In the mood for RAM. Any warnings?
LeatherGryphon
Posts: 12,119
I'm in the market for RAM for my new AMD motherboard (Asus TUF Gaming B450 Plus II). I could buy new RAM for it (16GB) but I already have 32GB (4 sticks of Corsair 2666 Vengeance LPX 8GB) in one of my current Intel machines. It has been my goal for a long time to replace two of the Vengeance LPX sticks in the Intel machine with the functionally similar 2666 Vengeance Pro sticks but which have pretty lights.
I'd then transplant the two removed LPX sticks to my new AMD motherboard.
Question: How can I tell, in advance, if that RAM is going to work at full rated speed of 2666MHz with the AMD CPU that I have selected (Ryzen5 1400). The CPU specs say it works with 2666, and the motherboard also supports 2666, but is the overclocking to 2666 going to work or do I specifically HAVE to get RAM designed for AMD's overclocking info? Is there an explanation, or a chart or a human expert who can help?
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LOL love your request for a human expert, really don't like the automated answering services so many use today.
The speed profiles are stored on memory in a standard format (SPD), the same for both Intel and AMD. What the two motherboards do with that information is what's different.
Not sure what you mean be overclocking to 2666, that's the standard speed they normally advertise, the profile(s) will have higher/faster values.
Your B450 should have no trouble getting that up to 3200. That's what my B550 does with the same Vengence LPX 2666 Memory.
XMP is actually Intels name for the process, DOCP is AMD's name for reading the profile from memory.
Go to the BIOS and check DOCP is actually selected.
Check RAM/mainboard compatibility carefully, I bought 64 GB Corsair Vengeance to use for an AMD board and found out too late it was specifically designed for Intel which the info in the store didn't say anything about.
Hmmm..., interesting!
I was aware of two tweeking technologies but didn't realize that it might be accomodated in the BIOS of suitably sophisticated motherboards.
I'll have to investigate this a little deeper.
Obviously I'm a newbie in this aspect of modern computers. I generally don't deliberately "overclock" my computers. The motherboards specify a max RAM clocking rate, as do the CPU specs and that's what I try not to exceed. Prefering to not jump through hoops risking death by flaming swords and silicon rot. However, I've learned just enough to be dangerous about RAM "overclocking". It's my understanding that for most modern motherboards, the highest standard speed supported is something like 2160? and that anything over that is pushing the envelope and, to me, that is what I call "overclocking". HOWEVER, the RAM manufacturers are churning out RAM that is tested or otherwise guaranteed to run at higher speeds and they find the good ones and mark the speed on them and sell them for more (as is their right). And now that motherboards come with this XMP feature to easily identify how fast the RAM is capable of running I let the motherboard take advantage of that because it's simple enough that even my ancient brain can figure it out and jump through that hoop. But now I get the impression that not only can I enable XMP via the BIOS but I might also be able to utilize AMD's method of reading the RAM's max speed (DOCP) parameters by a simple option in the BIOS. If true, then there is light at the end of the tunnel. Thank you.
Think of the profiles as optimum settings rather than an overclock.
This is the memory I have:
CMK16GX4M2Z3200C16
1333.3 MHz (DDR4-2666 / PC4-21300) {18-18-18-43}
with DOCP enabled:
1600.3 MHz {16-18-18-36}
With AMD boards you may have to be prepaired to set memory up by hand in the bios. This isnt always trivial.
The mobo XMP option was completely missing for the Vengance 3200 sticks I have with my B550 board. They were also unstable at the stock 3200 16,18,18 settings. After a couple of hours+ of my life wasted testing different settings, they are stable at 3200 16,19,18. Why do manufactures make it so darn hard to find settings info. I looked at 3 reviews of the same ram and all had different extra settings for the ones that have the 36/50/command rate settings past the first 3 ras/cas ones.
My other computer, b450 with Viper 3333 sticks would not boot at all with XMP and I had to also set memory timings by hand. Due to default XMP not working, I had to flash the bios (10 minutes each time) to get it back to 2333 default speeds to even get back into the bios, as clearing CMOS didnt clear the XMP use flag aparently.
Thank you!
This was exactly the type of warning I was looking for.
Now the question is; is this situation common with all memory makers? Or are some more in-tune with AMD needs? I've been buying Corsair Vengeance for all my Intel needs and never had any trouble. Should I switch to another manufacturer for AMD machines?
To be fair, mine is likely a worst case scenario these days with AMD. You don't see the tech forums filled with AMD memory problems any more like you did with Ryzen 1. My Corsair Vengence was 2nd hand and likely dumped on ebay due to the issues mentioned, technically faulty.
You can mitigate all problems nowardays to an extent just by checking the mobo manufacturer's XMP supported list in advance of purchasing. My Viper 3333 memory was not on the XMP supported listed of the B450 mobo.
Ah..., "Ryzen 1" do you mean 1st generation of Ryzen, i.e. CPUs with the -1xxx sub-numbering like "Ryzen 5-1400" (which is the CPU I have ordered)? Or do you mean "Ryzen 1" as opposed to "Ryzen 3" or "Ryzen 5", etc.
Again, I'm really a noob when it comes to AMD products, but I'm learning. The following article:
https://linustechtips.com/topic/1212410-can-ryzen-first-gen-memory-compatibility-be-solved-by-processor-upgrade/
seems to indicate that AMD CPUs with the sub-numbering of "1xxx" are the 1st generation of the Ryzen family. And that the problem was "solved" with the subsequent generations "-2xxx, -3xxx". And unfortunately, I've apparently saddled myself with one of the early AMD Ryzen CPUs that had memory compatability problems. (serves me right for wanting to go cheap!)
On the plus side, I have found the Asus memory compatability chart at their website but now I need to pull the Corsair Vengeance LPX RAM from my working computer to see exactly which model and date code it has to let me determine if it has a chance of working in the AMD machine I'm building.
My intention was to run this new AMD computer with hand-me-down RAM from one of my other machines. However, I have gleaned from some articles I've read, that the problem with RAM in AMD CPUs was trying to run them at overclocking speeds, greater than 2666. My existing RAM is rated at 2666 speed and I have no intention of trying to go faster with that CPU or motherboard. So, I might still get away with it. And if push comes to shove, I can survive running at lower speed. I had not intended this new computer to be a gaming machine, it's to be a household computer for a needy relative, head & shoulders better that what they already are struggling with.
PLEASE CORRECT ME IF I AM MISUNDERSTANDING THE AMD CPU NAMING SCHEME.
You're not wrong on the AMD Ryzen naming.
The memory not being on the QVL list for the board maker doesn't mean it won't work, it just means it's not tested with it. It might work... it might not. The standard speed for the Ryzen 1st gen, maybe later gens I don't remember is 2133. Ryzen CPU do get a significant performance boost from faster RAM.
If you're shopping for memory, you can also check the maker's QVL list. I'm kind of a fan of G.SKILL now, years back now I tried them out, a module went bad and the RMA process was very fast and easy. I bought them since without issues. My latest I got an Asus board, the modules weren't on their QVL list, but the motherboard was on G.SKILL's QVL list for the modules, plugged them in used the DOCP profile and they worked right off the bat at advertised speed (3600).
HWinfo seems quite good at reading the details in the BIOS and on RAM before you pull it fom the old machine.
Wow, that HwInfo is just the ticket.
Information you didn't know you wanted. I thought that I had the "Hw<something>" utility that was greatly touted. But apparently I had HwMonitor, which is pretty useful in its own right. But I've now added "HwInfo" to my linked-to-from-the-desktop icon layout. Thanks for the pointer to it.
They have lifetime warranty so you can have them replaced by Corsair if the seller/store won't. Kingston replaced a faulty RAM stick under lifetime warranty for me right away, they didn't even ask me to return the faulty one, just had to provide a copy of the purchase receipt (not sure what Corsairs policy is in that respect). There may be a problem though if someone already have had a bad stick replaced with a good one under the warranty and then afterwards is selling the bad one on eBay.