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Huh, the Compatible Software lists dForce Hair.
It might be just a mistake then. Perhaps they meant to add "dForce Cloth" and added "dForce Hair" instead. If so, a support ticket should probably be filed. The hair looks awesome and it's on my wishlist. :) So either way, I plan on nabbing it up along with the Elios pro bundle when I have a bit more spending cash.
It is because part of the feature is locked to PAs. Unlocking the feature to the user base would allow us the SHARE the things we come up with, sharing collective knowledge usually works well. We cannot do that, because of what has been walled off to PAs. So PAs are completely on their own to learn how to use this new feature. While there are a fair number of great PAs, they have their own jobs to do, and taking time time to learn this while still making content to sell is probably a barrier. But we cannot help them out here. Sorry.
Stand based hair first came to Daz beta on May 14 2019. While it was officially released later, that still gave PAs a nice head start to get something done before Daz 4.12 launched. Since that time, if Divamakeup is correct, we have had a grand total of 17 dforce strand hair products released. Of these, only 10 are human. Nearly half of these products have been for animals and creatures rather than humans (or grass). It is now August, we are just a couple days away from 3 full months since Daz made strand hair available. Several of these products were all released within the first week that dforce hair became available for sale. By comparison, dforce for clothing was an instant smash, with all sorts of clothing items releasing with dforce shortly after its release. There were new dforce clothes nearly every day, and that continues to today. Sometimes we get a whole bunch of dforce clothes released in one day. Daz Pro Bundles offer multiple dforce clothes, but none have yet to feature a dforce strand hair, which is most curious.
Unlocking the feature to the user base would allow us to work together and be able to create more. Also, just think of the possibility that perhaps some user gets really good at making strand hair and decides to step up and become a PA. New PAs would mean more products for Daz, which equals happier customers and most importantly, more money for Daz. But this is impossible with the situation as it is, since you must become a PA first to even get full access. Most people do not become a PA until AFTER they have learned how to use the tools and build products. That is a problem that dforce strand hair faces.
And yeah, we can create the strand hair, but who really wants to create strand hair that simulates slowly and poorly without the proper dforce hair settings? That is why I believe dforce strand hair is going to ultimately be a failure. In fact, I'll call it right now, unless something major changes, dforce strand hair is going to be one of Daz's biggest failures in recent memory. It is fun little toy, but without products it is only just a toy.
I mean, think about it, Daz invested in dforce hair, and Daz only makes money when they sell content. But they have only 17 product releases so far...tell me...was it worth it? Was it worth making dforce hair settings exclusive to PAs for 17 products? If you ask me, I don't think it was. The PAs who released strand hair content would have released that same content in this store whether or not dforce hair was PA exclusive. So the policy of making this feature PA only has not served any positive purpose at all, and it only served to sour many users who are not PAs.
The thing is, most if not all of those intimidating and not-at-all-explained dForce parameter directly correlate to tools in the Strand-Based Hair editor. (I noticed that when playing with the hair for the new House Cat. It isn't insider information.) The better you understand the SBH Editor, the more the dForce parameters are going to make sense to you.
I believe people who were adept with Garibaldi before SBH was a thing, and to some extent, people adept at using LAMH, are going to have a head start on those of us who have little to no experience with one or the other plugins—Whether or not they are a Daz PA. The rest of us have a lot of catching up to do.
From what I have read on the forums, I have extrapolated, (means I'm still guessing but I think my guess is correct,) that even the PAs have to demonstrate some proficiency with strand hair, (either native SBH or fiber mesh/what-have-you from other applications,) to get access to the dForce Hair tool. It makes me think "dForce Hair" is a lot more complex than just converting a "cloth" mesh to dForce with a one-click modifier.
In fact, I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest the reasons behind the dForce Hair not being available to all has much less to do with Daz wanting to keep the technology from us, and a lot more to do with how much the tech support would strain their limited human resources.
Of course, I could be wrong about all of it, but until proven otherwise, it is what I believe.
I have decided to personally not buy any dforce hair and most of you know why (voting with my wallet). Up until this point, I haven't and very likely never will. In fact, my spending here at Daz has slowly been decreasing over time, as I aready have thousands of products already. How much stuff does one need, really? ;)
Edit: I did buy the Daz housecat, only because it gave me a discount I wouldn't have otherwise gotten. I have no intention of installing it or using it.
Laurie
Dforce ads about 15 minutes to my render time- running the simulation. And about 50 percent of the time it ends in disaster, so I don't tend to love dforce to begin wtih. Although I like it for other things- like discarded clothing.
The dforce male hairs thus released have not looked good to me, and so I tend to pass on it.
In general, I haven't liked too much of the fiber mesh hairs It looks thin in a lot of areas and takes a lot of render time.
I took a risk on a dforce hair, but it did not drape nicely at all no matter what i did, and the sim took at least an hour. So it's a hard pass on dforce hair in the future for me. I like it for clothes, but not hair.
Really? My dforce hair sim literally took 3 minutes....?
I dunno, it was this one https://www.daz3d.com/alascanus-hair-for-genesis-8-males-with-dforce, and it's not that my computer doesn't have the oomph. I have 32gb of ram and 6gb of vram. And there was nothing else in the scene, but the figure and his hair.
Ah, but see that's a hair WITH dForce, not a dForce hair. That is, it's trying to pretend the hair is a cloth.
I know it's confusing, but they're quite different. The dForce hair is strand-based and (for me) simulates MUCH faster and better.
That's a different type of hair than the new dForce Hair. That's polygon hair with the dForce Cloth settings applied. The new dForce hair is strand-based hair based rather then polygon hair based. At least that's as far as my understanding of it is. lol :)
Ah, well my bad then. It's still soured me on the whole concept though, so I'll still take a pass on it. But if it works for other people, that's great and I wish them luck with it.
Also if you look at the log there are a number of dforce hair fixes in 4.12 so may be it simply isn't stable enough for PAs to work with it yet ..
Having a slightly elderly PC for my rendering and no OpenCL on it (the machine works, so I don't want to wreck it by putting on a potentially dodgy new driver) means dForce anything is avoided by me for that machine. I have tried a dForce hair (Long Straight Messy Hair) on my newer laptop. After 30 minutes, 5 simulation frames were complete, and my patience with dForce was exhausted. It is, without question, technically a very clever idea, but like all non-linear finite element packages it is hugely computationally intensive and beyond the limit of lower spec pc's.
Regards,
Richard
Strand based hair very much cares about UVs, as that it how it functions. If you want to do fur for say the pitbull, you need to make separate image maps for it than the base dog.
As for the non-PA thing, you very much can make longer fur for dForce hair, using texturemaps and playing with the settings.
I think dForce hair and dForce anything can look great, but I avoid it myself. It just takes too long, and I prefer products that can be adjusted and rendered more quickly but at the same time keeping a decent looking render. IMO, Swam creates a lot of the best hair. It looks good, and it's not extremely resource hungry, and it renders fairly fast.
Is Gone still around? He was a master at Garibaldi.
I purchased a few different dForce hair products but they don't seem to work for what I need. I mainly do pin up/glamour, "Perils of Pauline" and couples poses. You can forget about couples poses all together. If the hair collides with either model while it is simulating, you get a tangled mess. Say you want to do a dungeon scene where the model is hanging upside down then simulate, the model goes to the A pose then starts moving toward the final pose and the hair goes all over the place. When it is fiinished, it does not lay like normal hair is supposed to lay. I thought I might be able to use AprilYSH's dForce Kay hair and here is what I got (see attached photos). I was expecting nice hanging hair and got a deranged tribble so no Klingon torturing Star Fleet personal for me I am waiting for the technology to ctach up or vendors that will create good hangable hair before I but any more dForce hair.
The model only starts in the A-Pose if you tell it to that in the simulation settings (although that is the default setting). In the Similation settings unclick the option "Start bones from memorized pose" and the simulation will start at the pose the model is currently in.
Honestly for what you are doing the free strand based hair would work better.
The only people I can see using Dforce hair is animators hence the very limited market they are trying to sell to in their wisdom.
I actually think Strand Based presets would sell better!
proof being everyone has the tools for making clothes and models but we still buy them!
I actually would love it if the PA’s that make Dforce Hairs provided Stand Based versions too, it would help sell it to me more as I can style the stand based one rather than have to hit and miss simulate it for scenes where head movements are less obvious but positioning is everything and the majority who do still images I wager will actually prefer it.
Sure is:) He's shared a number of extremely useful tips when I've run into trouble with the GB editor.
I have to agree! For a still shot you can drape the SBH with much more control much faster than dForce can offer atm.
Frankly, I'm thinking that making dForce surface based may have been a big mistake.
Totally agree. I can't really see myself buying anymore Dforce hair creatures as I'm pretty dissapointed in the inability to edit the fur of the ones I have got might as well do it from scratch with SBH myself.
I was thinking the same thing, even extended to why it isn't available to the public yet. Rather than a "Daz Conspiracy" to keep the tool out of our grubby little hands, the Occam's Razor explanation would be that it's not quite ready for prime time.
Just a note that you can absolutely make great custom furs in current dforce hairs without being a PA.
This is Oso's Pooka and then just custom maps/setting I made.
According to the sneak preview we got of tomorrows products (or so I assume they will be), another of these rare dForce hairs will appear tomorrow.
It certainly crashes often enough for me for that to be true, trying to create and style is an excercise in frustration at the moment, never sure if an edit will work or hard crash DAZ Studio!
And it has! A very cool hair, too.
I only wish for more.