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That's true enough. Dawn has the same rigging it's the weight mapping that's different. If Smith Micro and DAZ3D had gotten their heads together instead of trying to outdo the other and decided which weight mapping would work best between both programs we wouldn't have to have debates about all this. Dawn is an attempt to bridge things. At least SOMEONE'S trying rather than just placing blame. and yes, it is up to the content creators to make their products for Dawn cross compatible. I for one while I'm enjoying creating morphs for Dawn if I decided to do skin I'd probably have to team up with someone to help me with the Poser side as I don't know enough about it to do anything like shaders or even basic mat poses any justice what so ever.
Cath, who started out as a Poser gal is now mostly using DAZ Studio but is learning Poser again to make sure her suite of upcoming products for Dawn is compatible. Out of Touch is also stepping up to the plate on that end as well as others. Not many but it's a new figure so time will tell. I like this figure allot and she's more versatile than many are giving her credit for.
As for her looking like Gina, she does but there was that other comparison to a Latin actress that I think befits her more. She's a hell of allot prettier than Victoria 3 could ever hope to have been and she was on top for years and years. LOL
DAZ and Smith Micro are competing companies and are no more obligated to work collaboratively than Coke and Pepsi, or Apple and Microsoft. The only thing in this case is that it behoove s DAZ and SM to collaborate because their customer base Is so intertwined. Hive wire is a neutral third party,so it's damn common sense for someone like them to try to bridge the gap between the programs, and it's rather extraordinary that DAZ and SM did eventually work together to get Genesis into Poser at all.
Those new morphs are really cool. I love the little snouts you gave them! SO cute. I can almost see fur on them and bigger eyes and puppy dog ears! lol
They really need to get Thorne on this too. His morphkits for Genesis were good, if expensive, but if they'd made something like that for Dawn, they will be very much in demand, I think.
Easy:
Dawn: Exaggerated hype and promises + “Poser’s Genesis” expectations + limited to her own items (must be supported or die).
I think Dawn is really BAD. Yet I hope she do good for those who have a use for her, but probably support will keep dropping eventually like the other 3rd party girls. She doesn't offers anything new.
They really need to get Thorne on this too. His morphkits for Genesis were good, if expensive, but if they'd made something like that for Dawn, they will be very much in demand, I think.
...I agree, I have several of them for Genesis/G2 and they really do make a difference for designing characters.
Just wanted to post an update of Genna... I mean MarilynD! More tweaks needed but coming along.....
Frankly, I doubt that Poser users outnumber DS users that much (although I would assume that they do out number them). After all, DAZ pretty much showed Poser users the door, yet are still able to pay their bills, apparently.
Content creators, however, seem to use Poser, primarily. That's, I would assume, is why there is so much support for Dawn.
As for myself, I am still shocked at the figure itself and, like, 99% of it's content. To be fair, she hasn't seen a lot of support by the artists I really like, but still....
Frankly, I doubt that Poser users outnumber DS users that much (although I would assume that they do out number them). After all, DAZ pretty much showed Poser users the door, yet are still able to pay their bills, apparently.
Content creators, however, seem to use Poser, primarily. That's, I would assume, is why there is so much support for Dawn.
As for myself, I am still shocked at the figure itself and, like, 99% of it's content. To be fair, she hasn't seen a lot of support by the artists I really like, but still....
i also suspect the poser marketshare advantage is at least somewhat questionable. It may not be a useful way of comparison, but in terms of web traffic, based on the numbers i could find, daz3d.com's is greater than the traffic at renderosity, contentparadise, and runtimedna all put together.
Which is to say that while the other sites are offering a wide initial spread of Dawn content, hoping to give the figure momentum, and DAZ is just plugging along releasing it's G2F content bit by bit, DAZ might well be doing a good bit more business on those releases than the rest.
Looking nice :)
I think you nailed that pose, too.
btw the awesome wilmap posted a dress for Dawn for Daz Studio users in the freepository :)
Frankly, I doubt that Poser users outnumber DS users that much (although I would assume that they do out number them). After all, DAZ pretty much showed Poser users the door, yet are still able to pay their bills, apparently.
Content creators, however, seem to use Poser, primarily. That's, I would assume, is why there is so much support for Dawn.
As for myself, I am still shocked at the figure itself and, like, 99% of it's content. To be fair, she hasn't seen a lot of support by the artists I really like, but still....General figures that are normally bandied about is about 50/50. I don't know of anyway to actually check though. Content creators use both programs and make for the figures that they wish to. There are many creators who use DAZ also some...like Cath and Rawn (who also made some morphs for Dawn) are making things for her. Dawn at this moment is still in her infancy barely a month old and she does have some great things either created or being created for her. If you don't want to use her (whatever your reasoning) that's your choice, but if you (and I'm not aiming this at you Barbubary it is a general comment) want to comment please make sure you're basing it on facts. Some people in this thread are posting without really knowing what they are talking about and are using emotive language to try and appear more knowledgeable then they are about this figure...which is why I keep being drawn back to this thread and posting for the sake of making sure that the facts are known.
I'm not claiming that Dawn is perfect, neither are her creators if you read over at the other forum, they are still adding more morphs and other things for her. In fact they stated in threads in other forums prior to her arrival that they were worried that people would build up their expectations too much.
Dawn is about a fresh start for those who want a community that is united. If you don't that's your choice...personally I like her and have found her to be flexible in terms of looks those who can't see past her initial shape need to ask themselves why and why they are so threatened that they need to diss this figure. Did they do it with the other figures that came out for Poser alone? Where is the harm in an additional figure? Is it the fact that this figure actually works in both programs that is causing this angst?
I have many figures in my runtime. My favourite up til recently has been Genesis, Dawn has a place in my runtime also...to those who say she brings nothing new to the scene, yes she does...she is Genesis style figure that has the same capabilities as the other genesis figures but also works in Poser. Just shows what can be achieved if people really want to.
Have you actually downloaded her Hellboy? Do you have any of her morphs? How long did you take to come to this conclusion? I just would like to know what you're basing your statements on?
An unmorphed Dawn doesn't show her full capabilities the same as an unmorphed Genesis doesn't I still remember the comments about the grey blob that people made that I ignored as I played with Genesis. So is that an educated statement coming from having spent considerable time with Dawn and all her morphs?
Easy:
Dawn: Exaggerated hype and promises + “Poser’s Genesis” expectations + limited to her own items (must be supported or die).
I think Dawn is really BAD. Yet I hope she do good for those who have a use for her, but probably support will keep dropping eventually like the other 3rd party girls. She doesn't offers anything new.
So tell me then, what is the alternative for Poser users if Dawn is so bad? Keep using V4 from now until the end of time?
Greetings,
Just to put this into context, Compete.com shows renderosity (for June, 2013, a pretty basic month) having almost exactly 50% of the traffic of daz3d.com in unique visitors.
Neither is exactly the darlings of the internet, but renderosity netted around 30,000 unique visitors and daz3d.com netted around 63,000. For what it's worth, turbosquid has more than renderosity, with 55,400-ish. No idea how much of those visits translate into sales, obviously, but DAZ definitely has significant mindshare. I couldn't find a competitor site that beats it.
As for Dawn, I have her. I have a few outfits for her, and a few basic morphs. The real problem with Dawn is that a lot of the support is from artists who produce stuff that...well, it wouldn't pass DAZ's QA. There are weird crinkles, bad rigging, a significant lack of DS support, etc., and without a company who really stands firm on QA, it's hard to feel safe buying Dawn content.
That's NOT to speak ill of Dawn's main store. Those folks have been awesome, and I feel like their QA is excellent...but there's almost nothing there, and (outside of the muscle/dwarf morphs which I didn't need) I've bought most of their Dawn content that works in DS. I picked up Xurge3D's Rogue outfit, and...then realized it was for Poser. They let me exchange it for the DS version when it finally came out, which puts them HIGH up on my 'excellent content producers' list. :)
But buying Dawn content at...other stores...well, without the return policy of DAZ or Dawn's main store, or the attendant top-notch QA, I really don't trust it anymore.
I do hope that not too many Poser users get burned in the process.
-- Morgan
p.s. I do have a few decentmorphs for Dawn, but none of them look even as good as G2F does sans morphs, unfortunately. My favorite at this point is Alexis, but not every character can be a late teen.
I have bought content for Dawn at all of the main stores. So far I haven't found any problems with the quality of the items I bought. I can highly recommend MStene(hope I spelt that right) over at RDNA's characters. I have a number of items sitting in my cart at Rendo trying to decide what to get as there are more items than I can afford and I want to save some money for Mec4D's stuff that she is currently working on. I doubt that anyone will question the quality of Cath's work.
Just until something better than Generation 4 arrives to Poser.
All this time I thought everyone was talking about Dawn for V4 and V5 by Raiya. Thanks for the explanation.
Have you actually downloaded her Hellboy? Do you have any of her morphs? How long did you take to come to this conclusion? I just would like to know what you're basing your statements on?
An unmorphed Dawn doesn't show her full capabilities the same as an unmorphed Genesis doesn't I still remember the comments about the grey blob that people made that I ignored as I played with Genesis. So is that an educated statement coming from having spent considerable time with Dawn and all her morphs?
I used the figure and it’s just yet another girl model, not impressed with her renders and to put it nicely, the content available isn't tempting either.
She’s too limited (it’s just a “she” to begin with), bends weird, can’t use other figure’s content (yes, you could try doing your own workarounds for clothing but why bother?) and as far as I know, she is limited to her own textures only.
Sorry, no way I’m spending on morphs for it. I have not seen morphs interesting enough. She’s too manly and they don’t look like helping so far.
I used the figure and it’s just yet another girl model, not impressed with her renders and to put it nicely, the content available isn't tempting either.
She’s too limited (it’s just a “she” to begin with), bends weird, can’t use other figure’s content (yes, you could try doing your own workarounds for clothing but why bother?) and as far as I know, she is limited to her own textures only.
Sorry, no way I’m spending on morphs for it. I have not seen morphs interesting enough. She’s too manly and they don’t look like helping so far.
Thanks for the answer so I can assume from your response you don't like GF2 either as she is just another girl figure? At least Dawn is not planning on staying that way...each to their own. I have better things to do then continue discussing this...I'm off to do some rendering there's an awesome render competition for those interested in Dawn. Details just announced over at the other forum...sorry I can't provide a link. Pity you aren't interested Hellboy as your renders are always top quality...the prizes are super cool.
OK, I was just anwering your question.
As you could read in other threads and sites, no, I don't like the gender split. I consider it an unnecessary and unfortunate step backwards.
I haven't been following the threads here so much...I agree with what you say here wholeheartedly. Sorry if I came across rude. I didn't mean to...I've been home sick the last few days and I'm probably a bit grumpy because of it. I personally like Dawn, a lot, but that doesn't mean others have to. Given the prizes in that competition I'm surprised someone with your skill at rendering isn't interested, however it does give other people more of a chance.
For what it's worth, it's REALLY pointlessly ridiculous when people judge a figure on its base shape. Let's be real- I can't think of many base figures that I thought were beautiful in default shape. Default V2, V3, V4, genesis, and genesis 2 F are all, IMO, totally unattractive. It takes custom shapes and textures to make them popular and beautiful and well loved, and that does take time. The same old complaints about Dawn being "unattractive" or "manly" or "plain" are just that... repeated for the start of any figure. And it doesn't relate at ALL to the figure's full extent of possibility and potential.
In all fairness, Dawn can do whatever genesis does. She's got some better posing ability than Genesis. Genesis has way more available right now, but uh...Dawn's not even a month old yet... that's expected right?
I'm all about giving characters a fair chance. I like variety. It true that Genesis gets an advantage because I can use all my old content on Genesis. Genesis 2 lost that advantage, has half the functionality of genesis one, details or not. True, i work mostly with female shapes, but its really hard to go to a new figure and leave all my awesome genesis content behind.
Dawn's a lovely new lady. Genesis is a very well supported figure. Daz is a big store. Hivewire is a new store. It's not about competition. It's about giving a new figure a chance without the same old angst that seems to dog every new figure out there.
Just my two cents but I don't really comprehend the whole reaction to her base shape. No one uses the V4 default, no one uses the genesis default shapes. Judging on those is just.... a non-point. It makes no sense at all.
I'll give them that.
Those prizes are insanely good.
I know the pros and semi-pros will be going at it for those.
Photoshop to the 1,000,000th power!
I don't even know what the prizes are. The problem is, there's not much I can do with Dawn. I'd had to reshape her, work on her textures, leave her naked, probably do lots of postwork, and who knows what the rules about those last two things are.
I like challenges, but I wouldn't know where to start and doubt I would come up with something good.
But I hope people have fun with it.
I don't even know what the prizes are. The problem is, there's not much I can do with Dawn. I'd had to reshape her, work on her textures, leave her naked, probably do lots of postwork, and who knows what the rules about those last two things are.
I like challenges, but I wouldn't know where to start and doubt I would come up with something good.
But I hope people have fun with it.
Not sure if I'm allowed to do this but there are no links so I'm hoping its alright...
Final Round Winners
1st Prize
•$1000 Cash
•Poser Pro 2014
•Reality 3 for Poser, or Reality 2.5 for DAZ Studio
•(free upgrade to version 3 when available) Store gift certs
•Free copy of Dawn’s Body Shapes from HiveWire 3D (Add-on Morph Pack Currently in Development)
•$100 RuntimeDNA Gift Certificate
•$100 Renderosity Gift Certificate
•Your Choice of 1 Free product from each of the following vendors from YURdigital:
•Prae
•sidherose
•islandgirl
farconville
•JaneEden
•12 month unlimited download membership to Poserworld
There are some limits on nudity though so like you said probably not your thing...I only listed the first prize
Cash is always nice, the rest, meh.
If only she came with a bikini or wathever it would worth the try.
Thanks anyway.
You're evil.
Basic Dawn pack comes with Dawn, a bikini, hair and skin with one makeup option. There is a really nice free pair of pumps over at the 'Rosity free section, should be on the first page still. They are in Poser prop format and the mats are also but it's easy enough to load them up and save them out in DS formats. The mats are pretty nice right out of the box. There is more free Dawn stuff just search for it.