Definitely not convinced on Genesis 8 yet.
This discussion has been closed.
Daz 3D is part of 
Connect
DAZ Productions, Inc.
7533 S Center View Ct #4664
West Jordan, UT 84084
Licensing Agreement | Terms of Service | Privacy Policy | EULA
© 2026 Daz Productions Inc. All Rights Reserved.
Comments
No, I didn't; I focused on the operative word, which is "interest".
Not everyone cares about anatomically accurate bends and flexs.
The point is surely that artists like Zev0 are already releasing the products to "complete" G8 just as those products came out for G3 and G2, etc. So, having bought most of Zev0's G3 store to get ShapeShift and Growing Up and Vascularity and Aging Morphs, etc., I would need to make a similar investment to get G8 to the same degree of versatility. And when it comes to clothes, I haven't tried it but in previous incarnations the clone transfer process didn't transfer like-for-like: something always gets lost in the process so I assume the same is true for G3-G8 transfers.
So I am still not convinced that there is enough improvement in G8 over G3 to justify starting over. The one thing that will tempt me to update is when exciting new products come out that only work with G8. Even so, I note that quite a few people who post here never made the jump from G2 to G3 so I'm suspecting that even more will not do so from G3 to G8. It is just too heavy on tha bank balance for me so I'll probably skip a generation and wait for spectacular innovations with G9.
His, I suppose. Not that I really care if I'm misgendered (I'm male, I have that luxury) but it might make other people more comfortable.
About eye distortion, it really isn't that big of a deal unless the morph is very stylized, most of the time. It's caused by the fact that there are many more verticies in G3's eyes than in G8s. Also due to the fact that the eyes have verts very close together. Finally, the fact that G8's eyes are watertight and G3's aren't means that, with subdivision active, G8's eyes are slightly smaller than G3s. This becomes visible on scaling, so large sylized eyes are noticably too small for their eyesockets. This has to be corrected maunually.
I understand that, and respect it. While I've bought at least Growing Up every generation, G3 was the first time i bought most of the products he made, so I'll probably wait for some time before getting any of his this time around. I may just limit myself to the Growing Up stuff again; I don't know.
I've noticed the faster loading too. But is it the morphs that come with installed characters for the figure that slows loading down, or just the morph pack addons, or both?
It's the addons.
OK, that's a relief, I already have all my G3 morphs packs installed but currently only a fraction of my G3 characters.
I thought so, but I wasn't sure...
This is a silly argument because how often are you going to leave the character in the default pose and neutral expression and render like that? For most people that's going to be rarely if ever. Most people do not buy characters to leave in the T-Pose and just look at in the default pose. You buy them to pose, set up in scenes, give expressions to, etc. And in those cases, the Genesis 8 figure is superior because, as I said, she has superior bends, muscle flexing, and expressions (and you do not have to buy added products to get the superior bends, muscle flow and flexing, and expressions - they come default with Genesis 8 Female base figure).
So your argument doesn't make a whole lot of sense.
Agreed, but the argument in question is centered around "anatomically accurate" bends and flexing, which for most users is overkill. In fact, in some ways I find the default bends to be MORE accurate in a lot of cases, since I don't particularly care for rendering the latest fashion model with what appears to be surgically perfected ankles and toes, etc.
I've been doing some G8F morphs in ZBrush and have found that to be a lot of fun. I've done some lovely (at least, lovely IMO) characters. If you'd like some help "fem-ifying" your character, let me know. If you send me the OBJ file I can see about morphing it to be a bit more girly lol. Here are some of the morphs I've done in ZBrush with the Genesis 8 base figure:
And here are some of the faces I morphed for G8F (I'm hoping Daz might be interested in having some of them in their store):
Let me know if you want some help with morphing your character to be a bit more "feminine". Send me the OBJ file and I'll be happy to send you a couple different "more feminine" morph versions. :)
Those morphs look good, divamakeup. Congratulations on your new skills! May I suggest that you change the eye sizes/position (not just shape) at least as much as you did the noses/mouths so that each head might look more distinctive from the others.
Ah - great idea! Thank you for the suggestion! :) When I first started doing the morphs I was scared to morph too close to the eyes, because I sometimes ended up morphing the eyeball or iris. So I didn't want to get too close to the eyes. However I've since learned how to keep the eyes and teeth "safe" while working on morphs. So yes, you're right, I should go back and do some more work with the eyes now that I don't have to worry about distorting the eyeballs or irises. :D
Thank you for the suggestion, xyer0!
I remember reading that thread. While you're at it, can you throw in some narrow-nostriled, thin-lipped, squinty-eyed faces just for variety?
If you send me links to some photo refrences I'll see what I can do. :)
Thinking about it, what's actually the difference between a morph in a morph pack and a character morph in this context? Unless the character is loaded they're usually (at least with G3) both dial morphs, and both zeroed by default? Why does the morph pack morphs slow down loading the figure, while the character morphs don't?
Because a single morph pack can have dozens or even hundreds of morphs. That said, I haven't found that they slow down loading much, but I know many people find they do.
OK, so a full character morph counts as a single morph in a morph pack. What about characters that use morphs from already installed morph packs only, will they make any difference at all?
Still, even if a character only counts as one morph, if you have several hundred characters installed it must slow down things in a noticable way.
With this approach my full-packed G3 will definitely win over hollow G8 each time in every aspect :)
Seems like you don't understand my point. It's clear:
1. G8 is not 'new generation' of figures. Everything it has 'new' could be done as addons to G3 and many such addons already exist and are even superior to what G8 has in base: HD expressions, HD muscles, conforming eyelashes, realistic eyes. Nails might be implemented as geografts. In fact, most of products of these kinds do exist in numbers and many users have them already bought (I do).
2., Instead of extending existing figure or making real innovations DAZ decided to give 'next gen' name to what really is just 'service release' (remember Vicky3 SR1, V4.1 and V4.2 - good old times... ?). And now people start to wait Lilith 8, Gia 8 or what their favourite figure was and will eagerly empty their wallets when said figures will come like they did for 5, 6 and 7 generations.
3. So they changed default pose to make it difficult for average Joe user to use new clothes and other stuff on G3. (Even after excelent tutorial from SY you still need make manual corrections as transfer is never 100% accurate). Yes, A pose is better for those who model clothes but at the same time it's worse for shoes so 'aid to devs' is not an argument here.
4. Doing all above mentioned DAZ almost lost me as customer. Everything I bought after G8 release are PC+ items and some old stuff. And interesting old stuff is quickly coming to an end.
Using your own arguments - people rarely if ever work with base figures, they want to work with their characters and if I'd want to transfer my characters to G8 I'd have to either spend bucks on required addons or spend hundreds of hours in transfer utilities and Modo.
You're doing nice morphs for G8 but I'll never buy them, if you'd do it for G3 the situation would be different :)
Studio identifies and loads every single morph in the figure morph folder. All of them. I don't know if it loads morph deltas, but that doesn't matter because they are all text files. What slows things down is the fact that each one must read, translated into machine code, and executed. For most people, a few hundreds of morphs aren't going to be vastly noticable. But because one product can be many tens of morphs, some people end up with many thousands. And that starts to add up. It's a big spender issue, or a "I own all the GenX2 stuff" problem, or a Featured Artist problem. Or something along those line. Access to the content firehose can really bog down the Genesis line of figures.
A clean install of G3 will load as fast as a clean G8.. Two years from now, everyone will be noticing how fast G9 loads.
To be clear, it's not that morph packs make slow and characters don't. It purely the absolute amount of morph data. A couple of morph packs is worth a dozen characters. Both sets of morphs will slow the load down by the same amount, roughly. It's possible really large morph packs, or those with lots of detals might slow things more, but that because they contain more data. Not all morphs are equal. Some are larger files than others and take more time to read.
When Studio loads a character for the first time all child directories under /data/DAZ 3D/Genesis 3/Female/Morphs must be scanned. Then all files that were found during scan (there may be hundreds if not thousands of them) must be decompressed, read and parsed at least to the point where actual morph deltas begin so Studio may build 'Parameters' pane and interdependency graph. I don't know if Studio can cache this info for subsequent characters or not but still the first one will require this work to be done.
Then goes actual loading of morphs that your character really uses. This process inludes reading deltas, allocating memory for them, applying them to mesh. If you use the mix of dialed characters then the total amount of morphs here may easily be over hundred too.
And finally - posing. Here JCMs are loaded and if you character is, say, a mix of Ivan 7 and George be prepared to load a couple of dozens custom JCMs.
And we didn't yet come to the loading of clothes and props :)
So I just buy things like props and environments and shaders which every generation of figures can use. Like Stonemason's new sets.
Yes, that was also what I was suspecting. Just checked, I have at least 10 G3F morph packs and 154 G3F characters installed and with a freshly opened DS G3F loads in about 45 seconds (7-10 year old hardware). Not that bad really, it just feels like a long time when you are waiting.
Yes, there are a lot of complex things going on behind the scenes so to speak, when you're working with this stuff, you normally don't think about this. Considering how complex everything is technically in the 3D world it's actually quite amazing how fast things are going anyway, these days. But we humans can never get it fast enough, of course.
The biggest slow down on starting DAZ Studio is your content residing on old-fashioned magnetic disks.
All right. Glad to have it confirmed from multiple sources that if one IS working mostly with extreme, cartoony, NPR models, the morph transfer process does lead to problems. Presumably thus sticking with G3 is genuinely the best option there.
I'm going to wait for DAZ to make the Morpheus Bundle & Girl / Guy products for Genesis 8. I am wondering though if 3DU will make their Toon Generations 2 bundle for Genesis 8; if they don't that might be the one bundle I do try to transfer to Genesis 8.
OK, who am I to interfere with mantras... :)
I have like 4 Tb of 'old-fashioned' HDD storage devoted solely to Studio content and am very happy with startup and scene load and rendering times. It all depends on content organization.