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.webp format for product pictures

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  • Blank_CanvasBlank_Canvas Posts: 36
    Dave230 said:

    This is how I fixed it

    Thank you! Thank you! Thank you!

  • Daywalker DesignsDaywalker Designs Posts: 3,586
    What if it's happening somewhere between the DAZ3D server and your web browser? As far as I know, they still require the submitted promotional materials to be in JPG format.
  • macleanmaclean Posts: 2,438
    Daywalker Designs said:
    What if it's happening somewhere between the DAZ3D server and your web browser? As far as I know, they still require the submitted promotional materials to be in JPG format.

    Yes. Daz require all product promos to be in .jpg format. I'm a PA, and I'd never heard of webp format till this thread popped up. So it's definitely not the PAs, nor is it DAZ that's creating this format.

  • stephenschoonstephenschoon Posts: 351

    Also never heard of webp until this thread, looks like it's a cloudflare thing to reduce image size and increase download speed by increasing the lossyness of the image. Only available on their paid plans, something the client (I assume Daz) enables.

    Regards
    S.

     

     

  • y3kmany3kman Posts: 765

    People have never heard of WebP? It's actually an old format now (~8 years old). I take it people here also never use WebM as a video format. WebP and WebM offer better compression. It's just other companies refuse to adopt it because of Google.

  • Daywalker DesignsDaywalker Designs Posts: 3,586
    y3kman said:

    People have never heard of WebP? It's actually an old format now (~8 years old). I take it people here also never use WebM as a video format. WebP and WebM offer better compression. It's just other companies refuse to adopt it because of Google.

    Not exactly; a lot of it is that people aren't using software versions that do support it because they've chosen not to embrace "rental" software.
  • Matt_CastleMatt_Castle Posts: 2,338
    edited March 2019
    y3kman said:

    WebP and WebM offer better compression.

    That's arguable in the first place, but even if we assume that's true if that's the format it was originally compressed in, it's obviously not true when they've been re-converted from JPEG - not only do you have the compression artefacts and losses from the original JPEG, you also get WEBP's compression artefacts and losses stacked on top of it.

    Looking at the latest thing I uploaded to the gallery, if I compare the JPEG image I originally uploaded to the WEBP version that Daz has converted it to, I can visibly see more compression artefacts in the latter (and even worse compared to my original PNG master*).

    * And as Daywalker Designs suggests, any question of "Why don't you export straight to WEBP?" can be answered with "My version of Photoshop is older than WEBP, but it still works, gorrammit". (While I hit a few limitations with the older software, I can mostly compensate by using GIMP to supplement it - and that will handle WEBP, but I really CBA to have to convert everything through another program when JPEG is still such a universally accepted format).

    For a company trading on artistic quality, double compressing images is hardly the best way to showcase that...

    Post edited by Matt_Castle on
  • algovincianalgovincian Posts: 2,576

    I hear you on the wisdom of recompression – especially on an art site. The forums will also re-compress a JPG to make a new JPG. If you wish to avoid this, use PNG. It will get re-saved as a new PNG, but it doesn’t matter (as far as quality goes).

    - Greg

     

  • namffuaknamffuak Posts: 4,063
    Daywalker Designs said:
    y3kman said:

    People have never heard of WebP? It's actually an old format now (~8 years old). I take it people here also never use WebM as a video format. WebP and WebM offer better compression. It's just other companies refuse to adopt it because of Google.

     

    Not exactly; a lot of it is that people aren't using software versions that do support it because they've chosen not to embrace "rental" software.

    I've been using Paintshop Pro 7.04 for over a decade as my primary image viewing/sorting/modification program for over a decade. It does everything I need and I see no reason to change software just for this. Cloudflare can show me .webp, but it needs to save as .png, .jpg, or .tiff - without introducing additional compression artifacts.

  • mr clammr clam Posts: 707

    I'm also someone who uses the promo images to keep track of my products and this is a pain. My work-around is to use Safari rather than Chrome. No special settings or anything are needed.

  • nDelphinDelphi Posts: 1,846

    I am downloading the jpg versions by using the open source Free Download Manager. So far it works great.

    I have to grab the image url and then paste it into Free Download Manager and it grabs the jpg version of the file.

    https://www.freedownloadmanager.org

  • drafter69_696b99e42bdrafter69_696b99e42b Posts: 348

    I tried and Adobe Photoshop can not open this format.... If I can't open it then it is useless to me.....

  • PetercatPetercat Posts: 2,315
    Dave230 said:

    Firefox 65 has added support for webp images.  This means if the image was originally served up as webp, the file will now be saved as webp.  Previously, I guess Firefox was internally converting webp to jpg, unbeknownst to many users.  There's nothing wrong with that, but forcing me to save images as webp is troublesome.

    This is how I fixed it, so Firefox saves jpeg images again:

    about:config
    image.webp.enabled  -> CHANGE TO FALSE (default true)
    image.http.accept   -> CHANGE TO  */*  (default image/webp,*/*)

    You must then quit Firefox and restart the program.

    You can test it out by going to the Shop, click on dForce Jasper Black for Genesis 8 Male(s), right-click the Product promo image, and Save Image As, and it should come up as jpeg instead of webp.

    But, this will obviously break support for webp images, so do this at your own risk. :)

    Tried this.
    Images don't show on product page any more.
    Reverted it, now they show again.

    DAZ, go back to .jpg or .png!

  • NotAnArtistNotAnArtist Posts: 367

    The latest version of GIMP supports webp. The XCF file extension of that newest version of GIMP is incompatible with any version of Irfanview. I do work with images between GIMP and Irfanview. So I have to use the older version of GIMP. So I have to use Irfanview to convert the promo webp files to bmp in order to get them into my mandatorily-older GIMP... OK, now I'm lost. Where was I going with this? I've been fighting this crap for several days and I'm so confused now I need a drink.

    I think webp is a relatively-new system that compresses more with less loss. It's being forced on us by... I think Google. Sorry, my brain's gone. Forget I was here.

  • NorthOf45NorthOf45 Posts: 5,244

    Tried the two solutions provided for Firefox, but neither one seems to work on its own. Experimenting a bit, I changed the image/webp to image/jpeg in both image.http.accept and network.http.accept.default keys, along with the image.webp.enabled to false. Works perfectly.

    BTW, IE11 and Edge still save as .jpg

  • nonesuch00nonesuch00 Posts: 17,929

    I'd heard of this format but ignored it as it is so unsupported that Windows 10 doesn't support it natively it must be some niche new propriety standard that isn't in wide use. I did look it up to see where it came from & it's Google format and it's supposed to be a modern take on the jpg format but with smaller disk and memory space so supposedly saving cloud companies bandwidth, compute time, and disk space. Unfortunately, researchers unconnected with Google and other cloud companies state that in their research webp doesn't save significant load time on client web pages and the lossy compression gives images that are more lossy and not as good in quality of jpgs. Of course for tiny screens of mobile phones image quality is not a big factorr but...well broken image icons also save on bandwidth, disk space, and compute time.

  • ColdrakeColdrake Posts: 236

    I'm using Firefox. Right click on the image, then Save Image as, then I change the File name from xxxxx.Webp to xxxxx.jpg and click Save. It saves the image as a jpg.

  • Cris PalominoCris Palomino Posts: 11,151
    Coldrake said:

    I'm using Firefox. Right click on the image, then Save Image as, then I change the File name from xxxxx.Webp to xxxxx.jpg and click Save. It saves the image as a jpg.

    Good to know.

  • ANGELREAPER1972ANGELREAPER1972 Posts: 4,413

    only just read about this in another thread so I thought I'd do a save as on a promo pic which as you all said only had the save as .webp format but I was able to view it in my pictures folder and in paintshop pro 2019 ultimate I'm on W10 pro too

  • pwiecekpwiecek Posts: 1,538

    I had beem using chrome more and firefox less.

    Guess I should have known bettert.

  • eeyuneeyun Posts: 16

    NorthOf45's solution worked for me. Dave230's solution gave me things called jpg's when I saved them, but Windows didn't recognize them as such.

  • MistaraMistara Posts: 38,675
    edited March 2019

    I had to open the jpg url in internet expplorer to save the promo image ss jpg. indecisionI save the oromo image fir everything i buy. The inconvenience is making me second guess if i really want to buy an item before i hit cart button 

    Post edited by Mistara on
  • ArtiniArtini Posts: 8,822
    edited March 2019

    The converters from .webp to .png, .jpg are on:

    https://developers.google.com/speed/webp/download

    I have compiled them from the source on linux and they works.

     

     

    Post edited by Artini on
  • L'AdairL'Adair Posts: 9,479

    I've seen Irfanview mentioned as a program that can open the .webp format. However, it does require you install a plugin. Irfanview has two files to download and install: one for the program itself, and one for the plugins that vastly expand it's capabilities. The webp plugin is in this second archive file.

    I love irfanview and use it for so many things. I especially love being able to save a jpg image at a specified file size. Daz Galleries will force your uploaded image to be under 2MB, if necessary. In the past, I noticed some of my larger images were not the same dimensions as I had uploaded. Since I've kept my uploaded images under 2MB, the dimensions aren't getting changed.

    But one of the great options with Irfanview is the ability to convert from one image format to another using the batch function. While it is extra work, you can save those webp images to a single folder and then run an Irfanview batch to convert all the webp to jpg in one operation. This post might be helpful, if you're not sure how to use the feature. It's geared toward converting png to jpg, but the steps will be mostly the same.

    I will say that I'm thankful for this thread. I now have no intentions of upgrading my FF to the latest version.

    And I hope Daz will read this thread, and choose to opt out of the webp conversion with CloudFlare. As @Matt_Castle points out so succinctly, double compression isn't a good idea on a site that is showcasing art work.

  • Seven193Seven193 Posts: 1,064
    edited March 2019

    .
    Images don't show on product page any more.
    Reverted it, now they show again.

    I updated my solution.  Only image.http.accept needs to be changed to */*.  You don't have to disable image.webp.enabled.

    And yes, if you do this correctly, real jpegs are being saved.  They're not .webp files with a .jpeg extension.

     

    Post edited by Seven193 on
  • MistaraMistara Posts: 38,675
    L'Adair said:

    I've seen Irfanview mentioned as a program that can open the .webp format. However, it does require you install a plugin. Irfanview has two files to download and install: one for the program itself, and one for the plugins that vastly expand it's capabilities. The webp plugin is in this second archive file.

    I love irfanview and use it for so many things. I especially love being able to save a jpg image at a specified file size. Daz Galleries will force your uploaded image to be under 2MB, if necessary. In the past, I noticed some of my larger images were not the same dimensions as I had uploaded. Since I've kept my uploaded images under 2MB, the dimensions aren't getting changed.

    But one of the great options with Irfanview is the ability to convert from one image format to another using the batch function. While it is extra work, you can save those webp images to a single folder and then run an Irfanview batch to convert all the webp to jpg in one operation. This post might be helpful, if you're not sure how to use the feature. It's geared toward converting png to jpg, but the steps will be mostly the same.

    I will say that I'm thankful for this thread. I now have no intentions of upgrading my FF to the latest version.

    And I hope Daz will read this thread, and choose to opt out of the webp conversion with CloudFlare. As @Matt_Castle points out so succinctly, double compression isn't a good idea on a site that is showcasing art work.

    +1

    i havent hated anything this much since the online only encrypted content

  • Seven193Seven193 Posts: 1,064
    edited March 2019
    Coldrake said:

    I'm using Firefox. Right click on the image, then Save Image as, then I change the File name from xxxxx.Webp to xxxxx.jpg and click Save. It saves the image as a jpg.

    I reset my Firefox network settings to test this out and it doesn't work.  You're still saving a .webp file with .jpeg extension.

    Post edited by Seven193 on
  • StezzaStezza Posts: 7,800

    I downloaded the free plugin available from here for my PSE2018 :

    http://telegraphics.com.au/sw/product/WebPFormat

    I can open and save webp images easily in PSE2018  cool

  • Matt_CastleMatt_Castle Posts: 2,338

    If Daz aren't going to disable conversion to WebP format, then they need to least add it to the allowable formats for the gallery.

    I'm fed up of seeing images recompressed with two sets of image artefacts, but lossless PNGs are frequently too large for the 2MB limit (even at low resolutions and after having been fed through PNGCrush) and get resized, and the gallery won't allow uploads directly in WebP format (which is somewhat more efficient at lossless compression than PNG).

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