Head size
Damsel
Posts: 389
in The Commons
I did a render of Genesis 3, morphed him and added the M7 head, plus Gianni. I noticed his head gets smaller. I sized the head up, but got complaints on Facebook that his head was still too small. How much should the head be sized up to be in proportion? Or am I doing something wrong?
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Comments
I think it really depends on the angle and the view and what he wears. I find myself frequently using head propogating scale between 0-3 to get the right look for a picture. Some morphs do size the head down and other hairs make the head look small. So it sort of is a judgement call I think.
I've heard this observation for years that DAZ figures need to have their heads scaled upwards. So I decided to do a quick test. We have a well known orthographic frontal view of a man from a renowned expert in art and anatomy. I'm referring to the Virtuvian man by Leonardo Da Vinci. If we assume Leonardo knows anatomy, it should be a good guage. I loaded in G3M default and a pic of the vitruvian man on a plane set to be semi-transparant so we can see how out of proportion the head (or anything else is). This is the result. Note that to I added a fig leaf to Leonardo's sketch both to be sure I wasn't violating the TOS and also as a wink at the trend post-renaissance of covering up masterpieces with fig leaves for "modesty".
So you can judge. It looks to me like Leonardo would approve of G3M proportions. However there may be some "uncanny valley" factor that makes the perfectly scaled head seem "off" somehow, not sure why it seems to many people to be too small. But I can say from years on th is forum that the observation your friends are making has been echoed by many here for a long time.
Added a second render using 3Delight which seemed more clear for this purpose.
Artist typically define a figures height and proportions by the head. Real people average 7 to 8 heads tall. Real world scale tends to make the figure look short and stock in most art mediums which is why 8 to 9 heads tall is typical artistic scale.
What do you mean 0-3? Percent? That seems like a negligable difference would be made.
I render a lot of men, and sometimes just a slight nudge bigger using the head proportion scale can make a difference in how an image looks. It really depends on the character, and what they are wearing and the angle of the camera. Female heads are bigger by default, but guys tend to run small. If the Scott Head morphs for gen 7 are dialed in, you want a touch bigger, since that morph makes the head smaller overall
It also can have something to do with the character's facial features. Females tend to be stylized wtih big eyes and big lips. male characters can sometimes go the opposite with more close features So dialing in a touch of bigger head shape can make a difference in what a guy looks like.
Of course like most things, it is a matter of taste.
If I dial the head a bit larger, because the character is wearing something bulky or the angle is extreme I may dial it down to zero again, when I take his shirt off and put him in boxers.
Thanks, folks. This is the render. The face blends a couple of different characters, including Gianni and M7. People absolutely hated this guy, which confused me. Some of it's because he's ripped, and some women hate that. Then some people just automatically hate anything connected with CGI. I dunno. What do y'all think?
Thanks! Very useful.
i think he looks good don't hate him at all.
Hence all the fat guys on romance novel covers. Oh wait...
I'll secind this; that guy looks fabulous. Don't let folks get you down, as I think you did a wonderful job on him.
I think he looks really good. His head seems a teeny bit small to me, but I have noticed that with the DAZ male figures, the more buff they are and the thicker the neck the smaller the head looks. However, I think that is sort of real-world accurate cause bodybuilder's heads look small to me. But on the other hand I have a friend who is skinny as a rail and his head has always looked huge to me. It's just a matter of personal preference, at least for 3d models.
Guys, thank you so much! Every time I post a cover design on Facebook, the loathing has been universal and total. I would hear from 12 people, and ten of them would hate it. The last time, 20 people responded and one liked it. And that one was a cover artist who works with me. I have been a CGI artist for 14 years, and this crushed me.
About the head thing, Zombietaggerung--Now that you mention it, I work out with a physical trainer who is a bodybuilder, and his head looks a little small. It may be because his shoulders are so wide. I think a man's shoulders are supposed to be two heads wide (chin to top), and I think his are three...
Where is the facebook thread? I'll be happy to give you my thoughts.
In general, there isn't much you can work with if someone doesn't like something. Art and 3d is stylistic and some people may just not be into it. Although, if they have nothing constructive to say, I probably wouldn't bother with their opinions, but I can see it is probably pretty hurtful.
When there's a few people that jump on something, people that would normally leave a nice comment tend to stay away.
With female characters, you can get away with a small head just cuz, but you can also hide it with more hair volume and earrings to "fill the space". With guys, it's a little more noticeable. The guy looks fine to me except for one thing. If his trapezoid musles (I think that's what they are, the one connected to the neck and shoulders) were not as developed, look at his neck length. Most fighters/bodybuilders look like they have short necks because the trapezoid musles covers much of the neck. Now, I could be completely wrong. But might be worth trying a shorter neck length to see if it helps. Might want to lower the height of the trapezoid muscles just a tad as well. They're quite high imo.