How to control the strength of normals?

deleted user

I realy like the normals but what I don't see is a strength meter. I have a water normal that looks great but it's overkill on the displacment. I tryed to use it as a displacement and it looks really lame. Used it as a bump map. Still not as clean. I want to use it as a normal but I want to be able to set the strength of it.

Fisty

Iray Uber shader has a strength slider, Daz default and Uber Surface for 3Delight don't.  I can't remember if AoA Subsurface shader does.

You can build your own shader using shader mixer (hard, big learning curve) or lower the height of the normal map with a program like AwesomeBump (free, easy, small learning curve)

StratDragon

LadyLuck said:

I realy like the normals but what I don't see is a strength meter. I have a water normal that looks great but it's overkill on the displacment. I tryed to use it as a displacement and it looks really lame. Used it as a bump map. Still not as clean. I want to use it as a normal but I want to be able to set the strength of it.

normal map density might be adjusted in Photoshop or GIMP by adjusting the transparany of the layer, then flattening the layer.
I never tired but it might work.

nicstt

Sometimes you see sliders, but the whole point of normals, I understand, is that the calculations are built into them; if you want variable strengths, either create new ones, or use bump maps; they can be adjusted but are more computational intensive. If I'm wrong, hopefully someone will correct me.

mjc1016

nicstt said:

Sometimes you see sliders, but the whole point of normal maps, I understand, is that the calculations are built into them; if you want variable strengths, either create new ones, or use bump maps; they can be adjusted but are more computational intensive. If I'm wrong, hopefully someone will correct me.

No, you are right...the problem is people THINK that normals should have a 'strength'.  The strength is already baked into the map when it's created (well, if they are created properly, that is...).  If they aren't correctly created (baked from hi-res meshses) then all they are is colored bump maps.

FSMCDesigns

mjc1016 said:

nicstt said:

Sometimes you see sliders, but the whole point of normal maps, I understand, is that the calculations are built into them; if you want variable strengths, either create new ones, or use bump maps; they can be adjusted but are more computational intensive. If I'm wrong, hopefully someone will correct me.

No, you are right...the problem is people THINK that normals should have a 'strength'.  The strength is already baked into the map when it's created (well, if they are created properly, that is...).  If they aren't correctly created (baked from hi-res meshses) then all they are is colored bump maps.

Exactly. One of the things I like in Reality when I render in Lux is the ability to adjust the strength in the Reality UI, saves me from having to adjust the actual texture.

V3Digitimes

I have made some shaders in shader mixer allowing to increase or decrease and even invert the normal map effects.

There a different ways, one of them is to mix the normal map with a pure flat normal map and use the result as the new normal map. I made it in my advanced metal shaders and advanced metal creator if I remember well.

The second one consist in taking the normal vector out of the normal map and mix it with the flat normal vector out of the geometry you work with. This is almost the same this time you work directly on the normal. I used it in my Amazing skins and similar products. (once again if I remember well) Both method work, and if you want to see how it is made, you just have to import a surface with a normal strength control in the shader mixer and follow the node displacement until you reach the normal map part. This is not complicated and you can use this part of the brick network in your own material by grouping it, saving it as a custom brick and reloading it in your own brick network, reconnecting the right elements. Then ply on your surface and save as a shader definition asset to apply it on any surface you have.

I hope this helps...