Would it be easier to call the next Generation 8 - Genesis 8?
linvanchene
Posts: 1,386
That thought came up while trying to navigate how to explain new users what kind of figures to buy.
It is confusing to explain to people that Genesis 3 is generation 7 with Victoria7. and Michael 7.
Then there are people still talking about generation 4 with Victoria 4 and Michael 4.
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Next up: Genesis 4 and Generation 8.
I dread the thought of the confusion about generation 4 and Genesis 4. Gen 4.
Therefore -> why not:
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Genesis 8
Generation 8
Victoria 8, Michael 8
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Guess we will find out sometime in the future if someone had a similar idea or not.
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Comments
Because up until Genesis, everything was an iteration of a much simpler base/unimesh line. Genesis brought entirely new technology on a fundimental level to the table that has never happened in such as way in the 3D world before. In fact, the Genesis tech was so revolutionary at the time that, at first, Poser users couldn't even get access to it unless they adopted DS4 or waited for DAZ themselves to negotiate with SmithMicro just to get scripts like DSON onto the scene.
Because of all this, none of the Iconic Characters are stand-alone figures, aka, "The Millennium Family", anymore. They're all just add-ons to the Genesis Base tech with special rigging adjustments now.
I like the idea.
Many examples... Java 1.4 went onto Java 5. It was a major overhaul though. I would have supported the Genesis 3 becoming Genesis 7 as that was a major change from triax to dual quaternion. If there's a major change with Genesis 4 again maybe :)
As a newcomer to 3D art and the different generations of figures, I'm still quite confused. I really wish that people WOULDN'T talk about "generations" - as, to me, THAT is confusing. I get V3, V4, V5, V6, V7 - I understand that, it's clear, concise, to the point and understandable. When people start throwing in "generation 3" and "generation 4" into the conversation it suddenly gets very unclear. Which figures are they talking about when they say generation 4? Are they talking about the V4 generation? The V5 generation? I just don't know, and you pretty much need a chart to understand it all.
Collectively, as a community, I think there needs to be a clear way to talk about figures, current and past, without using confusing terms that those of us who haven't been around for ages don't understand.
Can we say "the V4 generation"? Or "the M4 generation" if you like that better? To me that's much clearer than "generation 3" or "generation 4" when people who haven't been around for years and years don't know what that means. When someone says "generation 3" I don't know if people mean the V3 line of figures or do they mean Genesis 3 figures? Or do they mean something else entirely? I just don't know, and I doubt I'm the only newer person to 3D art that is confused by that terminology.
Personally, I wish people had picked up what I suggested years ago, and refer to V4 and M4 as the Mil(lennium) 4 figures.
The short form of Genesis and Generation are both "Gen" which is where the initial confusion comes from. However, since the first Genesis figure came out and was widely adopted, refering to the figures based on their Generation number has been replaced by refering to them based on the Genesis figure version. The numbers have been kept to avoid further confusion between characters with the same name for different base figures. And lets face it, Genesis 3 is still Generation 7 as its the 7th version of the Mike and Vicky characters to bare the name. The rest of the characters for Genesis 3 that Daz3D releases carry the same number to avoid confusion and to let you know they are for Genesis 3 and not an earlier figure. Think of it in terms of the Enterprise from Star Trek except Daz3D uses numbers and not letters.
+10. I've been here a bit over a year and I still get confused.
Since all the generation 4 figures (V4, M4, K4, A4 etc) are based on a single mesh and share a lot of underlying technology, people often want a way to refer to all those figures collectively, which is why the term generation 4 is used and is relevant. As stated above the core of the confusion is that Generation and Genesis both have the same short form. When you say V4, you are talking about a specific morph of one generation, not generally about the whole generation, so saying V4 alone can also be confusing to people.
What made you think I want people to say "V4 alone"? If you'd taken the time to read what I wrote, I clearly said: "the V4 generation" or "the M4 generation".
Or you would even be more clear by saying "the V4/M4 generation". Or "the V6/M6 generation".
The V4 or M4 is the only one I relate to a generation. I personally wouldn't want figures referred to by generation. I like them referred to by Genesis number (that's what I do, and what the product titles do. "For Genesis 3 Females.." etc.
If I see figures referred to as Generation 5, 6, or 7 it doesn't register, I don't even bother to decipher which Genesis that goes to. And yes, I do think it would be simpler to match up the generation and figure numbers.
I would prefer people said Generation 4 over the V4 generation or the V4/M4 generation, what we really need to avoid using is the short form gen, unless it is clear from the rest of what someone has said which set of figuers they are refering to.
Edit: I should add that I agree with the OP that the next set of figures should be called Genesis 8, otherwise the confusion will never end.
If DAZ had called the original Genesis "Genesis 5" instead of just Genesis then everything would be inline...ie V5 for Genesis 5 M5 for Genesis 5........ V7 for Genesis 7 yada yada yada
It makes sense to do it.
But whatever happens some are going to be confused; leaning the terminology for newcomers is always part of the process, and part of the 'fun' - and applies to anything you care to imagine.
I understand though that Daz might not want to do that; the technology is different, and making 8 would suggest it isn't. Of course, they're all meshes, and all rigged, and all have UVs, so really how different are they? Well that is also part of the learning processes for new comers, and up to them how much they chose to learn. That difference is actually important.
So while it initially makes sense to do, I'm not in favour of it for the reasons I've touched on.
The problem there is that Genesis was the first of its line, no 4 predecessors that were also called Genesis. But I do get the mixup-problems, too, on occasion.
Calling the next iteration of Genesis "Genesis 8" would likely cause more confusion, as many new to 3D would be looking for 4 - 7. A better way to look at it is to go by the figure iteration; Victoria 4 very clearly refers to "generation 4", where as Aiko 5 is very clearly "genesis".
That wouldn't have been the first time they skipped a few numbers to label the figure based on the "generation". The first version of David was David 3, same for Hiro, the Young Teens and Preschoolers, and Aiko 3 and SP3 were actually the second version of the figure: all of them were labelled "3" as they were part of "generation 3".
Agreed!!
+1!!
I, at least, do. Though that may, at least in part, be because I started just before the Mil 4 line was introduced with Victoria 4. Still, as far as I'm concerned there's Mil 1 (millenium man and Millenium woman), Mil 2 (Victoria 2, Michael 2, Stephanie/Aiko, the original Mil Baby, Mil boys and Ml Girls), Mil 3 (Victoria 3, Michael 3, Stephanie Petite 3, David 3, Luke and Laura, Matt and Maddie, Mil Baby 3, Aiko 3, Hiro 3, the Girl3, and Freak 3), Mil 4 (Michael 4, Vicoria 4, Kids 4, with all other attendant characters being morphs of those three), and then G(enesis) 1 (all verison 5 characters as morphs), G(esnesis) 2M/F (all version 6 characters as morphs) and now G(enesis)3 M/F (all version 7 characters as morphs), with G4 coming entirely too soon.
Agreed, although I'll be interested to see, but no intention of jumping on the bandwagon; i did it with 3 and then slowed drastically when DRM hit us. Even so, I am interested in what appears.
I don't think it should be called Genesis 8. Genesis started as a native DS Figure. So the name was choosen, to make clear, an new time, Poser times are over. Genesis 8 would confuse me. Where are Genesis 5, 6 and 7?
I like the idea as it would help avoid the mentioned confusion. But on the other side, that would be like making the Genesis figures an extension or continuation of the Millenium figures. :/
Genesis was Genesis - it was not the next generation - it was a whole new system.
I'm used to Genesis 1/Vicky 5, Genesis 2/V6, etc., so Genesis 4/Victoria 8, et al, so the naming convension doesn't bother me. However, Apple solved the revolutionary new "iteration" naming problem by switching to roman numerals (OS 9.2 to OS X).
I'm more interested in what Daz can do to make Genesis 4 different enough from Genesis 3 to make an upgrade worthwhile for anyone. Genesis 1 was a huge break from the underlying technology of the generation 4 figures (I think--I came on board around the time Genesis 2 debuted); G2 rejected the unisex mesh; G3 pretty radically reconfigured the mesh for better movement/animation. Anyone have speculation as to what the next generation will impove and/or change (if you think it won't be an improvement...I'd imagine all of the people still using Victoria 4 are't convinced Genesis figures were a win).
Zygote
Millenium
Genesis
Embryo
Fetus
New Age
Creation
Evolution
Transcended
Genesis was Generation 5, Genesis 2 was Generation 6 and Genesis 3 is Generation 7, at least in spirit. :)
Except there aren't that many who want "My Enterprise...no bloody A, B, C or D!" They are perfectly happy with later versions...
I disagree. Think about the meaning of the word Genesis.
And just to add in the confusion, lets not forget that there's also ANOTHER set of Generations out there as well, as a bunch of the Smith Micro characters are labled G2, 3 & 4.
I would really like this as well. G4, Gen4, Genesis 4 and Generation 4 are going to really overcomplicate things.
But that would be saying it is the 8th Genesis. Which, it is not.