How long until Victoria 8?

2

Comments

  • nonesuch00nonesuch00 Posts: 18,795
    Superdog said:

    I'd like to see features integrated that would make it easier to create characters from photo's like you can with FaceGen. I think this would really encourage people to personalise their characters a lot more. Although perhaps not if everyone ended up creating copies of celebs. Who needs another Kim Kardashian or Justin Beiber look-i-likey?

     

    Well advertisers typically use celebrities to garner initial interest but most people are hestitant to try new clothing or hair styles even with those celebrities hawking them. Maybe future versions of DAZ will help people try new clothing styles and hair styles they wouldn't have tried virtually first. That's not to say advertisers won't still use celebrities, they will. Personally though, I still have the same part on the left side of a short tapered men's cut that I've had since before I could walk. I think the only nerdier cut is a Mo bowl cut. :-)

  • false1false1 Posts: 43
    JOdel said:

    I suspect that a lot is going to depend on what new tech the staff want to get the advantage of.  Genesis 1 earned its awards. It was a real game-changer for people working in hobbiest-level 3D art. And some higher end art as well, although they probably had access to tech that was already more than anything built for gen4 was able to handle.

    Genesis 2 went back to a gendered base, which quite a few people weren't happy about, but it got a lot more vendors supporting the figures. And in their defense DAZ made the transition as painless as it was ever likely to get for the user.

    Genesis 3 is another real game-changer. Whole new rigging system (again), and a different UV system, which I am not altogether sure of why, but I gather there was some reason. 

    So the question is whether there is some tech just coming into play, or soon to come into play, that in another year+ is likely to offer something to a 3D model that DAZ is going to want to incorporate.

    The tech industry is built on upgrades and change. It's how they make their money. Version 7 has to be better than version 6 just because the number is higher. Sometimes this is true, sometime it's just marketing hype. The public seems to accept it though. You may not want to rebuy a wardrobe for a new figure but that's how Daz makes its money. That's why Adobe went subscription. There were a bunch of socialist malcontents still using CS3. It was good enough. Any new users will get the new version though, by subscription, whether they want it or not. After 25 years of computing I'm still surprised at the new stuff in new software versions. Sometimes it's awesome, sometimes it's just different, or even retro. Like MacOS going from flat icons to 3d icons and back to flat icons.

    Studio 5 is around the corner. A major upgrade will require (perceived) major improvements. A fresh new Vicky would fit the bill and it will have some "thing" that makes it "better". You may resist but she'll be "so pretty". The old heads may continue to use G2F, new users won't want to touch her with a 10 ft pole. It always changes. Get used to it.

  • JOdelJOdel Posts: 6,322

    All probably true. That said, I'd be perfectly happy to not see V8 (which to me is a vegetable juice drink) for another 3-5 years. 

    And, actually, given that the sales model appears to be to invent attractive, althoughnot necessarily needed new character bases as a device to get people to buy bundles of other DAZ O product, I suspect that we'll probably get V8 when the sales start showing that ther market doesn't feel like it *needs* random female character #14-18.

  • JOdel said:

    I suspect that a lot is going to depend on what new tech the staff want to get the advantage of.  Genesis 1 earned its awards. It was a real game-changer for people working in hobbiest-level 3D art. And some higher end art as well, although they probably had access to tech that was already more than anything built for gen4 was able to handle.

    Genesis 2 went back to a gendered base, which quite a few people weren't happy about, but it got a lot more vendors supporting the figures. And in their defense DAZ made the transition as painless as it was ever likely to get for the user.

    Genesis 3 is another real game-changer. Whole new rigging system (again), and a different UV system, which I am not altogether sure of why, but I gather there was some reason. 

    So the question is whether there is some tech just coming into play, or soon to come into play, that in another year+ is likely to offer something to a 3D model that DAZ is going to want to incorporate.

    The tech industry is built on upgrades and change. It's how they make their money. Version 7 has to be better than version 6 just because the number is higher. Sometimes this is true, sometime it's just marketing hype. The public seems to accept it though. You may not want to rebuy a wardrobe for a new figure but that's how Daz makes its money. That's why Adobe went subscription. There were a bunch of socialist malcontents still using CS3. It was good enough. Any new users will get the new version though, by subscription, whether they want it or not. After 25 years of computing I'm still surprised at the new stuff in new software versions. Sometimes it's awesome, sometimes it's just different, or even retro. Like MacOS going from flat icons to 3d icons and back to flat icons.

    Studio 5 is around the corner. A major upgrade will require (perceived) major improvements. A fresh new Vicky would fit the bill and it will have some "thing" that makes it "better". You may resist but she'll be "so pretty". The old heads may continue to use G2F, new users won't want to touch her with a 10 ft pole. It always changes. Get used to it.

    While DS5 might well include new figures if it includes new technology for them to exploit that isn'r necessarily true - nor is there any indication that 5.0.0.0 is just around the corner, as you say (the version numbers are integers separated by full stops so 4.10, 4.11 etc. are quite possible).

  • When the full body life size latex rubber 3D printers arrive and motorised skeleton kits, along with the 3D fabric sewing machines.

    actually damnit I want to print my DAZ clothes with morphs to fit now.

  • kaotkblisskaotkbliss Posts: 2,918
    JOdel said:

    All probably true. That said, I'd be perfectly happy to not see V8 (which to me is a vegetable juice drink) for another 3-5 years.

    Hehe, I caught that with the bottle shape and flavor reference :) Hence my reply hinting towards the old V8 comercials from when I was a kid :)

  • DaWaterRatDaWaterRat Posts: 2,885
    fool said:

    When the full body life size latex rubber 3D printers arrive and motorised skeleton kits, along with the 3D fabric sewing machines.

    actually damnit I want to print my DAZ clothes with morphs to fit now.

    3D fabric sewing machines... how is that different from a normal sewing machine?  :)

  • You just feed the fabric in off the roll and it does the rest?

  • or click to view this

  • nicsttnicstt Posts: 11,715

    More relaistic bends, and better IK; although IK not specifically a model problem.

  • DaWaterRatDaWaterRat Posts: 2,885
    fool said:

    You just feed the fabric in off the roll and it does the rest?

     

    fool said:

    or click to view this

    Even allowing for my stash, my machine and fabric takes up less room.  And may even require less finishing work... :p

    Wonderful idea though.

  • TesseractSpaceTesseractSpace Posts: 1,582
    edited February 2016

    Of course when Victoria 12  with 'AI based intelligent morphing and posing' declares herself our new virtual overlord and replaces humanity with 3d printed clones of herself, we'll all feel pretty silly.

    Post edited by TesseractSpace on
  • fixmypcmikefixmypcmike Posts: 19,707
    edited February 2016

    Of course when Victoria 12  with 'AI based intelligent morphing and posing' declares herself our new virtual overlord and replaces humanity with 3d printed clones of herself, we'll all feel pretty silly.

    But we'll all be young and pretty!

    http://www.sciencealert.com/new-3d-printer-produces-first-ever-life-sized-ear-muscle-and-bone-tissues-from-living-cells

    Post edited by fixmypcmike on
  • I have this lingering fear that she'd replace me with something that looks like Cory 6. (I'll give the artist who made him credit, it's not easy to get a guy to look right in the kind of stylized that Callie has, male features seem to go either goofy looking or something that could pass for an Anime style which I'm guessing they were trying to avoid.)

  • false1false1 Posts: 43
    JOdel said:

    I suspect that a lot is going to depend on what new tech the staff want to get the advantage of.  Genesis 1 earned its awards. It was a real game-changer for people working in hobbiest-level 3D art. And some higher end art as well, although they probably had access to tech that was already more than anything built for gen4 was able to handle.

    Genesis 2 went back to a gendered base, which quite a few people weren't happy about, but it got a lot more vendors supporting the figures. And in their defense DAZ made the transition as painless as it was ever likely to get for the user.

    Genesis 3 is another real game-changer. Whole new rigging system (again), and a different UV system, which I am not altogether sure of why, but I gather there was some reason. 

    So the question is whether there is some tech just coming into play, or soon to come into play, that in another year+ is likely to offer something to a 3D model that DAZ is going to want to incorporate.

    The tech industry is built on upgrades and change. It's how they make their money. Version 7 has to be better than version 6 just because the number is higher. Sometimes this is true, sometime it's just marketing hype. The public seems to accept it though. You may not want to rebuy a wardrobe for a new figure but that's how Daz makes its money. That's why Adobe went subscription. There were a bunch of socialist malcontents still using CS3. It was good enough. Any new users will get the new version though, by subscription, whether they want it or not. After 25 years of computing I'm still surprised at the new stuff in new software versions. Sometimes it's awesome, sometimes it's just different, or even retro. Like MacOS going from flat icons to 3d icons and back to flat icons.

    Studio 5 is around the corner. A major upgrade will require (perceived) major improvements. A fresh new Vicky would fit the bill and it will have some "thing" that makes it "better". You may resist but she'll be "so pretty". The old heads may continue to use G2F, new users won't want to touch her with a 10 ft pole. It always changes. Get used to it.

    While DS5 might well include new figures if it includes new technology for them to exploit that isn'r necessarily true - nor is there any indication that 5.0.0.0 is just around the corner, as you say (the version numbers are integers separated by full stops so 4.10, 4.11 etc. are quite possible).

    Yeah, that really threw me with Mac OS 10 10.10 or whatever. I'll have to keep that in mind. Also Daz is one of the few software vendors that doesn't upgrade by whole numbers, or skip a number just for the heck of it.

  • DaWaterRatDaWaterRat Posts: 2,885

    On topic - I'm hoping that Genesis 4, when it comes, is better at handling backward compatablility than Genesis 3.  While I get that DAZ (and the PA's) make money by making us buy everything over again... quite often that's not actually what happens.  Well, it is, but only with a handful of styles of things (mostly certain types of characters, swimwear, sleepwear).  Most everything else doesn't get revisited either because it didn't sell well enough the first time, or the original artist doesn't want to revisit that particular thing, and other artists are concerned (rightly or wrongly) about being accused of plagerisim if they do something similar.  All of which are perfectly valid reasons to move on to something else.  However, that leaves certain characters "stuck" on older figures, clothing can only handle so many iterations of autofit (depending on the outfit, sometimes not even 1) before it breaks, and parenting hair doesn't always work for certain morphs.  (and LAMH needs to be redesigned for the new figure anyway)

    I haven't moved to Genesis 3 because at the moment, investing further in Genesis 2 has greater value to me than investing in the same basic Genesis 3 stuff all over again.  When Genesis 4/Victoria 8 arrives, how much I invest in it will greatly depend on how much of what I have that probably *won't* be re-made for Genesis 4 I can use with it.

  • I don't know anyone off the top of my head who actually wants to see a new Genesis figure line released any time soon. If anything, we want to see Studio improvements, not more figures to repurchase everything for yet again.

    ...and Aiko7 when?

  • nicsttnicstt Posts: 11,715

    To answer the OP; not long enough.

    Anyone who thinks it will be unencrypted is fooling themselves; although we can hope, but...

  • Oso3DOso3D Posts: 15,095

    Well, presumably DRM will be written off as a failure before V8 comes out.

     

  • I feel Daz needs to be careful about releasing Genesis 4.  We already saw some push back and consumer fatigue when Gen3 was released.  Gen2 barely had it's training wheels off, and suddenly we were being asked to buy everything all over again for the third Genesis figure.  Three generations of Genesis hard on each others' heels is a lot to ask consumers to support.  Especially when you have things like new UV's that break elements of backwards compatibility.

    I realize Daz is a business and is here to make money, but I hope they give Gen3 a little extra time to mature.  Give customers a chance to settle into their investment before asking them to rebuy everything all over again for the umpteenth time.

  • Oso3DOso3D Posts: 15,095

    There are two problems with the Gen2 -> Gen3 thing... the first is timing, and the second is incompatibility.
    Either factor, alone, would have been difficult but not so bad. The combination compounds the problem.

    Another issue, for me, is that given the clever ways people are coming up with ways to adapt UV maps across figures... I'm thinking 'why didn't Daz work hard at doing something like this?' You'd think that if you were about to break with a 15 year tradition of compatibility across figures that it'd behoove them to find some way to deal with it from day 1.

    Ah well. Again, it doesn't bug me TOO much because they are, ultimately, the ones to suffer from people not buying their stuff.

     

  • Biggest upgrade I'd like to see is fine body hair.  Even skin that isn't "hairy" still generally has a thin layer of fine hair covering it.  Most of the time it isn't noticed, but sometimes it catches the light.  Having everybody's arms completely shaved throws things off to me.  I suppose it could be added to an exisiting model, but it seems like a big enough change that it could be on a V8 revision.

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,366
    edited February 2016

    Well I think you say some of the things about internal organs and such sarcastically but as computer HW and SW improves those things will come but I think it might take a decade or so. I can still remember my amazement at seeing a set of color computed tomography pictures of my skull as they were preparing to do reconstructive surgery. I can imagine a time when they might me able to model the entire endeavor for practice surgery dry runs once they are able to make sophisticated enough scans. 

    There are amazing things going on in animation but it's more geared towards gaming. Example, imagine variations of these World Wrestling Federation console type games that people have been playing for decades now. There is now ever improving sw & hw that can take a few pictures of a person and recreate a 3D likeness for use as a character in one of these WWF style games. And they can animate rolls of fat on a 400 pound man for example. So that's not available yet in those games but I think it will be in the future.

    As far as character recognition a large part of that besides geometry and wrinkles is the hair and skin coloring along with blemishes. Notice how the grey versions of these DAZ models requires a bit of concentration to distinguish them despite the different geometries? Well a camera taking a few pictures of a person won't do to make a suitable texture at the resolutions needed in varying lighting and environmental conditions the customers will have at home and so sw will be needed to extract blemishes, skin tones, hair tones and such from those pictures and create a reasonable set of simulated textures of the person suitable for the game model. Plus they needn't compromise their modesty.

    Besides gaming, now imagine a business like Wal*Mart using such SW on the internet and onsite with a 3D virtual changing room and you see such SW has the potential for Wal*Mart and other such chains to try out the next season's fashions before they go to mass manufacturing - potentionally saving massive waste of unsold and returned clothing besides virtual 3D changing rooms I think would be a big traffic draw for window shoppers.

    Of course I thought that would be the case 6 years ago and I was wrong then too but the technology seems to be imroving enough such that it is at least possible in the next 6 years. It's kind of exciting.

    Cool. Here is another explaining things ....

    Post edited by RAMWolff on
  • cherpenbeckcherpenbeck Posts: 1,416

    I do think DAZ didn't even try to use the full potential on G2 and V6 etc. They don't have to look like plastic dolls. They really can look like people, even V4/M4 can.

    You may not identify this girl as V6, but V6 she is, dialed-in some morphs, no sculpting or other such sophisticated things, which I still don't have mastery of,  that was during the first weeks I tried to learn working with DAZ. She's no beauty, but she isn't a plastic doll, either.

    HelloDragonfly.jpg
    700 x 850 - 647K
  • HavosHavos Posts: 5,612

    Biggest upgrade I'd like to see is fine body hair.  Even skin that isn't "hairy" still generally has a thin layer of fine hair covering it.  Most of the time it isn't noticed, but sometimes it catches the light.  Having everybody's arms completely shaved throws things off to me.  I suppose it could be added to an exisiting model, but it seems like a big enough change that it could be on a V8 revision.

    If you go and look over at rendo, you will find a product for G3F that tackles exactly this issue. It was a very popular product that stayed near the top of their What's Hot list for some time.

  • SpitSpit Posts: 2,342

    Well I think you say some of the things about internal organs and such sarcastically but as computer HW and SW improves those things will come but I think it might take a decade or so. I can still remember my amazement at seeing a set of color computed tomography pictures of my skull as they were preparing to do reconstructive surgery. I can imagine a time when they might me able to model the entire endeavor for practice surgery dry runs once they are able to make sophisticated enough scans. 

    There are amazing things going on in animation but it's more geared towards gaming. Example, imagine variations of these World Wrestling Federation console type games that people have been playing for decades now. There is now ever improving sw & hw that can take a few pictures of a person and recreate a 3D likeness for use as a character in one of these WWF style games. And they can animate rolls of fat on a 400 pound man for example. So that's not available yet in those games but I think it will be in the future.

    As far as character recognition a large part of that besides geometry and wrinkles is the hair and skin coloring along with blemishes. Notice how the grey versions of these DAZ models requires a bit of concentration to distinguish them despite the different geometries? Well a camera taking a few pictures of a person won't do to make a suitable texture at the resolutions needed in varying lighting and environmental conditions the customers will have at home and so sw will be needed to extract blemishes, skin tones, hair tones and such from those pictures and create a reasonable set of simulated textures of the person suitable for the game model. Plus they needn't compromise their modesty.

    Besides gaming, now imagine a business like Wal*Mart using such SW on the internet and onsite with a 3D virtual changing room and you see such SW has the potential for Wal*Mart and other such chains to try out the next season's fashions before they go to mass manufacturing - potentionally saving massive waste of unsold and returned clothing besides virtual 3D changing rooms I think would be a big traffic draw for window shoppers.

    Of course I thought that would be the case 6 years ago and I was wrong then too but the technology seems to be imroving enough such that it is at least possible in the next 6 years. It's kind of exciting.

     

    Actually, we'll be able to shop online for the dress kit we like then we can 3D print the outfit to our own personal specs.

     

  • outrider42outrider42 Posts: 3,679

    Better hair. You can have the most amazing looking character dialed in, but the obvious polygons in the hair mesh just break the whole thing. Skin has made some nice jumps, but hair should be a prioity for rendering humans next gen. Hair on skin is just painted on textures, with rare exception. Genesis 4 figures optimized for Nvidia Hairworks for Iray?

  • cosmo71cosmo71 Posts: 3,609

    Well, I will stop at G3F and V7, have spent enough money

  • Havos said:

    TBiggest upgrade I'd like to see is fine body hair.  Even skin that isn't "hairy" still generally has a thin layer of fine hair covering it.  Most of the time it isn't noticed, but sometimes it catches the light.  Having everybody's arms completely shaved throws things off to me.  I suppose it could be added to an exisiting model, but it seems like a big enough change that it could be on a V8 revision.

    If you go and look over at rendo, you will find a product for G3F that tackles exactly this issue. It was a very popular product that stayed near the top of their What's Hot list for some time.

    Thanks, just tracked this down, now to wait for a sale.

  • Fixme12Fixme12 Posts: 589

    While DS5 might well include new figures if it includes new technology for them to exploit that isn'r necessarily true - nor is there any indication that 5.0.0.0 is just around the corner, as you say (the version numbers are integers separated by full stops so 4.10, 4.11 etc. are quite possible).

    Well we can only hope it will not take that long for version 5, as iclone's 2016 year is very promising and will take more users from poser/daz world away.

Sign In or Register to comment.