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Darn message board. Just typed a long response and it got lost after I submitted the post.
Anyway, I guess it doesn't hurt to retype what I can remember. I don't find your post superfluous at all. I appreciate any comments, and there are certainly going to be people who think I am wasting my time "reinventing the wheel." In fact, DAZ might even find it too similar to the SuperSuit and reject it altogether. The main feature of this product is going to be the "oversuit", which will have features requested by the people contributing to this thread. What I have posted so far is merely the "undersuit", nothing more than long underwear, really. With options ;-)
My main goal is to produce a science fiction styled uniform/outfit that meets the wants of the user that, so far, have not been met in most of the sci-fi bodysuits out there. I have the SuperSuit, and I love it for the most part, but since it was originally based on Genesis UV's and geometry, many of the zones people wanted are not easily achieved. And as a community project, those who contribute specific design elements, such as a weapon or color scheme, even if it's just a crude sketch, will receive the final suit for free and will have something that meets their needs. And I will have something I might make a buck or two from. So, hopefully, win-win.
I'm not sure what is possible with material zones and uv mapping and all that tecnical stuff. But what would truly be a unique body suit would be one that has a kind of fine poly grid(?) where the user would have total control of the wardrobe design for adding shaders or opasity changes foreach polygon. --the super suit for genesis kind of does this but still has some very large material zones that limit the user's controls and creativity-- probably not possible or way too labour intensive but would be very nice!
Here are the two renders I promised in previous posts. The first is the suit on Victoria 5 so you can see how it fits a female. Yes, I will include breast span morphs. I can also see that I may need another zone for the short sleeves. They are too long as is, especially for females or children.
The second is the suit with an alphabet grid on it so you can see how the current UV layout will take a texture.
That sounds a lot like the new PTex technology, if I am understanding you correctly. That would be pretty cool, but is well beyond my skill set at this point.
Darn message board. Just typed a long response and it got lost after I submitted the post.
Anyway, I guess it doesn't hurt to retype what I can remember. I don't find your post superfluous at all. I appreciate any comments, and there are certainly going to be people who think I am wasting my time "reinventing the wheel." In fact, DAZ might even find it too similar to the SuperSuit and reject it altogether. The main feature of this product is going to be the "oversuit", which will have features requested by the people contributing to this thread. What I have posted so far is merely the "undersuit", nothing more than long underwear, really. With options ;-)
My main goal is to produce a science fiction styled uniform/outfit that meets the wants of the user that, so far, have not been met in most of the sci-fi bodysuits out there. I have the SuperSuit, and I love it for the most part, but since it was originally based on Genesis UV's and geometry, many of the zones people wanted are not easily achieved. And as a community project, those who contribute specific design elements, such as a weapon or color scheme, even if it's just a crude sketch, will receive the final suit for free and will have something that meets their needs. And I will have something I might make a buck or two from. So, hopefully, win-win.
Ok, as long as it's improving/adding, then it'll pay off.
Slosh I will be sending you pictures of what I have in mind. I tried to use your images with what I have in CS2, but I am still new to that program and can't use my Paint Shop Pro (no longer have the disk and my serial won't work with trial downloads).
Before I decide on the images to send you, does it matter if the suit is one piece or can it be two piece...secondly, would you be making one for women and one for men? I ask about the making two due to how the chest is done between the male and female. In many cases, the chest on women is enhanced to make it look bigger and show off cleavage, which is not typically done on men. Also, do you only want a simple bodysuit as armor such as the nano suit used in crysis3?, of which Xurge has a nice one. Or do you want a full blown armor suit like they have for Halo and space suits and the like? Of course you can go the ninja route or some sci fi version of that, but it's pretty plain.
Forgot to ask...is a helmet necessary?, cause I might have something for that as well, and boots and weapons. Guess it really depends on how different you want to be from what is already out there.
I still have not seen or read of anything resembling what I have in mind, which is surprising considering how popular the genre is. I do believe what I have in mind will fit in with what you consider "different" from what's out there, I certainly have never seen it's like in any 3D store on in real life.
Here's the image as requested. They did sort of a bustier top seam for supersuit but its very oddly shaped and goes too far above the cleavage.
If you can shrink individual seams on supersuit, i have no idea how to. Selecting the seam material doesnt seem to correspond to any morphs, only selecting the suit itself, the parts of which do not match up with mat zones. Still, I could easily be missing it, because Im that way lol.
And I am VERY interested. I will happily be the first customer in line ;) Espeically if this suit solves my sci-fi uniform problem. Are you planning to allow it to morph into a 2 piece like in my render, like ultrasuit does?
The shift to diagonal patterns on the arms and legs is interesting, but you might want to include an alternate UV that keeps the pattern orthogonal throughout.
My own experience with stretchy fabrics suggests that a certain amount and type of distortion is normal, e.g. The pattern on the lower legs will come out smaller than on the upper legs, where it will stretch. But a lot of people don't seem to like that effect, in which case youre going to have more visible seams. It may be worthwhile to do both of these as well.
The UV mapping of the original super suit isn't well designed for tiling patterns, so if yours handles them better, you may find a niche. :)
Let me know if you need illustrations of what I'm talking about....
It would be better to do this with opacity maps, etc. You do have pixel-level control with those. All you need is a simple paint program to make them.
This is what I meant for pads and capri zones.
My idea that each "pad" consists of 2 "half-pads", one slightly above the middle-cut and one slightly below. I like the idea of having a material zone right in the middle of joint, like you have so if a pad is just one zone it might not happen, therefore two "half-pads".
Capri pants and halfsleeves to add some variety.
Calie, it is completely open. If you choose to submit a 2-piece outfit, it will be taken into consideration. Right now, I am still working on the one-piece "undersuit", which will have many material zone options (see pic below for examples). There have not been enough suggestions to begin on the outerwear. You might say it will be at least a 3 piece outfit (undersuit and top/bottom). There will also be, of course, belts, shoes/boots, and other accessories. It all depends on what is suggested. Helmets, face masks, etc. If you want to submit those items, either with or without an outfit, they will also be considered. I will not be doing a cape (probably) because it's meant to be sci-fi, not superhero, but as you can see in my pic, superhero suits are certainly obtainable.
As far as marking up my pics, you don't have to. They are only provided for those who don't want to draw from scratch. If you have another sketch of your own, that is fine. The only thing I don't want is photos, screengrabs, or pics of other products except maybe to clarify an idea, such as "shoulders like on this outfit." I don't want to copy anyone else, keeping in mind of course that there are only so many ways to make a shirt.
I didn't intend, originally, to address the female form, but due to popular demand I think I need to consider it. I don't think I will be including a bustier or corset type of material zone because that has been done for female sci-fi suits again and again.
Here's the image as requested. They did sort of a bustier top seam for supersuit but its very oddly shaped and goes too far above the cleavage.
If you can shrink individual seams on supersuit, i have no idea how to. Selecting the seam material doesnt seem to correspond to any morphs, only selecting the suit itself, the parts of which do not match up with mat zones. Still, I could easily be missing it, because Im that way lol.
And I am VERY interested. I will happily be the first customer in line ;) Espeically if this suit solves my sci-fi uniform problem. Are you planning to allow it to morph into a 2 piece like in my render, like ultrasuit does?
I may have to forego the bustier top, Greco. So many sci-fi bodysuits already have such features, and I'm not sure my tired brain can handle remapping the suit for the ninth time. It is very tedious and there are already more than 30 individual material zones, including the seams. There is a chance that I might get a wild hair and do it anyway. My heart says, "Do it, do it!", but my brain says, "I'm tired of looking at those polygons." Maybe once I have explored other parts of the uniform design, I will find the motivation to rework the mesh. To put those zones in there means routing new polygons, which kills the current UV's, which contain all of the material zones. So, basically, starting over.
The shift to diagonal patterns on the arms and legs is interesting, but you might want to include an alternate UV that keeps the pattern orthogonal throughout.
My own experience with stretchy fabrics suggests that a certain amount and type of distortion is normal, e.g. The pattern on the lower legs will come out smaller than on the upper legs, where it will stretch. But a lot of people don't seem to like that effect, in which case youre going to have more visible seams. It may be worthwhile to do both of these as well.
The UV mapping of the original super suit isn't well designed for tiling patterns, so if yours handles them better, you may find a niche. :)
Let me know if you need illustrations of what I'm talking about....
ZBrush has managed to make me some very nice UVs, which have little or no difference in texture stretching, except when bending (such as the shoulders and knees). Still, very little distortion. And the seams fall down the back, under the arms, and between the legs. See my pic below for samples.
I think I will offer an alternate set of UVs, more orthogonal as you say. It would be hard for the user to get certain patterns to go the way they want in the current set of UVs.
It would be better to do this with opacity maps, etc. You do have pixel-level control with those. All you need is a simple paint program to make them.
With the nice UVs I have on this suit so far, opacity maps will take very well, even tiled.
You will be happy to know I added 2 more sleeve zones (capped and 3 quarter), and adjusted the capri length to mid calf. As for the pad zones, I think having pads as separate items might be a more logical choice. But, I never say never, except just there. I am considering adding a bustier zone, so if I do that I will readdress the pads. It's basically starting over when you add new zones.
Here is a sampling of some of the possibilities with the material zones I currently have in place. I apologize for the lousy Photoshop work... I forget to make the renders .png, so I had to really fudge the cutting out of the characters. Still, this is a good sampling, I think, of the versatility just based on material zones. I have not started creating the morphs yet... wanted to make sure the UVs and the material zones were good first. Material zones have to be made before fitting the suit to Genesis, then morphs have to be made after. Unless there is something I don't know, it's the only way. I spent a couple of hours making material zones, a few more hours making morphs, then I fit it to Genesis and the morphs disappeared! So, back to the drawing board I made the morphs after fitting to Genesis only to realize that my face groups had changed to match Genesis and I could no longer select the material zones. ZBrush (where I do most of the work) would not recognize my original zones which I wanted to use to select areas for morphing. Anyway, I have figured out the proper order of things and that means no morphs until the material zones are finished.
The only thing in this render that is not part of the suit is the cape on the superhero. Everything else, including the bracelets on two of the ladies is the suit.
Looks like it's coming along well.
really nice work
It looks really, really nice :)
Although I don't understand why you need to do a full remap each time you add a material zone (at least, it was my impression that you need to do this)
Looks like you've done a really good job so far. :)
Very nice! I like the work on the collar.
It is true, that's what happens. At least in the case of the bustier, where new polygons will have to be cut in to get the right shape. I suppose I could just move them into the shape, but then the whole thing won't flow nicely. As for the pads, they could be selected in DS, with the polygon group editor and reassigned... I have already done this with a couple of zones (the capris). Maybe I will give this whole issue some thought.
Full remap might be a misnomer. When I send the suit to ZBrush from DS, the zones I have set up disappear. I have a copy of the suit with UVs and material zones saved out, which I would normally just import into ZBrush to reestablish the zones, but for some reason that doesn't seem to be working anymore. The suit ends up importing at the wrong scale, making it useless for generation morphs. I do have an idea that I will try later, however. Too lengthy to explain, but it just might work. Funny how sleeping on something for a night or two, or explaining the problem in writing makes your brain "click" with a solution.
I was doing some housecleaning in my content directory today and realized that I have the V4 bodysuit (didn't even know I had it). When I look at that, it seems exactly like what I am making here, without the seam zones. I hope I am not wasting my time. I guess I need to start working on the main suit, but other than one or two sketches, I haven't gotten any guides from the community. I really like the blue and gold suit in the center of the image above. I might start exploring how to enhance that suit with more details, like breathable mesh zones, reinforced elbows, knees, shoulder details, etc. The stuff people have asked for in their features lists. I also notice that the suit is not very tight on some characters, so I will need to work some fitting morphs in there.
I browse cghub.com when I need inspiration, just pound that refresh button until something jumps out at you from the thumbnails.
The blue/green and gold one stands out to me, too. That looks like it could be used for a lot of different purposes.
I browse cghub.com when I need inspiration, just pound that refresh button until something jumps out at you from the thumbnails.
Thanks, but I'm not looking for inspiration. I'm designing the suit based on requests, although I might make one for myself based on my personal needs.
You are not wasting your time. Some of those zones already beat the v4 suit.
I will buy it.
I may have to forego the bustier top, Greco. So many sci-fi bodysuits already have such features, and I'm not sure my tired brain can handle remapping the suit for the ninth time. It is very tedious and there are already more than 30 individual material zones, including the seams. There is a chance that I might get a wild hair and do it anyway. My heart says, "Do it, do it!", but my brain says, "I'm tired of looking at those polygons." Maybe once I have explored other parts of the uniform design, I will find the motivation to rework the mesh. To put those zones in there means routing new polygons, which kills the current UV's, which contain all of the material zones. So, basically, starting over.
I will give you sex and babies. A nation-state named for you. *gasping weakly* pleeease.
I may have to forego the bustier top, Greco. So many sci-fi bodysuits already have such features, and I'm not sure my tired brain can handle remapping the suit for the ninth time. It is very tedious and there are already more than 30 individual material zones, including the seams. There is a chance that I might get a wild hair and do it anyway. My heart says, "Do it, do it!", but my brain says, "I'm tired of looking at those polygons." Maybe once I have explored other parts of the uniform design, I will find the motivation to rework the mesh. To put those zones in there means routing new polygons, which kills the current UV's, which contain all of the material zones. So, basically, starting over.
I will give you sex and babies. A nation-state named for you. *gasping weakly* pleeease. I'm still laughing at this, trying to type correctly. "Sex and babies." You are a riot. Just answered your PM, but I see you found my post reply.
But making me laugh is a great way to get results. That and playing the piano or guitar. I will make sure the bustier zones are in the final bodysuit. I will make a high and a low cut for it, more choices that way. And I will put in the knee and elbow zones for Kattey. It just might have to wait until later in the process. Right now I am so sick of looking at those polygons I could just go take a nap.
I really want to start on the outersuit. I was looking at my group render (it's my wallpaper so I can study it) and I have some ideas brewing. I just need some good coffee and a quick nap and I am ready to start messing around.
I hope to see some more submissions from the community. This is supposed to be for everyone, features by request. I would rather not just present something that I personally think is cool, and expect everyone else to want it, too. My experiment in designing clothes is not going as successfully as I had hoped. At any rate, I now have a full body suit that I can chop up into pieces for any future clothes. A base, if you will.
You are not wasting your time. Some of those zones already beat the v4 suit.
I will buy it.
You won't have to buy it. You've already contributed enough to get it free.