EULA With 3D Print License?
knuckledusterharris_b01188de76
Posts: 93
Posts in December seemed to suggest that DAZ was considering changing their EULA to change the way they deal with 3D print licensing of Genesis. I submitted a service ticket asking for licensing to use Genesis in some miniature projects (I have a very high-end jewelry DLP printer) but I'm getting no reply at all.
I simply don't understand why a miniature figurine, which can't be reverse-engineered, downloaded, or used to create a rival 3D product, is such a big deal, when 2d art and animation is granted such broad rights.
In any case, I use so many custom morphs that I create in Zbrush, Genesis hardly looks like Genesis in my final designs. I'm in the process of sculpting and rigging my own figure, and what I'm finding is that as the figure takes shape, it looks more and more like Genesis precisely because it is the human form! Unless you use one of their specific characters, you're just using it as a academy figure--a placeholder.
Thoughts? News? Insights?
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Comments
The issue is that the geometry (and depending on your printing method, textures) would have to be distributed to a third party printer, and are no longer solely on your machine. This act of distribution is where the current eula has contention. Even if the printer personally has no use for it, and would likely delete it after they are done, it still pushed the fine legal line on distribution, and as we have seen with most laws, if the line gets blurred even by little actions, someone else will want to push it a little further later, then a little more and all those movements will make anything impossible to enforce. That is the reason for the hard line stance. Digital copyrights are already a tough thing to enforce, so anything that weakens it is a disservice to us all.
However now that home printers are becoming more prevalent, DAZ is aware of this growth in technology and is working towards developing to encompass that as well. So your issue will likely not be an issue for much longer (if you are a PC member you will understand more of this)
That's good news. I'm using a commercial-grade machine (Envisiontec Micro, 25-micron layers) and not sending anything to a 3rd party for printing. My designs would go directly to a vulcanized rubber mold and cast in pewter at one-inch tall.
So they're considering making Genesis royalty-free for this kind of thing?
I dont think that would be the correct way to word it....best to wait and see how the eula spells it out.
That's fair enough.
If they end up being stingy, somebody will fill the void with a rival product because the demand is clearly there. If they choose to be generous, they will be heroes for a lot of artists and would be able to design and sell watertight clothing and accessory items or versions of current items.
I happen to know an artist who has already designed dozens of printable hats, coats, boots, weapons, etc. from scratch in Zbrush and fitted them to DAZ figures ;)
The issue is that the geometry (and depending on your printing method, textures) would have to be distributed to a third party printer, and are no longer solely on your machine. This act of distribution is where the current eula has contention. Even if the printer personally has no use for it, and would likely delete it after they are done, it still pushed the fine legal line on distribution, and as we have seen with most laws, if the line gets blurred even by little actions, someone else will want to push it a little further later, then a little more and all those movements will make anything impossible to enforce. That is the reason for the hard line stance. Digital copyrights are already a tough thing to enforce, so anything that weakens it is a disservice to us all.
However now that home printers are becoming more prevalent, DAZ is aware of this growth in technology and is working towards developing to encompass that as well. So your issue will likely not be an issue for much longer (if you are a PC member you will understand more of this)
I can understand that, and whilst I am very unlikely to do any 3D printing of my own (or commission any) it gave me pause on the subject of network rendering. I know DS doesn't do that, but Cararra, Bryce, LuxRender and Octane, etc. can. I suspect the waters are very muddy! ;)
HiveWire have already released a free model, Dawn SR2, which includes a personal, non-commercial 3D printing license at no cost. Commercial 3D printing licenses are also available for a fee.
From everything I can gather, Poser's EULA allows you to print their figures (as long as you don't scan them back in and try and make a new object out of them). I believe you are limited to the medium-resolution versions (which is ok, because I only use these programs to rough-in the basic sculpt. All the detail work is done in Zbrush).
I think DAZ is dragging feet on this, just like updating Hex and Bryce. >:-(
This is not really all that complicated; not for an expert in Intellectual Property. In fact, a good IP lawyer should be able to come up fairly quickly with a workable EULA to protect DAZ and the PAs, without putting too many unreasonable restrictions/demands on the customer.
I made a huge purchase earlier today, and I think it will be necessary for me to stop buying soon until I see what the plan is going to be. And my PC+ membership expires at the beginning of August. I'll have to SERIOUSLY consider my risk of continuing to stay and continuing to buy DAZ and PA products without knowing what the rules are going to be for 3D printing.
And you have of course spotted this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yme_z6sM9AY which does tend to confirm that DAZ 3D are working on this.
the video is cool, I don't understand much how the 3d printing process works, but heard of it being used to make Prosthetics, I guess I need to educate myself, but by watching the video, it appears you have to actually paint the model yourself? I guess only use I could see would be to make my husband D&D figures, as I don't have patience to paint anything I would make myself to make it look good. Sorry for this being off-topic
The printer DAZ 3D used actually uses colored sandstone, so it doesn't need to be painted.
...would so love to have actual figures of my characters. No where near being able to afford a 3D printer of my own (especially one that is capable of producing the level of detail as shown in the video). So will this be a service provided by Daz?
No, I hadn't seen it! That is exciting, whoohoo!
But it's still taking too long, so I ain't changing my signature just yet. :blank:
Greetings,
See, that...? That would neatly sidestep the intellectual property issues. There'd still be a back-and-forth while you worked to make your model printable (or paid them to do it), but given that they own duplication rights in general, that'd make the legal issues irrelevant.-- Morgan
-- Morgan
It could be an option, sure. But I would not wish for it to be the only way.
I don't want to deal with waiting for manufacturing, shipping, RMAs and returns, and all of the associated cost of and use of natural resources for same. Plus, DAZ is not well set up to become a manufacturer and shipper of physical product. That would be a HUGE change for DAZ, with a lot of risks.
...it would still be more cost effective than having to purchase a printer that has decent resolution (which is rather expensive) on your own if all you only wanted a figure made now and then.
I certainly hope their new EULA doesn't prevent artists with their own equipment from printing now that they've ventured into doing their own printing. I own a very high-end commercial-grade DLP printer myself, so I need a figure that does not come with restrictions on use. I do have a base figure I have sculpted (I just need to rig him), and I have purchased alternate commercial content that does not have restrictions (I have a plan B), but it would be a shame--Genesis on the Daz platform is very easy to work with and I will have to spend a weekend sculpting new morphs.
I guess the big question is, why the need for the change in the EULA to allow it? There is nothing stopping someone from printing figures for their own bookshelf or mantle now if they have their own printer. i would assume that the needed change would be for any commercial use of the figures such as selling them in various venues or online in which case I definitely can see the need for a specific EULA and even a specific license agreement since the figures are derived from DAZ content.
No, the current EULA does not allow this.
Daz's EULA does not allow personal or commercial printing. Poser's allows both as far as I can tell.
No, the current EULA does not allow this.
Point taken, guess I was confused with the video chohole linked to. I assume if /when they do change the license there will be separate parts for personal and commercial use since I can see a big difference in uses between the two. Personally, due to the current costs I can't see investing in a 3D printer unless I plan to use ti for some type of commercial use.
New EULA is available
http://www.daz3d.com/eula
Rawn
Are you sure? The section on 3D printing etc. looks the same to me.
Are you sure? The section on 3D printing etc. looks the same to me.
The creation of three-dimensional physical images (3D-print, molded copy, CNC-routed copy, and the like) of Content or any three-dimensional art derived from the Content is permitted only by User’s purchase from DAZ, via the User’s online DAZ store account, of permission to deliver User’s derived works (art), including necessary Content, to an entity that creates three-dimensional images in a physical medium. User may then deliver User’s art in file format to that third party to have three-dimensional physical images printed or created, up to the limitations set forth in the online DAZ Store as delineated on the purchase page associated with the permission purchased. These limitations govern (i) personal and/or commercial use of the three-dimensional physical or printed images; and (ii) the quantity of three dimensional physical or printed images allowed.
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/49713/P30/#732665
EULA Change went live within the past hour.
Where do you accept the new EULA so I can access and download my products?
Try going to your "Product library" in "My Account", the new EULA should appear.
Thank You!. For some reason the acceptance box does not appear when the EULA is accessed from the Install Manager and yes I was logged in.