Starting a model

GussNemoGussNemo Posts: 1,855
edited December 1969 in Hexagon Discussion

I saw a picture of a house I thought would make a really nice model, but I've never attempted something like this before. I'm unsure what the best way would be to start this project.

My thoughts are to use primitives to form the general shape of the house, then start in on the details. It seems the more logical way to start but since I've not done this before, logic might not be the best approach.

I'd like to know what experienced modelers think.

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Comments

  • patience55patience55 Posts: 6,988
    edited December 1969

    GussNemo said:
    I saw a picture of a house I thought would make a really nice model, but I've never attempted something like this before. I'm unsure what the best way would be to start this project.

    My thoughts are to use primitives to form the general shape of the house, then start in on the details. It seems the more logical way to start but since I've not done this before, logic might not be the best approach.

    I'd like to know what experienced modelers think.


    For starters, get a ''floorplan" on a square image to load onto the floor grid. This particular image does not have to be a high quality one at all. It is best if the actual floorplan is evenly placed on the image [not at an angle].

    Then yes, you can start with cubes, or by drawing lines and extracting up the walls.

  • GussNemoGussNemo Posts: 1,855
    edited December 1969

    GussNemo said:
    I saw a picture of a house I thought would make a really nice model, but I've never attempted something like this before. I'm unsure what the best way would be to start this project.

    My thoughts are to use primitives to form the general shape of the house, then start in on the details. It seems the more logical way to start but since I've not done this before, logic might not be the best approach.

    I'd like to know what experienced modelers think.


    For starters, get a ''floorplan" on a square image to load onto the floor grid. This particular image does not have to be a high quality one at all. It is best if the actual floorplan is evenly placed on the image [not at an angle].

    Then yes, you can start with cubes, or by drawing lines and extracting up the walls.

    Well, that's going to be a problem. The house I'd like to tackle is from a painting, so no floor plan is available.

  • cdordonicdordoni Posts: 577
    edited December 1969

    GussNemo said:
    Well, that's going to be a problem. The house I'd like to tackle is from a painting, so no floor plan is available.

    Maybe you don't need an existing floorplan. Especially if you are not modeling the interior.

    You could use Hex's 2D tools to to draw a top (plan) view of the house, and extrude that. Or you could take primitives like boxes and move them around interactively until they form a pleasing appearance for the basic shape.

    There is typically some thought given as to the end use of the model, and while you can certainly use primitives to build a more complex object, its possible that primitives may not work the best for the end use.

    At some point you might need surfaces that have a hard edge where they intersect as opposed to overlapping shapes. Then, building details like windows might use a combination of box modeling technique and creating separate pieces for the framing/trim.

  • GussNemoGussNemo Posts: 1,855
    edited December 1969

    @cdordoni: I don't have plans to show the interior of the house, just the exterior. If I'd planned to do an interior I'd do the entire model using Sketchup 2014, and a floor plan would be a great asset. But since the house is a period house it might be possible to get a floor plan and additional profiles. I'd just have to do a search to find out.

    I've never used Hexagon's 2D tools so I'd have to do a bit of experimenting to see if that method worked the best.

    It might be best to do a search for that type of house, floor plan as well, in order to get good sharp images to work from. That way I'd be able to see where transitions take place from sharp to soft edges, better detail of the windows and doors, and any accouterments which are the norm for that style house.

    I do know one important fact, this entire project is going to be a learning experience. It may even require I look through the tutorials I've found in order to create certain things. The one thing I know for sure, when I finish this house, I don't want it to be exploded like some structures I've downloaded from other sites. I'd want others to just place it in their scenes, add material, and move on.

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 23,290
    edited December 1969

    Wow I did not even know you could explode houses in Bryce!!
    I have only seen the nice scenic Bryce renders, missed the violent ones entirely,
    must be looking in the wrong galleries
    good luck with your house, Sketchup is pretty cool for modeling, I started with it but it does create lots of ngons.

  • ChoholeChohole Posts: 31,491
    edited October 2014

    Wow I did not even know you could explode houses in Bryce!!
    I have only seen the nice scenic Bryce renders, missed the violent ones entirely,
    must be looking in the wrong galleries
    good luck with your house, Sketchup is pretty cool for modeling, I started with it but it does create lots of ngons.

    lol :coolsmile: I somehow think that Guss means that some downloads from other sites do actually load "Exploded" and not as a completed model. 3ds are particularly prone to it in both Bryce and Poser. Of course as DS can't use 3ds files it is not so well known to some.

    Post edited by Chohole on
  • patience55patience55 Posts: 6,988
    edited December 1969

    Sketchup ... nooooooooo

    Technically you don't "have to have" a floorplan, it is usually easier to work seeing what one is aiming for.

    In most any paint editor one can make a basic floorplan. Doesn't have to be perfect even.

    Here's a quick start. And no the plan is not perfect. When one is using the line tools, Hexagon will draw the lines straight.

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  • patience55patience55 Posts: 6,988
    edited October 2014

    And a few more images.

    n.b. there are several ways to start a model, this is just one.

    The roof was started with a cylinder [3 sides].

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    Post edited by patience55 on
  • GussNemoGussNemo Posts: 1,855
    edited December 1969

    Wow I did not even know you could explode houses in Bryce!!
    I have only seen the nice scenic Bryce renders, missed the violent ones entirely,
    must be looking in the wrong galleries
    good luck with your house, Sketchup is pretty cool for modeling, I started with it but it does create lots of ngons.

    Hahaha...sorry I mislead you wendy, but chohole (aka Pam) is right. I've downoladed 3ds models from sites which look real good on that site, everything in it's place, but only to find all the pieces scattered when imported into Bryce. I then have to take those models into a program like Hexagon or Wings, etc. and reassemble the model. For small models this isn't much of a problem, but for large models, especially houses with lots of windows, it's a pain to reassemble because each component is made up of several smaller parts.

    @Pam: Thanks for the extra explanation. I should remember to use KISS when explaining something.

    @Patience55: Thank you, again, for the information. I have done a web search and found a few floor plans along with profiles. It's the multiple profiles that I really want in order to get something close to accurate. Seems the only images I find are frontal shots of some rather nice looking homes.

  • patience55patience55 Posts: 6,988
    edited December 1969

    You're welcome and I'm happy to read that you have found some floorplans and more views for the houses. Lots of fun ;-)

  • GussNemoGussNemo Posts: 1,855
    edited December 1969

    @Patience55: Oh, yeah, it's going to be lots of fun until I learn the quickest ways to accomplish things.

  • patience55patience55 Posts: 6,988
    edited December 1969

    My fav option in Hexagon is the Symmetry tool. After working one side of an object ... one doesn't have to spend the time over again to make the left over side, just make a symmetrical copy, weld them together, bit of patch work and onto the next step.

  • useroperatoruseroperator Posts: 247
    edited October 2014

    I usually like to make a cube then use edge tools to create lines to shape out things like doorways or extrude the face between the lines to create a hallway, etc.

    I'm sure there's also third party ways to quickly turn floor plans into 3d walls with a black and white image and a brush.

    Post edited by useroperator on
  • GussNemoGussNemo Posts: 1,855
    edited October 2014

    I gave the lines method of creating walls a try but found I had trouble creating the offset walls--it's a learning curve for me. I also gave the cube method a try and ran into trouble, again, creating the offset walls--another learning curve for me. Since this type of work is new to me it's going to take me a bit of time to figure out the best method to create the wall for the house I've selected. I can't use symmetry because the house isn't symmetrical, but I get it done.

    BTW, if I wanted to rip off this house I would use Sketchup 2014. But because I'm trying to learn how to use Hexagon I'm willing to suffer the ills of trial and error.

    Post edited by GussNemo on
  • Wee Dangerous JohnWee Dangerous John Posts: 1,283
    edited December 1969

    Gary Miller (geekatplay.com) did a 3 part tutorial on making a broken down shack which may help -

    http://www.geekatplay.com/hp3.php

  • GhostmanGhostman Posts: 215
    edited December 1969

    If you want to learn the basics of hexagon I highly recommend this tutorial by Grendel. Yes it is for an earlier version of Hex but it is still is pretty valid and you'll learn most of the basic tools you'll need. http://www.polyloop.net/showthread.php/4534-Modeling-of-a-digital-camera

    I went straight from this tutorial to making a highly detailed Mustang car.

  • GussNemoGussNemo Posts: 1,855
    edited December 1969

    @Wee Dangerous John: Thanks for the link, I like the tutorials that come from that site. I've watched one or two, or three, or four...

    @Ghostman: Thank you for the link to that site for the tutorial. It's not a model I'd thought of doing, but learning is learning.

  • GussNemoGussNemo Posts: 1,855
    edited November 2014

    Thought I'd post a screen shot of my progress so far. It's been slow, so much other stuff to learn on top of creating my house. The image is of the guide images I finally have setup in Hexagon. I don't have PS or PSP so I had to figure out how to do things using GIMP.

    Edit: I've discovered using the Facet tool will make it easier to help create the odd shaped wall on the house. But I've noticed if my view isn't precisely 90 degrees to the facet being set, that facet is out of place. Is there a way to align my view so it's exactly 90 degrees to the facet being set? I've encountered this problem in the past but it wasn't necessary to be precise at that time.

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    Post edited by GussNemo on
  • useroperatoruseroperator Posts: 247
    edited December 1969

    there are better programs out there specifically designed for modelling architecture in as much or little detail as you want, making putting up walls on a floorplan take just a few clicks. plus some of them have accessories like different types of siding to apply, light fixtures, furniture, etc.

    whether they're free or not is another thing, but I know from personal experience that using hexagon for detailed architecture can be a bit tedious. hours of work done in hexagon can take mere minutes in one of these programs.

  • GussNemoGussNemo Posts: 1,855
    edited December 1969

    @user.operator: Sketchup 2014 is a program which would take less time to knock a house together, since it works only with lines, faces, and vertices. It'd be a simple matter to make the floor, raise the walls, add the second story, and put on the roof. But I want to learn how to do such things using Hexagon, and am willing to go through the tedious work.

    In the image below I want to "loop cut" the red line which denotes the point where I extruded the edges of the floor to create the walls. Basically, I want to separate the walls from the floor. I know Hexagon doesn't do "loop cuts" so am wondering how it's done in Hexagon.

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  • useroperatoruseroperator Posts: 247
    edited December 1969

    sometimes you should just create new geometry. say for example you want to add a floor trim. You can use lines to draw out the shape/height around a room, then copy and paste the faces and do an extrude or add thickness.

    You'll eventually run into a point where it's difficult to keep modelling something from one single piece without running into problems. say you want to chamfer the edges of a floor trim just a little so it's not soo sharp, it'd be best to do that with a separate piece rather than an extrude from the wall.

    to separate the walls from the floor, all you need to do is select all the faces above that line, you can mass select things by right clicking and dragging over them. then you just cut and paste those faces. there are many ways to select faces. L will loop faces, and R will ring select faces....I suggest looking at more info on that feature if you don't already know about it.

    to select faces in the first place, you need to click the face selection box in the top menu. there's a few boxes. one for line, one for faces, one for points, etc.

  • RoygeeRoygee Posts: 2,232
    edited December 1969

    I know Hexagon doesn’t do “loop cuts” so am wondering how it’s done in Hexagon.

    Hex does - it's named "Tessellate by slice". :)

  • GussNemoGussNemo Posts: 1,855
    edited December 1969

    @user.operator: Thanks for the information. I've learned how to select the components needed, so that's not a problem. And I'm seeing it's not always possible to keep on keeping unless new geometry is created.

    @Roygee: How to separate created components is a problem I'm encountering. Separating those components so that independent operations can be preformed on each one. And a new form is created.

    Say I create a cube and want to cut in half, vertically or horizontally. I know I can select the edges and connect them to create two halves on that cube. But that new line doesn't actually cut the cube into two halves, two halves which can be separated. If I preformed the same operation in Wings 3D, select the like edges, connect those edges, then do a loop cut, that cube will now be two halves of the whole. And either one can be moved or worked in some other manner. So far I haven't found a command which allows the same operation in Hexagon. I've tried the Tessillate by slice on a sample cube, but it didn't cut the cube completely in half as the Loop Cut command in Wings 3D would have done. Tessillate by slice simply added a new line just as though the edges had been selected and connected. From what I've seen Tessillate by slice simply adds additional lines to an object. What I need/want is a way to actually cut the red line in my previous image so that the walls would be free of the floor.

  • useroperatoruseroperator Posts: 247
    edited November 2014

    to separate a cube cut in half, you select half the faces and edit>cut (or ctrl+x), then paste (ctrl+v). it'll paste it right back into the position it was cut from, and it'll show up in the scene tree as a new form.

    you can also use the 'disassociate entities' feature. it will all remain one model form, but they will be physically separate from each other. I mostly only bring it up to familiarize you with relevant features though, I still prefer cut and paste.

    Post edited by useroperator on
  • GussNemoGussNemo Posts: 1,855
    edited December 1969

    @user.operator: Again, thank you for the information. I tried both methods on a simple cube and see they both have their uses. If disassociate is used, and you want to rejoin something, how is that done?

  • useroperatoruseroperator Posts: 247
    edited November 2014

    you select all the faces of both halves and use the 'weld' tool. but if they're just two separate 'forms', then selecting both objects (without need to select faces) from the scene hierarchy and using weld will do it too. you can also weld by edges and points too.

    Post edited by useroperator on
  • RoygeeRoygee Posts: 2,232
    edited December 1969

    The correct tool for separating a mesh into two is "Extract". The other methods will also suffice, depending on the context and what you want to achieve.

  • Cris PalominoCris Palomino Posts: 6,536
    edited December 1969

    Guss,

    taconene did a nice series on building a house from floor plans in Blender and I think it would be closer to what you can do in Hex.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1fYPUf_ozHg

  • GussNemoGussNemo Posts: 1,855
    edited December 1969

    @Cris: Thank you for the link, he knows his way around Blender. I watched about half of the video but can see his method may be much better than the one I'm using at the present. At the moment, I can't see why his method couldn't be used in Hexagon, it's just resizing, extruding, etc. I'll finish my house using the method I started with but will definitely give his method a try on my next one.

  • Cris PalominoCris Palomino Posts: 6,536
    edited December 1969

    Yep, most modeling can carry over into other programs once you understand modeling. I will look for tutorials in any 3d package and can generally translate it to mine. Good luck, Guss. :)

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