Can you make .hdr files without Photoshop?

MimicMollyMimicMolly Posts: 674
I want to make my own custom HDR, but all the tutorials I found, explaining how to create one use Photoshop, which I don't have (I use GIMP). Is .hdr only a Photoshop exclusive file type to make, or can I be able to make it with GIMP, or other software?
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Comments

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 54,114

    No, there are various tools that can be used. I don't know if GIMP is one of them.

  • IvyIvy Posts: 5,411

    I do not know of any free software for making HDR , Nix collection had a HDRi plugin & use to be free when google offered it but you can only get a 30 day trial now

    I use  nix collection https://nikcollection.dxo.com/ with the HDRi plugin with photoshop to make some prety good hdri.s , thats the only way I know of though sorry

     

  • PetegePetege Posts: 16

    Picturenaut (http://hdrlabs.com/picturenaut/) can create HDR images.

  • MimicMollyMimicMolly Posts: 674
    edited May 17

    @Petege that's exactly what I needed. Also, thank you Richard and Ivy. :)

    I still need to figure out how to make it look good, but that's on me.

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  • Roman_K2Roman_K2 Posts: 796

    I'm not really into HDRI's and I wouldn't know what controls/settings you would use to brighten G2F in your sample render, other than a "bright sunny day in Arizona" HDRI would probably be better than a "foggy morning on the Yorkshire moors" HDRI.

    If you were going to render again I'd look at a background that appeared to be "further back" from the figure. Does the dark area above the head have to be so close to the head?

    If you wanted to work on the flat image some brightness and contrast over the entire image would make it more punchy right off the bat.

    Going into more detail, since there is radical light reflections on the lower lip, that tells me there is a light source somewhere above and to our right as we look at the image. So I might concentrate on brightening the shoulder and the right side of the face. I've sketched in some areas to brighten with a feathered lasso tool.

    In a real world photo shoot you would probably use a bounce flash to brighten the model, or your assistant would be just off camera holding up a large reflector to cast some light back into the image field. You can simulate this with post-render work, or you could also bring in some point lights close to the figure's head. Changing the hair color and rendering again might give you some bits of artificial "highlights" to paste back into the image.

    And it might be an idea to adjust the green and yellow values a bit.

    Hope this helps.

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  • SixDsSixDs Posts: 2,134

    You have not really said whether you want to use your HDRI primarily for lighting, or as a background MimicMolly (or both). They are not mutually exclusive, but the considerations are somewhat different.

  • SadKitty_CarraraSadKitty_Carrara Posts: 21,364

    Bryce can render them

  • MimicMollyMimicMolly Posts: 674
    @SixDs I wanted to make an .HDR of a specific location I had photographed to use as a background. The lighting wasn't as important (for what I wanted to do) because parts of it were bright, while others were shaded, and I planned to rotate the background.
  • MimicMollyMimicMolly Posts: 674
    Roman_K2 said:

    I'm not really into HDRI's and I wouldn't know what controls/settings you would use to brighten G2F in your sample render, other than a "bright sunny day in Arizona" HDRI would probably be better than a "foggy morning on the Yorkshire moors" HDRI.

    If you were going to render again I'd look at a background that appeared to be "further back" from the figure. Does the dark area above the head have to be so close to the head?

    If you wanted to work on the flat image some brightness and contrast over the entire image would make it more punchy right off the bat.

    Going into more detail, since there is radical light reflections on the lower lip, that tells me there is a light source somewhere above and to our right as we look at the image. So I might concentrate on brightening the shoulder and the right side of the face. I've sketched in some areas to brighten with a feathered lasso tool.

    In a real world photo shoot you would probably use a bounce flash to brighten the model, or your assistant would be just off camera holding up a large reflector to cast some light back into the image field. You can simulate this with post-render work, or you could also bring in some point lights close to the figure's head. Changing the hair color and rendering again might give you some bits of artificial "highlights" to paste back into the image.

    And it might be an idea to adjust the green and yellow values a bit.

    Hope this helps.

    I use G8F. I wanted more of "a cool early morning under the trees in the tropics" look. The only thing I didn't like from my test render was that the background image wasn't as clear as the original photograph.
  • FishtalesFishtales Posts: 4,100

    What are the pixel dimensions of the photograph? To fit properly in the dome they need to be in a 2:1 ratio and my minimum would be 4000x2000 pixels, bigger is better.

  • MimicMollyMimicMolly Posts: 674
    edited May 18
    @Fishtales My photo was about 7400x1000, because it was a 360° panoramic photo.
    Post edited by MimicMolly on
  • FishtalesFishtales Posts: 4,100

    To fit in the dome it has to be in a 2:1 ratio that is a 7.1:1 ratio which will get distorted in the dome.

  • FishtalesFishtales Posts: 4,100

    Make a primitive plane to the dimensions of your render, shrink your picture to those dimensions and then use it as the diffuse map of the plane. You can then use it as a backdrop which you can move about to get the area you want in the render window and zoom the camera in and out. You can then use any HDRI in the dome for lighting or set sun and sky using lat/long and time of day.

  • MimicMollyMimicMolly Posts: 674
    edited May 18

    @Fishtales I was planning on editing my photo so it could fit those dimensions. Borrowing from other photos I took and cloning or painting anything else I needed. I'll try your suggestion too.

    Post edited by MimicMolly on
  • SixDsSixDs Posts: 2,134
    edited May 18

    Here's a question, Fishtales. If the image needs to be 2:1 and isn't, thus producing distortion when applied to the dome, what would happen if the original image were altered by adjusting its proportions to 2:1 thus distorting it. Would applying it to the dome then reverse the distortion?

    Post edited by SixDs on
  • FishtalesFishtales Posts: 4,100

    @SixDs

    No, because you will have already distorted the image and it would still be distorted when loaded. It is the same if you use an image as a Background. If it isn't the same aspect and pixel size as the render it will either be squashed or stretched. That is menu Environment Background not adding it to a Primitive Plane.

  • SixDsSixDs Posts: 2,134

    Ah, because it is not actual geometry. I would have simply tried it myself, but this "workclothes" PC I am using only has an older version of DAZ Studio installed, so I don't have the environment dome.

  • FishtalesFishtales Posts: 4,100

    @SixDs

    If you load a skydome, any skydome, and use your image on it you should see enough to test it.

  • MimicMollyMimicMolly Posts: 674
    edited May 18

    I attempted to edit the photo, mostly add to it while the center strip was the original. The distortion is gone but the problem is that it's somehow too bright (compared to the original photo) and there is a seam. I wonder if there is a way to extract the Iray skydome so I can import it to paint on another app and remove the seam. 

    Other test render:

    That portion of the original photo. (I wanted it about this same brightness.)

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  • Roman_K2Roman_K2 Posts: 796

    I don't know if this is true in the tropics (DAZ Studio has some latitude and longtitude settings for lighting, off hand I forget which lighting exactly) but in the northern hemisphere early morning light will come in from the side because the sun will still be fairly low. Ok so the light may not make it to an enclosed, shady place but in a real world photo shoot you'd probably want to locate the model where the light is more interesting, eg. not in the shade.

    "Indoors" (ha ha) on the computer, in DAZ Studio, it is possible to buy preset lighting kits that will give you a choice of several point-and-click ways to light the model from the side, and you could have interesting edges and stuff. Look for "basic portrait lighting" maybe. Another trick might be to use "gel lights" which may have special "masks" that may simulate the light as it is filtered down through nearby trees.

    I have been doing this for a few years and I still have trouble with the lighting... so much so that I'm still putting like a primitive sphere and a cube and a pyramid in the center of a background plane, and from there I'll try to make stable, predictable light presets for just those relatively simple objects.

    FWIW, sometimes I get BLACK renders (time to reset the computer!) but I've never had DS totally burn something out, incandescent like, like the roof of your building in the sample. OBJECTS can be over-exposed maybe, but the background usually remains stable, WYSIWYG-like if I may use that expression.

  • Roman_K2Roman_K2 Posts: 796
    edited May 19

    Note that there are different ways to have a "background" in your render. The first one is a "null" sort of concept where there is actually no background at all! -- and you get that by rendering to TIF format; using an image editor like Photoshop you can then slide the TIF around as a "layer" over a separate image file of your choice until you get the positioning just right, and there could even be multiple TIF layers arranged in whatever way you like. The next method is to specify a bitmapped image in the environment pane. Not as flexible but in certain situations better edges. If you do go the TIF route then Photoshop also lets you put in a bit of edge shadowing (or glowing) after the fact and you can also stretch or compress or twist the render to conform to the "background" layer in some particular way.

    You can also put an image file or shader onto an object that is like a flat sheet or one that resembles a sound stage or a photographer's "no seam" paper roll. These types of polygonal models will take a shadow cast by an object that's in front of the "background". One such flat, but curvable sheet is included in Maclean's everday morphing primitives set; there are many others, both static and adjustable. The easiest way to make one is to flatten a primitive cube on either the x or the z axis, and you then push this thin "plane" a bit further back from where your main objects are going to be. Add color or an image to the plane by selecting it with the Surfaces tool and then going to "Diffuse Color" in the Surfaces tab in DS.

    Some sets like Merlin's church include optional background elements that are like a cyclorama. "Cyclorama" is a term that... was in vogue mostly in the nineteenth century if I'm not mistaken, and it had to do with panoramic paintings. (Wikipedia link) You could also put your main models under a "sky dome" (usually one word) which is vaguely like a sort of cupola and if they are spaceships say, the "skydome" could be a vertical (relative to the camera) stardome.

    It is also possible to put a thick layer of something (like a thick row of trees or a wall of rocks say) behind your main models.

    Sometimes when you load cycloramas or domes there may appear to be nothing on the screen. That's because the position of the camera or perspective view has to be inside the dome or other round object if you're using a cyclorama or similar. One of the "back alley" models for example, in the DAZ store comes with a "cloudy day" skydome as a stock, optional component. Zoom in close enough (but not enough to go THROUGH the surface of the dome) and it's like going through a puffy white cloud in an airplane or under a parachute: Whoosh, everything becomes a wall of white with no reference points.

    Post edited by Roman_K2 on
  • FishtalesFishtales Posts: 4,100
    edited May 19

    Personally I would just trim the edge off :) You could try changing the camera angle/zoom/focal length.

    The image will have a Gamma setting so click on the Environment Map, got to edit image in the LIE, and change the Gamma setting to either zero or 2.2. Anything other than that and Iray adds Gamma of 2.2, renders and then resets Gamma to 2.2. or whatever you have set in Tone Mapping, so if the Gamma is 1.0 it goes to 3.2, which blows out parts of the image, and then adds your Gamma to that. I think that is how it works.

    For your image I would also drop the intensity in Environment Map and/or Intensity which should darken the image but will give less ambient light, even although it isn't an HDRI you will still get some.

    It could be your Tone Mapping is set too high which is blowing out the image. Try setting it for the background and then adjust the light shining on the horse to make it brighter.

    Here is some Info on HDRI and the Dome.

    http://docs.daz3d.com/lib/exe/fetch.php/public/read_me/index/21981/21981_quick-start-guide-to-the-iray-dome-and-the-use-of-hdris.pdf

    Post edited by Fishtales on
  • SadKitty_CarraraSadKitty_Carrara Posts: 21,364

    since it is already a 360 panorama

    why not stick it on the environment dome on an empty scene

    fiddle with the settings for the dome with show dome on to get it lighter, darker etc  and render some spherical camera exr files of it to the desired dimension then pick the one that works best for your HDR

  • FishtalesFishtales Posts: 4,100

    since it is already a 360 panorama

    why not stick it on the environment dome on an empty scene

    fiddle with the settings for the dome with show dome on to get it lighter, darker etc  and render some spherical camera exr files of it to the desired dimension then pick the one that works best for your HDR

    The problem is that the seam will always be there as the two ends of the panorama aren't level, it happens with hand held ones even although you start and finish in the same spot. Also that is a linear panorama which isn't designed to fit on a curved dome like real HDRI panoramas are so if you angle the camera up to look at the dome the image is squashed to fit the curve.

  • SadKitty_CarraraSadKitty_Carrara Posts: 21,364
    edited May 19

    because I only have Elements and cannot use it with that I drag and drop my picture on the exe from the Nik collection and use it that way

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  • SadKitty_CarraraSadKitty_Carrara Posts: 21,364
    edited May 19
    Fishtales said:

    since it is already a 360 panorama

    why not stick it on the environment dome on an empty scene

    fiddle with the settings for the dome with show dome on to get it lighter, darker etc  and render some spherical camera exr files of it to the desired dimension then pick the one that works best for your HDR

    The problem is that the seam will always be there as the two ends of the panorama aren't level, it happens with hand held ones even although you start and finish in the same spot. Also that is a linear panorama which isn't designed to fit on a curved dome like real HDRI panoramas are so if you angle the camera up to look at the dome the image is squashed to fit the curve.

    stick the seam behind the camera LOL

    I actually fix such stuff on my stiched Microsoft ICE images in Gimp using select and the heal filter, and a bit of cloning

    Post edited by SadKitty_Carrara on
  • FishtalesFishtales Posts: 4,100

     

    Fishtales said:

    since it is already a 360 panorama

    why not stick it on the environment dome on an empty scene

    fiddle with the settings for the dome with show dome on to get it lighter, darker etc  and render some spherical camera exr files of it to the desired dimension then pick the one that works best for your HDR

    The problem is that the seam will always be there as the two ends of the panorama aren't level, it happens with hand held ones even although you start and finish in the same spot. Also that is a linear panorama which isn't designed to fit on a curved dome like real HDRI panoramas are so if you angle the camera up to look at the dome the image is squashed to fit the curve.

    stick the seam behind the camera LOL

     

    As I would do but the OP wants that bit of the image as her background :)

  • FishtalesFishtales Posts: 4,100
    edited May 19

    because I only have Elements and cannot use it with that I drag and drop my picture on the exe from the Nik collection and use it that way

    That is a Spherical Panorama you are using, not a Linear one. And the HDR plugin is a tonal effect which is a photographic effect and not a lighting effect.

    Post edited by Fishtales on
  • FishtalesFishtales Posts: 4,100
    edited May 19

    I actually fix such stuff on my stiched Microsoft ICE images in Gimp using select and the heal filter, and a bit of cloning

    I use Autostich to do stitched images.

    https://autostitch.en.softonic.com/

    http://matthewalunbrown.com/autostitch/autostitch.html

    Post edited by Fishtales on
  • SadKitty_CarraraSadKitty_Carrara Posts: 21,364

    https://www.deviantart.com/wendyluvscatz/art/1-651686659

    full size here if you want

     

    one of mine stiched with Microsoft ICE

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