object. I've used two products to sort this out over the years.

    https://www.daz3d.com/look-at-me-ii-pose-control

    https://www.daz3d.com/eye-clock-pose-control-for-genesis-3-and-8-male-s-and-female-s

    Intersecting Objects - Getting hand poses (holding things) correct and getting characters to sink into objects. Body parts squish on impact. There are morph products to flatten and compress. At worst, sink your character into the surface a small amount (usually feet flatten when supporting weight) . Make sure fingers, feet and items do not overlap. 

    Feet are sunk a little into the floor.

    Feet on and in floor

    More later.

     

    Capture Feet Sunk a bit.JPG
    692 x 399 - 32K
    Capture Poke 01 Shirt Pokes.JPG
    978 x 428 - 64K
    Capture Poke 02 Shirt Selected.JPG
    534 x 363 - 38K
    Capture Poke 03 Editing.jpg
    1332 x 750 - 657K
    Capture Poke 04 shirt is cut away.JPG
    977 x 416 - 58K
    Zero Figure.jpg
    1332 x 750 - 369K
    Daz Capture Move to Floor.jpg
    462 x 738 - 172K
    Post edited by Griffin Avid on
  • David RDavid R Posts: 463

    Another solution to pokethru is the "Mesh Grabber" product.  Expensive, but well worth it.
    https://www.daz3d.com/mesh-grabber-win

    https://www.daz3d.com/mesh-grabber-mac

  • Great suggestion. I need to experiment more with that.

  • acbacb Posts: 733
    edited November 2025

    I don't want to interrupt this great tutorial, but I'd like to suggest two more ways to deal with poke-throughs, if that's alright:

    1. Smoothing modifier with collision detection – especially when applied hierarchically. For example, the jacket would then be based on the shirt and not the model itself. Most clothing items already have a smoothing modifier enabled. Then you only need to change the base of the outer item and adjust the sliders until it fits. However, this can be resource-intensive.

    A product that can be helpful with this (but isn't strictly necessary) is: Morph Master

    2.Thickener Plug-In: A plugin that increases the thickness of clothing (or any other) items. The underlying clothing or model might then poke through the first layer, but there would still be something above it. However, the thickener can be a bit tricky at times and probably requires some experimentation – not necessarily for beginners.

    Both options can be freely enabled/disabled – so they are non-destructive, unlike the Geometry Editor or Mesh Grabber.

    Post edited by acb on
  • I'd like to suggest two more ways to deal with poke-throughs

    Of course. All ideas are welcome.

  • 14) Build your own Troubleshooting, Tips & Tricks and Tools & Techniques Guides

    If you have a problem once, you'll probably have it twice. It's a good idea to keep a document that lists your problems and their solutions.

    You can even add points that you haven't encountered yet- from the forum.

    Black Image Renders: Usually a camera issue. The camera is placed behind a solid object or placed under the virtual ground (Render Settings/Draw Ground = On). Possibly Dome related as older sets used a dome for the backdrop and that doesn't work with Iray. Scene Menu, find Dome and remove.

    You open a scene and it's dark. Ctrl+L to turn on ambient light. etc

  • ArtiniArtini Posts: 10,430

    Great thread. Many interesting topics.

     

  • There is always something new to learn with sequential art.

  • Styles make fights. 

    "Styles make fights" is a common saying in combat sports meaning that a fighter's specific approach (style) creates unique challenges, making any fight unpredictable. 

     

    It's the desire and quest (or natural development of an artistic journey) to develop a unique aspect in your work that becomes a signature. Part of this is related to the Three Cs of being an artist. (edited for 2026)

    Care – attention to small details.

    Control – skill with the chosen tools and related techniques

    Consistency – a body of finished output/ completed projects

    There is a balancing act between the Three Cs, where overdoing one impacts the other. Consistently making stuffs- without improving (increasing care and control) leads to an artistic plateau, a stagnation- and what we know today as content. Volume without value.

    On the other end, spending so much time attempting to be a ‘perfectionist’ leaves too little finished work to be properly appreciated and/or evaluated.

    Along with measuring your personal growth as an artist is the search for your voice. Usually, we start an endeavor because we want to participate. We want to do it too.

    At some point the questions arise:

    Why are you here?

    What do you have to add?

    Who are you, and better yet, why should anyone care?

    We are all different people, living, having lived, with a unique set of experiences. It’s what defines us and influences our worldview. What do you see from your vantage point? What do you believe?

    Even simpler. What do you enjoy? What do you like? What are you attracted to? What excites you? What are you passionate about?

    Your art increases in personal meaning the more you inject yourself into it.

    To inject your personal feelings into art requires confidence and even some audacity. The boldness of an artist to say it in pictures and then dare their voice to be seen.

    [It’s the difference between Art and Craft, but that’s a subject for another day]

    Among approaches, for most of us here…it’s a direction of Style (realistic, cartoony, anime- hard drawn, painted, photographed) a texture (canvass, poster, paper), a time (vintage, retro, 80s, 90s, pinup) - anything that adds an edge to the work to elevate it from the ‘common render’.

    When does a CG-powered picture move beyond an assembly of assets and become a piece of art? Usually when it says something about the artist, about society, about the world, about the human experience.

    It’s about a moment that needed to be captured.

    It’s about a story that needed to be told.

    Or is it simply something you needed to share?

    The development of a (unique) style or signature can be born from tendencies.

    Is there Care and attention to detail that shines through in the work?

    In there a remarkable skill and controlled mastery of the tool set- evident in the work?

    Is there a consistency- pointed toward a subject, theme, or message?

    Enough to say “Oh, I know who did that?”

    A style is not something to need to find. It arrives naturally, once you develop enough artistic maturity to listen to your inner voice.

    Your inner voice leads to meaningful visions.

    Patience and perseverance turn your vision into art.

     

  • IceDragonArtIceDragonArt Posts: 12,909

    All this time and I had no idea there was a way to move my character to the floor.  Or maybe I just forgot.  Regardless, thank you!

  • IceDragonArtIceDragonArt Posts: 12,909
    edited December 2025

    Griffin Avid said:

    Styles make fights. 

    "Styles make fights" is a common saying in combat sports meaning that a fighter's specific approach (style) creates unique challenges, making any fight unpredictable. 

     

    It's the desire and quest (or natural development of an artistic journey) to develop a unique aspect in your work that becomes a signature. Part of this is related to the Three Cs of being an artist. (edited for 2026)

    Care – attention to small details.

    Control – skill with the chosen tools and related techniques

    Consistency – a body of finished output/ completed projects

    There is a balancing act between the Three Cs, where overdoing one impacts the other. Consistently making stuffs- without improving (increasing care and control) leads to an artistic plateau, a stagnation- and what we know today as content. Volume without value.

    On the other end, spending so much time attempting to be a ‘perfectionist’ leaves too little finished work to be properly appreciated and/or evaluated.

    Along with measuring your personal growth as an artist is the search for your voice. Usually, we start an endeavor because we want to participate. We want to do it too.

    At some point the questions arise:

    Why are you here?

    What do you have to add?

    Who are you, and better yet, why should anyone care?

    We are all different people, living, having lived, with a unique set of experiences. It’s what defines us and influences our worldview. What do you see from your vantage point? What do you believe?

    Even simpler. What do you enjoy? What do you like? What are you attracted to? What excites you? What are you passionate about?

    Your art increases in personal meaning the more you inject yourself into it.

    To inject your personal feelings into art requires confidence and even some audacity. The boldness of an artist to say it in pictures and then dare their voice to be seen.

    [It’s the difference between Art and Craft, but that’s a subject for another day]

    Among approaches, for most of us here…it’s a direction of Style (realistic, cartoony, anime- hard drawn, painted, photographed) a texture (canvass, poster, paper), a time (vintage, retro, 80s, 90s, pinup) - anything that adds an edge to the work to elevate it from the ‘common render’.

    When does a CG-powered picture move beyond an assembly of assets and become a piece of art? Usually when it says something about the artist, about society, about the world, about the human experience.

    It’s about a moment that needed to be captured.

    It’s about a story that needed to be told.

    Or is it simply something you needed to share?

    The development of a (unique) style or signature can be born from tendencies.

    Is there Care and attention to detail that shines through in the work?

    In there a remarkable skill and controlled mastery of the tool set- evident in the work?

    Is there a consistency- pointed toward a subject, theme, or message?

    Enough to say “Oh, I know who did that?”

    A style is not something to need to find. It arrives naturally, once you develop enough artistic maturity to listen to your inner voice.

    Your inner voice leads to meaningful visions.

    Patience and perseverance turn your vision into art.

    This is interesting .I have no idea if I have developed a distinctive style yet or not.  What I do know is that I am driven to create, its not a choice for me.  Not just digitally but in most aspects of my life.I don't do comics but I would like to monetize my art at some point. I guess we will find out if its any good or not lol  We will see.  I have a new machine coming which will allow me to render much, much faster, and will allow be to use the Iray preview window instead of haing to make an adjustment, turn on iray, pray It doesn't lock up and freeze before I can switch back lol.  Wether or not I end up selling my art, the stories and pictures refuse to be silent.  I am actually very grateful to have found Daz, it enables me to get it all out of my head and into the world.  I've spent several years working on learning the program, and then I learned photoshop and then I learned to put them together.  And I still have soooo much more to learn.   Note the foot comment above lol

    Post edited by IceDragonArt on
  • Griffin AvidGriffin Avid Posts: 3,829
    edited January 5

    The AI that was, is and will be….

    Sometimes I just want the truth. I’d like someone to tell me the unfiltered truth. No narrative, no spin, just tell me the truth. Why is the truth so hard to get these days?

    It’s a bunch of years ago and AI, as an art-generating option, is still widely unknown.

    Mostly, it’s rendering images like this- which appear more like an impression or a vague suggestion of something. At his point it’s interesting on its own as a thing.

    AI Image Generated

    For the most part, artists are ignoring AI images and saying ‘maybe in 10 years they’ll have something to worry about”.

    AI generated images improve to the point that it takes work to turn the generated output into something interesting. Using AI at that time felt no different than post-work. It takes imagination, an eye for fixing things and lots of graphic art skill to turn the rough output into a solid illustration.

    Generated Art with Post Work
    Another leap in quality and we have output that requires minimal fixes.

    AI generated Masked Human Soldier

    And another leap leaves to output that needs no human touches to pass muster.

    Painting Generated

    Now the problems start.

    I started off asking for truth, because all I ever find is emotional reactions.

    We have attitudes about AI, but not a philosophical stance about the Arts and artistic output.

    An attitude is something you adopt; it’s something you choose to apply based on your feelings.

    You fully know what it is to have a coworker with an attitude.

    Let’s get to the truth.

    It’s not fair that someone with little effort (and investment) can generate an illustration of quality. Everything that AI touches lowers in value.

    Generated AI music mixes that ruined the Lo-Fi genre (overall)

    Generated AI news clips that ruined Shorts/Reels

    Generated AI personas/filters that ruined (the already ruined) fashion and beauty influencer..etc...

     

    Why pay for something when you can just generate it yourself? The bottommost AI strategy has been to flood the space with quick  content. They call it slop. It’s not one picture a week, but instead 12 pictures of AI-generated works a day. And all of them are just okay, something to scroll past as you become numb to the general look, tone and feel. Quick blurbs, generated articles, recaps, reactions, recycled clips, trends, algorithmic feeds, etc.

    The main problem with Generative AI is that it robs the user of the artistic journey and stops the user- short of becoming the THING at the end. Sure, you generated 10 novels this weekend, but you are still not an author. Sure, you generated an album of music, but you are not a recording artist or producer. In the doing comes the mind-shift. The experience of creating, the hours that are spent- also shape your understanding. The appreciation and respect for OTHERS as you learn what it takes to make anything of quality. You accept the significance of meaningful work. You give credit where credit is due. A subject is always taken for granted before it dies.

    AI as a Tool and Technique.

    For decades- we’ve had filters, overlays, color-correction and a myriad of tools to polish our artistic works. (Tons of Apps, Plug-ins, suites, scripts and Photoshop Actions)

    Now that AI has arrived, the filters and post-work options have reached magical levels of execution.

    For every artist, there is an innate sense about ‘how much of the work is their own’. You know, the part(s) that YOU DID. No one else can decide that for you. Some feel a sense of pride for doing everything in Daz Studio and once they hit render that’s it. For others, Daz Studio is a foundation and the post-work enhancement is a point of pride. Look at what I can do- look at what I did!

    Daz Render + AI Filter

    DAZ Render + AI Filter
    Everyone wants polish. That last 10% of quality is very expensive and very hard to come by. Everyone wants a respectable (creative) process that suggests diligence and an investment.
    We wanted an AI Filter in Daz Studio.
    We wanted a drop-down menu of Artistic Choices.

    We wanted the Daz PAs to make Presets.

    What we (I’m being hyperbolic, but you know what I mean) wanted was for AI Tools to enhance our CG work and not replace the…the…us.

     

    I guess it falls on each of us to figure out how to leverage these new AI tools against the knowledge, resources, skills, and library we’ve amassed over the years. Maybe for you- it’s a productivity boost. Maybe it’s just there to fix a few things and add polish. Maybe it’s a muse, a source of inspiration. Maybe it can do everything, and, and anything.

    There are users who say if wasn’t for Generative AI, they wouldn’t be doing… anything.

    And maybe that’s a truth worth accepting.

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  • wolf359wolf359 Posts: 3,940
    edited January 5

    I guess it falls on each of us to figure out how to leverage these new AI tools against the knowledge, resources, skills, and library we’ve amassed over the years. Maybe for you- it’s a productivity boost. Maybe it’s just there to fix a few things and add polish.


    I just retired ,here in January, and speaking (for myself of course), 
    I am more than happy to completely abandon all of my previous tedious software workflows and migrate completely to AI for both comics/graphic novels and animation.



    si=vUdOano8lpu9pSkX

    Post edited by wolf359 on
  • Griffin AvidGriffin Avid Posts: 3,829

    "...migrate completely to AI for both comics/graphic novels and animation."

    Shocked, but not shocked. You've been pushing some complicated workflows to get your animated movies done - in the past.

    I'm sure, for you, it's an incredible productivity boost as you already had a ton of creative experience.

    I'm actually interested in what you'll do with AI Voice and sound. 

    Right now there's a huge stigma behind AI use - so there's that hurdle and although EVERYONE (yeah, I kinda do mean everyone, not everyone, but everyone) is using AI in some way, most are denying it.

    I honestly don't know if that will ever fully change, but since the audience is now filled with bots, it's almost fitting that - as soon as the average person can make awesome AI stuff, there's no audience left that cares.

  • David RDavid R Posts: 463

    I don't think I would ever go to AI for the creation of my webcomic because I don't want to relinquish the control of the elements of a scene and also I honestly enjoy using DAZ.  Maybe I'm old-fashioned?  Possibly I might turn to AI for a background image if I didn't have or couldn't find suitable assets, but I haven't had to do that yet.

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 40,399

    I am actually suffering Ai withdrawal because Pinokio stopped working on my PC last update and am too apprehensive about using ComfyUI devil

    ... so 3D rendering it is yes

    I can still do Ai images though, just not animations which was what I was using it for on my 3D renders

    I think as Ai dominates most online content, 3D will finally get the respect as real art it deserves 

    keep posting yes

  • IceDragonArtIceDragonArt Posts: 12,909

    I have zero interest in using AI in my art.  For me, it would no longer be mine.  What makes my art special, different in some way from everyone else, would be lost for me if I used AI.

  • Griffin AvidGriffin Avid Posts: 3,829
    edited February 13

    One of the Daz-centric Facebook groups I belong to- had this message posted by one of its Moderators. – the image is followed by one of member’s comments.

    All sensible stuff, really, but it got me to thinking.

    The group is for people who use Daz Studio as their main tool for creating Art and Illustration.

    The general slant for all these groups- is that your submissions/uploads/shared stuffs need to LOOK LIKE A DAZ RENDER. Someone needs to be able to see the Daz Assets (and rendering engine) on display. Which is interesting as you mostly need to point to Daz Store Assets to prove your work is… from… Daz Studio.

    This makes for an interesting dilemma among artists- as many Daz users’ goal is to make art that does NOT look like a Daz Render. Also, for many artists there is a pride (and credit to be given) for using unique assets that are not readily available/recognizable. And that’s before customized textures/morphs/advanced tools/plugins are considered.

    The comment states they “want to see what Daz is capable of.” Did they really want to see what “Daz is capable of” or what an artist that uses ONLY Daz is likely to make?

    I have had my heavily post-worked art taken down (this was before AI) as the moderator [not this group or moderator] couldn’t tell if I used Daz or Not. I sent them a link to MY DAZ COURSE ON POST WORK. Yes, you can add a realistic fog and explosions AFTER the render is finished. Who knew.

    Times have changed and they also haven’t changed. The ban against AI-works is meant to stem the tide and remove the onus from anyone needing to scratch their head while they look at an illustration and try and figure out where the Artist stops and AI begins.

    Once AI is involved, it becomes hard to tell how much of the work was done by the human artist. How much of the Daz render is Art or Asset? Once enough Daz is removed from your work, what’s the point of wanting to share it with a Daz-only-users group?

    Art, at its most effective, isn’t about what tools you used, it’s about what you had to say as an artist. And in many places, how you say it is more important than what you said.

    Makes sense to me.

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  • wolf359wolf359 Posts: 3,940
    edited February 14

    I started my own private Facebook group for comic books and graphic novels created with AI
    We have about a 119 members at this point.


    I'm also a member of a few other AI animation Facebook groups as well. 
    My point here is there is no need to go into (or continue to participate)
     in user groups, that are 
    anti-AI and, argue and fight with them over the" artistic" value of AI or anything like that. 
    There are too many other vibrant and active online communities where you can join like-minded people and share what you are producing.

    Post edited by wolf359 on
  • backgroundbackground Posts: 623

    Griffin Avid said:

     

    Once AI is involved, it becomes hard to tell how much of the work was done by the human artist. How much of the Daz render is Art or Asset? Once enough Daz is removed from your work, what’s the point of wanting to share it with a Daz-only-users group?

     

    Preumably so Daz users will think the artist is a Daz expert. 

  • backgroundbackground Posts: 623

    wolf359 said:


    My point here is there is no need to go into (or continue to participate)
     in user groups, that are 
    anti-AI and, argue and fight with them over the" artistic" value of AI or anything like that. 
    There are too many other vibrant and active online communities where you can join like-minded people and share what you are producing.

    And yet.... 

  • Griffin AvidGriffin Avid Posts: 3,829
    edited 12:01PM

     

    I saw this sentiment in another Facebook comics group recently. Of course, this points to how most anti-AI arguments are based on emotional attitudes- hence the insults always paired with the opinion, and not an artistic philosophy. I say that because a philosophy is something you apply to life (basically everything) and the stance remains consistent and evenly applied. An attitude is something you adopt and choose to apply when you feel like it.

    Several large comic publishers have made their No-AI stance quite clear with public statements. Stuff like we support artists…as you also see artists complaining about their unfair treatment at the same hands of these publishers.

    It’s actually NOT up to the publisher to make this decision/mandate stick. Gone are the days (if they ever were days like this) of a row of artists assembled behind drawing desks in a publisher’s main office- while an editor or two leans over their shoulder and suggest improvements. We’ve already seen examples of artists using AI in the work of these very same publishers. The reaction comes only after public outcry.

    And public outcry has become very performative. In most cases when I look up the hardcore anti-AI posters, they are generally NOT artists. They are usually writers and friends-of-an-artist, and something else that makes them join a comics forum, but hardly ever anyone that has actually made a comic.  Strangely enough, there are many examples of artists who are publicly against AI, but then are ‘outed’ for using AI.

    The original post implies there are some systems/tools/techniques that are acceptable to use to make comics and others that are not. As in AI is not ‘okay’ to use in/for comics. So, from this end, who is this person making this statement? Is it a peer and it’s a fellow comic maker saying they don’t approve of HOW one makes their comic? Is it a reader who doesn’t want to read AI-powered comics and are expressing their displeasure- at the very thought? Are they some kind of authority figure that can dictate what you can and can’t use to make your comics?

    Let’s circle back. It’s an attitude because if you were to ask for rules, there aren’t any. It goes by feeling. We run into lots of confusing angles.

    Tracing is okay, long as it’s not done a lot. Tracing over AI is a no go, not even little bit.

    Tracing over a 3D object and pretending you drew it is okay, tracing over an AI image and pretending you drew it…is no good.

    Using a picture as a reference and keeping it to yourself is great. Using an AI image and not disclosing AI-as-a-reference is cheating.

    Heck, you can trace over other artists drawings. You can take ideas, use bits and pieces, adopt styles, do it all, but anything AI is automatically evil reprehensible theft.

    What if you only draw and others finish your art by doing inks and color?

    Maybe it’s my annoying Fine Arts degree that keeps rearing its ugly head. Maybe my goal isn’t to be a (traditional) comic artist. Maybe I’m an artist that just wants to make comics and How, I’ll figure out later.

    I tried watercolor, oils, even spray paint to make my comics. They were mixed-media for sure.

    A page from one of my earliest experimental comics. I’m taking newspaper clips, articles, using photoshop and making my comics. I was hand-lettering and then cutting up the word balloons and placing them in the book.

    Then I figured out how to use Photoshop to print the text, and I was stull cutting out the word balloons and glueing them onto the pages.

    Eventually, I figured out color and somewhat better cut & paste.

    Near the end of this direction, I was able to do everything in Photoshop and was able to have a Staples print the pages on better paper.

    I reached the point where I was using images (photographs and videos) of people I knew as the characters in my comics.

    And now, as most know, I use Daz Studio as the foundation of my comic work. Some of my work.

    Same series, not sequential pages...

     

    And yes, my art has been scanned by AI models and for a time, if you used my professional name or character’s name, you got a messed-up version of me stuffs -cobbled from my internets-shared book covers. How do I feel about that?

     

    I don’t know if I want to go by feelings at this point.

    My artsy fartsy philosophy is kinda simple.

    Use a method/medium/technique that leads to work that …

    Demonstrates a skill or adept use of the associated tools.
    Expresses a unique vision and voice that resonates.

    Creates an immersive experience through imaginative visual storytelling/sequential art.

    One of the old comic masters (a legend associated with the golden age of comics) said to me (and I’m paraphrasing) It doesn’t matter how you get there, as long as you get there.

     

    I felt that.

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    Post edited by Griffin Avid at
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