For someone with a 50x0 card, which parts of the process need the alpha?
AndrewJJP
Posts: 779
Is iRay preview supposed to give a representative view of the scene on a 50x0 card with just the render failing? Or am I supposed to use the alpha for lighting and texturing?
On my machine, the iRay preview looks appauling (flat and lifeless), but it's fine on the alpha. Sadly, the alpha is an alpha and does not work well enough to be used as a serious creative tool (which isn't a criticism - it behaves as I would expect an alpha to behave).
Thank you :)
Post edited by AndrewJJP on
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Hello,
From what I read, anything related to Iray will only take advantage of a 50x0 GPU if you're using the alpha: with Daz Studio 4.24, anything related to Iray will be done using the CPU.
The DrawStyle not working would be a matter of settings, the GPU's not being supported would just make it slow.
Thanks both. I had not tried it since it failed after I first got the machine, and it's not behaving as it did back then (possibly driver updates I suppose). The standard version doesn't get beyond "preparing scene", even though the 5090 is selected in render settings (as it also is in the alpha). It wasn't slow before, it's just that scenes looked terrible, although I couldn't put my finger on why. I'm sorry I didn't retry it, and didn't get the current state correct.
So it's really broken now, and as to what I did, I just installed it on a new machine, nothing more. Same for the alpha, so the defaults worked fine there.
If this is the expectaion, that's fine. If not, what draw settings should I check?
I just need to know whether to try and fix it, or just give up. I also need to know whether to renew my Premium subscription.
In DS 4 you can't select the 50x0, you must select CPU - if you don't, and don't have CPU fallback enabled, then the render will fail. if you, you will get a slow render (but your CPU will be kept busy; you can control that with the Affinity setting in the hardware tab, which can limit the number of cores used - DS needs to be restarted if you chnage that setting, or to enable CPU Fallback)
Thank you, My renders took 4-12 hours on a 3090. Slow means weeks. But I am still not clear on the what needs the alpha, so I want to get this into some yes / no questions, then I'll follow up with another.
Those are my main questions WRT to the membership.
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Based on current plans, when is there going to be a beta (i.e. feature complete), and when is there going to be finished software? And if there are no dates, are these times measured in months or years?
And I am grateful for any help here, even if it's a "we simply don't know". I'm sure you can appreciate that these are very serious questions for me. If there's no support planned in 2026, then I'll need to consider selling the hardware if I can't even use iRay Preview with GPU.
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To satisfy my curiousity, because I'm sure there is a reason, why is it possoble to add completely new render engines like Filament without rewriting everything, but impossible to replace the iRay engine with one that implements the latest nVidia API and supports new hardware unless TK is upgraded (and whatever else)? And like I say, I'm sure there is a reason for this, because software that only runs on out of production GPUs is a more serious problem for Daz than for me.
Off the top of my head, Nvidia provides Iray to Daz, and the current version of Iray is not compatible with QT4 which is used by DS 4.24, which means it's not possible to get it to work with Daz Studio 4.24.
No timeline has been made public so far
The first version of Iray which supported 50xx cards could have been integrated into DS4, but unfortunately had major bugs so Daz chose not to do so. But when creating the next version which fixed those bugs, Nvidia made some technical changes (including moving to a newer C++ version / compiler IIRC) which made it incompatible with the DS4 code base.
Just for context, I have years of experience writing C++ Windows applications. That doesn't make sense as an explanation to me, and in fairness, I shouldn't have asked and I appreciate the answer anyway. It's probably the new iRay SDK forces an upgrade of something else that means the current QT won't build / work :)
I guess my real question is that I have a 5090 and I want to use Daz.
Thanks again :)
Thanks, I'm sorry, i think we crossed over and my last message can be disregarded. So it's what I suspected - they were forced to upgrade a codependency. I happens, it's one of those things...
It is a shame there's no timescale, but the reason for that is probably that they don't know either!
I have the information I need in order to decide what to do anyway, so thank you very much!
We don't have the details of what nvidia changed, only what was reported at the time. It's been very long since I've worked with C++ or Qt, but I remember it was quite picky with what it worked with, so "they changed compiler version or C++ libraries and now the project won't build" didn't see too far fetched to me
Your 5090 won't be used for Iray preview either, the versions of Iray in DS4 don't use 50xx card at all and will only use the CPU. It will be used for regular OpenGL preview or dForce simulation, though.
As I already said no timeline has been given by Daz yet for DS2025/6. The change log entry for the latests private builds suggests a beta should be released soon, but at Daz "soon" has a highly variable duration
No, it makes perfect sense. The version of QT used by Daz 4 (QT 4) is probably not binary compatible with modern versions of Visual Studio. QT 4 was released in 2005. QT 5 in 2012 and Daz doesn't use QT 5. Binary compatibility with a 20 year old library is spotty at best.
I googled this: "is qt 4 compatible with dev studio 2012" and it says you probably need to compile QT from source. The Visual Studio ABI (binary interface) changed between visual studio 2010 and 2012. QT 4 is very old. Daz started a Daz 5 project like 5 years ago and were only forced to get it finished when the NVIDIA SDK stopped being compatible with the older compilers.
Thank you :) I've never had the pleasure of working with QT, only direct Win32 and MFC, but I never had requirements for portability.
Thanks for clarifying the preview, too, it's hardly surprising, I suppose.
I'll wait for "soon" :D
What you said there makes sense, but what you said there is different (and it's what I said in my follow up, and what Leana said). But it's not a distinction that matters. What matters is it means it takes a lot longer to fix. I remember we had to upgrade a component, which should have been changing a couple of lines, but it pulled in something, which pulled in something else, and so on, and in the end it took a year.
But really it doesn't matter. These are probably not distinctions that are relevant to anyone outside Daz...
For the record, Daz likely started working on a DS5 much earlier than that.
They officially announced a pre-release version of DS5 in 2021 because at the time there was a major compatibility problem between DS4 and the latest Mac OSX (BigSur IIRC) and they thought they couldn't solve it without the Qt framework update. In the end they managed to make a DS4.15 version which would work on Mac again, so the DS5 pre-release didn't happen then and they kept releasing DS4 versions for a few years while working on the next major version in the background.
And as you said, the technical changes made by Nvidia finally forced them to release the DS2025 alpha.
There's a forum post from 2021 announcing Daz 5. That's why I said 5 years. https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/506346/daz-studio-5-development-update/p1
In case you missed it (like I did), the first beta of DS2026 is now available.
I'm a little afraid to try it lol.